What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

Cordell

We like to think that Western medicine is scientific and reliable, but a lot of it is experimentation

Of course it is all those, all in the same time. Being scientific implies experimentation, and also implies getting reliable results. This is how any scientific field, and medicine is one of them, moves forward.

Not all nations follow the "western" codes of practices

True, but the doctors in Ireland need to follow Irish codes of practices.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119753678#Comment_119753678

Of course it is all those, all in the same time. Being scientific implies experimentation, and also implies getting reliable results. This is how any scientific field, and medicine is one of them, moves forward.

Reliable results. Yup. I went through just over a decade of visits to consultants, receiving cocktails of drugs, with them altering the various balance of the infusions involved... and in spite of all the warnings about the medicines used (which weren't discussed), I still went through years of puking, pissing blood, skin discoloration, rashes, bouts of internal bleeding, migraines, lethargy, "fits", etc.. and finally, when I had enough and could put an end to it (not that these experts wanted to end their examinations), I have permanent internal damage to various organs. Still, none the wiser on the nature of my shaking "disorder", or how to treat it (except that it, might, possibly be related to Essential Tremor which is another vague diagnosis with little real scientific understanding behind it).

Science suggests that if you do XYZ ten times, you will get the same result with slight/minor/minute deviations. Western medicine is not that. Definitely when western medicine intersects with psychology.. it's not that.

Western medicine has often stepped sideways, and occasionally backwards, on it's route towards forward progress. There's a lot of propaganda which revolves around anything considered "western".

True, but the doctors in Ireland need to follow Irish codes of practices.

Yes, they do. However, I was referring to their education, and there's also a lot of leeway involved when it comes to diagnosis/treatment, especially when you step away from the more official/monitored hospital floors, and enter private practices.

Cordell

Going through what you did I can understand why you lost faith in western medicine, but

Definitely when western medicine intersects with psychology

When science combine with pseudoscience all the science is gone and both become pseudoscience. And with all it's failures, because there are failures in any scientific field, western medicine is still superior. And in fact it's the only one that can be called medicine.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754137#Comment_119754137

We're going way off base here, but in certain areas, Western medicine is superior. In other areas, it's just as prone to guessology (and taking ideas from the ancients when it can't prove something wrong). Considering the consumer/business aspect applied to medicine, it's deviated a lot from the main tenants of scientific progress.

Let's just say that we disagree in terms of Western Medicine. And agree that substandard "qualified" doctors do come from developing nations to work in Ireland... which would be a sign that multiculturalism is "working as intended".

ShamNNspace

Multiculturalism in action for good or bad in Cologne, now maybe it's a good thing, maybe it's not, we have the Angelus after all but it may not be long before the call to prayer rings out here too in the near future

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754764#Comment_119754764

We got out from under the yoke of one form of superstition and control and yet are inviting another in, and all too often those who celebrate the former also celebrate the latter.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754764#Comment_119754764

It's quite a beautiful sound when called out over a city.. however, while I expect to see/hear it in traditionally Muslim countries, I definitely don't expect to see it happen in the West. Nor should it.

We don't "allow" all religions and faiths to express themselves fully here. They're protected, yes, but the respect towards religion needs to be extended equally towards everyone.. and this isn't it.

Nope. I don't like it. Not in Europe. It should remain in the M.East, Asia or Africa where Islam has held a majority for centuries. Which is why we have the Angelus here (although that's dying too), or the Catholic/Protestant bells ringing out in European countries.. because of history, tradition, etc. Its' been part of our culture for centuries. Islam hasn't. Nor should it be treated the same in this regard.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754764#Comment_119754764

The funny thing is all the secularists thought they were building societies without religion, that void will always be fillled

ShamNNspace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754922#Comment_119754922

I lived in both Berlin and Munich in the 80s and 90s and visit them from time to time and imv changes haven't been for the better especially since Merkels time, drug gang wars in Berlin, Munich Centre full of hookah bars, not a nice place at night anymore, I agree there was something soothing and comforting to hear the call for prayer when I was in Turkey especially in the morning, but I never expected to hear the call to prayer ring out from a city like Cologne in the centre of Europe in my lifetime but "that's the way" as the old people used say when they put a full stop on a conversation

malinheader

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754764#Comment_119754764

Do They celebrate the angelus in these other countries. I would bet that they Don't

malinheader

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754812#Comment_119754812

What's next Saturday night stonings.

Sky probably be looking for the coverage.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119755077#Comment_119755077

Ahh well, I lived in Frankfurt for a year, and I never "liked" the Turkish quarter. Now, later, having experienced a lot of Northern African cultures, I can see that there's a difference in how Islamic cultures behave. In Iran, or Jordan, the expression of Islam is obvious but rather gentle. (Yeah, I know all the bad things about Iran). The expression of Islam was soaked into the rocks. However, there is a roughness, an aggressive side to Turkish Islam or the North African Islamic societies. In Frankfurt, the Turkish quarter was no longer German. Different languages spoken, and the signposts defaced with other script

This is my problem with Islam in Europe. We look at Islam and see it as being the same everywhere. But it's not. I don't want to see the spread, and acceptance of Islam, because throughout the world, nations with majority Islamic populations are turning towards the harder more fundamentalist interpretations of Islam, and how societies should operate within it. And the Islamic population in Europe is continuing to grow rather quickly.. We really need to make a stand against how Islam becomes established here..

I don't have anything against Islam per se. I believe it's suitable for M.East, and parts of Asia/Africa. If they want it, so be it. Their choice. However, I don't want it in Europe.. the cultural aspects of control feature too strongly, as does the focus on male dominance. Being male, you'd think it wouldn't bother me so much, but it does. It's just wrong for us... we have our own culture and values.. we don't need to regress into theirs.

Acceptance of Islam in this manner is another step towards that new reality where Islam has greater influence to affect societal change in European countries.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119755183#Comment_119755183

European countries tend to have a greater separation between Church and State, and by extension how religion is expressed socially. It helps that most of Northern Europe had very strong Protestant influences, which is a very "quiet" religion in how it expresses itself. You might hear Church bells ringing the odd time. Southern Germany and Austria often have this.. with the Church bells ringing each day at certain times, but it's easily ignored. It's certainly not broadcasted across the whole city, which the Islamic call to prayer will do.

AllForIt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119755077#Comment_119755077

I agree there was something soothing and comforting to hear the call for prayer when I was in Turkey especially in the morning,

How long did you reside there, cuz I lived in Istanbul with my other half way back and I found it rather irritating and a bit creepy. The novelty wore off pretty quick, for me anyway. Can't believe that's going on in Germany now.

ShamNNspace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119756989#Comment_119756989

Never lived there, holidayed 4 times there, maybe if I was there longer my mind would have changed but that was my experience anyway for the few weeks at a time I was there, I suppose I took the view it was their country and their customs, who was I to disrespect it

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754764#Comment_119754764

Wonder if its been challenged on the basis of noise pollution. I've never lived in Germany but I Think I remember that they have very strict noise regulations on things like having your washing machine on during the night. I wonder how this call to prayer will square with that culture

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119758546#Comment_119758546

Like it's the first time when indigenous culture is forced, bent and sacrificed to make room for the foreign one. Well, like all the great civilizations the western civilization has to die someday, and that's how is starts.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119758751#Comment_119758751

haha... in Germany? It's most likely the place where serious pushback occurs. No, seriously. In spite of all the indoctrination and social guilt over the Holocaust or Hitler's Germany, there remains a very strong sense of self in German people, and the kind of reaction they might have to the "wrong" influence in their country.

Other European nations are more... patient, with the perspective of outlasting the foreign cultures, ultimately believing that their own cultures will be superior enough to assimilate others. It's never said, but personally, I suspect that's the case. Assimilation is still the hope regardless of all this talk about integration. However, Germans? They've already had a series of marches, riots, etc over the amount of foreign groups in their country, and the divisions that have occurred, along with the economic costs that Germans have had to shoulder for other nationalities (both in Germany and as part of the EU).

Honestly, I think someone made a rather big mistake here in deciding to start this in Germany. Denmark would have been a better starting point, maybe gaining acceptance in a few other countries before spreading the idea into German and France. However, Germany and France are increasingly becoming more hostile to the influence of foreign cultures, especially that of Islam.

It's only a matter of time before it all explodes.

As for western culture, I do think we're seeing an end to the current expression of it. If Germany/France explode in response to the foreign populations existing, it will mean the rise of the " Right" and all that entails. Not nationalist socialism, but more likely something closer to the original ideas for Italian Fascism, tempered by modern sentiments. But it will be the end of western culture as we know it.

Which, perhaps is a good thing. Western culture has shown itself remarkably weak to dealing with foreign culture and non-native populations. The "evolution" of societal movements, originating in the US (but not exclusive to it), has also shown a self-destructive and almost self-hate for western society. So, maybe this will be a good thing, with something better and stronger emerging. Going to be a rough few decades though. It's worth remembering that Germans view all non-Germans, including other Europeans, as being little different from their foreigners from outside Europe (with there being similar attitudes in both France and Spain). So, it could be a difficult period for all concerned, depending on who garners enough public support.

malinheader

Any women on here advocating that multiculturalism is good should look up what has happened to the Iranian athlete who partook without wearing the head covering. Can't tell you what happened her yet because they are still trying to contact or locate her????

Females especially should be careful what they say is good for multiculturalism. I believe Islam is definitely not.

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119758805#Comment_119758805

The time for pushback was decades ago, but I will be happy to be proven wrong.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119759692#Comment_119759692

There wasn't the environment within society for it. Western nations carry so much guilt. The guilt over being more successful, the guilt over imperialism, or colonialism, or the guilt over WW2.. etc. All of which ensured that there was no focus point to respond to the changing world within western nations. The social movements of America ensured that through the PC movement that any resistance was squashed.

It's going to take time for the effects of the "thought police" and the PC movements to decline in effectiveness, but it's happening now. There's far more public disagreement with the pro-immigration or multiculturalism positions that ever before.

Also, in all honesty, the time for a pushback wasn't decades ago, because we needed to go through this rubbish to evolve into something else. To recognise the weaknesses that manifested within our societies, and the philosophies/ideologies that were emerging. Otherwise, Western culture would have stagnated more.. and it was stagnating. TBH it's no different to the reaction to Hitlers Germany and the changes that swept Western nations as a result. A shift in focus away from Imperialism, racial superiority towards equality, and compassion. All cultures need hotspots to see where they're heading the wrong direction, and so, steer towards something better.

I tend to get rather pessimistic about the state of Western nations, and subsequently, Western culture.. but I'm feeling a lot more optimistic as time goes by. In part. I still think we're screwed as long as we tolerate/ignore our flawed political systems, all the while advocating for how wonderful it is. That will bite us in the ass at some point, probably countering a lot of the positive change that might arise from the counter-movements towards multiculturalism.

Mike Murdock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119759893#Comment_119759893

If and when LePen wins the Presidency next time around, it’ll be funny to see the surprised Pikachu faces that this twat Macron, and the media in Ireland and Europe make.

Miadhc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119759960#Comment_119759960

Yeah tbh man, I haven't much faith in the political system at this stage. We need very radical solutions. I'm not seeing them getting proposed. I'm watching to see what's gonna happen in Italy, Sweden. It doesn't look all that good initially. I hope to be wrong.

Dyr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119759960#Comment_119759960

If LePen was going to win anything she'd have done it by now.

Macron is apologizing because he needs to Toady up to the Algerians. Those lads shouldnt have been killed, they should have been rounded up and dropped back into Algeria. Imagine the Brits tolerating that from Germans in london during WW2.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119759880#Comment_119759880

Lola is one of eleven French girls who have been murdered so far this year by suspects with North African and the Sub-Saharan background.

Miadhc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119760576#Comment_119760576

https://mobile.twitter.com/GBNEWS/status/1582099926724796416

It seems so yes.

lmao10

Ah we're back to spamming the thread with crimes committed by immigrants.

Miadhc

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/dont-need-the-hate-post-kellie-harrington-deletes-tweet-about-immigrants-42075817.html

Kellie Harrington attacked by the Twitter mob for having the cheek to notice a pattern.

>After deleting her original tweet, Harrington returned to Twitter and issued another message, she said: “Deleted and walked away. As someone rightly suggested, thanks.

>“Don't need the hate post! But my god, that poor poor soul. Absolutely heart breaking, just a wee girl, her whole life ahead of her.

wonder who her handler was.

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119760964#Comment_119760964

What do you expect? She retweeted the far right, fascist outlet GB news.

Ireland is almost becoming a unique case, where the I word can't even be said in anything but positive terms. With the way things are going it means that if there's a turn around, it will be led by the plebs and not the celebs, as they've no way of voicing their views without ruining their careers.

Independent.ie has contacted Harrington's management for comment

😂

Miadhc

>Generalising to Immigrants is wrong

One sentence later...

>Generalises to Immigrants