BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

Tell me how

stefanovich wrote: »

That was his Dad I believe. They settled with no admission of guilt.

Regardless, getting rid of ghettos and slums reduced crime.

You should watch the Wire. They touched on this topic in a way I think you might just be able to get your head around in Season 3 I think it was.

Now, it's a drama, so don't go come back here shouting about how the BLM protestors should be doing something about Omar instead of talking about police.

stefanovich

Tell me how wrote: »

You should watch the Wire. They touched on this topic in a way I think you might just be able to get your head around in Season 3 I think it was.

Now, it's a drama, so don't go come back here shouting about how the BLM protestors should be doing something about Omar instead of talking about police.

So we should cancel regeneration here then?

Oscar Madison

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3LR-zrN-jo

I don't know if this has been posted already so if it has, apologies!

I also wouldn't be following this nonsense!

_Kaiser_

Tell me how wrote: »

No.

Do you think black people are treated unfairly in America by police?

And herein lies the issue.

Yes police persecution in America is wrong and a problem, but America's problems are not our problems. We cannot fix them, and are not responsible for them, and should not have to apologise for them.

Social media has become an extremely damaging tool whereby all of these crusades are being imported wholesale into societies where they have no relevance (like ours) and only serve to stir up the division they are supposedly against as others question why they should care or change something about their lives or opinions in response.

jam_mac_jam

There are actual slave markets in Libya, thousands dying in Yemen, concentration camps in China and footballers are kneeling in Europe for a couple of people getting shot in the richest country in the world.

Its Its nothing to do with Europe and nobody in Europe should be getting involved with it.

Some black lives matter.

ExMachina1000

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

There are actual slave markets in Libya, thousands dying in Yemen, concentration camps in China and footballers are kneeling in Europe for a couple of people getting shot in the richest country in the world.

Its Its nothing to do with Europe and nobody in Europe should be getting involved with it.

Some black lives matter.

The Blm movement doesn't care about black on black crime and violence within black communities.

biko

There have been no BLM events in Arab countries, except one in Tunisia.

“Racism is a serious problem in all Arab countries, but it is perhaps more acute in North Africa because of the greater historical weight of the enslavement of people from Sub-Saharan Africa,” says Marta Scaglioni, a researcher at the University of Milan who has recently published a book on the subject.
“It has, however, traditionally manifested itself differently than in the West. Discrimination is not so much based on people’s skin colour as the fact that they come from a lineage of slaves. If you are dark-skinned but your genealogy is Arab, there is no stigma,” adds Scaglioni.
https://www.equaltimes.org/black-lives-matter-in-the-arab?lang=en

Ted_YNWA

Tell me how wrote: »

I think you meant to say persecuted.
They disproportionally experience violence, often fatal, at the hands of police. That's just one way.


No


It's in my post. If you can't find it, try again in the morning.

Tell me how wrote: »

You should watch the Wire. They touched on this topic in a way I think you might just be able to get your head around in Season 3 I think it was.

Now, it's a drama, so don't go come back here shouting about how the BLM protestors should be doing something about Omar instead of talking about police.

Mod

Less of the passive aggressive behaviour if you want continued access to thread

Bobblehats

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

There shouldn't be any politics in sport and certainly no American politics in European sports.

They’ve found a way to thwart those manly non-kneelers by announcing the #rugbyagainstracesm initiative. Ireland and France forced to stand in a minutes silence for..... who died, exactly but they’re not about to voice their disapproval. And obviously nobody is in attendance to voice their disapproval so it continues...

Taking a knee disrupted the england squad last week enough to lose their opener to Scotland, which never happens scuppering their campaign before it had even begun so this is it now.

Biker79

Bend the knee, or else.

Fairly sure that's from a TV show based on the brutality of medieval Europe. Hmm...

Tell me how

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

And herein lies the issue.

Yes police persecution in America is wrong and a problem, but America's problems are not our problems. We cannot fix them, and are not responsible for them, and should not have to apologise for them.

Social media has become an extremely damaging tool whereby all of these crusades are being imported wholesale into societies where they have no relevance (like ours) and only serve to stir up the division they are supposedly against as others question why they should care or change something about their lives or opinions in response.

Most of the people who thanked this post have spent a good portion of their time on this thread arguing against this statement in Bold. I take it they have changed their minds.

I'm not surprised you have an issue with social media because it allows others to show empathy and support for something and not to just ignore it because it doesn't affect them directly.

It's the same type of weak argument used in relation to climate change. 'Oh we shouldn't do anything in Ireland while America and China are polluting so much'.

Why do some people get so involved in conversations while claiming that we shouldn't be talking about them?

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

No.

Do you think black people are treated unfairly in America by police?

Do I think there may some racist police? Sure. Do I think the police force as a whole is racist? No.

Tell me how

Biker79 wrote: »

Bend the knee, or else.

Fairly sure that's from a TV show based on the brutality of medieval Europe. Hmm...

'Respect the flag'

Up and until the time when it is attached to a pole which you are using to beat a police officer who is defending the Capitol which you and your homies are breaking in to so as to prevent the process of a democratic election being completed and while doing so, you remove the vaunted flag people are supposed to care so much about, and replace it with that of a defeated politician.

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

Do I think there may some racist police? Sure. Do I think the police force as a whole is racist? No.

Finally moving towards an acceptance of there being a problem. How should these racist police be identified, and dealt with, in your view?

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

'Respect the flag'

Up and until the time when it is attached to a pole which you are using to beat a police officer who is defending the Capitol

But sure, the police are racist anyway so good enough for them I suppose

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

But sure, the police are racist anyway so good enough for them I suppose

These are your words.

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

Finally moving towards an acceptance of there being a problem. How should these racist police be identified, and dealt with, in your view?

Through due process.

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

These are your words.

I know. I typed them myself.

(I was doing a little bit of sarcastic satire just for the avoidance of doubt)

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

Through due process.

Due process by who?

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

Due process by who?

The judicial system?

Accused of a crime, investigate the crime, if enough proof exists go to trial, hear evidence, prosecution or acquittal should follow.

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

The judicial system?

Accused of a crime, investigate the crime, if enough proof exists go to trial, hear evidence, prosecution or acquittal should follow.

Why do you think people chant Breonna Taylors name at protests?

Your belief in the system is something that not everyone enjoys, but let me guess, you'd be abhorrent at the suggestion that such a fact might be considered a privilege.

How did this happen?

A police officer in Boca Raton, Florida, who was fired over racist comments is now back on the streets just eight months later.

Or how do you think former Sherriff Todd Wright would handled complaints of racism from one of his deputies?

Sheriff Todd Wright of Arkansas County, about 85 miles southeast of Little Rock, resigned effective immediately on Friday during a public meeting on the incident at the county's Quorum Court, which is its governing legislative body.

.............

According to the local outlet, Wright is heard on the recording, which has been widely shared on social media, becoming upset that a woman he was with spoke to a Black person in a store.

Throughout the recording, the woman refers to the man as “Todd.” The man in the recording uses a racial slur against Black people about nine times.

Why hasn't due process worked so far?

Hidden in Plain Sight: Racism, White Supremacy, and Far-Right Militancy in Law Enforcement

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

Most of the people who thanked this post have spent a good portion of their time on this thread arguing against this statement in Bold. I take it they have changed their minds.

I don't think they have been arguing against the piece in bold. The vast majority of posters have acknowledged that there is racism within the US police force, and that sometimes they kill suspects wrongly.

The difference, and perhaps it's a little subtle, is the belief that the whole police force isn't racist.. and the vast majority of police have little interest in specifically targeting Black people based solely on their race, as opposed to the belief that Black people are more likely to be engaged in criminal activity.

The opposition was pushing the belief in widespread systematic racism throughout the police force. It was a claim of absolutes.

You're seeking to take the part in bold and make it into something it isn't.

I'm not surprised you have an issue with social media because it allows others to show empathy and support for something and not to just ignore it because it doesn't affect them directly.

That's one perspective. Another is that social media gives license to the frenzied mob. The stroking of egos and adrenaline surges as they condemn others and gain support from like minded people. A place where claims of facts are given, but rarely proven, because those like minded people want to believe that they're true.

Social media is generally extremely toxic, feeding on negative emotions and beliefs.

It's the same type of weak argument used in relation to climate change. 'Oh we shouldn't do anything in Ireland while America and China are polluting so much'.

Not really. How much influence do you believe you have over the US administrations, and official bodies?

Why do some people get so involved in conversations while claiming that we shouldn't be talking about them?

Who is doing that? I didn't get that from the other posters opinion.

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think they have been arguing against the piece in bold. The vast majority of posters have acknowledged that there is racism within the US police force, and that sometimes they kill suspects wrongly.

The difference, and perhaps it's a little subtle, is the belief that the whole police force isn't racist.. and the vast majority of police have little interest in specifically targeting Black people based solely on their race, as opposed to the belief that Black people are more likely to be engaged in criminal activity.

This is a view that did not exist on this thread throughout last summer, so stating it now, and you are the second person to allude to it is a sign of progress.

This arguing that what people are doing is defending against the claim that all police forces (there isn't a single police force across the country) are racist is a fallacy because that isn't what has been claimed. Certainly not by me. But that there are cases of unacceptable behaviours by police and that in many cases the way they operate is still not best serving the people they are specifically there to serve.

The likelihood for Black people to be more involved in crime has been highlighted by BLM advocates as something which needs to be targeted and looked at. Some people think it is inherently in their culture to do so, I think that whatever culture exists in this respect (or a predisposition rather than a cultural motivation) has been influenced by societal practices including redlining, historical barriers to education and a disparity in sentencing practices and that too needs to be looked at but that it isn't simply a case of telling black people to pull yourselves out of it, you have the same opportunity as everyone else.

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

Why do you think people chant Breonna Taylors name at protests?

Your belief in the system is something that not everyone enjoys, but let me guess, you'd be abhorrent at the suggestion that such a fact might be considered a privilege.

How did this happen?



Or how do you think former Sherriff Todd Wright would handled complaints of racism from one of his deputies?



Why hasn't due process worked so far?

How would you combat this racism? I don't have all the answers. But I sure as hell do not believe that BLM have done anything positive with regards race relations between law enforcement and black people. Quite the opposite. I abhor racism in all its forms.

I yes, I do find it abhorrent that you would bring up "privilege" based on skin colour. It's a disgusting and cheap tactic to dismiss white people's opinions.

why are people chanting out Breonna Taylor's name? No clue. Why were they chanting kill the cops and berating white people for not kneeling and putting their fist in the air?

Tell me how

Deleted User wrote: »

How would you combat this racism? I don't have all the answers. But I sure as hell do not believe that BLM have done anything positive with regards race relations between law enforcement and black people. Quite the opposite. I abhor racism in all its forms.

I yes, I do find it abhorrent that you would bring up "privilege" based on skin colour. It's a disgusting and cheap tactic to dismiss white people's opinions.

why are people chanting out Breonna Taylor's name? No clue. Why were they chanting kill the cops and berating white people for not kneeling and putting their fist in the air?

So no answers, but agree there's problem. Why then denouncing those trying to call for meaningful action to address the problem?

It's telling that you think pointing out the disparity in how different races experience the policing and judicial system is a disgusting and cheap tactic. Always more outraged at this being pointed out, than at the fact that it exists.

Don't know what to say about you not knowing why Breonna Taylors name is mentioned nearly 12 months on. Quite surprising from someone so involved in a BLM discussion.

BattleCorp

Tell me how wrote: »

Why do you think people chant Breonna Taylors name at protests?

Your belief in the system is something that not everyone enjoys, but let me guess, you'd be abhorrent at the suggestion that such a fact might be considered a privilege.

How did this happen?

Or how do you think former Sherriff Todd Wright would handled complaints of racism from one of his deputies?

Why hasn't due process worked so far?

Over 800,000 police in the US. Of course some of them are going to be racist. Only an idiot would deny that.

But your narrative and the BLM narrative would have us believe that every single one of them is racist, and that's not the case.

Your narrative and the BLM narrative would also have us believe that every single black person killed by the police force was an unjustified killing, which again is not the case.

Tell me how

Tell me how wrote: »

This is a view that did not exist on this thread throughout last summer, so stating it now, and you are the second person to allude to it is a sign of progress.

err... I'm getting the rather strong feeling you're seeing what you want to see.

This arguing that what people are doing is defending against the claim that all police forces (there isn't a single police force across the country) are racist is a fallacy because that isn't what has been claimed. Certainly not by me. But that there are cases of unacceptable behaviours by police and that in many cases the way they operate is still not best serving the people they are specifically there to serve.

Strange.. I've seen that very claim on multiple fronts from the beginning of this thread. The police are murderers and racists! grr.

But sure, I agree. Police reform is needed. It always was.. and should always be a consideration for any police force dealing with such stresses.

The likelihood for Black people to be more involved in crime has been highlighted by BLM advocates as something which needs to be targeted and looked at.

Really? I've seen extremely little of that, and most that could be considered such an acknowledgement is seeking to limit the damage done by other people.

In the vast majority of cases, BLM have blamed external influences for what happens to African Americans in the US, and I haven't heard them ever talk about what Black people themselves can do to resolve the problems within their own culture. (Without, again, passing blame and responsibility off on to someone else who is not Black)

Some people think it is inherently in their culture to do so, I think that whatever culture exists in this respect (or a predisposition rather than a cultural motivation) has been influenced by societal practices including redlining, historical barriers to education and a disparity in sentencing practices and that too needs to be looked at

I'm splitting it because they're two very different scenarios.

Of course, AA (African American) culture/society has been influenced by these things. At the same time, AA culture has been influenced by black-on-Black crime, calling each other "Ni**er", domestic abuse, single parents, gangs, etc

At some point, there needs to be recognition that AA people themselves created a society with many negative influences, and that change can only come about when they recognise that, and seek their removal. Blaming others only helps so much.

but that it isn't simply a case of telling black people to pull yourselves out of it, you have the same opportunity as everyone else.

you have the same opportunity as everyone else? Which they do. They can leave that neighborhood, and claim supports in another area. There are reams of educational, and work related schemes available in the US, either provided by AA organisations or the various US official bodies.

I suspect a poor black teenager has more supports available to them, than a poor white redneck. There aren't going to be quotas, diversity initiatives and educational sponsorship for that poor white redneck.. whereas...

Sweetemotion

Defunding the police seems to be going well.

https://twitter.com/JackPosobiec/status/1360985099756478464

Tell me how

BattleCorp wrote: »

Over 800,000 police in the US. Of course some of them are going to be racist. Only an idiot would deny that.

But your narrative and the BLM narrative would have us believe that every single one of them is racist, and that's not the case.

Your narrative and the BLM narrative would also have us believe that every single black person killed by the police force was an unjustified killing, which again is not the case.

Link any post which indicates either of these points please.

Tell me how

Sweetemotion wrote: »

Defunding the police seems to be going well.

Police reform worked for this city.

Before its police reforms, Camden was routinely named one of the most violent cities in the US.

Now, seven years after the old department was booted, the city's crime has dropped by close to half. Officers host outdoor parties for residents and knock on doors to introduce themselves. It's a radically different Camden than it was even a decade ago.

........


Violent crimes have dropped 42% in seven years, according to city crime data provided by the department. The crime rate has dropped from 79 per 1,000 to 44 per 1,000, the data shows.

Cappelli credits the improvement to new "community-oriented policing," which prizes partnership and problem-solving over violence and punishment.