Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

Father Hernandez

Red Silurian wrote: »

It's for a few months, don't be so dramatic! Plus flights are still going so there's very little stopping you and if you quarantine on your return then you won't be bringing variants back so win-win

My wife is non-EU and hasn't seen family since late 2019 - 18 months to be exact.

Country of origin on MHQ list with no idea how long it'll be on there for, what the reasons it was added or what it'll take for it to removed. Plus add to the fact there is a virus that could have an effect on said family.

Plenty of people in the same boat, easy for many like yourself to say don't be dramatic when we have literally no idea when we'll see them again. But shur you're grand so that's all fine.

hotmail.com

A further challenge in the High Court today. A brand new one..

Maybe we need to have a referendum on it.

Valhallapt

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

MHQ is putting those of us with family abroad in a very difficult and stressful position.

There are already 9 extra aircraft based in Belfast to work around this, Ryanair 5 new, aerlingus 4 extra, easyJet 1 extra.

No need to stress, the law is an ass, just go via Belfast

hotmail.com

Barristers making a fortune from this.

Red Silurian

Feria40 wrote: »

.What tourists are coming in? Everything here has been closed! There is no more than a dribble of people coming in or out of the country that might be tourists

What changes in a few months? How am I being dramatic?

timmyntc wrote: »

Tourists were never coming in.
The country is shut - there is no reason for tourists to even consider coming here.

As said before, 1/5th of our population is foreign. So these people travelling to visit family would be the vast majority of all travel to/from this country over the last year.

Tourism works both ways, unless you're of the opinion that all those people coming into the country in January from the canaries weren't tourists? Or all the Texans that flew over last summer were they all on business trips to the Killarney restaurants?

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

We don't know yet how long this is for. With the inevitable delays to the vaccine rollout, there's every chance this could be extended well into the summer. A week to see family plus 2 weeks MHQ would use up the majority of the statutory minimum annual leave. The cost is also very high, plenty of people on a low wage couldn't afford MHQ in addition to flights and accommodation. There's also the issue that some employers will only let you take leave at certain times of the year.

MHQ is putting those of us with family abroad in a very difficult and stressful position.

Imagine the stress passing COVID to family members would give you... Also is it your intention to go abroad and not quarantine at all on your return?

a_squirrelman

Father Hernandez wrote: »

My wife is non-EU and hasn't seen family since late 2019 - 18 months to be exact.

Country of origin on MHQ list with no idea how long it'll be on there for, what the reasons it was added or what it'll take for it to removed. Plus add to the fact there is a virus that could have an effect on said family.

Plenty of people in the same boat, easy for many like yourself to say don't be dramatic when we have literally no idea when we'll see them again. But shur you're grand so that's all fine.

Similar here, last home to Ireland in October 2019. Flights booked for next month so really hoping they don't extend this MHQ across all the EU countries.

Danno

Feria40 wrote: »

This is the thing that really gets me. I can't recall if it's one in every four or one in every five people living in Ireland are not born here.

I am married to an EU national and there appears to be some on boards.ie that think it's perfectly fine into the medium term for us and our children not to see family abroad.

I've family living outside my 5km that I've not seen in many months. Does it matter whether your family is 20km or 2000km away - by seeing them you're breaking the restrictions.

timmyntc

Danno wrote: »

I've family living outside my 5km that I've not seen in many months. Does it matter whether your family is 20km or 2000km away - by seeing them you're breaking the restrictions.

Mustn't miss them that much if you wouldn't go 6km to go and visit them!

Danno

Red Silurian wrote: »

I would expect the Universities to have made an exemption to the Erasmus requirement during the pandemic

I would expect Uni's to pay for the MHQ on behalf of the student. To be fair, universities are awash with cash, it's just they waste it on massive wages for some dubious "lecturers" that somehow manage to setup nest within.

hotmail.com

Danno wrote: »

I've family living outside my 5km that I've not seen in many months. Does it matter whether your family is 20km or 2000km away - by seeing them you're breaking the restrictions.

Maybe you want to comply with the restrictions but others don't wish to.

You have to respect their wishes. We don't live in a dictatorship.

Danno

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

My intention is to travel to visit my wife's family once we're both fully vaccinated.

As someone who supports MHQ, there should be no restrictions whatsoever on fully vaccinated folk travelling.

Any country with an Irish embassy should be able to "verify" the local fully vaccinated cert and issue a permit to travel back to Ireland for folk intending on returning/traveling here. Again, these well paid embassy staff should be at the forefront of implementing this, God knows they've had an easy ride the last year.

Red Silurian

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

I've been taking every precaution necessary to avoid spreading covid to my family. I haven't seen my parents (who live in Ireland) since last year. My intention is to travel to visit my wife's family once we're both fully vaccinated. We're also planning to get tested when we travel. Why is this not sufficient to at least reduce quarantine time?

There seems to be an assumption throughout this forum that anyone who has any issue with the restrictions is a reckless covid denier - that just isn't true.

Your earlier statement

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

A week to see family plus 2 weeks MHQ would use up the majority of the statutory minimum annual leave

Would suggest you were intending to go into work without quarantining on your return which would be reckless

Danno wrote: »

I would expect Uni's to pay for the MHQ on behalf of the student. To be fair, universities are awash with cash, it's just they waste it on massive wages for some dubious "lecturers" that somehow manage to setup nest within.

I'm not very familiar with the Erasmus program but I was of the impression that it's an EU idea administered at govt level and so the Universities hands were essentially tied by the state on that matter, hence my thinking that the state should pay for their MHQ

Red Silurian

Danno wrote: »

As someone who supports MHQ, there should be no restrictions whatsoever on fully vaccinated folk travelling.

Any country with an Irish embassy should be able to "verify" the local fully vaccinated cert and issue a permit to travel back to Ireland for folk intending on returning/traveling here. Again, these well paid embassy staff should be at the forefront of implementing this, God knows they've had an easy ride the last year.

I agree with you but how easy is it to get these certs forged? Happened a lot last year that false negative PCR certs were sold, these vaccine certs could go down the same way

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/01/scammers-are-selling-fake-negative-covid-test-certificates-europol-warns

Danno

hotmail.com wrote: »

Maybe you want to comply with the restrictions but others don't wish to.

You have to respect their wishes. We don't live in a dictatorship.

In that case, repeal all laws and let's have a free for all where the fittest will survive?

Valhallapt

Danno wrote: »

In that case, repeal all laws and let's have a free for all where the fittest will survive?

MHQ is repugnant to the constitution. Government know this, hence they won’t allow any challenges go before a judge as MHQ may well be struck down.

Danno

Danno wrote: »

As someone who supports MHQ, there should be no restrictions whatsoever on fully vaccinated folk travelling.

Any country with an Irish embassy should be able to "verify" the local fully vaccinated cert and issue a permit to travel back to Ireland for folk intending on returning/traveling here. Again, these well paid embassy staff should be at the forefront of implementing this, God knows they've had an easy ride the last year.

Indeed. I will be vaccinated with 2nd dose on 1 July and am then going the USA for a wedding.

If MHQ is still in place when I return in August, and there is no exemption for vaccinated people, I will bypass it. It would be a nonsense. Will go through the UK, Belfast if necessary. I think that many vaccinated people will do the same thing - the sensible thing.

It will probably not happen anyway - I really don't think that the government will be able to maintain MHQ for vaccinated people

Danno

Red Silurian wrote: »

I agree with you but how easy is it to get these certs forged? Happened a lot last year that false negative PCR certs were sold, these vaccine certs could go down the same way

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/01/scammers-are-selling-fake-negative-covid-test-certificates-europol-warns

Surely some digital system could stamp that shyte out?

As for the scammers - there ought to be a special jail term for that.

Feria40

Danno wrote: »

As someone who supports MHQ, there should be no restrictions whatsoever on fully vaccinated folk travelling.

Any country with an Irish embassy should be able to "verify" the local fully vaccinated cert and issue a permit to travel back to Ireland for folk intending on returning/traveling here. Again, these well paid embassy staff should be at the forefront of implementing this, God knows they've had an easy ride the last year.

But one of the reasons put forward for MHQ and the selection or not of countries for MHQ is the prevalence of variants of one type or another and the uncertainty as these may or may not evade the vaccines..

Father Hernandez

Danno wrote: »

I've family living outside my 5km that I've not seen in many months. Does it matter whether your family is 20km or 2000km away - by seeing them you're breaking the restrictions.

Nonsense, of course it does does.

Family member gets seriously ill, 20km away. Grand hop in the car and go look after who needs looking after.

Family member gets seriously ill, 2000km away. Book flights, travel to country which will require stop off or lots of traveling time. Time off work. Depending on country, require 2 weeks detention plus €1,800, potential issues with work in MHQ.

Even if restrictions lift domestically, it's a nonsense argument.

zebastein

Father Hernandez wrote: »

Nonsense, of course it does does.

Family member gets seriously ill, 20km away. Grand hop in the car and go look after who needs looking after.

Family member gets seriously ill, 2000km away. Book flights, travel to country which will require stop off or lots of traveling time. Time off work. Depending on country, require 2 weeks detention plus €1,800, potential issues with work in MHQ.

Even if restrictions lift domestically, it's a nonsense argument.

Add the 24h /48h delay to do a PCR test and get the result before flying, a PCR before arrival, and either a PCR test 5days later, or if in MHQ one after arrival and one after 10days

josip

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

I've been taking every precaution necessary to avoid spreading covid to my family. I haven't seen my parents (who live in Ireland) since last year. My intention is to travel to visit my wife's family once we're both fully vaccinated. We're also planning to get tested when we travel. Why is this not sufficient to at least reduce quarantine time?

There seems to be an assumption throughout this forum that anyone who has any issue with the restrictions is a reckless covid denier - that just isn't true.

I think there's something about 'variants coming in from abroad' that triggers a 'keep foreign things and people out' defense/coping mechanism in some people.
Even if it's Irish people bringing back the variant, there is still the irrational fear of 'abroad'.

Red Silurian

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Do you agree with two week quarantine for vaccinated and tested people? If so, why? If not, what is the issue with what I said?

I work from home BTW - the earlier post was just an example of how difficult of a situation some people are in.

Depends on the vaccine... If it's a vaccine that stops you spreading the virus then yes 100%

But as of yet there is no vaccine that has been proven to do this, studies are ongoing and some are showing promising results but as of yet nothing concrete

is_that_so

Whatever issues people may have with Harris we have missed his plain talking.

The Minister for Further and Higher Education has said it is his "firm view" that anyone who has been vaccinated against Covid-19 and has a negative PCR test result should not go into quarantine.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0413/1209539-coronavirus-politics/

faceman

Danno wrote: »

In that case, repeal all laws and let's have a free for all where the fittest will survive?

You’ll find that anyone who followed the covid laws in Ireland to the letter is in the
minority.

M_Murphy57

Red Silurian wrote: »

Depends on the vaccine... If it's a vaccine that stops you spreading the virus then yes 100%

But as of yet there is no vaccine that has been proven to do this, studies are ongoing and some are showing promising results but as of yet nothing concrete

Exactly right.

Same way that even though I'm vaccinated against polio and rubella, I still assume at all times that I might still have those diseases. All of my interactions with other humans are therefore (cautiously and sensibly) based first and foremost on the assumption that my presence may cause them to get polio or rubella - just because you're vaccinated doesnt mean you cant still be killing people by spreading disease every single day, you know.

I guess it's possible the people I'm interacting with might also have had vaccines against polio and rubella but there is also the chance that they might have falsified their vaccine carts or be lying. It's happened before.

Best to be cautious. You never know. Ever. No matter how much data there is.

namloc1980

is_that_so wrote: »

Whatever issues people may have with Harris we have missed his plain talking.



https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0413/1209539-coronavirus-politics/

Harris is about a billion times better than that dreadful spoofer Donnelly.

faceman

Danno wrote: »

As someone who supports MHQ, there should be no restrictions whatsoever on fully vaccinated folk travelling.

Just picking up on this, and this isn’t a negative comment to your point, we are likely going to see vaccine snobbery as rollout increases and vaccine passports becoming the norm.

Once J&J rolls out, it’s a 1 shot vaccine. But if you’re unlucky to be dished the AZ vaccine there is a 16 week delay between shots. So it’s 4+ months before you are fully vaccinated.

It’s not something being flagged in media as much yet but i expect it will soon

Red Silurian

M_Murphy57 wrote: »

Exactly right.

Same way that even though I'm vaccinated against polio and rubella, I still assume at all times that I might still have those diseases. All of my interactions with other humans are therefore (cautiously and sensibly) based first and foremost on the assumption that my presence may cause them to get polio or rubella - just because you're vaccinated doesnt mean you cant still be killing people by spreading disease every single day, you know.

I guess it's possible the people I'm interacting with might also have had vaccines against polio and rubella but there is also the chance that they might have falsified their vaccine carts or be lying. It's happened before.

Best to be cautious. You never know. Ever. No matter how much data there is.

In fairness your chances of being near somebody without a polio or rubella vaccine are slim-to-none. Even if you do find one their chances of being near somebody not vaccinated for these diseases is also slim... The same logic does not apply to COVID-19 and it's part of the reason the CDC suggest that only 2 fully vaccinated people can meet together indoors without social distancing or masks

NSAman

faceman wrote: »

Just picking up on this, and this isn’t a negative comment to your point, we are likely going to see vaccine snobbery as rollout increases and vaccine passports becoming the norm.

Once J&J rolls out, it’s a 1 shot vaccine. But if you’re unlucky to be dished the AZ vaccine there is a 16 week delay between shots. So it’s 4+ months before you are fully vaccinated.

It’s not something being flagged in media as much yet but i expect it will soon

Will J&J rollout though?

It has been put on hold in many states here as there are blood clotting issues with it also.

Having just had the J&J it is something that worries me personally. 2 weeks after the vaccine things are showing up.

Red Silurian

faceman wrote: »

Just picking up on this, and this isn’t a negative comment to your point, we are likely going to see vaccine snobbery as rollout increases and vaccine passports becoming the norm.

Once J&J rolls out, it’s a 1 shot vaccine. But if you’re unlucky to be dished the AZ vaccine there is a 16 week delay between shots. So it’s 4+ months before you are fully vaccinated.

It’s not something being flagged in media as much yet but i expect it will soon

Just to elaborate on this, it's a 12 week between the 2 doses for AZ but your point is still a good one... There is also a 2 week wait for Moderna and Biontech after the second dose before full protection is given.. I presume there is similar for AZ and J&J but can't confirm