BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

Biafranlivemat

Overheal wrote: »

Seems to be a lot of deliberate and dishonest cherry picking happening now.

US Police, the institution, are sanctioned killers. The institution is sanctioned to kill, and has Qualified Immunity on the individual level to do it. This does not translate to “all police are bloodthirsty murderers” or other words put in my mouth. Obviously, the majority of cops never see a need to ever deploy such force in the line of duty. As an institution though, if there is a killer among them, the institution far from excising the problem Officer, is designed to excuse them.

Qualified Immunity, doesn’t just apply to the police.

‘Qualified immunity protects certain classifications of government officials from personal liability, including money damages, in civil lawsuits in federal courts, as long as the conduct in question does not violate clearly established statutory or constitutional rights of which a reasonable person would have known.
The doctrine is available not just to police officers—including school police officers—but to any government official exercising discretionary functions, and that includes teachers, principals, superintendents, and school board members. Some of the U.S. Supreme Court’s most significant decisions outlining the contours of qualified immunity have come in K-12 school cases, and educators routinely invoke it when they are sued, sometimes successfully and sometimes not.’


https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2020/06/11/curbing-immunity-for-police-could-affect-school.html


If you want to outlaw it, you’ll be hurting other public employees the most.

Dufflecoat Fanny

Nabber wrote: »

Does anyone else see a problem in business owners painting 'Black owned' on there store fronts to deter looting? Seems like it's suggesting that Asian, Hispanic and White stores should only be targeted.

The USA is divided by race on both the left and right.
Imagine an Irish election where they talked about Leo going out to Balbriggan to appeal to the black vote! Yet in the states it's totally normal. CNN, FOX, MSNBC... You name it they all divide it out by race. They don't bat an eyelid at it.
Conservative and Democrats openly talk about how they are good for XYZ race.

USA Politics, Media and Universities define people by their race... How could the USA not have race related problems?

Its becoming a human catastrophe which will be recorded second by second from many angles. The Orwellian nightmare might be in the here and now just not how we imagined it.

some.guy

I just saw a video for Bidens campaign where he says "Why in this nation do Black Americans wake up knowing they could lose their life in the course of just living their life?". Even if you agree there's systemic racism and police brutality issues that statement is just hyperbole to the highest degree. He really is just trying to ride the coattails of this situation to victory.

Biafranlivemat

Tell me how wrote: »

Why?

Give me a comparable situation where agents of the state are misbehaving and we can discuss that.

I have repeatedly said that all violence is wrong, am I going to have to start copying and pasting that in to each post?

OK
can we talk about scum bag public school teachers.

Carfacemandog

gozunda wrote: »

Lol so did mine.

Looks like its not just some white folks act like idiots with guns.

Louisville

Apparently all out of towners. From Atlanta. Not sure which route this particular bunch of eejits took to get to Louisville

I read about that when it happened a month or so back, and those guys are idiots as tends to be the case with these militia types, also if you look into their leader (Grand Master Jay) he's a bit of a nut job if I recall which is also a pretty common trend for militia leaders. Though as best I am aware, they and the other militia there were at least legally allowed to hold those guns and weren't being looked at by law enforcement for possibly wanting to pick people off with said guns.

They're also the group that a Republican Congressman called Clay Higgins included a picture of a few days ago when threatening to murder people which Facebook took down for inciting violence. It was a strange choice of photo on his part, though that older story you brought up which uses the exact same one helps it make more sense as Higgins himself is connected to, spoken at rallies for, and has actively promoted the white supremacist linked Oath Keepers and Three Percenters feature in it.

Higgins as he alluded to in that deleted post is an ex cop, but had to turn in his badge over using assaulting an unarmed black person.

Broadstone Bob

https://twitter.com/ScooterCasterNY/status/1302060108898357257?s=20

francois

https://www.politico.com/amp/news/2020/09/04/white-supremacists-terror-threat-dhs-409236?__twitter_impression=true

gozunda

Carfacemandog wrote: »

I read about that when it happened a month or so back, and those guys are idiots as tends to be the case with these militia types, also if you look into their leader (Grand Master Jay) he's a bit of a nut job if I recall which is also a pretty common trend for militia leaders. Though as best I am aware, they and the other militia there were at least legally allowed to hold those guns and weren't being looked at by law enforcement for possibly wanting to pick people off with said guns. ...

To be fair the Not ****ing Around Collitiion are also on record threatening to return to Louisville in four weeks time and 'burn this motherf****r down"

The Not ****ing Around Coalition is listed as a paramilitary organisation in the United States. They have also been linked to the New Black Panthers who are considered by he Anti-Defamation League, the Southern Poverty Law Center, and the U.S. Commission on Civil Rights  to be a hate group

I think the point I was making is that such eejits are not restricted to anyone side. Social media is covered with the posturing and threats of this lot and others. It really doesn’t do any good to be copying and pasting these rantings tbh.

One thing you are mistaken on the photo of black militia NFAC you listed as being " a strange choice of photo"??? It's not in my post and It is not in the newspaper article linked.

nullzero

Broadstone Bob wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ScooterCasterNY/status/1302060108898357257?s=20

"Black Lives Matter" (Smash Smash Smash in the background). Just another peaceful protest.

weldoninhio

Broadstone Bob wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ScooterCasterNY/status/1302060108898357257?s=20

Absolute scum

Danzy

Nabber wrote: »

Does anyone else see a problem in business owners painting 'Black owned' on there store fronts to deter looting? Seems like it's suggesting that Asian, Hispanic and White stores should only be targeted.

The USA is divided by race on both the left and right.
Imagine an Irish election where they talked about Leo going out to Balbriggan to appeal to the black vote! Yet in the states it's totally normal. CNN, FOX, MSNBC... You name it they all divide it out by race. They don't bat an eyelid at it.
Conservative and Democrats openly talk about how they are good for XYZ race.

USA Politics, Media and Universities define people by their race... How could the USA not have race related problems?

BLM activists have burnt out a generation of black businesses across America. One would think that they have deliberately targeted them given the scale.

They haven't, it's just they looted and burnt without a care.

biko

This happened a while back

4 black youths try to cut in line at a shop and another shopper disapproves.
The youths leave and wait outside.
When the lone shopper comes outside the youths set upon him and

“He comes up to me, kicks me in the face, and screams, “Black Lives Matter, b****!” Mason said.

Harry lyme

If BLM are as innocent as their defenders claim they should have had some sense and explicitly state that anyone claiming to represent them that their form of protest in all instances was to be a sit down protest outside courthouses/police stations/houses of government and anything other than that is not BLM. Make it impossible for anyone to use the name of the movement for anything other than 100% peaceful protest.

They had an opportunity to actually make a difference and unfortunately they've blown it as they can't really be trusted anymore.

Broadstone Bob

weldoninhio wrote: »

Absolute scum

I'd like to know if the 2 who were telling the table of women to get out and throwing their food on the ground, go to cafes or restaurants when not "protesting"?

What is the point of it? What is the objective here?

If its for publicity then its only bad publicity they will get from this.

gozunda

Biafranlivemat wrote: »

OK
can we talk about scum bag public school teachers.

Interesting point re qualified immunity. I never knew teachers could have qualified immunity in the US tbh. That said there are bad apples in all professions. Not everything can be assigned to racism.

I'd hope this teacher was sacked.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/texas-teen-beaten-substitute-teacher-video-shes-afraid/story?id=67029996?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&id=67029996&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA=&cid=referral_taboola_feed

1800_Ladladlad

Fair play to the firemen catching this cowardly thug. That White old woman's life matters too. I dont know the outcome or how the woman was after it but at that edge, to hit your head would end disastrously

https://twitter.com/JFNYC1/status/1301867018040348672

1990sman

1990sman wrote: »

are the people of the world are being fooled into a hyperpolarised pseudo-civil war with dissent and ennui as indoctrinated decorations?

asking for a friend..

still askin...

weldoninhio

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

Fair play to the firemen catching this cowardly thug. That White old woman's life matters too. I dont know the outcome or how the woman was after it but at that edge, to hit your head would end disastrously

https://twitter.com/JFNYC1/status/1301867018040348672

Brilliant from the FDNY!! Legends

Tell me how

https://twitter.com/ACLEDINFO/status/1301897036799901696

Biker79

Tell me how wrote: »

Twitter fake news

Another legitimate statistic from the left.

I don't blame them...statistics are hard. Accurate data is difficult to come by.

Much easier just to make it all up.

1800_Ladladlad

New stills of CCTV footage shows Michael Reinoehl lying in wait for Aaron J. Daniels and his mate. With his hand on his weapon? Has anyone seen the footage recorded by "someone" leading up to the murder. Showing all the signal signs within the group involved in the murder along with support cars pulling up. It was all organized and was synchronized to perfection. And of course, the degenerate brick eater picking up the shells.

Dyr

Tell me how wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ACLEDINFO/status/1301897036799901696

Manic Moran

Tell me how wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ACLEDINFO/status/1301897036799901696

The figures are correct, but after digging into the link, it I wonder about the conclusions. For example, they cite the shooting of Garret Foster by Daniel Perry as an “attack” but it seems that the claim of self defense has been accepted and that no charges are being filed. (This was the Uber driver who shot the protestor with the AK-47 in Texas in July). Is it a one-off or does the analysis consistently confuse “violence” with “attack?” without context?

That’s a minor thing, though. I might be cautious of reading your own conclusions from twitter title vs what they actually say.

For example, the data omits the perspective that authorities are permitted to use force against peaceful protests if considered appropriate which may be reflective of time/place/manner changes of those protests, which are not addressed.

It also does not seem to address the relative increase in non-government forces in relation to the violent vs non-violent protests. The implication is that the militias are attacking non-violent protests more frequently, but unprovoked attacks against folks just marching seem rare.

In other words, it appears to do the time consuming job of providing the numbers of protests vs amount of force or violence used over time, but also seems to avoid any analysis of cause.

biko

Rioters goes nuts in Rochester NY

https://twitter.com/ScooterCasterNY/status/1302060108898357257?s=19

biko

biko wrote: »

Rioters goes nuts in Rochester NY

https://twitter.com/ScooterCasterNY/status/1302060108898357257?s=19

Ah yeah but the people chanting "black lives matter" while destroying property and waving flags saying "black lives matter" while pushing innocent people away and threatening and intimidating people while wearing clothes saying "black lives matter" aren't representative of black lives matter dontcha know.

gozunda

Tell me how wrote: »

https://twitter.com/ACLEDINFO/status/1301897036799901696

wording of tweet linked above

New @ACLEDINFO data show that while more than 90% of demonstrations since #GeorgeFloyd's killing are peaceful,

An standalone study which appears to have been selectively reported by the media

Some reports claim the findings "contradict assumptions that protests associated with the Black Lives Matter movement are spawning violence and destruction of property"

They don't.

The wording taken directly from the actual report details that:

The vast majority of these events — more than 93% — involve non-violent demonstrators

So the exact wording (from the report) states that - "more than 93% of events" involve non-violent demonstators AND not that 93% of events were "non-violent/ peaceful" - which appears to be what is being incorrectly reported by twitter, social media etc.

Read as it is written - it would indicate that at least 93% of events - at least some protestors were engaging in violence. With would indicate that just 7% of all protests which were peaceful.

The report also details that approx 9% of all demonstration events associated with the BLM movement — or nearly one in 10 events — have been met with intervention by police or other authorities.

Considering the almost daily independent reports of violence, looting and attacks on neighbourhoods during these demonstations. This is not surprising tbh.

Even where protests are all peaceful - it is standard practice for police to manage such events in the interest of public heath and safety. It is evident that arrests of those involved in criminal behaviour at these protests have also occured - an to quote an often quoted figure - we know there were at least 10,000 arrest up to June of this year.

Nice try though.

kildare lad

Largely peaceful ?

https://nypost.com/2020/09/05/black-lives-matter-protesters-riot-in-manhattan-cause-100000-damage/

Eight people were arrested Friday night when a group of 150 Black Lives Matter protesters smashed windows and graffitied the storefronts of Lower Manhattan chain stores and banks, police sources said.

At least two Starbucks, five banks and a Duane Reade had their windows busted, causing an estimated $100,000 in damage.
Police recovered two stun guns, smoke grenades, and burglary and graffiti tools.

The protest had been advertised on Twitter by groups calling themselves the “New Afrikan Black Panther Party” and the “Revolutionary Abolitionist Movement.”

One of the arrested protesters was from Portland, Ore., and another was from Iowa, the sources said.

All were charged with rioting; some were additionally charged with weapons and burglary tool possession.

The protest began at 6 p.m. at Foley Square; protesters lit trash can fires and scrawled graffiti — including the word “Abolition” — as they made their way north.


“Every city, every town, burn the precinct to the ground,” the group was recorded chanting at one point.

Three of the banks damaged were on Seventh Avenue, between 14th and 20th streets, police sources said.

One source noted that the marchers bypassed the home of City Council Speaker Corey Johnson, who lives at 15th Street and Seventh Avenue.

Johnson has called for an investigation into counter-protesters who plowed a car into a crowd of BLM protesters in Times Square on Thursday night.

“They’re breaking his neighbors’ windows — how come he’s not calling for an investigation now?” the source asked The Post wryly.

Security footage obtained by NBC4 shows a protester in a balaclava using a tool to smash windows of a shop as others held umbrellas to shield the vandal from view.

“We call on everyone who stood up during the #GeorgeFloyd uprising and all supporters to come out to say #DropTheCharges for all who have fought for our liberation!” wrote one of the groups that organized the event, RAM NYC, while promoting the protest on Twitter late last month.




https://twitter.com/JFNYC1/status/1301351356222103554?s=20

Overheal

gozunda wrote: »

Well to be fair that normally goes with all the posters with whom you disagree being lumped together and eventually accused of having hive minds and / or being painted as morally suspect for that same reason.

'making stuff up' Tmh?

I dunno but the poster was quite open that they had made up that figure in order to highlight your utterly daft reliance on one statistical measure to try and prove your take on a very complex issue.

And yet so many people here oversimplify this whole issue down to “blacks commit half the crimes on record etc”

Manic Moran

On the whole "defend the police" thing, this video released a day or two ago gives a demonstration why in most jurisdictions specialists don't go to disturbances without police backup. Call was for a domestic disturbance, no indication of violent trouble.

https://youtu.be/0lWnEmV8WuY

Just as well the cop had the caution to step back away from the door after knocking. The woman apparently wasn't in the mood to talk, as "door open" to "stab" was about one second.

The idea of taking money away from police to other services is not as good an answer as giving money to other services in addition to keeping police services. Instead of sending one or the other, send both. Even when things seem simple, you probably feel better bringing a cop along.

gozunda

Overheal wrote: »

And yet so many people here oversimplify this whole issue down to “blacks commit half the crimes on record etc”

Who do? Where?
Checked the thread for that and I can't find anyone saying that?

Afaik various statistics posted on race, crime rates etc in context etc which is fair enough imo.