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Sean Russell statue defaced overnight

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    #152
    kildare lad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭kildare lad


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Erwin Lahousen,one of witness at neuemberg didnt regard him as a nazi sympathiser,thats enough for me anyway

    That's not enough for the blue haired, non binary college students tho is it


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    #153
    Nermal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,660 ✭✭✭Nermal


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    I would have joined the Allied armed forces and fought on the correct side like many Irish did.

    Your grandfather might have lived through the famine.


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    #154
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kildare lad wrote: »
    So what , Europes been constantly at war with each other for centuries , many of the guns used in the 1916 rising were got from Germany aswell. The enemy of my enemy is my friend

    You're actively ignoring their point. There was targeting of specific groups in society by the nazis, for a nation that had "souperism" and had people targeted because of their religion, the irony is lost on you? To join the guys targeting the Jews, that is utterly shameful and he is not a man deserving of respect.


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    #155
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    kildare lad wrote: »
    That's not enough for the blue haired, non binary college students tho is it

    Non binary, is that when you email in your thesis instead of having it bound?


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    #156
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    kildare lad wrote: »
    That's not enough for the blue haired, non binary college students tho is it

    Just remember feelings are more important than facts to these people


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    #157
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    Bowie wrote: »
    No you're confused. By all accounts Russell would deal with them to further the Irish cause.
    The blueshirts admired them and some in FG today admire the blueshirts, (Councilor O'Leary) and some in FG just didn't like Jews, (Oliver J. Flanagan) is all.

    Not confused, but thanks for your concern, Matt.

    Nice work getting your FG digs in while defending the indefensible.


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    #158
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Just remember feelings are more important than facts to these people

    Facts? Says the lad with the time travelling pope. Are you for real or just here trolling? Do you have ANY self awareness?


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    #159
    kildare lad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭kildare lad


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    You're actively ignoring their point. There was targeting of specific groups in society by the nazis, for a nation that had "souperism" and had people targeted because of their religion, the irony is lost on you? To join the guys targeting the Jews, that is utterly shameful and he is not a man deserving of respect.

    Irish people joined the british army . Do I have to list the crimes and atrocities they committed in Ireland alone. They specifically targeted Catholics , if I recall correctly


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    #160
    Hamsterchops
    Registered Users Posts: 3,275 ✭✭✭Hamsterchops


    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    There is no Nazi sympathy, that's in your mind. Violent Unionist/British sympathies are very real though despite the misery they've inflicted on the Irish population down through the generations.

    No Nazi sympathy on here? so this whole Sean Russel helping the Nazi/statue thing is just an illusion, and all those on here who say our enemy's enemy is our friend (the Nazis) are just bluffing?

    You especially wallow in the whole anti British thing, the misery, the 800 years, oh the torture of it all, hence Sean Russell & the Nazis might have been our saviours...but they failed.

    I guess from your perspective (as a hardened IRA supporter) it was truly awful that Britain and her Allies were not defeated by the Nazis.


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    #161
    statesaver
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭statesaver


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    Not confused, but thanks for your concern, Matt.

    Nice work getting your FG digs in while defending the indefensible.

    FG have a fascist history, Blueshirts, fought in the Spanish civil war ( badly, Thank God ), Deal with it


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    #162
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Hamsterchops wrote: »
    Amazing how much Nazi/IRA sympathy there is on this thread, truly amazing in this day & age, specially with all the information that's available to us today. Maybe it's just the bravado of youth & the thrill of being controversial.

    The Nazis and their collaborators were not heroes, and there should not be a statue to Sean Russell.

    I missed that. Can you quote anyone being a Nazi sympathizer?
    Do not fool yourself on the IRA either. You might like to think they were on the wrong side of history but like FG being a SF splinter party and Collins a terrorist think before you go rewriting history to suit your poor modern day excuse for public representatives. If it were left up to FG we'd be bowing to the Queen and having Tan rallies ffs..

    The Nazis and their collaborators were not heroes, agreed. What's your issue with the Sean Russell statue?


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    #163
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,069 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2002/sep/15/world.race

    Do we have to wait for a statue of him to be put up before denouncing him? :pac:
    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    Nice work getting your FG digs in while defending the indefensible.

    lol, someone is shook


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    #164
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    Facts? Says the lad with the time travelling pope. Are you for real or just here trolling? Do you have ANY self awareness?

    Rattled :pac:


    Its ok...you get a participation prize for your posts :D


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    #165
    Bonniedog
    Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    A blatant attempt to rewrite history. The world knew plenty by 1940. You would have us believe that Kristallnacht never happened or that Mein Kampt was never published, or Poland invaded by 1940.

    Wannsee conference where decision to liquidate Jews was in 1942.

    Of course their anti Semitism was known before then, but not sure anyone could have predicted the horrors to come.

    BTW, left still celebrates Irishmen who fought under NKVD/Comintern command in Spain when the Stalinists had already murdered millions. And that was known, eg the artificial famine in the Ukraine.

    Were Frank Ryan and the rest collaborators with Stalin? Indeed, Ryan might be one of rare band to have claims to have collaborated with the two worst monsters of the 20th century :)


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    #166
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    statesaver wrote: »
    FG have a fascist history, Blueshirts, fought in the Spanish civil war ( badly, Thank God ), Deal with it

    And the SF leader, a Nazi sympathiser, attempted to form an alliance with Nazi Germany. Deal with it.


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    #167
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    Not confused, but thanks for your concern, Matt.

    Nice work getting your FG digs in while defending the indefensible.

    It's completely defensible Wheeliebin. That's the point.


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    #168
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    And the SF leader, a Nazi sympathiser, attempted to form an alliance with Nazi Germany. Deal with it.

    Sean russell.wasnt SF leader to best my knowledge


    Like i said who needs facts.......actually wasnt he previously condemned for seeking help.off soviet union?


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    #169
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    Bowie wrote: »
    It's completely defensible Wheeliebin. That's the point.

    No idea what this means.


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    #170
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    And the SF leader, a Nazi sympathiser, attempted to form an alliance with Nazi Germany. Deal with it.

    Don't forget the FF leader and the fledgling FG went one better and were fascists.
    In fact most of political Ireland either wanted support from them or wanted to be them ;)
    Which is worse?


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    #171
    statesaver
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭statesaver


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    And the SF leader, a Nazi sympathiser, attempted to form an alliance with Nazi Germany. Deal with it.

    An alliance ? No he didn't. He's aim was an independent Irish Republic. The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

    Who were Fine Gael fascists fighting for in the Spanish Civil War ? Democracy ? It wasn't democracy, ask Flanagan's daddy who disliked the ***s


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    #172
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Sean russell.wasnt SF leader to best my knowledge


    Like i said who needs facts.......actually wasnt he previously condemned for seeking help.off soviet union?

    Ah, Mr Factoids is back. You were all for facts a few minutes ago, ahead of feelings. You must feel silly now. Maybe you can travel back in time and fix your Papal faux pas.


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    #173
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,069 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    West Brit offended by mention of Pope.

    More at 11


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    #174
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,013 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    Ah, Mr Factoids is back. You were all for facts a few minutes ago, ahead of feelings. You must feel silly now. Maybe you can travel back in time and fix your Papal faux pas.

    Top tip, don't dismiss facts when trying to make a historical point. Did you not know Irish history or FG's past and present leanings?


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    #175
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Rodney Bathgate wrote: »
    Ah, Mr Factoids is back. You were all for facts a few minutes ago, ahead of feelings. You must feel silly now. Maybe you can travel back in time and fix your Papal faux pas.

    :D

    This isnt going well for you atal



    I mean like,its known pope at time.collaberated with nazis??


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    #176
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    Bowie wrote: »
    Top tip, don't dismiss facts when trying to make a historical point.

    Thanks Matt, in case you missed it, blazz tried to claim that the papal cross was to commemorate the German popes visit. That is factually incorrect. As I’m sure you are well aware. So maybe make that point to blazz.


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    #177
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    :D

    This isnt going well for you atal



    I mean like,its known pope at time.collaberated with nazis??

    Did you or did you not claim that the Phoenix Park papal cross, erected in 1979 commemorated the visit of the Hitler youth pope?

    Simple yes or no please.


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    #178
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kildare lad wrote: »
    Irish people joined the british army . Do I have to list the crimes and atrocities they committed in Ireland alone. They specifically targeted Catholics , if I recall correctly

    I literally referred to the targeting of Catholics... Basic summary, he sidled up to the very type of regime that committed atrocities here. They were actively engaging in targeting their own citizens and he knew it. Meanwhile the Allied war effort had no such goal, no desire to push for a superior race or any of that stuff. It was simply preventing an incredibly dangerous regime from dominating Europe.

    Events that had occurred before WW2 included book burnings, boycotting of Jewish business owners, limiting the number of Jews in schools, sterilization of citizens with mental or physical disabilities, Nuremberg Race Laws, Kristallnacht and the closing of all Jewish businesses. That's excluding annexations etc. And your logic is, they're the enemy of my enemy so irregardless of what they do, it's fine....


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    #179
    Hamsterchops
    Registered Users Posts: 3,275 ✭✭✭Hamsterchops


    Bowie wrote: »
    The Nazis and their collaborators were not heroes, agreed. What's your issue with the Sean Russell statue?

    My problem is that it's a statue to him, and he was involved with/ collaborated with the Nazis.

    Too many questions about him and his dealings with his gas oven goose stepping mates to have a statue erected in his memory :mad:


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    #180
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    statesaver wrote: »
    An alliance ? No he didn't. He's aim was an independent Irish Republic. The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

    So what term would you use for the agreement he sought with Nazi Germany? Or was he just visiting for the sights?

    Doesn’t matter what his aim was, how was he hoping to achieve it? By doing a deal with the devil.


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    #181
    Rodney Bathgate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,445 ✭✭✭Rodney Bathgate


    Thread is pointless anyway. The statue will be gone from Fairview Park by the end of the summer.

    Maybe SF can take it back up north with them and put it outside their headquarters.


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