Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

JP Liz V1

faceman wrote: »

All the speculation on the 2 women, their circumstances, suggestions they’re criminals by people here and in public.
Reminds of that time the public suspected that a family of Irish travellers had kidnapped a child as the child looked far too exotic for them. The gardai took the child from them
We all know how that ended up.

I'm not bothered about how they paid but why cosmetic surgery twice to Dubai was deemed essential, was any airport checks? Same with all those who went abroad for new teeth veneers whitening etc.,

ZX7R

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Is France, US, Italy and Germany going on the mandatory quarantine lists? The government it seems don't want to upset the EU

Enhanced home quarantine not mhq

ZX7R

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

What the actual fück? So are you saying, you're free to do what you want until you test positive?

Basically yes.

faceman

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

I'm not bothered about how they paid but why cosmetic surgery twice to Dubai was deemed essential, was any airport checks? Same with all those who went abroad for new teeth veneers whitening etc.,

I don’t think the word essential is used in the legislation for travel, I could be wrong but I don’t believe so. So technically yes, an aul teeth polish would permit you to travel.

I know anecdotally the gardai aren’t quizzing people on how essential their appointments are

Kaisr Sose

faceman wrote: »

All the speculation on the 2 women, their circumstances, suggestions they’re criminals by people here and in public.

Reminds of that time the public suspected that a family of Irish travellers had kidnapped a child as the child looked far too exotic for them. The gardai took the child from them

We all know how that ended up.

You are mounting a good defence but ultimately I see the whole exercise as a folly.

It is deeply annoying and frustrating for many people that have followed the public health guidelines, with our liberty to work, travel, and socialise severely curtained within our own neighbourhoods. However, we don't go running to the High Court to challenge the constitutionality of these measures. If we did, most likely we would not get free legal aid to do so.

There are so many questions about the trip or trips, including the source of funds. The relevant state agencies can look into this now as it has been disclosed in court proceedings. The amounts involved fall into scope for scrutiny, so let's hope they follow the money. If they are living beyond their financial means, they should be treated the same way as others found to be doing the same. After all, all the two women want is to be treated fairly.

faceman

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

You are mounting a good defence but ultimately I see the whole exercise as a folly.

It is deeply annoying and frustrating for many people that have followed the public health guidelines, with our liberty to work, travel, and socialise severely curtained within our own neighbourhoods. However, we don't go running to the High Court to challenge the constitutionality of these measures. If we did, most likely we would not get free legal aid to do so.

There are so many questions about the trip or trips, including the source of funds. The relevant state agencies can look into this now as it has been disclosed in court proceedings. The amounts involved do fall into scope for scrutiny, so let's hope they follow the money. If they are living beyond their financial means, they should be treated the same way as others found to be doing the same. After all, all the two women want is to be treated fairly.

Totally get the anger and frustration. I’d have as much time for those 2 as the shinners have for Arlene Foster

But at the same time I’m not going to cast moral judgements on them either in absence of the facts. Particularly at a time when most of Ireland are breaking covid rules anyway.

The big issue is the scrutiny of the law. A lot of the legislation around covid was rushed, understandably, and some portion of it is based on what we don’t know rather than on science. That’s a noose we could hang ourselves with.

A simple example being MHQ for travellers with negative tests but no enforced restrictions for the hundreds of people who are confirmed to have covid in Ireland daily.

Irish people have had the vast majority of their civil liberties for over a year now and at no point during the whole thing has there been an exit strategy. While other countries are saying vaccines get us out and giving vaccinated citizens freedoms back, Ireland isn’t claiming “unknown variants”

tjhook

faceman wrote: »

I don’t think the word essential is used in the legislation for travel, I could be wrong but I don’t believe so. So technically yes, an aul teeth polish would permit you to travel.

I know anecdotally the gardai aren’t quizzing people on how essential their appointments are

The law uses the phrase "reasonable excuse". Example "reasonable excuses" provided by the statute include visiting "essential retain outlets", with take-aways being specified as one of them, and "attend a medical or dental appointment" is also allowed. But there is scope to apply further restrictions to these "excuses". Otherwise one could travel across the country, or even to Lanzarote to collect a take-away.

I think the law does allow for the prevention of travel abroad for non-essential treatments, but the enforcers (gardai) wouldn't feel qualified to be the ones do decide how essential a medical treatment is. I couldn't blame them for that.

tjhook

tjhook wrote: »

The law uses the phrase "reasonable excuse". Example "reasonable excuses" provided by the statute include visiting "essential retain outlets", with take-aways being specified as one of them, and "attend a medical or dental appointment" is also allowed. But there is scope to apply further restrictions to these "excuses". Otherwise one could travel across the country, or even to Lanzarote to collect a take-away.

I think the law does allow for the prevention of travel abroad for non-essential treatments, but the enforcers (gardai) wouldn't feel qualified to be the ones do decide how essential a medical treatment is. I couldn't blame them for that.

The law states 'essential' medical reasons and Gardai make the call in this as much as they do with a normal traffic or public order ticket. Thats all it is, a ticket and like all tickets, can be decided by a court if you dont pay.

Its really a lot more mundane and daily than people think

tjhook

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

The law states 'essential' medical reasons and Gardai make the call in this as much as they do with a normal traffic or public order ticket. Thats all it is, a ticket and like all tickets, can be decided by a court if you dont pay.

It does say "essential", that's a good catch, and Gardai are entitled to make a call on it. I'd agree with Faceman's assessment that they don't appear to be doing so.

I can only imagine the fuss if they stopped a person going for plastic surgery or dental work, for it to arise later that the work was considered essential by a medical consultant who referred them for it. If I was a member of the Gardai, I wouldn't risk making that decision.

tjhook

tjhook wrote: »

It does say "essential", that's a good catch, and Gardai are entitled to make a call on it. I'd agree with Faceman's assessment that they don't appear to be doing so.

I can only imagine the fuss if they stopped a person going for plastic surgery or dental work, for it to arise later that the work was considered essential by a medical consultant who referred them for it. If I was a member of the Gardai, I wouldn't risk making that decision.

Why not? Its only a ticket. The person still travelled and got whatever they wanted done, done. Again, its minor compared to the decisions being made most days. gardai have to make decisions on removing people freedom, sometimes for a long period of time. A ticket is nothing.

theres been a few thousand tickets issued but it cant be both sides, either travel is down and mostly for essential reasons or its not and Gardai simple arent bothering. Personally I wouold suggest that Gardai arent making much effort to enforce a weak and easily circumvented law but where they encounter breaches, tickets are issued.

Sono Topolino

I wonder how many people casting judgement on these two women have been staying faithfully within their 5km the past few three months, and have never met friends for a coffee outdoors?

Whenever I go out for my daily walk, I'm seeing plenty of people meeting up outdoors in small (and sometimes even large) groups drinking coffee (and sometimes wine). It's absolutely forbidden under the rules (though two households can meet after next Monday). I don't see anyone on Boards.ie calling for heads to roll though.

And then there's the small matter of the CEO of the Beacon Hospital giving out jabs as favours, without even a criminal investigation. Lucky for him he wasn't a single mother, or there'd be hangings.

Happydays2020

Sono Topolino wrote: »

I wonder how many people casting judgement on these two women have been staying faithfully within their 5km the past few three months, and have never met friends for a coffee outdoors?

Whenever I go out for my daily walk, I'm seeing plenty of people meeting up outdoors in small (and sometimes even large) groups drinking coffee (and sometimes wine). It's absolutely forbidden under the rules (though two households can meet after next Monday). I don't see anyone on Boards.ie calling for heads to roll though.

And then there's the small matter of the CEO of the Beacon Hospital giving out jabs as favours, without even a criminal investigation. Lucky for him he wasn't a single mother, or there'd be hangings.

Not to mention HSE staff skipping the queue. We will have lots of one way trips in the coming years.

caveat emptor

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

You are mounting a good defence but ultimately I see the whole exercise as a folly.

It is deeply annoying and frustrating for many people that have followed the public health guidelines, with our liberty to work, travel, and socialise severely curtained within our own neighbourhoods. However, we don't go running to the High Court to challenge the constitutionality of these measures. If we did, most likely we would not get free legal aid to do so.

There are so many questions about the trip or trips, including the source of funds. The relevant state agencies can look into this now as it has been disclosed in court proceedings. The amounts involved fall into scope for scrutiny, so let's hope they follow the money. If they are living beyond their financial means, they should be treated the same way as others found to be doing the same. After all, all the two women want is to be treated fairly.

Yeah it's amazing that two state funded single mums who are of modest means both get a fairly large gift of flights to Dubai and phantom cosmetic surgery appointments just as mandatory quarantine comes in.

Talk about unfortunate and coincidental. Great though that they got the free legal aid for the constitutional challenge. People should try that the next time they can't make bail and see how they get on.

py2006

There are daily flights full with passengers on them from Romania and Moldova and Poland EVERY day with people flying in on their holidays or returning from holidays.

Looking at the schedule there are 2 flights daily from Amsterdam, 2 from Portugal, 2 from spain.

josip

py2006 wrote: »

There are daily flights full with passengers on them from Romania and Moldova and Poland EVERY day with people flying in on their holidays or returning from holidays.

Looking at the schedule there are 2 flights daily from Amsterdam, 2 from Portugal, 2 from spain.

You're saying that at least 150 people are flying to Ireland in Level 5 Lockdown every day from each of Poland, Romania and Moldova?
For their holidays?What hotels are they staying in?
Did you mean to post that in this thread?

Route1

Are you allowed collect people from the airport? Is that deemed a legitimate reason to travel.

py2006

josip wrote: »

You're saying that at least 150 people are flying to Ireland in Level 5 Lockdown every day from each of Poland, Romania and Moldova?
For their holidays?What hotels are they staying in?
Did you mean to post that in this thread?

They don't need to stay in hotels, they are staying with family.

py2006

Route1 wrote: »

Are you allowed collect people from the airport? Is that deemed a legitimate reason to travel.

I assume if you are within 5km of it.

py2006

py2006 wrote: »

There are daily flights full with passengers on them from Romania and Moldova and Poland EVERY day with people flying in on their holidays or returning from holidays.

Looking at the schedule there are 2 flights daily from Amsterdam, 2 from Portugal, 2 from spain.

Schedule will also show empty flights, staff returning to their hub and commercial flights being used for essential ppe.

Can you confirm that the flights are daily and full as you claim?

Route1 wrote: »

Are you allowed collect people from the airport? Is that deemed a legitimate reason to travel.

Yes you can. It is considered better that they dont get public transport.

py2006 wrote: »

I assume if you are within 5km of it.

****ING HELL. Really? Have you read this thread at all? Have you read the legislation? ESSENTIAL TRAVEL does not have a set limit on it. If hes collecting someone from the airport then he can travel from wherever he lives.

py2006

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Schedule will also show empty flights, staff returning to their hub and commercial flights being used for essential ppe.

Can you confirm that the flights are daily and full as you claim?

Yes I can and the flights you see on the DAA website are NOT empty or just staff returning.

py2006

Not really sure collecting somebody from airport can be considered essential travel but I am sure the Gardai if they stop you would accept that.

py2006

py2006 wrote: »

Yes I can and the flights you see on the DAA website are NOT empty or just staff returning.

So please show us HOW you can confirm this.

py2006 wrote: »

Not really sure collecting somebody from airport can be considered essential travel but I am sure the Gardai if they stop you would accept that.

As public transport has been earmarked for essential workers, private transport is considered safer in the event of a person being positive.

py2006

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

So please show us HOW you can confirm this.

As public transport has been earmarked for essential workers, private transport is considered safer in the event of a person being positive.

I can't show you anything, but I am well aware of what is coming into Dublin airport.

Public transport is for anyone, but social distancing is implemented.

Corholio

py2006 wrote: »

I can't show you anything, but I am well aware of what is coming into Dublin airport.
.

This is exactly how these crazily titled threads get started.

py2006

Corholio wrote: »

This is exactly how these crazily titled threads get started.

Imagine I am wrong and you are right, tell us what comes into Dublin airport daily?

py2006

py2006 wrote: »

I can't show you anything, but I am well aware of what is coming into Dublin airport.

Public transport is for anyone, but social distancing is implemented.

right, all just hearsay and nonsense. Like your understanding of the 5km

py2006

You tell us then

glenfieldman

faceman wrote: »

All the speculation on the 2 women, their circumstances, suggestions they’re criminals by people here and in public.

Reminds of that time the public suspected that a family of Irish travellers had kidnapped a child as the child looked far too exotic for them. The gardai took the child from them

We all know how that ended up.

Roma gypsies

py2006

py2006 wrote: »

You tell us then

Your comments and allegations, your burden of proof

py2006

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Your comments and allegations, your burden of proof

Ok, so I am lying and haven't a clue what I am talking about...

In your opinion how many people arrive per day into Dublin airport, from where, and for what reason?