What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/education/ukrainian-teachers-already-applying-to-work-in-ireland-as-schools-welcome-growing-number-of-fleeing-pupils-41475496.html

The_Kew_Tour

Funny how how all these media big guns in RTE and Irish times were telling everyone should play their part in helping people fleeing war for years. No sign of them taking up offers to accommodate themselves. Do as I say, not as I do comes to mind.

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821389#Comment_118821389

It’s not just the media and politicians. I can think of a couple of posters here who are particularly well positioned to house some of the Ukrainian refugees. They throw out mealy mouthed platitudes and barbed remarks, but have they actually signed up to accommodate these desperate people?

Have they f**k..

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118820835#Comment_118820835

If only they would also do their job of clearing the asylum seeker applications and appeals backlog, to make some room for genuine war refugees.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821555#Comment_118821555

Needs to be staffed appropriately for that to happen. It's the same story all throughout govt, courts, planning depts etc etc etc.

People using the systems are held up with years of delays for no other reason than understaffing.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821555#Comment_118821555

That's not the job of social welfare

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118820835#Comment_118820835

nope, not pleased that someone, a taxpayer, genuinely in need of a dig out has to drag themselves to a meeting with some clown during a pandemic who is neither a doctor, physiotherapist or an accountant, but who is going to endeavour to pass some judgement on them, a taxpayer getting help…

They have been told to bring bank statements to this meeting ffs. I’ve seen the letter with my own eyes.

if they had a tip off that they’d been working then fair enough, they haven’t…quite simply… told to bring bank statements, that’s a joke…

in a civilised society people being under that scrutiny when tens of thousands will be spent on each of these non taxpayers…nice…

there are 23 wars and several minor conflicts happening on this planet now…might as well start helping everyone.

as for the Irish taxpayers, let’s park our overall wellbeing, ambition, safety and financial wellbeing at the door.. sure we can be giving everyone a dig out.. as long as we don’t need one ourselves….

Could easily have their GP reconfirm that it’s needed, wouldn’t need to release any medical information… I dr Sean Harris confirm that Sarah Smith is in need of illness benefit… simple, information from an accredited source.

what accreditation will these new arrivals have before they get a place to live, cash, medical card etc… social supports and so on…. SFA

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821615#Comment_118821615

Don't know the situation but it's not unusual to have to supply financial documents if applying for certain supports. This requirement is typically laid out in the application information.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821634#Comment_118821634

They are supplying docs to ‘continue’ receiving, I’ll post a segment of the letter minus identifying info tomorrow…

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821698#Comment_118821698

Ahh there’s no need man, we’re all aware of some absolute clangers in administration, but the circumstances you’re describing for your cousin have nothing to do with immigrants, asylum seekers, refugees or any of the rest of it.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821722#Comment_118821722

I’d respectfully beg to differ, if people here are having to drag themselves into a meeting, an interview or assessment during a pandemic to justify continuing to get illness benefit…. A few bob, and at the same time plane loads of people are arriving and without interviews get housed, money and healthcare…that’s piss poor.

in my eyes the reason for the meeting will be to use whatever is said, against them in order to discontinue the benefit. It’s with that intention…. cannot be that effort for any other reason… the effort isn’t cursory or procedural. It has intent.

which again, when you’ve paid in, you should be as long as you need, entitled to take out….nobody in that meeting is a doctor but as I’m typing hmmmmm 💡 perfect…

the sheer numbers arriving and the cost to the taxpayers is simply driving the government to take from us again, money doesn’t grow on trees..if it’s growing in your pockets they’ll try get it.

@One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821758#Comment_118821758

You are comparing apples and oranges.

You are also assuming negative intent where none exists.

You also seem to be taking offense that this person is being asked to follow a process because how dare they ask this person to follow a process as they've paid tax.... or something, not really sure

Either way, I'm inclined to agree with @One eyed Jack

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821765#Comment_118821765

Not really, because it all boils down to one thing….

money is being available for helping 200,000 refugees who might need help..

meanwhile people here, taxpayers who need it end up possibly loosing it…

the timing ain’t coincidental.

im inclined to see the wood from the trees and the agenda for Irish people, taxpayers getting thrown under the bus,

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821758#Comment_118821758

I understand why you’d beg to differ, but that’s not going to change the fact that the two different circumstances aren’t linked in any way. It’s you that’s trying to link them, but one has literally nothing to do with the other, because Ireland’s taxation system doesn’t function like that for one thing -

“Hypothecation (or the ring-fencing of taxes for specific and related purposes) is not a feature of the Irish tax system in general.

https://www.thejournal.ie/sugar-tax-revenue-5212076-Sep2020/?amp=1

Doesn’t matter how much anyone does or doesn’t pay in taxes or whether they pay income tax or any other kind of tax, it’s simply not related to welfare benefits. Because I’m a PAYE employee, Government don’t have to reach into my pockets as the amount of income tax is taken at source before anything lands in my bank account. That doesn’t mean I’m directly contributing to your cousin’s benefits any more than I’m not directly contributing to the welfare of asylum seekers and refugees, any more than I’m not directly contributing to the welfare of thousands of people who rely on welfare to sustain themselves.

Some of them are even claiming benefits which they aren’t entitled to, and when inspectors call people claiming benefits in for interview, it’s to detect fraud, not to accuse anyone of committing fraud. Pain in the arse but sure it’s not actually extraordinary circumstances and your cousin isn’t being treated any differently to thousands of people who are called in to their local offices every day up and down this country for interviews already.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821768#Comment_118821768

the timing ain’t coincidental.

Must be your first time 😏

https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1506501591347732480?t=s6ZGXXbq3yg5pmg8J7hCMQ&s=19

Delete

MarkEadie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821768#Comment_118821768

DEASP are going to act like that regardless. Any person working in that capacity that I've ever met was a power tripping idiot who enjoyed looking down on a jobseeker or someone in need. It's an endemic problem in the system here and perhaps just down to Irish nature, a large percentage of people who go for those jobs are just that type of person and there is some enjoyment in making things difficult for people having a hard time. The reason the welfare system is in such a good position in the country is that the EU gave Ireland 40 billion euro to improve itself since the 70s and the money has been well spent and one of the ramifications of getting that support from the EU is that the welfare system is what it is.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118821615#Comment_118821615

Everybody in receipt of social welfare is subjected to checks and yes, bank statements are required.

the only person wrong is you, who seem to think that your relations shouldn't be subjected to the same checks as everyone else in the country.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118820620#Comment_118820620

Many will return to Ukraine.. sure. But many won't. Why?

They're bypassing the normal visa restrictions to come to a first world nation. Many of them wouldn't have passed the requirements to gain a visa in the EU or Ireland, and this allows them to stay in Ireland, or gain access to the EU. This is an incredible opportunity to raise their own living standards but also gain access to a welfare system that is light years better than what exists in Ukraine. Assuming that they are as family orientated as you claim, they will want the best opportunities for their children, which Ireland provides, in addition to the reams of supports that our government is putting in place for them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118820744#Comment_118820744

The problem is what happens when the conflict ends. Both the UN and Ireland/EU have laws regarding reunification of the family, which means all those women/children who stay in Ireland could potentially call their husbands, fathers, etc to come here after them, and stay here.

Post war Ukraine will not be an appealing place for any family. Sure, the EU and US will pour money into it's reconstruction and the creation of a stout democratic nation near Russia, but it will not be appealing for many people to avail of. They might return after things become settled, or they will find themselves settled in Ireland, unwilling to return. We're going to see a large number remain.

A lot of Ukranian women stay home with their children unlike western women so the skill set may be a lot less than you think. 

Which is a sign of less developed, and therefore less costly nations. To live properly, western families need to have both parents working (or make sacrifices in certain areas with tight budgeting) due to the rising costs to the family, whether it's the high costs of mortgages, or the costs of equipping children for schools. It's one of the major reasons why family sizes have dropped considerably between the 1950s and nowadays. The range of supports that the government/welfare can provide are finite.. at some point the economy is going to buckle under the strain, which will require Ukrainian women to work to support themselves, and then there's the men who come to join them after the conflict, who will need to work.

Lastly, there's a willingness to consider all Ukrainians as being "good" people.. but Ukraine has plenty of dodgy aspects to it. We're all aware of the scams over Russian Brides, but Ukraine (especially in the south) has had, for decades, a wide number of scams regarding marriage/dating with foreigners. Same with Ukraine having a rather substantial prostitution industry.. and that's just looking at some of the female led stuff. There's plenty more to choose from, and a lot more to add when taking into account the men. Remember. Standard checks for visas and entry have been suspended.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118822766#Comment_118822766

All perfectly valid concerns but not a strong case for the alternative i.e. Leaving them sitting in a war zone

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118822934#Comment_118822934

How is letting them sit in a war zone the alternative? Surely a 2 year refugee visa, to be extended if the war goes on longer, would be an alternative. Once the visa elapses, you are out.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118822974#Comment_118822974

They are getting a 3 year visa at the moment so what's the issue?

Pure drink of prejudice of some of these posts! Classism.

What is it about the stuck up classes that they automatically believe refugees want to live here on social welfare rather then return home, to their (before the war) perfectly acceptable homeland? They don't live in caves FFS, they had functioning lives in cities and rural towns. It's a perfectly modern country, before the war. Ireland is a fine place to live, but I don't understand the attitude that it's somehow some utopia that everyone wants to live in. Millions of people live happily in thousands of other countries.

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118823174#Comment_118823174

What will the death toll be before the war ends? Would you like to return to the place your father, brother, husband, uncle was killed by Russian forces who could decide to re-engage again the day after you get back or end up in a situation where your son could grow up to be 18 when another attack happens and he's not allowed leave?

Let me guess, you've friends who the above happened to and they were happy to go back??

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118823314#Comment_118823314

Some will stay, most will return. I don't see the issue.

The ones that return will get on with their lives, the ones that stay will do the same.

I understand you don't like it but that's the way it is.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118822934#Comment_118822934

Did I suggest doing that? Did anyone suggest doing that?

In any case, there's scope to limit the rights of Ukrainian refugees in a manner that protects the future of Irish people and the Irish economy, while also providing a safe haven until the conflict has resolved... There's no need for this rush over the cliff.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118822979#Comment_118822979

The issue is the attitude that Justice has towards deporting those who have expired visas.. and the likelihood that Ukrainian refugees will be extended favourable terms to remain in Ireland after the visa. The 3 year visa constitutes grounds for a citizen application, which in practical terms, would be granted.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118823419#Comment_118823419

I understand you don't like it but that's the way it is.

Actually, it's not yet, the way that it is... it all depends on the policies and approach to the situation that are decided over the next few months.

I never really understood the logic of that statement above. We come to boards to discuss topics, so why shutdown the topic with the belief that it can't or shouldn't be changed.

MarkEadie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118823174#Comment_118823174

I think most refugees will want to work and most will work. It's a narrative that certain people with agendas like to spew that the refugees are all on social welfare. The cost of living in Ireland is far higher than what they will be used to in Ukraine. I know a few Ukrainians who were actually here illegally before all this started and they didn't paint a great picture of the country. It's probably where you'd expect Ireland to be if we didn't join the EU and get 40 billion euro to improve the country as a whole. I'm sure many will return to their countries but many will see Ireland, and virtually any other western non eastern european country as an attractive place to settle. Fair play to them and I wish them all the best and it's very satisfying to see the whinging from the usual suspects on here :)

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118823501#Comment_118823501

What other laws do you like to see broken?? Drink Driving? Assault?

Throw up a list there so we know what laws Mark isn't bothered with.