BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

iamstop

cfuserkildare wrote: »

We pretty much all want True Equality,
But when there is so much media content about Black Domination of White people, then please explain How we are meant to feel!!

Wow. I've not seen any. Please link some.

Cordell

iamstop wrote: »

I'll just leave this here:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57647703

Do you have an opinion?
Here's mine: clearly he was a troubled individual with mental health problems. But no one cares about whiteys problems until they go shooting blacks and then it's not mental health problems, it's racism and white supremacy.

iamstop

What if I told you Racism and White Supremacy ARE mental healthy problems?

cfuserkildare

iamstop wrote: »

What if I told you Racism and White Supremacy ARE mental healthy problems?

As a Moderator, are you permitted to get involved in the opinions of this post?

Cordell

iamstop wrote: »

What if I told you Racism and White Supremacy ARE mental healthy problems?

You would be wrong because they AREN'T.
But it's an interesting point of view: if they are mental health problems then racists and white supremacists are not guilty of anything, they are VICTIMS.
Right?

iamstop

Cordell wrote: »

You would be wrong because they AREN'T.
But it's an interesting point of view: if they are mental health problems then racists and white supremacists are not guilty of anything, they are VICTIMS.
Right?

That's a huge leap there cowboy. You're implying that someone with mental health issues is automatically exonerated of any wrong doing and can not be guilty of crimes.
Getting a bit off track here but there are countless serial killer and people who have done horrendous things in the past that have been deemed to have had mental issues. They still acted upon those urges and impulses, perhaps triggered by childhood trauma or perhaps triggered by delusional concepts of the world they live in.

iamstop

cfuserkildare wrote: »

As a Moderator, are you permitted to get involved in the opinions of this post?

So because I'm countering your points with well constructed, rational and real world ideas you're trying to get me checked? I'm the mod of a music forum. How would that forbid me from taking part in a discussion in any thread? What reasoning is there for prohibiting me being a part of this thread because I'm a mod in a completely non related forum?

cfuserkildare

iamstop wrote: »

So because I'm countering your points with well constructed, rational and real world ideas you're trying to get me checked? I'm the mod of a music forum. How would that forbid me from taking part in a discussion in any thread? What reasoning is there for prohibiting me being a part of this thread because I'm a mod in a completely non related forum?

That's why I Asked you a Question,
Not simply made a statement.
Please learn how the English Language works?!?!

Baggly

iamstop wrote: »

So because I'm countering your points with well constructed, rational and real world ideas you're trying to get me checked? I'm the mod of a music forum. How would that forbid me from taking part in a discussion in any thread? What reasoning is there for prohibiting me being a part of this thread because I'm a mod in a completely non related forum?

cfuserkildare wrote: »

That's why I Asked you a Question,
Not simply made a statement.
Please learn how the English Language works?!?!

Mod

This is irrelevant to this thread. Anyone can contribute to this thread once they stay on topic and post civilly. Drop this and get back on topic please.

Baggly

Mod

Overheals threadban lifted after discussion via PM

Mic 1972

biko wrote: »

You'll have to report posts you find problematic. Forum mods cannot be expected to see your post otherwise.

My post was removed, i can't provide evidence anymore.
However this link about the "white supremacist" killing a black guy is still available.

Overheal

Cordell wrote: »

By showing support to BLM, a black supremacist violent organization.

That's a bit reductive. Everyone who kneels for the anthem, it's direct allegiance and fealty to the BLM organization? I don't see how we can make that assertion.

“I never said that I hated the country. Never said that. All I said was I respect my people enough to not stand to acknowledge something that disrespects them. I love my people, point blank, period,” she said. Doesn't mention the BLM organization anywhere.

Her reasoning she gave for doing all this seems quite sound, doesn't relate to the BLM organization, and even reinforces why trying to ban critical race theory is such a backslide - for example, many Irish will have heard the Star Spangled Banner many times before, some can even recite it (sorry about that) and you sure know the melody. But, that's only the first verse of the actual song. The third verse is something they won't educate you about, because 'it's problematic:'

https://www.mediaite.com/news/watch-olympian-gwen-berry-speaks-out-on-disrespectful-national-anthem-that-does-not-speak-for-black-americans/

O say can you see, by the dawn’s early light,
What so proudly we hail’d at the twilight’s last gleaming,
Whose broad stripes and bright stars through the perilous fight
O’er the ramparts we watch’d were so gallantly streaming?
And the rocket’s red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there,
O say does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

On the shore dimly seen through the mists of the deep
Where the foe’s haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o’er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning’s first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines in the stream,
’Tis the star-spangled banner - O long may it wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

O thus be it ever when freemen shall stand
Between their lov’d home and the war’s desolation!
Blest with vict’ry and peace may the heav’n rescued land
Praise the power that hath made and preserv’d us a nation!
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto - “In God is our trust,”
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

https://www.pri.org/stories/2016-08-30/historians-disagree-whether-star-spangled-banner-racist

Mic 1972

Overheal wrote: »

That's a bit reductive. Everyone who kneels for the anthem, it's direct allegiance and fealty to the BLM organization? I don't see how we can make that assertion.

the kneeling has everything to do with BLM, let's not pretend it hasnt

BattleCorp

Overheal wrote: »

That's a bit reductive. Everyone who kneels for the anthem, it's direct allegiance and fealty to the BLM organization? I don't see how we can make that assertion.

Am I correct to understand from your statement above that if anybody 'takes the knee', they are showing direct allegiance and fealty to the BLM organisation?

Overheal

Mic 1972 wrote: »

the kneeling has everything to do with BLM, let's not pretend it hasnt

Said without evidence dismissed without evidence. Not going to automatically assume every black person is associated with BLM any more than I will assume every white person is associated with the 3 percenters.

Overheal

BattleCorp wrote: »

Am I correct to understand from your statement above that if anybody 'takes the knee', they are showing direct allegiance and fealty to the BLM organisation?

You would not be correct. Another said that by kneeling, athletes were "showing support to BLM, a black supremacist violent organization." I was rubbishing this statement, not making it.

BattleCorp

Overheal wrote: »

You would not be correct. Another said that by kneeling, athletes were "showing support to BLM, a black supremacist violent organization." I was rubbishing this statement, not making it.

Fair enough. Thanks for the answer.

There are many though who would view 'taking the knee' as showing support for BLM.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

Said without evidence dismissed without evidence. Not going to automatically assume every black person is associated with BLM any more than I will assume every white person is associated with the 3 percenters.

I would have agreed if the England players weren't making the exact same gesture in support of the BLM, mere weeks ago, with BLM logos emblazoned on the television.

That's the issue I and others have with the gesture.

Mic 1972

Overheal wrote: »

Said without evidence dismissed without evidence. Not going to automatically assume every black person is associated with BLM any more than I will assume every white person is associated with the 3 percenters.

George Floyd > BLM Riots > Kneeling

Overheal

BattleCorp wrote: »

Fair enough. Thanks for the answer.

There are many though who would view 'taking the knee' as showing support for BLM.

There are clearly some overlapping reasons, like police brutality and race disparity, but I don't see that as being support for an organization in particular. Similarly, someone who protests taxation is not, in turn, 'showing support for the Tea Party,' and they may have strongly held views in opposition to the Tea Party, someone who defends Judaism is not, in turn, defending the atrocities committed by Israel.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

I would have agreed if the England players weren't making the exact same gesture in support of the BLM, mere weeks ago, with BLM logos emblazoned on the television.

That's the issue I and others have with the gesture.

Without verifying the event you're discussing: if some English players decided to, and decided to state they were supporting the BLM organization, then, those English players expressed support for the BLM organization. That does not, however, make it the case for every athlete who kneels sits turns around etc. must clearly be supporting the BLM organization, because some English players did that one time.

Overheal

Mic 1972 wrote: »

George Floyd > BLM Riots > Kneeling

I don't get it. Please explain.

BattleCorp

Overheal wrote: »

There are clearly some overlapping reasons, like police brutality and race disparity, but I don't see that as being support for an organization in particular. Similarly, someone who protests taxation is not, in turn, 'showing support for the Tea Party,' and they may have strongly held views in opposition to the Tea Party, someone who defends Judaism is not, in turn, defending the atrocities committed by Israel.

The problem is that while you don't see 'taking the knee' as being supportive of BLM, lots of people do. The 'taking the knee' gesture has been somewhat tainted because of the actions of some of the BLM movement.

Kind of like how a 3000 year old religious symbol was tainted by a group of Germans about 80 years ago.

Retr0gamer

BattleCorp wrote: »

Fair enough. Thanks for the answer.

There are many though who would view 'taking the knee' as showing support for BLM.

There are. And they'd be wrong.

Overheal

BattleCorp wrote: »

The problem is that while you don't see 'taking the knee' as being supportive of BLM, lots of people do. The 'taking the knee' gesture has been somewhat tainted because of the actions of some of the BLM movement.

Kind of like how a 3000 year old religious symbol was tainted by a group of Germans about 80 years ago.

I don't care if lots of people do, they're wrong, with insufficient evidence to lay the claim that everyone who kneels supports the BLM organization(s) and trying to appeal to me by saying loads of people believe it and therefore I must be wrong, is argumentum ad populum.

BattleCorp

Retr0gamer wrote: »

There are. And they'd be wrong.

Says you.

BattleCorp

Overheal wrote: »

I don't care if lots of people do, they're wrong, and trying to appeal to me by saying loads of people believe it and therefore I must be wrong, is argumentum ad populum.

I'm not trying to appeal to you by saying it, I'm just stating that that's the way a lot of people view the gesture. They view it as being in support of BLM.

Look, I'm not against some of the aims of BLM. I'm in favour of black people getting fair play from the Police in the US. But there are certainly elements of BLM that I am not in favour of.

Overheal

BattleCorp wrote: »

Says you.

Says what we know and what we don't know. People believe the moon landings were faked and the earth is flat. But we simply do not know the level of support each individual has for or against the BLM organizations based on nothing more than whether or not they kneeled for the national anthem.

BattleCorp wrote: »

I'm not trying to appeal to you by saying it, I'm just stating that that's the way a lot of people view the gesture. They view it as being in support of BLM.

That's fine, and I repeat, they have insufficient basis for their belief.

kildare lad

Overheal wrote: »

You would not be correct. Another said that by kneeling, athletes were "showing support to BLM, a black supremacist violent organization." I was rubbishing this statement, not making it.

It's amazing with all the kneeling , protesting and tearing down of statues , gun crime and violence is on the increase across America . London's looking at having it's deadliest year in a long time with the amount of black teens getting killed . I thought all the kneeling and BLM protests would've stopped all this . It appears that all this virtue signalling by woke lefties really doesn't have any impact in the amount of young black people that get killed every year , if anything violence has gotten worse . What's going on ?

Overheal

kildare lad wrote: »

It's amazing with all the kneeling , protesting and tearing down of statues , gun crime and violence is on the increase across America . London's looking at having it's deadliest year in a long time with the amount of black teens getting killed . I thought all the kneeling and BLM protests would've stopped all this . It appears that all this virtue signalling by woke lefties really doesn't have any impact in the amount of young black people that get killed every year , if anything violence has gotten worse . What's going on ?

You're kicking up a lot of dirt but let's pick a lane: which of these topics do you want to dive into? Are you attempting to argue that kneeling = BLM support or are we ready to move past it onto one of these topics offered up as a pivot?