What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970727#Comment_119970727

Collapse in young home ownership rates will leave future retirees financially exposed, study finds – The Irish Times

things weren't not always this bad, the rate of home ownership among young people, has halved from 60% to 27%, in the years, 2004-2019.

yes, people did live in bedsits, but only for a couple of years, in order to save money.

ShamNNspace

The banning of bedsits pushed by the greens in 2013 or so was a terrible mistake imv, yes they needed to be regulated properly but they suited a lot of people back then, like the loner types who knew no other way of life and in their own way were happy enough, the builders who stayed in them Mon to Fri and going down home at the weekends,the students roughing it on the cheap, those between rents or those saving to buy a house, as long as they were clean and well regulated with shared bathrooms and all they were fine, instead they were banned Allmost overnight with nothing to replace them

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970818#Comment_119970818

Well, some of us did anyways dursey, I didn’t, because I was sleeping rough at the time, so I do take that into consideration as a factor which may inform my perspective where other people perceive as a crisis, and I don’t. I’ve considered it, but it’s not really an influencing factor.

More objectively, when you’re referring to rates of home ownership among young people in Irish society, having worked in the homelessness charity sector, home ownership is practically welded into the Irish psyche among the middle and lower classes, I’m sure you’re familiar with the idea of those people who express a desire for their ‘foreva home’, and the criticism such an attitude to having their own home tends to attract around these parts.

If you were to look at other countries in Europe, those more developed economies than Ireland such as Germany and France, the concept of home ownership isn’t really a thing. Home ownership rates in Germany for example are around 50%. Romania has the highest rate of home ownership at 95% -

https://www.statista.com/statistics/246355/home-ownership-rate-in-europe/

The projections in that article mirror the direction of German society and align with the direction Ireland is heading - talk of requiring increasing numbers of migrants to fulfil a labour shortage and alleviate a looming pensions crisis (there’s that word again), with Germany facing the same dilemma as Ireland is currently facing in it’s future without significant reforms -

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2022/10/31/germanys-pension-system-will-collapse-without-reform-influential-lobby-group-says.html

The reality is that Ireland really doesn’t have any other choice but to encourage more migrants to come here and try to encourage them to stay here long term and establish themselves, but that seems unlikely given how expensive the cost of living is in urban areas like Dublin which is home to 28% of the population, and nobody wants to live outside the city in the underdeveloped rural regions.

This creates what some people will call an accommodation crisis, a housing crisis, etc, which is based upon perception from their perspective, as opposed to the reality of an actual crisis if they were expected to be packed head to toe into a one-room ‘apartment’ with only one shower and toilet facilities between 20 of them while being expected to pay €300 a month for the privilege. There are differing opinions as to the extent of any crisis, depending upon whom you ask. For some, there isn’t a crisis in Ireland for purchased properties, there is a crisis for rental properties -

https://selectra.ie/moving/tips/housing-crisis-ireland

Immigrants holed up in bedsits that aren’t called bedsits, basically shìt conditions unfit for human habitation, aren’t depriving Irish people of such accommodation. Immigrants holed up in refugee shelters and direct provision and all the rest of it, aren’t depriving Irish people of accommodation either. Government sees fit to ignore people in such conditions, and the only time anyone appears to give a shìt is when they’re looking to blame others for their reality not meeting their expectations. That’s why they imagine depriving other groups in society of support will mean they will have all the support for themselves that they feel they have contributed to throughout their working lives.

That’s a very simplistic view of supply and demand focused on themselves, whereas from Governments perspective they have to regard the functioning and competitiveness of Irish society as a whole, as opposed to having to appease people who feel uncomfortable with Non-Europeans in their area.

jmayo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119969635#Comment_119969635

Yet another impressive word count.

I can't be bothered reading through all that blatter after your first sentence yet again shows your complete lack of understanding.

Seriously at this stage you are making yourself look like an eejit.

I did however spot your parting shot.

I have never ever said I want a pureblood native Ireland and I demand you withdraw that remark.

For all your incessant blattering that of course makes look to some as a sort of intellectual scholar adept in the art of debate, you still have to resort to the cheap shots at the end.

Time for ignore.

One benefit will be that it will make the thread a hell of a lot shorter.

xxxxxxl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119971507#Comment_119971507

Someone should suggest there are in fact no pure blood Irish as it's put. Ireland has been intermingling with the UK for centuries. There are however Irish natives to this Island with a Rich culture and Identity of their own. That should be on peoples minds and wanted to be protected.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119971507#Comment_119971507

I have never ever said I want a pureblood native Ireland and I demand you withdraw that remark.

You what now?

Must think you’re talking to an immigrant.

Nosler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119971167#Comment_119971167

"The reality is that Ireland really doesn’t have any other choice but to encourage more migrants to come here and try to encourage them to stay here long term and establish themselves...."

Absolutely no one has made the case for mass immigration into Ireland? Even if we all agreed that Ireland needed mass immigration would we really want the likes of Roma Gypsies?

The arguments from the pro immigration crowd are just bizarre.

Hungry Burger

What is most baffling to me, is the rabid support of mass immigration from the LGBT community, especially migration from Muslim majority countries, I have a close relative from this particular community so know plenty of people in it who completely support this. I find it so strange that these people usually are highly hostile and critical to the Catholic Church yet embrace the “cultural enrichment” of the country from young, mostly male members of a certain hardcore fundamentalist, highly rigid belief system which doesn’t view their lifestyle favourably, to say the least.

I certainly see, coming from the left and the far left, especially those from historically “marginalised” groups. That they feel that they have not gained anything from normal society, and have a conscious or unconscious desire to destroy the society in which they feel they have been oppressed by, whether this is by the undermining of the family, state, law and order, institutions or indeed, the ethnic and cultural homogeneity of the country.

Ireland needs a legitimate right wing opposition, and fast or I feel we are headed for a situation in which no one will benefit, and the Irish people will suffer greatly.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119972950#Comment_119972950

Completely agree.

I'm a member of the so-called "LGBT community", and I'm aghast that the positive developments we have made in this country are being reversed by mass immigration from Islamic countries that have stone age views of gay people - but not only gay people, but also women too (that's more than 54% of the population).

The standard defence you get is that "...well, we don't know what each migrant believes so we cannot judge, maybe we are getting the most liberal ones", but we all know that statistically speaking, if you have 10,000+ migrants from a socially backward country, most of them will bring those social views with them.

There's also a large cohort who feel they have to support migration because it's what lefties and "good people" support. So a blind adherence to a policy, even if it objectively damages the rights of the people who support it, is followed.

buried

Don't know why any of you would be aghast. It's plainly obvious what's going on. The establishment want the proles at each others throats, both migrants and natives. That way, when they inevitably go for each others throats, the establishment can reign in new controls to subjugate them all.

Hungry Burger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119972979#Comment_119972979

And of course you are 100% correct and justifiable in your concerns, but I feel sadly, that if you were to express your concerns in public, you would be ostracised by the majority in your community.

I hope I am wrong..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119973024#Comment_119973024

Trust me, I can't express half of my opinions within the so-called "LGBT community" without being completely ostracised!

It's very much dominated by a very singular and often very angry perspective. Very, very angry people, and you never know which one will snap. It's the most intolerant group I know.

I've learned to manage it, but you're right; the backlash is extreme.

Sand

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119971519#Comment_119971519

The argument that "mass migration" has always happened, every European ethnicity is meaningless as a result so what's different now always bemuses me. The advocates for mass migration are referring to much smaller movements of people and they largely left little or no trace in the modern populations. Further and more importantly, the "migrants" were violently resisted by the indigenous people. Even after the initial invasion, centuries of ethnically driven mayhem and bloodshed followed

So to the extent that modern European populations reflect ethnic diversity (they largely don't) its best viewed as scars from past trauma, not an argument to do it all over again but far worse this time.

------------------------

"The reality is that Ireland really doesn’t have any other choice but to encourage more migrants to come here and try to encourage them to stay here long term and establish themselves...."

The baseless assertion that Ireland doesn't have any other choice other than mass migration is nonsensical and completely without any foundation. Its the last refuge for people who have no decent justification for their views. There is no alternative, TINA, TINA. Yeah right.

Ireland has choices and the policy makers ought to be held accountable for the choices they make.

Mass migration has made and continues to make the outcomes for Irish people far worse. The only people who benefit from mass migration are those who receive massive transfers of wealth from the Irish people to "solve" the problems they themselves created by mass migration into Ireland. The NGOs who referee it, the politicians who legislate for it, the landlords who enable it and the property developers who profit from it. They have to be held to account.

Hungry Burger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119973033#Comment_119973033

Which I find very sad, because there are plenty of very intelligent and very astute people in the LGBT community, especially those who fought for equal rights under the law and did so extremely successfully.

I think the fringe and radical elements, who would smear anyone who talks out about mass migration as far right are completely missing the point, because it’s those people who are actually looking out for their best interests!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119973068#Comment_119973068

For sure, the left used to campaign for gay rights, women's rights, and working class people / their rights.

Now it campaigns for men's rights, straight middle class people, and immigrants whose views are incompatible with gay rights and women's rights.

But that's the way things turn. Once the first three were achieved, they needed something else to spend their waking hours on. Unfortunately, it was all those things that undermined the first three successes to begin with.

And they just cannot see that when you bring people into a country, they are not empty vessels. They carry with them social and cultural baggage, which is deep rooted and ingrained. That will not disappear overnight. Never mind this country, just look at how gay people and women feel threatened (and often are threatened) in Sweden - who has already conducted this multicultural experiment on our behalf.

It has been a total failure.

I suggest that we do not follow that template.

In fact, there's nothing "multicultural" about it. It destroys culture; it's anticulturalism.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119972370#Comment_119972370

This conversation would be a lot shorter if you and other people weren’t constantly shifting the goalposts. We’re now at the point where the goalposts have been shifted so much, they’re back where we started, talking about Roma gypsies.

Roma are EU citizens entitled to freedom of movement within the EU. They are entitled to be here. They are not entitled to any assistance from the State. They are not contributing to any accommodation or housing crisis or whatever other way you or anyone else wishes to interpret that.

The only thing that can be said is that they engage in antisocial behaviour of public begging, and there are laws against that sort of behaviour which don’t just apply to Roma, they apply to everyone on the basis that begging is contrary to Irish law, and it is the duty of Gardaí to assess those situations -

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2011/act/5/section/3/enacted/en/html

The extent of the problem? Because 2022 was the first time Roma were included as an ethnic minority in the census, estimates before then put the figures at somewhere between 3,000 and 5,000 in Ireland. You’re making a mountain out of a molehill.

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119974907#Comment_119974907

If Roma have no source of income that can support them here, they can, and should be deported, same as any other EU citizen

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119976200#Comment_119976200

Well if you’re aware that it can be applied to any EU citizen, you must also be aware that it can’t be applied on the basis of nationality or ethnicity. The UN wouldn’t be long rapping Ireland on the knuckles for the kind of behaviour you’re suggesting, which would likely explain why they leave the Roma who are here alone, rather than giving them any kind of support to integrate into Irish society.

The Irish Government and the authorities don’t appear too keen to make mountains out of molehills either. They’re likely to be understandably more cautious since this happened -

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/roma-family-who-boy-taken-6662532?int_source=amp_continue_reading&int_medium=amp&int_campaign=continue_reading_button#amp-readmore-target

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119976584#Comment_119976584

I didn’t ask for it to be applied on an ethnic or nationality reason, I said it “they can, and should be deported, same as any other EU citizen”.

It’s literally in my post. Roma and any other EU citizen who cannot support themselves and their kin should be repatriated asap. Just to remove any ambiguity.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119976668#Comment_119976668

Good of you to remove the any ambiguity, makes it clearer you weren’t just referring to Roma gypsies, which was the point Nosler was making -

Even if we all agreed that Ireland needed mass immigration would we really want the likes of Roma Gypsies?

Your suggestion that they should be deported is meaningless either way, because nobody who has argued in favour of immigration, has ever argued in favour of mass immigration, or that we need more of any particular immigrant, let alone focussed specifically on whether or not “we” want the likes of Roma gypsies.

Since we’re removing any ambiguity I figured it might be good if I was to do the same.

Nosler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119974907#Comment_119974907

"The extent of the problem? Because 2022 was the first time Roma were included as an ethnic minority in the census, estimates before then put the figures at somewhere between 3,000 and 5,000 in Ireland. You’re making a mountain out of a molehill."

So there are at least 3,000 Roma in the country? How many houses will they be staying in? At least 500? How much will will they cost the taxpayer each week? 200 euro a week each?

Deport the Roma from Ireland and there will be 500 houses available for Irish families and the taxpayer saves about €30,000,000 a year.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119982961#Comment_119982961

I thought there was a rule that says if you do not find work / or refuse to find it, that you can be deported back to your home country?

If so, that rule should be enforced.

If I'm wrong and the rule doesn't exist, then it should be created.

Then we can implement the kind of policy that you've rightly identified.

Fandymo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119983028#Comment_119983028

That rule does exist. We don’t bother with it. Don’t want our EU overlords to get annoyed with us.

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119982961#Comment_119982961

Off you go so, no need to let me know how you got on with that, I’ll probably read about it later in this thread 😂

Viscount Aggro

They live in crowded, shared properties, each paying tiny rent.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119984257#Comment_119984257

That's an outrageous demand to make of any population.

It's also absurd.

The_Kew_Tour

Anyone tell them Ireland will be under water in next 30 years. In wrong country if want avoid climate change.

ShamNNspace

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119984257#Comment_119984257

Catherine day, a died in the wool eurocrat, on the gravy train to beat all gravy trains for many years, her primary allegiance is to the European project (and my have they plans for that going forward as they say) not to the Republic, a dangerous unelected type but revered and never questioned in the halls of montrosia

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119970559#Comment_119970559

because someone isn’t sleeping rough doesn’t mean they don’t have an accommodation crisis…

if you are relying on the kindness of friends and or strangers from night to night, week to week, that’s a crisis. You don’t have a home you have a crisis.. only having temporary accommodation is a crisis…

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119984535#Comment_119984535

It’s what you’d call a crisis, it’s not what I’d call a crisis. Different expectations really, and when it comes to referring to something like housing, or accommodation, or anything else as a crisis, it’s important to put that in some sort of context, in order to maintain perspective.

Otherwise it permits headless chicken sorts to claim anything is a crisis and theirs are legitimate concerns which should concern everyone. In reality anything they are referring to as a crisis only affects a small number of people. What gives me a chuckle is homeless organisations sponsored sleep outs are sponsored by the same electricity company which has no qualms about cutting off people who haven’t the means to pay their electricity bills and end up homeless as a result. Still not a crisis though.

It’s almost as ironic as men complaining about women portraying men as sexual predators, but when it comes to immigrants, the same men portray them as sexual predators, and when 100 immigrant men are on the verge of freezing to their death in tents in the arsehole of nowhere, the same men complain that immigrant women are being prioritised for accommodation!

They must imagine anyone can’t see what they’re at.