Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

quokula

ShineOn7 wrote: »

Superb post from TheLad95





Greece's GDP - 218 billion USD (2018)

Ireland's GDP - 382 billion USD (2018)

Greece's economy is built on tourism. They're open for business right now and have tons of tourists coming in from all over Europe. Of course they're going to invest in infrastructure at the airports to do this as safely as possible.

Practically nobody is coming to Ireland apart from essential travel like people returning home, visiting family etc. Yes, there may be a few tourists, but the numbers are so low they're not worth mentioning.

Holiday destinations are going to be at risk of foreign travellers bringing it in and need to act accordingly. Countries like Ireland are much more at risk of internal community transmission, in addition to our own citizens travelling around which should be discouraged as much as possible.

jimmycrackcorm

PhilOssophy wrote: »

So how do you explain the fact that it has travelled globally if it isn't due to travel? Wind? Ocean currents?

Travel isn't that relevant. It was transmitted because no one took any precautions back then. Now with general awareness, social distancing, and all airlines and airports requiring mask-wearing, the risk isn't from travel.

Over half our COVID deaths were in nursing homes where the residents didn't travel.

Put it like this - with recent outbreaks occurring in close confinement in factories, how come we haven't witnessed an outbreak traced to any particular flights?

saabsaab

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Travel isn't that relevant. It was transmitted because no one took any precautions back then. Now with general awareness, social distancing, and all airlines and airports requiring mask-wearing, the risk isn't from travel.

Over half our COVID deaths were in nursing homes where the residents didn't travel.

Put it like this - with recent outbreaks occurring in close confinement in factories, how come we haven't witnessed an outbreak traced to any particular flights?

Travel is the key. Why was there a lockdown if it wasn't travel. The nursing home had it brought to them by travel. Anyone traveling is much higher risk, just basic logic.

PhilOssophy

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Travel isn't that relevant. It was transmitted because no one took any precautions back then. Now with general awareness, social distancing, and all airlines and airports requiring mask-wearing, the risk isn't from travel.

Over half our COVID deaths were in nursing homes where the residents didn't travel.

Put it like this - with recent outbreaks occurring in close confinement in factories, how come we haven't witnessed an outbreak traced to any particular flights?

Because somebody on a flight could be asymptomatic and be transmitting it wherever they go.

faceman

PhilOssophy wrote: »

So how do you explain the fact that it has travelled globally if it isn't due to travel? Wind? Ocean currents?

Familiarise yourself with Farr’s Law. Travel in Q1 2020 is very different to travel now

PhilOssophy

faceman wrote: »

Familiarise yourself with Farr’s Law. Travel in Q1 2020 is very different to travel now

I know what Farrs Law is. You have no idea where on that curve we are, or if it is a valid hypothesis.

faceman

PhilOssophy wrote: »

I know what Farrs Law is. You have no idea where on that curve we are, or if it is a valid hypothesis.

lol

mean gene

quokula wrote: »

Greece's economy is built on tourism. They're open for business right now and have tons of tourists coming in from all over Europe. Of course they're going to invest in infrastructure at the airports to do this as safely as possible.

Practically nobody is coming to Ireland apart from essential travel like people returning home, visiting family etc. Yes, there may be a few tourists, but the numbers are so low they're not worth mentioning.

Holiday destinations are going to be at risk of foreign travellers bringing it in and need to act accordingly. Countries like Ireland are much more at risk of internal community transmission, in addition to our own citizens travelling around which should be discouraged as much as possible.

theres yanks and uk tourists all over the south of the country without isolating

MickeyLeari

What is clear at this stage is that the limited foreign travel that is happening is not the cause of any spike in Ireland.

What is needed (no matter where you are) is vigilance on hand washing, reasonable social distancing and wearing masks where needed. For the most part I have felt far safer abroad than at home.

If the current approach of knee jerk reactions while failing to control the known risks continues into the Autumn and winter we will be in serious trouble.

PhilOssophy

faceman wrote: »

lol

LOL? Have you nothing else to add to say I am wrong? I love the fact that you think it is a bell shaped curve when there is nothing anywhere to suggest that is the case? (I'll let you frantically Google before you reply)

PhilOssophy

MickeyLeari wrote: »

What is clear at this stage is that the limited foreign travel that is happening is not the cause of any spike in Ireland.

How can you say that is clear? That is anything but clear. If 200 Americans land from Texas and start travelling around coming into contact with people in Killarney, and only a handful have it and are asymptomatic, how can you say with any confidence that that can't cause a spike?

fly_agaric

PhilOssophy wrote: »

Because somebody on a flight could be asymptomatic and be transmitting it wherever they go.

Yes. IMO they can never pick up the source of such cases.
Either no illness or mild illness, such a person [likely young and fit] will not go to the doctor in a foreign country if they are a tourist or a new arrival.
When they detect cases up the chain (if test & trace system is good enough) it'll be a dead end. I think you'd expect a constant low background of such cases, but I suppose if you can't count it/find it, can make the claim it does not exist.
At least the inward travel is much lower than usual and opportunities for spread are reduced with pubs + large indoor gatherings still being shut down.
Presume necessary inward travel will go up late Aug/Sept with students returning to schools and colleges for new term so will be very interesting to see how well the voluntary code works out at that point.

faceman

PhilOssophy wrote: »

LOL? Have you nothing else to add to say I am wrong? I love the fact that you think it is a bell shaped curve when there is nothing anywhere to suggest that is the case? (I'll let you frantically Google before you reply)

As evidenced throughout this thread, there is clearly no talking to you and you’re pandering arguments either not backed by research or adverse to evidence

PhilOssophy

faceman wrote: »

As evidenced throughout this thread, there is clearly no talking to you and you’re pandering arguments either not backed by research or adverse to evidence

I think my arguments are valid. You asked me if I had heard of Farr's Law and when you were caught out you didn't like it and had no reply other than "LOL". You couldn't even defend your point on Farr's Law? If you could, you would have come back with "You are wrong because.....".

I would expect a mod to be living up to the "attack the post not the poster" mantra. Say what you like about my contributions to the thread, I have always attacked the point being made.

faceman

PhilOssophy wrote: »

I think my arguments are valid. You asked me if I had heard of Farr's Law and when you were caught out you didn't like it and had no reply other than "LOL". You couldn't even defend your point on Farr's Law? If you could, you would have come back with "You are wrong because.....".

I would expect a mod to be living up to the "attack the post not the poster" mantra. Say what you like about my contributions to the thread, I have always attacked the point being made.

I’m not a mod of this forum, not sure what that has to do with anything. Nor have I bring attacking you, you’re entitled to your opinion whether I agree with it or not.

We don’t see eye to eye on the matter and it’s fruitless to continue the debate. Not sure how I have been “caught out” but ces’t la vie.

PhilOssophy

faceman wrote: »

I’m not a mod of this forum, not sure what that has to do with anything. Nor have I bring attacking you, you’re entitled to your opinion whether I agree with it or not.

We don’t see eye to eye on the matter and it’s fruitless to continue the debate. Not sure how I have been “caught out” but ces’t la vie.

Agree. But I'm still wondering why LOL was your best comeback to my response to your post questioning my knowledge of Farr’s Law?

I'll ask you again though, where do you think we are on that curve and why do you think it is a valid hypothesis, when case numbers nowhere in the world are backing up the bell shaped hypothesis?

Boredstiff666

I just discovered that people in camper vans can travel from the heavily infected UK to Northern Ireland and then driving straight into the Republic that way. So in effect possibly infecting two countries at the same time.

Apparently they can do this without registering or anything? Is this true?

If so what the point of having regs and borders?

Madness.

Boredstiff666

Boredstiff666 wrote: »

I just discovered that people in camper vans can travel from the heavily infected UK to Northern Ireland and then driving straight into the Republic that way. So in effect possibly infecting two countries at the same time.

Apparently they can do this without registering or anything? Is this true?

If so what the point of having regs and borders?

Madness.

You just discovered this? We don't have a border with the North

ednwireland

Boredstiff666 wrote: »

I just discovered that people in camper vans can travel from the heavily infected UK to Northern Ireland and then driving straight into the Republic that way. So in effect possibly infecting two countries at the same time.

Apparently they can do this without registering or anything? Is this true?

If so what the point of having regs and borders?

Madness.

youve just discovered this ? ferries havent stopped running between two parts of the UK throught the whole course of this, where i live is full of english reg cars has been for the last couple of months

Boredstiff666

Yes because I never looked before and saw something on Youtube. Ahh well what a joke.

Boredstiff666

Boredstiff666 wrote: »

I just discovered that people in camper vans can travel from the heavily infected UK to Northern Ireland and then driving straight into the Republic that way. So in effect possibly infecting two countries at the same time.

Apparently they can do this without registering or anything? Is this true?

If so what the point of having regs and borders?

Madness.

Loads of English reg cars around during the bank holiday weekend, apparently. They all came over for the weekend on the ferry, no 2 weeks self isolation there. It will be interesting to see if there will be a spike in cases next week.

MickeyLeari

PhilOssophy wrote: »

How can you say that is clear? That is anything but clear. If 200 Americans land from Texas and start travelling around coming into contact with people in Killarney, and only a handful have it and are asymptomatic, how can you say with any confidence that that can't cause a spike?

Tell me what cases (other than the well known case linked to returning workers) are linked to travel.

Have you looked at where the clusters and strikes are? Travellers, Roma, Direct provision and good processing.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Loads of English reg cars around during the bank holiday weekend, apparently. They all came over for the weekend on the ferry, no 2 weeks self isolation there. It will be interesting to see if there will be a spike in cases next week.

People have been talking about the ‘hordes’ of UK registered cars ‘pouring’ off the ferries for literal weeks, and there has been no associated spike in cases

munchkin_utd

Deleted User wrote: »

People have been talking about the ‘hordes’ of UK registered cars ‘pouring’ off the ferries for literal weeks, and there has been no associated spike in cases

spikes associated with Dubs having the craic in Dublin, Dubs having the craic in Kildare, Dubs having the craic in Kerry.....

Its not the lads from abroad that are the issue.

Jinglejangle69

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Tell me what cases (other than the well known case linked to returning workers) are linked to travel.

Have you looked at where the clusters and strikes are? Travellers, Roma, Direct provision and good processing.

1 in 5 is unknown community transmission.

How do you know they aren't travel related?

PhilOssophy

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

1 in 5 is unknown community transmission.

How do you know they aren't travel related?

Beat me to it. And who is to say that the origin of some of the cases isn't an asymptomatic American off a flight from Texas? I can't say it definitely is, any more than it can be said it isn't.

fly_agaric

NPHET opinion on the issue seems pretty clear anyway.
Think its been pretty consistent for a while (months at this stage).

The State’s public health team has asked the Government to consider implementing a travel ban on non-essential travel from countries with high rates of Covid-19.

In a letter to Government, the National Public Health Emergency Team said it had previously recommended mandatory quarantine for all passengers travelling to Ireland from overseas.

“While this remains NPHET’s preferred recommendation, if this is deemed unworkable or disproportionate, the NPHET again recommends that consideration is given to the introduction of a travel ban on non-essential travel for those countries with particularly high incidence rates.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/nphet-calls-for-ban-on-non-essential-travel-from-countries-with-high-covid-19-rates-1.4322542

Feria40

fly_agaric wrote: »

NPHET opinion on the issue seems pretty clear anyway.
Think its been pretty consistent for a while (months at this stage).



https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/nphet-calls-for-ban-on-non-essential-travel-from-countries-with-high-covid-19-rates-1.4322542

Thankfully they will be ignored on this particular idea

Acosta

Feria40 wrote: »

Thankfully they will be ignored on this particular idea

There might as well be a ban considering how small the numbers are flying at the moment.

Feria40

Acosta wrote: »

There might as well be a ban considering how small the numbers are flying at the moment.

True but I suspect anything other than a travel advisory, such as we have now would be difficult to legislate for