BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

mrkiscool2

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

Before I even start replying to this, I wanna say you are either a. Woefully ignorant or stupid or b. Are purposefully being obtuse and deliberately replying to points I never even made. Which is far worse and shows you that you actually don't care for discourse and are just trying to justify racism by not actually arguing the main points

And you're woefully rude, but I'm still giving you the benefit of the doubt and treated you (yup, past tense) with respect.

I quoted your post and placed my own points against them. I'm getting the feeling that you don't know how an argument goes.

Yup, I do. If you did you would know everything I said above actually is what they want. Not your idea of BLM being a terrorist group, or a group for black supremacy or what have you.

And... you wouldn't need to make **** up about my posts because you could use what I've written... I have never called BLM terrorists, or "what have you". When you quote someone, you have the opportunity to respond to what they have written, as opposed to making **** up.

I Still have no idea if you've read their details because you didn't answer my point. You deflected.

That's not even what I was talking about. I was talking about how the school system in America perpetuates a cycle of poverty which mostly affects POC. Are there some white kids in these districts too? Yes, but nowhere near as many proportionally as POC.

That's nice. It's what you said though. You connected his lack of knowledge about the schooling system with his supposed white privilege.

Search for POC/Black/AA scholarships to college based entirely on race. Then search for scholarships for white people to college based entirely on race (you wont find any). All the scholarships available for white people are also available to POC due to financial circumstances. Would that be a case the existence of black privilege? After all, it's illegal to have white only scholarships but not illegal to have black only scholarships. Even though the US has as many poor white people as poor black people.

The point being that our lack of knowledge about the US educational system does not indicate any white privilege because we're not American. As for your point, yes, as I said, there are some examples of things being stacked against Black people, but at the same time, there are examples where POC benefit from their race.

Again, not the point I was trying to make at all. I was talking about how police in the UK and US and other first World countries disproportionately stop POC for hardly any reason, if there is a reason at all. As I mentioned above, two Olympic athletes had been stopped by UK police 10 times in the last 12 months. How many times have you been stopped here for your skin colour?

Here? Never. But then, Ireland is a predominately white country so the assumption is that I would be stopped for other reasons. Whereas with POC, the assumption that they were stopped because of their skin color. Which they weren't. They would have been stopped for other reasons, and people want to suggest everything is connected to race because then, they can use the racial victim card, ignoring the actual reasons why they were stopped.

Do you know what they were doing when they were stopped? the details of each case? I seriously doubt it. You're simply assuming it was racial, whereas with a white person, you would assume it was due to other reasons.

Also, lul at using an authoritarian country as an example for how racism affects everyone. If you had use Japan (which is a country that does have a racism problem too, though not to the extent of China) then I'd be more inclined to agree. But when everyone is systemically oppressed in China, its hard to just say "much racism". Also, in this instance, people aren't murdered in Japan or other Asian countries just because they are white. (Again, China can't be counted as it's an authoritarian regime)

Everyone isn't oppressed in China. This is more of the ignorance that goes on. In any case, I used other examples such as traveling through the M.East and Africa. The point remains that white people can be targeted due to the color of their skin... You've done nothing to refute that.

Once again though, what gives you the amazing ability to understand black peoples problems when you suggest our inability to do likewise?

Ah, grand then. I'll tell all the people in Direct Provision that they aren't being systemically oppressed. That they aren't the third biggest group to be affected by Covid19. That they aren't racially abused day in and day out. That they aren't being exploitated by companies. We, as a state, are directly culpable for the situation they are in. So yes, every white Irish person does share the blame for that. Because we elected the cowboys who thought DP was a fantastic idea in the first place.

Ok. You've lost all credibility with this paragraph. DP isn't based on ethnicity, and nobody is being racially oppressed.

Also, you don't understand the definition of racism. Seeing as how the definition has recently changed, I'll forgive that one. And pointing out that white people have privilege isn't racist you insufferable imbecile

You're right there.... I don't understand the definition of racism because people like yourself expand it whenever they feel like it, while also cherry picking when to apply it.....

Direct insult. Reported. Not going to speak with you further because you are incapable of showing respect to others.

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

Could you just advocate that all people do this instead of taking the angle that the BLM argument doesn't follow through for absolutely 100.00000% of cases?

Absolutely. But while people support divisive groups like BLM it cant happen. Hearing people spout ****e like the white privilege myth is proof

2u2me

Terry Crews issues a stern warning about the militant type forces in BLM on CNN. This follow his 'controversial' tweet.

https://twitter.com/terrycrews/status/1279493774679261185

bloopy

I am concerned at the amount of people who seem to really really want to take the extremely divisive American political ideologies and apply them to Ireland.
We do not have the same history as the States. To attempt to apply that here is idiotic and dangerous.

ted1

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

Lolololol lad, you haven't got a clue what BLM is clearly. POC just wanted to be treated with the same respect, giving the same chances and be judged for their actions and not their skin colour like white people are.

And, if you think that systemic racism isn't a thing, that is your white privilege showing. You have no idea what its like to live in a schooling system that was designed to use taxation from the district that school is in. Districts that, in the new deal, were specifically designed to keep POC together and away from white people.

You have no idea what its like to be stopped by police officers multiple times a year for no reason except the colour of your skin. Hell, two well known athletes were arrested yesterday after being stopped for the 10th, the fcuking 10th, time in 12 months in the UK.

What happens in America doesn’t reflect what happens in the rest of the world.

Who are the atheletes ? Why where they stopped ?

bloopy

bloopy wrote: »

I am concerned at the amount of people who seem to really really want to take the extremely divisive American political ideologies and apply them to Ireland.
We do not have the same history as the States. To attempt to apply that here is idiotic and dangerous.

I think it's because they want to see the status quo shook up, but have little idea of how to do it.. And I sympathize. The older I get the more I feel that the common person in any democratic nation has very little actual power/influence to shape government policy. Governments and political parties do what they want within the boundaries of what they consider impossible for the electorate to ignore, but... those boundaries expand every decade.

Groups like BLM and the SJW creed seek anarchy because they believe it gives them the chance to seize power. The idea is rooted in the Marxist/militant ideology that forms the basis of such 'organisations'. Decentralized organisations that is.

The point is that they want to import such beliefs because Europe is still a predominately white population... and working within the system to change culture takes far too much time and work. Instant gratification is the rule these days, and... the protests in the US have shown the value in acting out. People are afraid of the mob now. Fear makes people give concessions that other logical people wouldn't consider sensible, and once a concession is given, it's damn hard to take it back.

2u2me

ted1 wrote: »

What happens in America doesn’t reflect what happens in the rest of the world.

Who are the atheletes ? Why where they stopped ?

If you are asking because you don't know, this is a good post about it.

ted1

2u2me wrote: »

If you are asking because you don't know, this is a good post about it.

Thanks. Sounds like it was their actions that caused them to be pulled over. There’s strict rules on tinted windows in the front seats and windscreen.

https://www.gov.uk/tinted-vehicle-window-rules

ted1

ted1 wrote: »

Thanks. Sounds like it was their actions that caused them to be pulled over.

Hard to make the case for racism when you have tinted windows. :pac:

mrkiscool2

2u2me wrote: »

It's not easy to disprove a negative. Better you prove white privilege exists by giving examples of it.

I'm sure you'll say "But black people are stopped by the police more", but they also commit more crimes.

I'm sure you'll say "But black people are shot more disproportionately by the police" but then I'll say there are other extenuating circumstances, black people generally are armed more often.

The problem with this focus on race doesn't solve any actual problems.

It's akin to a plane going down and focusing on why 50% of the people who died in it were black when the country only has 25% black people. (Maybe the plane was returning from a BLM conference?) Better to focus on what happened to the plane and it's engine, it's flight log etc.. then to focus on why more black people were killed.

Firstly, he literally said he could prove me wrong. So, no, he isn't proving a negative. He made the positive claim of being able to prove what I said was wrong.

But let's address your points, shall we? Black people committing more crimes and being stopped by the police are not the same thing at all. The idea that they are is wholly ignorant. Also, you are ignoring why black people commit more crime. Its because of systemic barriers to breaking out of poverty. Notably a poorer education due to how schools are funded in the US, less likely to have access to funds for third level, less likely to get a job than a white person if they have a black sounding name. Social disadvantage leads to crime.

That still doesn't explain why stop and searches are disproportionately carried out on black men. Also, the crime rate doesn't factor in the fact that black people are 5 times as likely to be arrested for possession for personal use of drugs even though white people are more likely to use drugs. That's not systemic to you?

No, there is not. Between 2013-18 300 unarmed black people were shot by police officers. 300. White people had around 100. White police officere are more likely to shoot black people then black officers are likely to shoot white people. Hell, black police officers aren't as likely to shoot anyone as white police officers are. In general, if you are white, don't have a weapon and are approached by a police officer you are extremely unlikely to be killed by a police officer. That is not the case for black people.

YES IT FCUKING DOES! With the issue of education in the states, that's probably the only one that could be addressed without talking about race as it allows middle class and upper class students to have all the benefits. But the rest are entirely due to systemic racism.

That analogy is fcuking terrible by the way. A better one would be to ask why the black and poor white people were put on a worse plane then the middle and upper class white people.

ted1

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

No, there is not. Between 2013-18 300 unarmed black people were shot by police officers. 300. White people had around 100. White police officere are more likely to shoot black people then black officers are likely to shoot white people. Hell, black police officers aren't as likely to shoot anyone as white police officers are. In general, if you are white, don't have a weapon and are approached by a police officer you are extremely unlikely to be killed by a police officer. That is not the case for black people.
.

Those facts on their own seem alarming. But if you study each case you might find some reasoning. How does a white person respond to an order from a cop? Do they lie down and cooperate ?
Does a block person cooperate, or do they start having a melt down and act irrational ?

2u2me

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

That analogy is fcuking terrible by the way. A better one would be to ask why the black and poor white people were put on a worse plane then the middle and upper class white people.

There's only one plane.

mrkiscool2

[Deleted User] wrote: »

And you're woefully rude, but I'm still giving you the benefit of the doubt and treated you (yup, past tense) with respect.

I quoted your post and placed my own points against them. I'm getting the feeling that you don't know how an argument goes.



And... you wouldn't need to make **** up about my posts because you could use what I've written... I have never called BLM terrorists, or "what have you". When you quote someone, you have the opportunity to respond to what they have written, as opposed to making **** up.

I Still have no idea if you've read their details because you didn't answer my point. You deflected.



That's nice. It's what you said though. You connected his lack of knowledge about the schooling system with his supposed white privilege.

Search for POC/Black/AA scholarships to college based entirely on race. Then search for scholarships for white people to college based entirely on race (you wont find any). All the scholarships available for white people are also available to POC due to financial circumstances. Would that be a case the existence of black privilege? After all, it's illegal to have white only scholarships but not illegal to have black only scholarships. Even though the US has as many poor white people as poor black people.

The point being that our lack of knowledge about the US educational system does not indicate any white privilege because we're not American. As for your point, yes, as I said, there are some examples of things being stacked against Black people, but at the same time, there are examples where POC benefit from their race.



Here? Never. But then, Ireland is a predominately white country so the assumption is that I would be stopped for other reasons. Whereas with POC, the assumption that they were stopped because of their skin color. Which they weren't. They would have been stopped for other reasons, and people want to suggest everything is connected to race because then, they can use the racial victim card, ignoring the actual reasons why they were stopped.

Do you know what they were doing when they were stopped? the details of each case? I seriously doubt it. You're simply assuming it was racial, whereas with a white person, you would assume it was due to other reasons.



Everyone isn't oppressed in China. This is more of the ignorance that goes on. In any case, I used other examples such as traveling through the M.East and Africa. The point remains that white people can be targeted due to the color of their skin... You've done nothing to refute that.

Once again though, what gives you the amazing ability to understand black peoples problems when you suggest our inability to do likewise?



Ok. You've lost all credibility with this paragraph. DP isn't based on ethnicity, and nobody is being racially oppressed.



You're right there.... I don't understand the definition of racism because people like yourself expand it whenever they feel like it, while also cherry picking when to apply it.....

Direct insult. Reported. Not going to speak with you further because you are incapable of showing respect to others.

Oh no. I got reported for a post. Whatever shall I do? Prove to me you aren't an ignorant imbecile and I'll apologise. Nothing you've said here has proved that.

Your point about BLM was wrong. You don't understand what red lining is and how funds given to elementary, middle and high schools are handed out. By the way, for reference, when you do education in a third level institution you do learn about how education is funded in future possible teaching destinations. Also, if the education system was as fine as you think it is, why is there more scholarships? Kind of seems counter intuitive, no? Or maybe its because third level institutions in America like having "diversity" as a slogan in their prospectives to attract other students? Hmmm. Either way, it says racism.

Nope, not if they have been stopped multiple times in the last 12 months whereas its rare for white people to be stopped for absolutely no reason. Seriously, the amount of stories you hear from POC about being stopped for no reason should say something. Now, that's anecdotal so it's not real evidence, but if you can't even consider why its the case it says more about you than anything else. Pretty proud of our Gardai, by the way. Far less likely to stop POC than our American and UK neighbours. Almost like there is a factor at play there?

Segway here. Ireland being "less racist" than other countries doesn't mean racism doesn't happen or that POC don't have issues here. They absolutely do. But even if they didn't, there is still something about applying social pressure around the world to a country with systemic racism.

Ah yeah, sure China is great. No-one is measured on a social points scale. Or not allowed access certain sites that have no international illegality issues. Or get arrested for protesting. Or are brought to camps for being against "the general good of China". Nah, definitely not oppressed mate.

Yeah, it isn't based on ethnicity. Sure aren't there loads of white people in DP? Sure aren't they as likely to have their asylum application be slowly processed. Sure aren't there plenty of groups complaining about the fact that those same people are coming to live in a centre near their town. Yeah, all of that DEFINITELY happens (dunno if you can tell I'm being sarcastic or not due to the report for my "direct insult" so thought I would make it clear.

mrkiscool2

ted1 wrote: »

Those facts on their own seem alarming. But if you study each case you might find some reasoning. How does a white person respond to an order from a cop? Do they lie down and cooperate ?
Does a block person cooperate, or do they start having a melt down and act irrational ?

That is actually a valid argument and not one made out of ignorance. Nice to see some discourse.

Look, of course its impossible to know every single case individually. And, for both black and white people, I am sure some of those officers generally did feel threatened. And we had a horrific case recently of an autistic white kid being brutally murdered in his fathers car when his father was stopped (btw, the officer who killed him had been stalking the kids mother). However, the disparity in unarmed black people being shot (that doesn't include excessive physical force leading to death) kind of does show there is something more at play than that.

2u2me

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

Look, of course its impossible to know every single case individually. And, for both black and white people, I am sure some of those officers generally did feel threatened. And we had a horrific case recently of an autistic white kid being brutally murdered in his fathers car when his father was stopped (btw, the officer who killed him had been stalking the kids mother). However, the disparity in unarmed black people being shot (that doesn't include excessive physical force leading to death) kind of does show there is something more at play than that.

Where do you get your data from?

Last year the Washington post logged a total of 1,004 killings (USA population 328million)
In the 802 shootings in which the race of the officer and suspect was noted;

• 371 killed were white
• 236 killed were black
• Vast majority were not unarmed
• African american suspects more likely to be armed
• Only 10 cases where unarmed african americans were fatally shot by the police last year according to the WaPo
• 9 men- 1 woman
• In 5 deaths an officer was attacked before the shooting
• 4 deaths without a standoff or armed suspect - 3 of those officers were charged.
• 1 unarmed blackman shot last year without a standoff or armed, or didn't attack the officer first, and officer didn't get charged.

2u2me

2u2me wrote: »

Where do you get your data from?

Last year the Washington post logged a total of 1,004 killings (USA population 328million)
In the 802 shootings in which the race of the officer and suspect was noted;

• 371 killed were white
• 236 killed were black
• Vast majority were not unarmed
• African american suspects more likely to be armed
• Only 10 cases where unarmed african americans were fatally shot by the police last year according to the WaPo
• 9 men- 1 woman
• In 5 deaths an officer was attacked before the shooting
• 4 deaths without a standoff or armed suspect - 3 of those officers were charged.
• 1 unarmed blackman shot last year without a standoff or armed, or didn't attack the officer first, and officer didn't get charged.

Ugh.... stats with citation!

Racist.

mrkiscool2

2u2me wrote: »

Where do you get your data from?

Last year the Washington post logged a total of 1,004 killings (USA population 328million)
In the 802 shootings in which the race of the officer and suspect was noted;

• 371 killed were white
• 236 killed were black
• Vast majority were not unarmed
• African american suspects more likely to be armed
• Only 10 cases where unarmed african americans were fatally shot by the police last year according to the WaPo
• 9 men- 1 woman
• In 5 deaths an officer was attacked before the shooting
• 4 deaths without a standoff or armed suspect - 3 of those officers were charged.
• 1 unarmed blackman shot last year without a standoff or armed, or didn't attack the officer first, and officer didn't get charged.

Well, this study of empirical evidence still says black people are more likely to be shot in every category. But, of course its not racism

https://news.northeastern.edu/2020/04/16/000-people-in-the-us-are-killed-every-year-in-police-shootings-how-many-are-preventable/

mrkiscool2

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

Well, this study of empirical evidence still says black people are more likely to be shot in every category. But, of course its not racism

https://news.northeastern.edu/2020/04/16/000-people-in-the-us-are-killed-every-year-in-police-shootings-how-many-are-preventable/

So where did you get your figures from earlier?

mrkiscool2

[Deleted User] wrote: »

So where did you get your figures from earlier?

Will find the FBI report for ya. Will put it here as an edit when I do.

2u2me

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

Well, this study of empirical evidence still says black people are more likely to be shot in every category. But, of course its not racism

https://news.northeastern.edu/2020/04/16/000-people-in-the-us-are-killed-every-year-in-police-shootings-how-many-are-preventable/

That's an article, about a report from 2014-2015 of only 27 states. Things have changed. Things have improved every single year since then. Have you got any recent data to back up your claims?

mrkiscool2

2u2me wrote: »

That's an article, about a report from 2014-2015 of only 27 states. Things have changed. Things have improved every single year since then. Have you got any recent data to back up your claims?

https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/

mrkiscool2

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/

I'd be a little dubious about this site:

"This information has been meticulously sourced from the three largest, most comprehensive and impartial crowdsourced databases on police killings in the country: FatalEncounters.org, the U.S. Police Shootings Database and KilledbyPolice.net. We've also done extensive original research to further improve the quality and completeness of the data; searching social media, obituaries, criminal records databases, police reports and other sources to identify the race of 90 percent of all victims in the database"

2u2me

mrkiscool2 wrote: »

https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/

Police shootings of black people per million is 6.6
Police shootings of white people per million is 2.5
Police shootings of Hispanic per million is 3.8

We're talking PER MILLION. It's hardly systemic racism?

You see why I make the analogy of being on a plane? We're all on it together, every race gets shot by the police however disproportionately. That disparity could easily be explained by differences in culture and/or socio-economic background. (The proportion of black people on the plane can be explained by other reasons)

By the way did you click on the 'unarmed victims' link at the bottom?

Overheal

2u2me wrote: »

Where do you get your data from?

Last year the Washington post logged a total of 1,004 killings (USA population 328million)
In the 802 shootings in which the race of the officer and suspect was noted;

• 371 killed were white
• 236 killed were black
• Vast majority were not unarmed
• African american suspects more likely to be armed
• Only 10 cases where unarmed african americans were fatally shot by the police last year according to the WaPo
• 9 men- 1 woman
• In 5 deaths an officer was attacked before the shooting
• 4 deaths without a standoff or armed suspect - 3 of those officers were charged.
• 1 unarmed blackman shot last year without a standoff or armed, or didn't attack the officer first, and officer didn't get charged.

So blacks are 13% of the population but 38% of those killed by police, wow

Overheal

2u2me wrote: »

Police shootings of black people per million is 6.6
Police shootings of white people per million is 2.5
Police shootings of Hispanic per million is 3.8

We're talking PER MILLION. It's hardly systemic racism?

You see why I make the analogy of being on a plane? We're all on it together, every race gets shot by the police however disproportionately. That disparity could easily be explained by differences in culture and/or socio-economic background. (The proportion of black people on the plane can be explained by other reasons)

By the way did you click on the 'unarmed victims' link at the bottom?

Are you for real?

“Well they aren’t gassing them so it’s not racist”

In US history there was something along the lines of 5,000 lynchings. With about 5 million blacks by the turn of the 20th century, ah sure that’s only 1,000 for every million therefore “hardly systemic” right?

Your ignorance astounds me. As though if it’s not genocide it’s not ‘real persecution’

Cop yourself on. Do I need to play back the video of the cops in the patrol car discussing their ideations for race war, against “those ****ing nigg3rs?”

cfuserkildare

Overheal wrote: »

Are you for real?

“Well they aren’t gassing them so it’s not racist”

In US history there was something along the lines of 5,000 lynchings. With about 5 million blacks by the turn of the 20th century, ah sure that’s only 1,000 for every million therefore “hardly systemic” right?

Your ignorance astounds me. As though if it’s not genocide it’s not ‘real persecution’

Cop yourself on. Do I need to play back the video of the cops in the patrol car discussing their ideations for race war, against “those ****ing nigg3rs?”

So are You a person if Colour?

Are you an American citizen?

If not, then why is it an issue for you?

And remember, George Floyd was a Convicted Criminal!!
Or had yeh forgotten about that??

joeguevara

cfuserkildare wrote: »

So are You a person if Colour?

Are you an American citizen?

If not, then why is it an issue for you?

And remember, George Floyd was a Convicted Criminal!!
Or had yeh forgotten about that??

So if you are not a minority you shouldn't care how others are treated.

If it happened to undocumented people, we shouldn't care because its not us?

And do people who have served time in jail have less rights because they are previously convicted? If so why not just exterminate them as they are already tainted.

Overheal

cfuserkildare wrote: »

So are You a person if Colour?

Are you an American citizen?

If not, then why is it an issue for you?

And remember, George Floyd was a Convicted Criminal!!
Or had yeh forgotten about that??

I’m an American and they are my brethren.

You can shove off somewhere else if you think you need to be black to care about what happens to blacks or to be Jewish to care about the holocaust or or or.

George Floyd wasn’t convicted of any crime which resulted in his death. Your priors have no bearing on whether you deserve to die in police custody. Nobody deserves to die in police custody. It’s an awfully decrepit state of mind to suggest otherwise.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

So blacks are 13% of the population but 38% of those killed by police, wow

They're also more likely to be engaged in some manner of crime. The numbers of those killed by the police who are completely innocent are relatively low in comparison (still too many in my eyes). Sure, there are many reasons for that, but it doesn't escape that in many cases (not all), the black person killed was doing something they shouldn't have been doing and were armed at the time of their deaths.

And no.. you don't need to refer to those clear cases where the police were completely in the wrong. That's covered everywhere already. We all know that there is police brutality, racism and racial profiling in the US. At the same time, simple logic also says that many other Black deaths happened because they resisted or were violent in some manner. Considering their population within the US, Black people still represent a rather hefty chunk of crime that happens. That should be acknowledged rather than being deflected.

There's a rush to ignore the criminal/violent behavior of many black people, while focusing entirely on the Police.

Overheal

[Deleted User] wrote: »

They're also more likely to be engaged in some manner of crime. The numbers of those killed by the police who are completely innocent are relatively low in comparison (still too many in my eyes). Sure, there are many reasons for that, but it doesn't escape that in many cases (not all), the black person killed was doing something they shouldn't have been doing and were armed at the time of their deaths.

And no.. you don't need to refer to those clear cases where the police were completely in the wrong. That's covered everywhere already. We all know that there is police brutality, racism and racial profiling in the US. At the same time, simple logic also says that many other Black deaths happened because they resisted or were violent in some manner. Considering their population within the US, Black people still represent a rather hefty chunk of crime that happens. That should be acknowledged rather than being deflected.

There's a rush to ignore the criminal/violent behavior of many black people, while focusing entirely on the Police.

There’s no rush to ignore anything.

If the police are broken as an institution how else do you plan to address criminal and violent behavior???

Clearly, if we want to address that behavior we are compelled to reform police so they can, effectively, address those problems in turn.

As it is I am thoroughly convinced by all evidence to date that disproportionate rates of crime by blacks is cause and effect with over policing of blacks stretching back hundreds of years, with no modern revolution in this regard. I commit petty victimless crimes all the time, if there was a cop on every corner looking to harass me I’d have a record as long as my arm too. But these white suburbs are just not where cops have been conditioned to spend the majority of their time.