Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

hotmail.com

It's clear now that Ireland is moving away from the European Union.

The far right having a real impact on our culture.

munchkin_utd

indeed, in Germany the restrictions were not as severe as in Ireland, were proportionate to the specific threat (IRL has incidence of 1000+ and variants), they had exceptions for family work reasons, they were temporary and were relaxed over time and now are gone completely for entry from most of Ireland and all of the UK incl NI

Thats the opposite of How NPHET operate, which is not to be transparant, not to look at measures as being temporary and at the moment even a high court case wont get you out of hotel quarantine with your aul lad on his death bed so very disproportionate and no functioning system of exemptions

saabsaab

fly_agaric wrote: »

How though and what is that alternative approach?

I don't know if we can actually stop "variants" coming in (given our link to UK via NI + assuming they don't quarantine travellers), likely we can only slow such things down.

Certainly contact tracing and enforcing Covid tests and isolation/quarantine for those who test positive seems impossible too after 1 year, either due to lack of resources or the fact that such things are probably also illegal/unconstitutional [if you declare MHQ is].

Volumes are important the more people coming in the harder to test, re-test, track and trace. Reduce the volumes coming in especially air traffic.

muddypuppy

Valhallapt wrote: »

You are gas lighting, that article says

In principle, entry is possible from:

EU member states
states associated with Schengen: Iceland, Norway, Switzerland and Liechtenstein
Other countries, from which entry is possible due to the epidemiological situation assessment by the EU.

The german documentation is a bit of a mess tbh, especially if you don't speak german. They keep moving you to different sites without a clear list of can I / can't I.

But as you said, yes, people from Ireland can travel to Germany at the moment. If you're coming from the south-west, south-east or mid-west of Ireland you just need a negative test prior to the flight. If you're coming from other regions you need negative test prior the flight, 10 days quarantine at home, and you need to take another test within 2 days of landing.

Also in his defense Ireland was a "virus variant area" from January 13, 2021 to March 20, 2021, with the carrier restrictions in place (but it didn't affect German citizens).

The up to date list is here in German, or just start filling this form (in English) to see what the current restrictions are

saabsaab

josip wrote: »

..or trying to come home.

Not relevant. They may still have a new variant.

muddypuppy

muddypuppy wrote: »

The german documentation is a bit of a mess tbh, especially if you don't speak german. They keep moving you to different sites without a clear list of can I / can't I.

But as you said, yes, people from Ireland can travel to Germany at the moment. If you're coming from the south-west, south-east or mid-west of Ireland you just need a negative test prior to the flight. If you're coming from other regions you need negative test prior the flight, 10 days quarantine at home, and you need to take another test within 2 days of landing.

Also in his defense Ireland was a "virus variant area" from January 13, 2021 to March 20, 2021, with the carrier restrictions in place (but it didn't affect German citizens).

The up to date list is here in German, or just start filling this form (in English) to see what the current restrictions are

Negative antigen test, not PCR test. quarantine at home. They are bending over backwards to respect people's freedoms.

seamus

The baby one is hilarious.

After the tenth knock on the door from someone trying to get a look at the new baby, they'll have wished they stayed in quarantine.

Interestingly, the same zerocovid nutjobs do not make any proposal on how to stop the spread of the virus in Offaly.

They do, to be fair. It's a completely unworkable solution that involves Garda checkpoints at every road in and out of Offaly, but they do have a proposal.

Valhallapt

caveat emptor wrote: »

I think it's called misinformation. If you are talking about me please do follow the links and read before starting a pile on.

Yes read the links he’s spouting pure lies

caveat emptor

munchkin_utd wrote: »

indeed, in Germany the restrictions were not as severe as in Ireland, were proportionate to the specific threat (IRL has incidence of 1000+ and variants), they had exceptions for family work reasons, they were temporary and were relaxed over time and now are gone completely for entry from most of Ireland and all of the UK incl NI

Thats the opposite of How NPHET operate, which is not to be transparant, not to look at measures as being temporary and at the moment even a high court case wont get you out of hotel quarantine with your aul lad on his death bed so very disproportionate and no functioning system of exemptions

But they are not gone and have been extended. The vast majority of people who live in Ireland are legally not allowed to enter Germany. Further more airlines are breaking the law there if the transport them.

Why the misinformation?

caveat emptor

Valhallapt wrote: »

Yes read the links he’s spouting pure lies

I don't think you understand.

The Robert Koch Institute (RKI) is a German federal government agency and research institute responsible for disease control and prevention.

They publish the latest information regarding covid in Germany.

I assure you it's real.

Information on the designation of international risk areas by the Federal Foreign Office, BMG and BMI
Status: April 16, 2021, 12:30 p.m.

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

But they are not gone and have been extended. The vast majority of people who live in Ireland are legally not allowed to enter Germany. Further more airlines are breaking the law there if the transport them.

Why the misinformation?

What? They are allowed enter and enter quarantine.

Corholio

caveat emptor wrote: »

The average age of the trial participant was young so now hospitalisation or death was observed in either arm. Not enough data yet either way.

You were saying this earlier.......

"The South African one has been shown to evade immunity through infection or vaccine. So much so that they gave away their Astra allocation"

Now it's 'not enough data yet either way'?

Is it any wonder these threads are a mess when inaccurate, flip flop nonsense like this is posted, and yet you accused someone earlier of misinformation.

saabsaab

Corholio wrote: »

You were saying this earlier.......

"The South African one has been shown to evade immunity through infection or vaccine. So much so that they gave away their Astra allocation"

Now it's 'not enough data yet either way'?

Is it any wonder these threads are a mess when inaccurate, flip flop nonsense like this is posted. And you accused someone earlier of misinformation?

Have they given it away? Yes?

Caveat Emptor should be treated in the spirit of his Username. Trust absolutely nothing he says when deliberating on a topic.

Here is the guidance for entering Germany current as of three and a half hours ago:
https://www.rki.de/DE/Content/InfAZ/N/Neuartiges_Coronavirus/Transport/Archiv_Risikogebiete/Risikogebiete_aktuell_en.pdf?__blob=publicationFile

Corholio

saabsaab wrote: »

Have they given it away? Yes?

Why do all the 'thank' buddies ride in to each others rescue?

It hasn't been shown or proved, or anywhere even near to evade immunity through infection or the vaccine.

caveat emptor

Corholio wrote: »

You were saying this earlier.......'

"The South African one has been shown to evade immunity through infection or vaccine. So much so that they gave away their Astra allocation"

Now it's 'not enough data yet either way'?

Is it any wonder these threads are a mess when inaccurate, flip flop nonsense like this is posted.

Really? People really need to do some research before calling people liars and gaslights.

Rueters:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-safrica-vaccine-idUSKBN2BD0K4

MARCH 21, 20217:14 PMUPDATED A MONTH AGO
South Africa sells AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccines to other African countries

JOHANNESBURG (Reuters) - South Africa has concluded the sale of AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccines it had acquired but did not use to other African Union (AU) member states, the health ministry said on Sunday.

The country had paused AstraZeneca vaccinations last month because of a small trial showing the shot offered minimal protection against mild to moderate illness caused by the dominant local coronavirus variant.[/QUOTE]

BBC:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-55999678

South Africa in shock after AstraZeneca vaccine rollout halted

South Africa's decision to halt its rollout of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine after a study showed "disappointing" results against its new Covid-19 variant may have left the nation in shock, but it also shows how scientists are at the forefront of the battle against coronavirus.
One and half million doses of the jab had been bought for healthcare workers and they were due to start getting their vaccinations this week

In this case, the most recent phase of the study on the AstraZeneca vaccine was carried out on 2,000 people whose average age was 31.
Recent data from the trial shows it was not effective against mild and moderate symptoms of the more contagious South African variant, also known as 501.V2 or B.1.351.
This is a stumbling block as 90% of new infections in South Africa are of the new variant.

a_squirrelman

hotmail.com wrote: »

It's clear now that Ireland is moving away from the European Union.

The far right having a real impact on our culture.

What's more shocking is that the left are totally on board with it.

saabsaab

caveat emptor wrote: »

Really? People really need to do some research before calling people liars and gaslights.

Rueters:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-safrica-vaccine-idUSKBN2BD0K4


JOHANNESBURG (Reuters) - South Africa has concluded the sale of AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccines it had acquired but did not use to other African Union (AU) member states, the health ministry said on Sunday.

The country had paused AstraZeneca vaccinations last month because of a small trial showing the shot offered minimal protection against mild to moderate illness caused by the dominant local coronavirus variant.

BBC:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-55999678[/QUOTE]


Some here don't like inconvenient facts getting in the way of their arguments.

Corholio

caveat emptor wrote: »

Really? People really need to do some research before calling people liars and gaslights.

Rueters:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-safrica-vaccine-idUSKBN2BD0K4


JOHANNESBURG (Reuters) - South Africa has concluded the sale of AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccines it had acquired but did not use to other African Union (AU) member states, the health ministry said on Sunday.

The country had paused AstraZeneca vaccinations last month because of a small trial showing the shot offered minimal protection against mild to moderate illness caused by the dominant local coronavirus variant.

You're completely missing the point. If we all put up 'small studies' as finality of the absolute efficacy of vaccines, there would have been thousands of them on here. You yourself were definitive in one post and then said there's not enough data yet either way.

It's utterly reckless posting when so much is still ongoing.

Doctor Jimbob

Corholio wrote: »

You're completely missing the point. If we all put up 'small studies' as finality of the absolute efficacy of vaccines, there would have been thousands of them on here. You yourself were definitive in one post and then said there's not enough data yet either way.

It's utterly reckless posting when so much is still ongoing.

At the start of the pandemic there were links being posted suggesting frankly absurd fatality rates and various apocalyptic scenarios. Now it's moved on to links casting doubt on vaccine effectiveness and overplaying variant risk.

I don't think there's anything malicious about it, people are just concerned, but in general these worst case scenarios haven't come to pass and I can't see any reason to assume that will change.

caveat emptor

Deleted User wrote: »

Caveat Emptor should be treated in the spirit of his Username. Trust absolutely nothing he says when deliberating on a topic.

Here is the guidance for entering Germany current as of three and a half hours ago:
https://www.rki.de/DE/Content/InfAZ/N/Neuartiges_Coronavirus/Transport/Archiv_Risikogebiete/Risikogebiete_aktuell_en.pdf?__blob=publicationFile

So only Mid-West and South-East are not considered high risk.


Ireland – the regions Mid-West and South-East are no longer considered as risk areas.

https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/de/ReiseUndSicherheit/irlandsicherheit/211460

Epidemiological situation

Ireland continues to be affected by COVID-19. The number of new infections in the several parts of the country is more than 50 cases per 100,000 inhabitants over seven days, which is why Ireland, with the exception of the South-West region, will also be a risk area from April 18, 2021 with the exception of the Mid-West and South-East regions

Thanks Mudpuppy for clarifying.

caveat emptor

caveat emptor wrote: »

So only Mid-West and South-East are not considered high risk.


Ireland – the regions Mid-West and South-East are no longer considered as risk areas.

https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/de/ReiseUndSicherheit/irlandsicherheit/211460

Inward travel to Germany with quarantine which is not mandatory hotel quarantine is permitted. You continue to misinform.

BobbyBolivia

saabsaab wrote: »

BBC:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-55999678


Some here don't like inconvenient facts getting in the way of their arguments.

Why are you linking this embarrassing study and pretending like you have just checkmated everyone?

caveat emptor

BobbyBolivia wrote: »

Why are you linking this embarrassing study and pretending like you have just checkmated everyone?

Why did South Africa sell their vaccine then?

Why are UK worried about it.

Honestly don't believe all you want.

BobbyBolivia

caveat emptor wrote: »

Why did South Africa sell their vaccine then?

Why are UK worried about it.

Honestly don't believe all you want.

I don't know why other governments make decisions. With over 50,000 deaths to date in South Africa I would not be looking at their government as any entity to invoke to score points. I would honestly be embarrassed if my position relied upon the South African governments judgement to support it.



The study you linked had a truly embarassingly low sample size, and also found that the vaccine prevented severe illness and death against the variant. The study had not been peer reviewed.

mmclo

is_that_so wrote: »

They've already responded to it and the government now have ten days to reply. It's not as if this reaction couldn't have been predicted if they insisted on tacking on more EU countries to the red list.




https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0416/1210274-coronavirus-ireland-quarantine/

True but it's a long way short of infringement procedure, all I'm saying is these things can take a long time as we can see in a number of other cases, even Apple is under lengthy appeal.

https://www.friendsoftheirishenvironment.org/fie-work/17804-eu-complaint-over-irish-water-quality-upgraded-after-9-years

The Govt is more than likely thinking that too, they just want to get to September. They may take EU countries off the list of course, it's more politics than law

Even infringement actions are not so unusual https://www.lawsociety.ie/gazette/top-stories/38-eu-actions-against-ireland-last-year/

faceman

caveat emptor wrote: »

But they are not gone and have been extended. The vast majority of people who live in Ireland are legally not allowed to enter Germany. Further more airlines are breaking the law there if the transport them.

Why the misinformation?

You realise that the German approach would solve all the current issues and justify ending MHQ.

No one is disputing the need to temporarily quash tourism. The people travelling at the moment aren’t tourists.

The other thing is travel bans, as multiple studies over the past year show us, do not prevent covid. They delay it by a period of 3-5 weeks. The most dominant strain in Spain is the U.K. variant. Travel from the U.K. to Spain has been banned since December.

OwenM

caveat emptor wrote: »

Why did South Africa sell their vaccine then?

Why are UK worried about it.

Honestly don't believe all you want.

Because they did a small trial that showed reduced efficacy against mild and moderate covid disease. It's not logical but it is why, and that illogical action has caused endless speculation and assumption and worry. Astrazeneca was shown to prevent severe disease and death in that study, go figure.

fly_agaric

saabsaab wrote: »

Volumes are important the more people coming in the harder to test, re-test, track and trace. Reduce the volumes coming in especially air traffic.

True. We cannot contact trace properly anyway because as far as I understand 1) there isn't the resources available to do it and 2) even if there were, data protection/privacy rights would need to be set aside to allow public health investigate outbreaks fully (maybe bigger can of worms than this hotel quarantine).

I don't expect that will change now.

If the contact tracers just get stonewalled when asking questions (as I'd imagine could happen quite often given the answers could be embarrassing) or peoples' memories fail them, that is it.

timmyntc

Vaccines dont always give you 100% immunity, but they still give you some immunity.

I got measles despite having my MMR vaccine - do I think the vaccine was a waste? Of course not.


Studies showing that people with 1 dose got sick is hardly the variant evading vaccines. Plenty of people with 1 dose get sick with the mainstream variant we have, but its not newsworthy.