What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

Slowyourrole

Deleted User wrote: »

You've no interest in how other countries behave, but expect Ireland to be "better". Which is why we're going to make the same mistakes as other countries who have embraced multiculturalism and your 'charitable' views on immigration....

I literally said in the post you quoted we can learn from others. The point I was making was that our policies shouldn't be based on a reciprocal policy.

Deleted User wrote: »

No, you stated that it was either all or nothing... I've reread your post three times now and each time I understand it the same way.

No, I said most anti-immigration people seem to believe that.

Deleted User wrote: »

It doesn't matter. I understand where you're coming from, and I find it to be extremely short sighted considering the state of the world and where it's heading in terms of instability. But then, that's hardly new with the pro-immigration crowd.

What's causing the instability? People wanting to be treated equally or the people already at the top of the pile trying to stop them? Instability in the West isn't being caused by human rights campaigners, it's caused by people like Trump and Johnson being voted in to resist change, whether it be positive or negative.

smurgen wrote: »

Loyalists not a fan of multiculturalism it seems..
..

https://twitter.com/christineomg5/status/1282030584743813122?s=19

They'd fit in well here

mr_fegelien

AFAIK, the only migration that Ireland benefits from is supranational migration from EU countries where the same race of people and similar cultures ensures these people can integrate relatively easy.

Then Indians and Chinese should be allowed.

That's it. No other groups because you just look at their unemployment rate. It's said Africans and Muslims fare worse than all other immigrants.

Slowyourrole

Slowyourrole wrote: »

I literally said in the post you quoted we can learn from others. The point I was making was that our policies shouldn't be based on a reciprocal policy.

Why not? Shouldn't our citizens going to other countries, have the same rights & protections, as migrants coming to this country?

In any case, we're slowly moving/drifting away from the original points.

No, I said most anti-immigration people seem to believe that.

Sure. Some do. There's a lot of people on this thread who are not anti-immigration (myself included) but would be lumped in with them, because we don't fully accept the pro-immigration attitudes.

What's causing the instability? People wanting to be treated equally or the people already at the top of the pile trying to stop them? Instability in the West isn't being caused by human rights campaigners, it's caused by people like Trump and Johnson being voted in to resist change, whether it be positive or negative.

Now you're shifting goalposts. We were talking about the instability in the world, which was increasing the numbers of migrants who would seek access to Europe. But you want that to be about something else entirely.

Instability in non-western countries (or some recently joined EU countries) is driving migration patterns due to economic issues, political instability, religious division, etc.

This has nothing to do with the US.... This is about Ireland & Europe.

They'd fit in well here

Why? Because everyone who doesn't agree with your pov should be all lumped in together?

mr_fegelien

mr_fegelien wrote: »

AFAIK, the only migration that Ireland benefits from is supranational migration from EU countries where the same race of people and similar cultures ensures these people can integrate relatively easy.

Then Indians and Chinese should be allowed.

That's it. No other groups because you just look at their unemployment rate. It's said Africans and Muslims fare worse than all other immigrants.

Ireland and western nations benefit greatly from skilled migration from all countries, including those from Africa and the M.East. The key point is skilled.

Making this about ethnicity only gives those who want to claim discrimination ammo. It justifies their outrage.

Focus on economics and the ability to integrate (not assimilate) and most arguments fall apart, except for the humanitarian case. As for humanitarian, it makes sense to fix the problems we currently have in Europe before importing more problems.

Once those problems are resolved, Europe would be in a better place to help people both abroad, and within it's borders. Allowing in more needy migrants, simply stretches resources, and ignores the existing problems, further increasing the effect of those problems on society. Basically, Europe needs to become strong again. People want to pretend that everything is grand, but it's not.

Invidious

It should be simple.

Focus on rapid turnaround for asylum seekers — no more languishing in direct provision for years while solicitors pocket state legal aid for appeal after appeal after appeal. Admit genuine refugees, and deport everyone else quickly. As soon as we shed our image as a soft-touch country for asylum seekers, the numbers coming here will drop of their own accord.

All other non-EU migrants must have a degree or other marketable qualification, and should be ineligible to receive social welfare for their first 5 years in the country. We should let educated, hardworking people come here to contribute, but dissuade those who only want to avail of generous welfare benefits.

olestoepoke

Just read that there will be a muslim gathering in Croke Park called the sacrifice. They slaughter live animals for this religious festival. I've no problem with any religious gathering but will they actually be slaughtering live animals?

Slowyourrole

Deleted User wrote: »

Why not? Shouldn't our citizens going to other countries, have the same rights & protections, as migrants coming to this country?

Sure. But we can only control our own policies, not those of other countries. We should treat immigrants the same way we would like to be treated in other countries.

Deleted User wrote: »

Sure. Some do. There's a lot of people on this thread who are not anti-immigration (myself included) but would be lumped in with them, because we don't fully accept the pro-immigration attitudes.

OK.

Deleted User wrote: »

Now you're shifting goalposts. We were talking about the instability in the world, which was increasing the numbers of migrants who would seek access to Europe. But you want that to be about something else entirely.

Instability in non-western countries (or some recently joined EU countries) is driving migration patterns due to economic issues, political instability, religious division, etc.

This has nothing to do with the US.... This is about Ireland & Europe.

And most of that world instability is caused by religious or ethnic intolerance.

Deleted User wrote: »

Why? Because everyone who doesn't agree with your pov should be all lumped in together?

Because the views they express can be seen here too.

Wibbs

Slowyourrole wrote: »

Sure. But we can only control our own policies, not those of other countries. We should treat immigrants the same way we would like to be treated in other countries.

I have no problem with that if they're legal. Illegal is quite another matter. And yes I'd apply that to illegal Irish living in the US or Australia.

And most of that world instability is caused by religious or ethnic intolerance.

And yet you want to risk importing that here? The problems of European multiculturalism as it stands and has done for decades are also caused by religious or ethnic intolerance. Maybe you continue to miss the mass protests around the world in multicultural nations? But this time in Ireland it'll be different... Abracadabra. By magic.

Slowyourrole

Slowyourrole wrote: »

Sure. But we can only control our own policies, not those of other countries. We should treat immigrants the same way we would like to be treated in other countries.

Welll.... as the covid situation has shown, that's not strictly true. The EU is refusing to open borders to China/Taiwan until they do likewise... so there is often a reciprocal nature to these things..

And we actually do have similar policies regarding immigration as other nations, when those policies are enforced, and not bypassed for refugees, or political statements.

And most of that world instability is caused by religious or ethnic intolerance.

The statistics on migration into Europe wouldn't support that. Most cases are related to economic reasons, or as a result of warfare (usually a civil war of some type). You should take a look at the EU reports on the reasons why migrants come to Europe.. last one was for 2014 I think.

Because the views they express can be seen here too.

You've lost me.

DelaneyIn

Slowyourrole wrote: »

And most of that world instability is caused by religious or ethnic intolerance.

Why would you wish to import these issues?

DelaneyIn

DelaneyIn wrote: »

Why would you wish to import these issues?

Actually, I think there's some arrogance involved. For the most part, religion has been relegated to the shadows in Europe, with the rise of alternative faiths. I suspect people think that because Catholicism failed in Europe, then other organised religions will too... or simply they have no real understanding of what Islam is actually like. Few people have made the effort to go to a Islamic country such as in the M.East, so their perceptions are watered down.

You see, I've traveled through the M.East. I admired the architecture, the carpets, the stunning women (when I could see them, and just their eyes when I couldn't), and stood shivering listening to the call to prayer. It's another world, which I don't think many here really appreciate.. and it's all based on their religion. Their religion is the core part of their cultural identity depending on which heritage they fall under. Which is not an attack on Islam or Muslims BTW. I have no issue with such happening in their own countries... although I am very very nervous about it's presence in the West.. not as a minority, but when numbers are pretty high, like what happened in London.

Just as when I traveled through Western Africa, I heard account upon account of violence occurring because various tribes hated each other. Sure, the British and other colonial powers mixed them up, but the tribes are the ones continuing the violence towards each other.

There's an arrogance in the West, that suggests that migrants will simply stop whatever behavior they were doing in their own countries, and be someone else when they're here. Traditional hatreds spanning hundreds of years will simply disappear because migrants are so happy to be in Europe. Nor will they want to change Europe to be more like their own countries or cultures, because , well, Europe is wonderful. We're successful. Yay.

All the while, the same people cries against any suggestion of national pride. National pride for white people is white supremacy and leads to the dark side (although I suppose we should be saying leads to the white side now). We're no longer supposed to feel pride about any aspect of western culture that essentially made Europe one of the most successful areas in history...

Why do people want to import these problems? Because they're superior to everyone else. They've got their high morals and values... and they're different from others because they're enlightened. Reality doesn't matter because they seek to reshape reality to something else entirely. From what I can gather, they genuinely believe that they won't be affected except in positive ways by this new reality.

Oddly enough, I'd imagine it's like tripping on shrooms.

Sorry. Was in the mood for a soapbox speech.

Mr. Karate

olestoepoke wrote: »

Just read that there will be a muslim gathering in Croke Park called the sacrifice. They slaughter live animals for this religious festival. I've no problem with any religious gathering but will they actually be slaughtering live animals?

The whole point of EID is to sacrifice animals to appeal to Allah. If this was just prayers this could easily be done in their mosques [And Lord knows there's plenty in Dublin]

This treason on the Govt and GAA 's part and a sign that they have already conquered us on the Muslim's part.

jmreire

Deleted User wrote: »

Actually, I think there's some arrogance involved. For the most part, religion has been relegated to the shadows in Europe, with the rise of alternative faiths. I suspect people think that because Catholicism failed in Europe, then other organised religions will too... or simply they have no real understanding of what Islam is actually like. Few people have made the effort to go to a Islamic country such as in the M.East, so their perceptions are watered down.

You see, I've traveled through the M.East. I admired the architecture, the carpets, the stunning women (when I could see them, and just their eyes when I couldn't), and stood shivering listening to the call to prayer. It's another world, which I don't think many here really appreciate.. and it's all based on their religion. Their religion is the core part of their cultural identity depending on which heritage they fall under. Which is not an attack on Islam or Muslims BTW. I have no issue with such happening in their own countries... although I am very very nervous about it's presence in the West.. not as a minority, but when numbers are pretty high, like what happened in London.

Just as when I traveled through Western Africa, I heard account upon account of violence occurring because various tribes hated each other. Sure, the British and other colonial powers mixed them up, but the tribes are the ones continuing the violence towards each other.

There's an arrogance in the West, that suggests that migrants will simply stop whatever behavior they were doing in their own countries, and be someone else when they're here. Traditional hatreds spanning hundreds of years will simply disappear because migrants are so happy to be in Europe. Nor will they want to change Europe to be more like their own countries or cultures, because , well, Europe is wonderful. We're successful. Yay.

All the while, the same people cries against any suggestion of national pride. National pride for white people is white supremacy and leads to the dark side (although I suppose we should be saying leads to the white side now). We're no longer supposed to feel pride about any aspect of western culture that essentially made Europe one of the most successful areas in history...

Why do people want to import these problems? Because they're superior to everyone else. They've got their high morals and values... and they're different from others because they're enlightened. Reality doesn't matter because they seek to reshape reality to something else entirely. From what I can gather, they genuinely believe that they won't be affected except in positive ways by this new reality.

Oddly enough, I'd imagine it's like tripping on shrooms.

Sorry. Was in the mood for a soapbox speech.

This is the whole crux of the matter. A muslim's whole life is completely lived around Islam....and as you mentioned Klaz...unless you have lived ( and I mean lived, not just visited or for holidays ) amongst them, you cannot understand the mindset of Muslims, and how dedicated they are to their religion. Its the most important thing in their Lives. If all the pro-multicultural supporters lived for few months in an Islamic Country, they would have quite a different viewpoint.

Mr. Karate

Mr. Karate wrote: »

The whole point of EID is to sacrifice animals to appeal to Allah. If this was just prayers this could easily be done in their mosques [And Lord knows there's plenty in Dublin]

Dunno. I haven't heard the justifications for it yet. Just lots of complaining by people... I do find it a strange venue..

Have you had Halal meat? It's bloody good. If only we could get Muslim food without the religion being attached.. hmm..

This treason on the Govt and GAA 's part and a sign that they have already conquered us on the Muslim's part.

Ahh no... Actually, it's a pretty minor gesture to give them. When we start chopping hands for criminals, stoning women, allowing child marriage, then we're well on the way to being conquered.

Don't get me wrong. I do point out the dangers of Islam... Not because I hate it but because I respect it. Islam made the Middle East a number of the most powerful civilisations the world has seen (Ottomans, The Marmaluks, etc) and it's one of the few religions remaining with a growing population of converts.... That's pretty impressive.

And... while I do point out the dangers (as I see them), I'm not terribly interested in high drama. Muslims still make up a tiny percentage in Ireland.. they're not anywhere close to taking over. There is some risk of our governments pandering to them, by giving certain "rights", but honestly, that can be contested in our own law courts.... Irish law is still the law of the land.

jmreire

jmreire wrote: »

This is the whole crux of the matter. A muslim's whole life is completely lived around Islam....and as you mentioned Klaz...unless you have lived ( and I mean lived, not just visited or for holidays ) amongst them, you cannot understand the mindset of Muslims, and how dedicated they are to their religion. Its the most important thing in their Lives. If all the pro-multicultural supporters lived for few months in an Islamic Country, they would have quite a different viewpoint.

Haha... well.. I spent three weeks living with a Muslim family in Iran. Wonderful people. Incredible English and very well educated (their whole family were all University lecturers). I knew their son from teaching in China. We had many talks about Iranian culture, religion, etc. and.... while I was, once, a very devout Christian, I still didn't have a clue as to the connection they had with their religion. Oh, it's beautiful in many ways.... and scary, in others, when you see highly intelligent/educated people bow to religious authority on subjects. Still, it's not that different to the Chinese on many political issues.

Islam is everything to them. Oh, I've known young Muslim guys who live abroad, party, screw around, drink, do drugs etc... and then, they approach 30, and they're instantly a perfect Muslim. It's incredible. You can see the previous person in their eyes, but in reality, that person is dead. It's... an experience when you see it happen to someone you admired. Really wacky.

I love other cultures. It's my thing.... but Islam while often very beautiful in how it manifests in culture, also manifests in other ways. I've seen a lot of these other aspects, which have made me very nervous. It's not about individuals. We got a taste of mob rule with the recent BLM movement in the US... well, Islam is a mob religion. Very very powerful. You look at the individual, and then Islam can seem very reasonable. You look at the mob, and it's anything but reasonable. And that's the problem.... in small numbers Islam isn't an issue.. but once numbers increase dramatically.....

I don't think people realise that Islam isn't just in the M.East. It's very popular throughout Africa and Asia too... So, many migrants will be Muslim, even if they're not from a nationality we normally associate with Islam.

jmreire wrote: »

If all the pro-multicultural supporters lived for few months in an Islamic Country, they would have quite a different viewpoint.

Wanted to answer this point separately.

I genuinely don't think they would think differently. There's still that arrogance about Western culture, while also, at the same time, hatred of western culture. There's a kind of insanity affecting western nations now. This need to tear ourselves apart for... reasons. It's destructive, but people do it anyway. It's utterly retarded, but they do it anyway.

Many expats I know live abroad because we're expecting to see western nations implode. There's just too many agendas being pushed around.

Yurt2

Iranians aren't half as pious as you'd imagine, and there's a broadly secular country waiting to break out once the yoke of the Islamic Revolution is thrown off. Again, under the surface, it's more religiously pluralistic than is assumed.

Iranians I have met in Europe and elsewhere have been sharp as a tack, well educated and well spoken. Always keen to emphasise their Persian cultural heritage than the dead-hand of the monocultural Islamic Revolution, which they are vaguely embarrassed of I got the sense. Good folks all-round I feel

Then again, my sample size probably consists of exiles from urban Iran and those who would be broadly opposed to the excesses of the revolution.

jmreire

Deleted User wrote: »

Haha... well.. I spent three weeks living with a Muslim family in Iran. Wonderful people. Incredible English and very well educated (their whole family were all University lecturers). I knew their son from teaching in China. We had many talks about Iranian culture, religion, etc. and.... while I was, once, a very devout Christian, I still didn't have a clue as to the connection they had with their religion. Oh, it's beautiful in many ways.... and scary, in others, when you see highly intelligent/educated people bow to religious authority on subjects. Still, it's not that different to the Chinese on many political issues.

Islam is everything to them. Oh, I've known young Muslim guys who live abroad, party, screw around, drink, do drugs etc... and then, they approach 30, and they're instantly a perfect Muslim. It's incredible. You can see the previous person in their eyes, but in reality, that person is dead. It's... an experience when you see it happen to someone you admired. Really wacky.

I love other cultures. It's my thing.... but Islam while often very beautiful in how it manifests in culture, also manifests in other ways. I've seen a lot of these other aspects, which have made me very nervous. It's not about individuals. We got a taste of mob rule with the recent BLM movement in the US... well, Islam is a mob religion. Very very powerful. You look at the individual, and then Islam can seem very reasonable. You look at the mob, and it's anything but reasonable. And that's the problem.... in small numbers Islam isn't an issue.. but once numbers increase dramatically.....

I don't think people realise that Islam isn't just in the M.East. It's very popular throughout Africa and Asia too... So, many migrants will be Muslim, even if they're not from a nationality we normally associate with Islam.



Wanted to answer this point separately.

I genuinely don't think they would think differently. There's still that arrogance about Western culture, while also, at the same time, hatred of western culture. There's a kind of insanity affecting western nations now. This need to tear ourselves apart for... reasons. It's destructive, but people do it anyway. It's utterly retarded, but they do it anyway.

Many expats I know live abroad because we're expecting to see western nations implode. There's just too many agendas being pushed around.

I lived in Iran ( Mashad ) for 6 mths, and also further 6 mths as a frequent visitor staying for a week or two at a time, so year all told. As you said Klaz, a beautiful historic Country, lovely cultured and intelligent people. But suffering from and praying for a release from a religious dictatorship. There are the two Iranian's, the public one, who will not be seen doing anything un-islamic, and the real Iranian, within the confines of his house. They are two different people. Its something to see a wife or daughter arrive home covered head to to toe, and 2 minutes after the front door is closed, a remarkable transformation takes place. Like the butterfly emerging from its cocoon. A beautiful woman, dressed in western fashion, lipstick and make up appears. But still held fast in the iron grip of the Ayatollah's. A short trip across the Border to Afghanistan, and its a different story...I worked there for a nr of years, and its a much more strict version applied, and its the people themselves who apply it. In my years there, I have never met, not even once, the wifes or daughters of any of my colleagues. Even when a visitor to their houses, the food will be prepared by the womenfolk, but you won't see them...it will be served by the sons or male relatives. And this was even before the arrival of the Taliban, who ratcheted up an even more severe form of Islam. Cross another border into Pakistan, and you will meet well travelled and well educated Pakistani's,, but also out of control mob's rampaging through the streets, Its not too long ago that thousand's of them marched on Islamabad to demand the death penalty for Asia Bibi, after a court found her not guilty of the heinous crime of insulting the profit. They were stopped on the highway, but basically shut down the city for several days until the Govt said that Asia would not be released, and only then did they disperse. Since then , the govt have arrested the ringleaders, and they are now in prison. But it shows what whipped up religious fervour is capable of. And this has happened in other Country's too. So its all in the Nrs. But the bottom line is, you can take the man from his islamic country, but you can never take the Islam from the man, not even when he travels to a different non islamic Country. And also as you mentioned, when abroad, a Muslim be it he / she will have a good social life, and all the new Country can offer, but sooner or later, they revert to Islam. A friend of mine met up with a Muslim woman, and they were living together. At the outset, my friend made it clear that he wanted nothing to do with religion...any religion, If she wanted a religious ceremony, he would go along with it, but only for show....he would not be converting to Islam. And she full accepted this at the time, and they went on to have 2 daughters. She is exactly the type of person many people on Boards would have met, and formed their Islamic opinions on. Fast forward 20 odd years, daughters now in University, and out of the Blue,,,,,wife demands that from this day forth, he will become a fully practicing Muslim,,, no discussion or argument. They are now split up. So what triggered this? I don't know, but it seems to be a fairly common occurrence. I know both of them very well,,have eaten and drank with them, she is a well educated intelligent woman, yet despite living in Europe for all of her married life ( she is now a Danish Citizen ) at the end of the day, the pull of Islam was stronger than anything else in her life.

jmreire

From Klaz:
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmreire View Post
If all the pro-multicultural supporters lived for few months in an Islamic Country, they would have quite a different viewpoint.
Wanted to answer this point separately.

I genuinely don't think they would think differently. There's still that arrogance about Western culture, while also, at the same time, hatred of western culture. There's a kind of insanity affecting western nations now. This need to tear ourselves apart for... reasons. It's destructive, but people do it anyway. It's utterly retarded, but they do it anyway.

Many expats I know live abroad because we're expecting to see western nations implode. There's just too many agendas being pushed around.
Last edited by klaz; Yesterday at 23:58.

From hearing about Islam and Muslims, to actually living with them in their own Country, how did it affect your perception of Islam? Because, its not everyone who has the chance to do this, in the best case, people will have Muslim colleagues and friends here in Ireland, but that's not a true sampel of Islam. For the rest, their experience of Islam is gleaned from TV, newspapers and hearsay. You are right about the state of Western Nations ( and not only the west either) giving cause for worry..... there seems to be no strong central point to anchor ourselves around to bring stability.

jmreire

jmreire wrote: »

From hearing about Islam and Muslims, to actually living with them in their own Country, how did it affect your perception of Islam?

I didn't have any strong preconceptions about Muslims or Islam before I left Ireland. I had some knowledge from reading and movies (El Cid being one of my favorite movies), but I really knew nothing about Muslims, nor did I really trust the information I had. I understood early, that there's a big difference between what you're exposed to in the West, vs what something is really like.

My first experience was a woman. I fell hard for a woman I met, who was half-Egyptian and half-Persian. Muslim to the hilt. Very devout but somewhat flexible. She taught me a lot about the religion, explained the Koran to me, and made me appreciate the history & culture. From her explanations, I actually held Islam in rather high regard.

Because, its not everyone who has the chance to do this, in the best case, people will have Muslim colleagues and friends here in Ireland, but that's not a true sampel of Islam.

The problem is that it's very rare to be invited into actually sharing the realities of a Muslims life. As a westerner. We get to see certain aspects which are watered down for viewing. Typically, M.Eastern societies are very shy about showing what they consider private affairs, so few westerners ever get the opportunity to experience it, with someone to explain what's happening... instead people steal glances and interpret it all through the lens of western values. Which is why so much is seen as a negative, or... a positive. There's a lot of both going on. For me, the problem is that based on my experiences, both of these positives and negatives reported about Islam tend to be opposite of my own experience.

For the rest, their experience of Islam is gleaned from TV, newspapers and hearsay. You are right about the state of Western Nations ( and not only the west either) giving cause for worry..... there seems to be no strong central point to anchor ourselves around to bring stability.

There is one clear point which I will always remember because I've heard it repeated many times, from many sources, and it is this. There is one religion, and that religion is Islam... and everyone shall be Muslim. That will happen. It's an absolute. It might not be here today, but at some time in the future everyone believer, or not, will embrace the truth that Mohammad is the Prophet, and the God of Islam is the one true God.

People like to suggest that this is simply rhetoric. A propaganda piece. Just like the Christian Church made similar statements, but never managed to bring it about. Islam, though, is different. They believe that this will be the case sometime in the future. Whether by words or by the sword, it will come about. Which is part of the reason why I'm very very nervous about Islam.

The other reason is that across the world Islamic nations are all reverting to the more fundamental teachings. Take Indonesia, which became very successful, was a leader in rights for women, has done almost a complete U-turn, embracing the more traditional beliefs for Islam.. and it mostly came from the women.. That's scary. That the women who had gained all these freedoms, chose to turn back to bondage.

Islam can be a beautiful faith. No, truly, it can be. Which is the problem really. Westerners nowadays want to do away with nuance and subtlety. Absolutes are the rule now. Black/White. Right/Wrong. Good/Bad. Very simple states about reality. So, they see the good in Islam, but can't recognize the bad. They know it exists, but since there's so much good, they focus entirely on that. Which is very dangerous. Islam is an old faith, and people have a long history of spreading Islam to other nations whether through peace or war... Without question in my mind, Islam is easily the most successful religion in spreading itself around the world.

Quick thing to add.

I've enjoyed living in Islamic Nations... and I probably will do so again (depending on the national culture, though.... some countries are horrible). However, I don't want my nieces growing up in an Islamic nation. It's fine for women who are native to that culture. That's life.... but I really don't want that carryon going on here. This is Ireland, and should retain our own unique national culture.. and more importantly our values.

If I ever get around to having children, I'd raise them in Ireland, because it's (for now) a great country to raise a family. I wouldn't do so in a Muslim country. Although I have no hesitation in saying that as a Single person, I'd live there.

edit: I would highly recommend a visit to Iran at some point (after covid is wrapped up naturally) because it's a wonderful destination. Less so for women but if you're male, it's a great spot for culture, and a very friendly culture. Just leave your politics at home.

Clarence Boddiker

Ireland’s population has diversified over the past decade. Just 82% of the population identifies as white Irish in the 2016 Census, compared to 94% in 2011.

12% shift in only 5 years, absolutely insane. Is there any other country on Earth that has experienced such a rapid demographic shift?

https://www.noteworthy.ie/proposal/racism-work-ireland-107-Jun2020

Mr. Karate

Deleted User wrote: »

Ahh no... Actually, it's a pretty minor gesture to give them.

That's how they eventually take over. Constantly giving them these minor gestures add up. "Oh...Its just a mosque, What's the harm?", "Oh its just a prayer service in our National Stadium. What's the harm?", "Oh its just a head scarf, What's the harm?" They always take over piece by piece.

And guess what. They won't be so quick to give us minor gestures if/when they become the majority. That's why you can't keep appeasing groups no matter how much they want to scream about minority rights. Because if the tables are turned they will never return the favor.

Yurt2

Clarence Boddiker wrote: »

Ireland’s population has diversified over the past decade. Just 82% of the population identifies as white Irish in the 2016 Census, compared to 94% in 2011.

12% shift in only 5 years, absolutely insane. Is there any other country on Earth that has experienced such a rapid demographic shift?

https://www.noteworthy.ie/proposal/racism-work-ireland-107-Jun2020

The figure in that article (94 percent in 2011) is incorrect, and I see exactly where the misread from the CSO factsheet released in 2017 came from.

The correct figure for 2011 is 85.8 percent identifying themselves as white Irish.

2011: 85.8 percent white Irish
2016: 82.2 percent white Irish

For accuracy...

https://www.thejournal.ie/ethnicity-ireland-census-2011-640737-Oct2012/

jmreire

Yes, since the 6th century, the spread of Islam has been relentless...it has ebbed and flowed down through the years, but its momentum is still there.Its there because from baby stage to death, and all the days in between, its your very way of life.. Even before you start school, you will be taught the Quran,and every day for the rest of your Life, you will pray 5 times each day. You will measure your Life by how good a Muslim you are...and so, its second nature to spread it in any Country you find yourself in. And its happening, plenty of evidence of that in any Country where the Nr's of Muslims has grown. It is helped by our Democracy, which guarantees the freedom of Religion, so it can be legally propagated. The equivalent concept cannot be found in Islam,,its effectively a one way street. And its a strict religion, once you are in, there is no out ( there are exceptions to this of course, depending on which Country its happening in, in the UK, for example you have the "UK Council for ExMuslims,,,who have to hide behind false name's . And this in a western society ?) On the other side of the coin, there are the reward's if you reach Jannah ( paradise ) So you have the carrot and the stick, and dedicated, willing participants. So it works. But take over the World??? I'm not so sure about that...here in Europe, they have to date, being relatively unimpeded in their progression...so far. But there is a growing anti-islamic back lash gathering pace in the west. This can be seen in recent election results, where anti immigration party's have become very pronounced. Then of course you have the very active prosecution of the Muslim Uighurs....or "re-education " as the Chinese call it., Plus, while its not mentioned too much ( maybe for obvious reasons ) there are many thousands of Muslims who leave Islam every year, and also the many who while not leaving it, are definitely not practising it either. You can add to the mix who are the Real Muslims? Shia? Sunni? + variations of both? Maybe as you have said, Islam will rule the world someday.....but even if it will happen, there will have to be major change's taking place in the world before then. Personally. I never want to see it, Muslim, the Man /Woman, welcome. Islam, the religion, no. Not under any circumstances.

excludedbin

Clarence Boddiker wrote: »

Ireland’s population has diversified over the past decade. Just 82% of the population identifies as white Irish in the 2016 Census, compared to 94% in 2011.

12% shift in only 5 years, absolutely insane. Is there any other country on Earth that has experienced such a rapid demographic shift?

https://www.noteworthy.ie/proposal/racism-work-ireland-107-Jun2020

This shift to multiculturalism is not necessarily reflected equally in employment statistics. While 15% of the workforce in Ireland identifies as being of migrant descent, the upper tiers of management in the public and private sectors remain predominantly white Irish.

In 2018, the Economic and Social Research Institute (ESRI) reported that black non-Irish people are five times more likely than white Irish people to experience discrimination when seeking employment. And when it comes to racist incidents in the workplace, Ireland ranked last year as one of the worst Europe-wide with a rate of 33%, compared to an EU average of 22%.

It should also be noted that "“Any other White background” (9.5%)", while "non-Chinese Asian (1.7%)", and “Other incl. mixed background” (1.5%).

Source: https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp8iter/p8iter/p8e/

But I'm sure that won't stop the usual names from promoting hysteria about the Saracen hordes coming to "take us over". After all, we have them to thank for one of he worst rates of racist incidents in the workplace in Europe. Of course they see a brown face and their pea brains immediately think 'Muslim' and they can't help but give that innocent person an earful of abuse.

Don't let these neanderthals drag us backwards.

biko

excludedbin wrote: »

But I'm sure that won't stop the usual names from promoting hysteria about the Saracen hordes coming to "take us over".

Sweden is now at 33% foreign background spread over the entire nation.
This used to be one of the most homogeneous societies around, much like Ireland.
In the three main cities the population is now half and half old Swedes and new Swedes.

Half of women having children in Sweden are from foreign background - a third are non-European.

When is it "taking us over" to you? At 51%? 75%? When that happens, what will you do? Nothing, it'll be too late then.



https://tobiashubinette.wordpress.com/ src

excludedbin

It'll be "taking over" to me once there's even a shred of evidence for this "taking over". Immigration, no matter how much you stamp your feet, is not "taking over", "invading", or whatever you want to call it. There's a lot of conspiracy theory stuff but as usual, little to no facts.

Cordell

In 2018, the Economic and Social Research Institute (ESRI) reported that black non-Irish people are five times more likely than white Irish people to experience discrimination when seeking employment. And when it comes to racist incidents in the workplace, Ireland ranked last year as one of the worst Europe-wide with a rate of 33%, compared to an EU average of 22%.

That's only because these incidents are recorded and investigated. Ireland is one of the least racist country in EU, if not THE least racist.

biko

excludedbin wrote: »

It'll be "taking over" to me once there's even a shred of evidence for this "taking over". Immigration, no matter how much you stamp your feet, is not "taking over", "invading", or whatever you want to call it. There's a lot of conspiracy theory stuff but as usual, little to no facts.

The numbers I presented are from government funded researcher Tobias Hübinette. He is actually very pro-immigration and have some gems that BLM would not be able to match

To feel or even think that the white race is inferior in every conceivable way is natural given its history and current actions.
Let the western race of the white race perish in blood and suffering.
Long live the multicultural, racially mixed and classless ecological society!
Long live the anarchist!

excludedbin

excludedbin wrote: »

It'll be "taking over" to me once there's even a shred of evidence for this "taking over". Immigration, no matter how much you stamp your feet, is not "taking over", "invading", or whatever you want to call it. There's a lot of conspiracy theory stuff but as usual, little to no facts.

Taking over, no... I don't believe I've ever said that any particular group would be taking over Ireland (others have, but oddly enough, they're a minority on the thread).

I have said that the movement for minority groups could gain too much influence in promoting their cultures/religions, but, nope. Nothing about taking over.

Hmmm... little to no facts. Actually, the thread is pretty full of facts for those people who are willing to do some reading. Oh, you mean, we're not reposting all the links and references every couple of pages, whenever someone makes an objection that has been made a dozen times before?

Oh. I'm sorry. You're not the first to make such a comment. Shocking, isn't it? (I'm truly not trying to be sarcastic or nasty here) I'll share a little secret about this thread. Every so often someone joins in full of objections regarding the discussion, demanding links and evidence.... and when that evidence is presented, it's either deflected or the poster disappears on to another thread. It's happened to us all a few times on this thread.