BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

Overheal

I have great admiration for Stewart but a lot of what he did was play clips of Fox pundits contradicting themselves on different days of the week and then making funny noises and wubwubwubing his head back and forth.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

I have great admiration for Stewart but a lot of what he did was play clips of Fox pundits contradicting themselves on different days of the week and then making funny noises and wubwubwubing his head back and forth.

It was a lot of what he did, but it wasn't ALL he did. At least with Stewart, you got the feeling he believed in what he was saying and would be fair to either side and not be a one sided "gotcha" merchant.

Oliver has the entertainment value but doesn't have the same legitimacy in my opinion as it seems like he is pandering only for his audience.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

It was a lot of what he did, but it wasn't ALL he did. At least with Stewart, you got the feeling he believed in what he was saying and would be fair to either side and not be a one sided "gotcha" merchant.

Oliver has the entertainment value but doesn't have the same legitimacy in my opinion as it seems like he is pandering only for his audience.

I don't agree with that. He doesn't have to dive into any of the things he does, but he does so as a newly minted US citizen with concern about what he signed up for whether that's Civil Asset Forfeiture or SLAPP lawsuits, such as that Bob Murray levied at him. He's way elevated himself since the days of playing the slapstick stereotypical British correspondent on Stewart's show. He had kind of a transcendence the summer of 2013 he took over for Jon when Jon was in the middle east producing a film. His Last Week Tonight segments routinely achieve viral viewership and catch headlines. The only arena Stewart has him beat a bit is Stewart went on Fox to tell it to their faces, more than that Stewart attained legendary status with his lobbying in DC for the Zadroga Act and its extensions. I think we're getting off the rails of the topic now though, but I think your characterization is better aimed at Stephen Colbert, who undeniably plays to his audience for the laughs, his last real capstone was his work raising awareness in the US of SuperPACs by running for President in 2012 as a stunt.

worded

Black Tea and coffee matter. Or add milk for a white

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/retail-and-services/bewley-s-grafton-street-cafe-to-reopen-from-august-27th-at-latest-1.4318090

Overheal

An incident involving 2 black women and their kids and the Secret Service of all things - they were planning on wading in the memorial pool (as people are wont to do in DC during hot weather) and Secret Service. On this visit, they never got there. After parking, Secret Service slammed their car into their front bumper and pointed guns at them:

It was a hot Thursday afternoon, so India Johnson, 26, and Yasmeen Winston, 25, decided to take their babies to splash in the fountains at the World War II Memorial. The women, best friends since seventh grade, parked on Constitution Avenue near the White House and readied themselves for the walk to the Mall.

Their babies were in the back seat, Mother Goose Club was singing through the car speakers, and the mothers were digging around in their diaper bags when they heard the crash and felt the jolt.

Johnson and Winston looked up. A Secret Service cruiser had driven into their front left bumper, Winston told The Washington Post. Within seconds, Winston recalled, a uniformed Secret Service officer was pointing a rifle at them, yelling “Get out!” and “Put your hands in the air!” More officers surrounded them with guns pulled, the women said.

Over the next hour, Winston and Johnson said, they were handcuffed without reason, separated from their crying babies, and handled by police who, at first, did not wear masks to protect against the novel coronavirus.

The women are now demanding that the Secret Service investigate the encounter and publicly release details of the incident which, they said, made them fear for their lives and the safety of their children.

“This incident took place near our national monuments across from the White House,” their attorney, Timothy Maloney, wrote in the letter demanding an investigation to Secret Service Director James Murray over the weekend. “It occurred after eight weeks of unprecedented national demonstrations about excessive police conduct, some of which took place right there on Constitution Avenue. Has the Secret Service learned nothing this summer?”

Initially, the women said, an officer told them the vehicle had been reported stolen and that the suspects were two Black men. But the women, both African American, said no men were with them and provided proof that Johnson was the owner. She told the Secret Service she had never reported the car stolen. Eventually, the women were released — without an apology or answers to their questions, Winston said.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/legal-issues/two-black-moms-took-their-kids-to-the-mall-secret-service-confronted-them-with-guns-they-said/2020/08/03/be4dfa8c-d4f1-11ea-9c3b-dfc394c03988_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-low_secretservicmoms-349pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory-ans#comments-wrapper

They're calling for Secret Service to give a public explanation, they say they are 'investigating' the incident. They're prepared to ask for a congressional inquiry if they drag on this.

I don't know of any situation where the Secret Service's scope was investigating suspected stolen cars in this manner.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

I don't agree with that. He doesn't have to dive into any of the things he does, but he does so as a newly minted US citizen with concern about what he signed up for whether that's Civil Asset Forfeiture or SLAPP lawsuits, such as that Bob Murray levied at him. He's way elevated himself since the days of playing the slapstick stereotypical British correspondent on Stewart's show. He had kind of a transcendence the summer of 2013 he took over for Jon when Jon was in the middle east producing a film. His Last Week Tonight segments routinely achieve viral viewership and catch headlines. The only arena Stewart has him beat a bit is Stewart went on Fox to tell it to their faces, more than that Stewart attained legendary status with his lobbying in DC for the Zadroga Act and its extensions. I think we're getting off the rails of the topic now though, but I think your characterization is better aimed at Stephen Colbert, who undeniably plays to his audience for the laughs, his last real capstone was his work raising awareness in the US of SuperPACs by running for President in 2012 as a stunt.

I disagree.

He comes across, to me at least, as a newly minted American who spouts whatever he is told to say by his team of writers and has minimal input to his material.

Stewart always gave the impression he was invested.

I agree with you regarding Colbert. A sad parody of himself, who ironically, was a parody.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

I disagree.

He comes across, to me at least, as a newly minted American who spouts whatever he is told to say by his team of writers and has minimal input to his material.

Stewart always gave the impression he was invested.

I agree with you regarding Colbert. A sad parody of himself, who ironically, was a parody.

Complete horsesh*t.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

Complete horsesh*t.

Ah well, it was nice for once to be able to compare opinions but I see you've reverted to type.

No it's not horse****. John Oliver is nothing more than an English talking head for a pro democrat television programme. I would doubt if he has much, if any creative input and think no less of him for it.

He is a (person who likes to pretend he's) thinking man's James Corden.

But he says the things you like so I assume you like him. Fair enough.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah well, it was nice for once to be able to compare opinions but I see you've reverted to type.

No it's not horse****. John Oliver is nothing more than an English talking head for a pro democrat television programme. I would doubt if he has much, if any creative input and think no less of him for it.

He is a (person who likes to pretend he's) thinking man's James Corden.

But he says the things you like so I assume you like him. Fair enough.

Your prerogative to have that opinion but its entirely baseless. Hence, it is horse****. Your doubt about his creative input is also completely unfounded. He won an Emmy for his role as Jon Stewart's writer, actually, on The Daily Show. He is a lead writer for Last Week Tonight, as well and Executive Producer. And more awards.

2u2me

Overheal wrote: »

Your prerogative to have that opinion but its entirely baseless. Hence, it is horse****. Your doubt about his creative input is also completely unfounded. He won an Emmy for his role as Jon Stewart's writer, actually, on The Daily Show. He is a lead writer for Last Week Tonight, as well and Executive Producer. And more awards.

Oliver has some good moments (I.e. the snowden interview) but he treats his audience like the idiots that they are.

Stewart also joked at his audience but offered them the respect of not being idiots.

Overheal

2u2me wrote: »

Oliver has some good moments (I.e. the snowden interview) but he treats his audience like the idiots that they are.

Stewart also joked at his audience but offered them the respect of not being idiots.

And how does he treat his audience like idiots?

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

Your prerogative to have that opinion but its entirely baseless. Hence, it is horse****. Your doubt about his creative input is also completely unfounded. He won an Emmy for his role as Jon Stewart's writer, actually, on The Daily Show. He is a lead writer for Last Week Tonight, as well and Executive Producer. And more awards.

I'm judging it on his whole career. From when he was a stand up comedian in England until he went to America.

His credits on his show and awards mean absolutely nothing unless you
are of the opinion that Kim Kardashian is actually actively producing her shows and you feel that holding an Emmy or the likes mean you aren't scripted...

He is savvy, he is astute and he has a quick wit. He is also a mouthpiece who will say what he is told.

He is in as much control of his output as Cordon or Noah is.

It's all insidious propaganda but some are more entertaining than others. But to think it's actually the opinion of John Oliver is naïve to say the least.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

And how does he treat his audience like idiots?

Some don't see it. Evidently.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

Some don't see it. Evidently.

If you can't explain it..

2u2me

Overheal wrote: »

And how does he treat his audience like idiots?

The way he feels obliged to intersperse every complicated story he presents with some cute animal just to get people to pay attention. He even tells you that's why he's doing it.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm judging it on his whole career. From when he was a stand up comedian in England until he went to America.

His credits on his show and awards mean absolutely nothing unless you
are of the opinion that Kim Kardashian is actually actively producing her shows and you feel that holding an Emmy or the likes mean you aren't scripted...

He is savvy, he is astute and he has a quick wit. He is also a mouthpiece who will say what he is told.

He is in as much control of his output as Cordon or Noah is.

It's all insidious propaganda but some are more entertaining than others. But to think it's actually the opinion of John Oliver is naïve to say the least.

Right he's a mouthpiece and Jon Stewart was a genius who had no help from writers including John Oliver.... right.

Oh no.... That's for the "other idiots" who don't get it. The people who agree with him laugh at the silly people.

It's very cut and paste.

Entertaining all the same.

Overheal

2u2me wrote: »

The way he feels obliged to intersperse every complicated story he presents with some cute animal just to get people to pay attention. He even tells you that's why he's doing it.

So what, how dare he inject some humor into what would otherwise be bland reporting on civil asset forfeiture? Oh gods, comedian inserts joke into 30 minute segment - and Jon Stewart "offered them the respect of not being idiots," by shoving his mouth full of corn dogs and baconnaise. Right.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

Right he's a mouthpiece and Jon Stewart was a genius who had no help from writers including John Oliver.... right.

Again, that's not what I said. Not even nearly. I admired Jon Stewart because I believed him. I never said he was a genius.

Jon Stewart was incredibly outspoken and would gladly debate his position and even turn up on television programmes which were historically negative towards his point of view.

He had an air of legitimacy, which he managed to back up in the public eye and in interviews. Sometimes he won, sometimes he lost.

The only time I have seen Oliver interviewed was on the likes of Colbert or Seth Myers.

Which is absolutely fine. He has no need to do anything other than his show. It's a very good show. He needs to prove nothing.

I just don't believe him and don't think for a moment that he would be able to hold himself or his "opinions" in good stead outside of an autocue or a scripted environment.

I have no idea why you would be so argumentative about this opinion but here we are.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

So what, how dare he inject some humor into what would otherwise be bland reporting on civil asset forfeiture? Oh gods, comedian inserts joke into 30 minute segment - and Jon Stewart "offered them the respect of not being idiots," by shoving his mouth full of corn dogs and baconnaise. Right.

Wow.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow.

No really, he did that:

http://www.cc.com/video-clips/1fupdb/the-daily-show-with-jon-stewart-intro---pancakes---sausage-on-a-stick

This sidebar has been fun and all but seemed like a long winded way of ignoring the more constructive bit of the whitewashing of history in the US.

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

No really, he did that:

http://www.cc.com/video-clips/1fupdb/the-daily-show-with-jon-stewart-intro---pancakes---sausage-on-a-stick

This sidebar has been fun and all but seemed like a long winded way of ignoring the more constructive bit of the whitewashing of history in the US.

I'm not a fan of Jon Stewart as a person. I thought he was a great host of the Daily Show. That's about it. I respected him for his opinions even though I often disagreed with him. It's not often that happens as people usually just call other opinions horse****. Hey ho

Whitewashing of history is a great term. It's almost as if you believe that white people are hiding the fact that slavery or racism exists.

****ing Germans keep walking about as if their **** doesn't stink too.

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm not a fan of Jon Stewart as a person. I thought he was a great host of the Daily Show. That's about it. I respected him for his opinions even though I often disagreed with him. It's not often that happens as people usually just call other opinions horse****. Hey ho

Whitewashing of history is a great term. It's almost as if you believe that white people are hiding the fact that slavery or racism exists.

****ing Germans keep walking about as if their **** doesn't stink too.

Because that's more or less what's happened in US history. I shared a WaPo article about it, and an Oliver piece on it. Both refer to sources. You can see for yourself the whitewashing in play. They downplayed racism when they couldn't hide it and when they could they pretended it never happened, like the Tulsa race riot that whites have tried to systematically deny and erase evidence of, or the Wilmington Insurrection, which is barely mentioned if at all.

when you think about it you do have 2 sides to this 'erasing history' dichotomy in the US: people who want all the statues removed and what that racist history taught, those who want them kept/have traitor rags everywhere and want that history silenced/not taught in schools.

Do you believe that reparations should be paid to black people or that there should be positive discrimination to redress any perceived imbalance? Should there be accurate representation in all aspects of society based on the population spread?

What needs to be done in modern western society (I'm assuming it's only the western developed world you are talking about) to redress your opinion that white people have an advantage?

Overheal

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you believe that reparations should be paid to black people or that there should be positive discrimination to redress any perceived imbalance? Should there be accurate representation in all aspects of society based on the population spread?

What needs to be done in modern western society (I'm assuming it's only the western developed world you are talking about) to redress your opinion that white people have an advantage?

I leave it to other people to mete out the reparations agenda, I don't have any personal stake in that either way. I just don't think it is practical any longer, and there are practical issues with affirmative action.

Tell you what though Trump reversing the housing rule to desegregate housing won't help. I think that was an imperfect but measured approach by the Obama admin. https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/29/trump-housing-policy-low-income-suburbs-386414

I will read into that. Too late for me tonight. But I will have a read and get back to you.

But it does seem very easy to blame trump. Normally too easy. A lot of people forget that

Again, segregation is not something I would ever ask for, but black lives matter and "positive discrimination" is, in my opinion, more pro segregation than anti.

Overheal

I don't think theres the cohesion in the BLM movement people think and you've reminded me of part of that: at Clemson in 2015 there was a popular movement by black students calling for re-segregation of living spaces etc. which blew my mind. Their logic was they wanted to feel comfortable 'around their own kind' or whatever. I think it was very shortsighted of them. But anyway there's that and you also have a lot of people who align with 'black lives matter,' who would say the opposite, that we do need to desegregate and assimilate together of course. But you're right nobody is right or wrong all of the time.

Biafranlivemat

The bLM movement Louisville,Kentucky is acting like the Mafia.
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/blm-uses-mafia-tactics-threaten-cuban-restaurant-owner-diversity-demands

People saying that Black Lives Matter and shouting that white people are the reason for all the ills in the world without taking responsibility for their own actions are terrible people

White people shouting that black people should look after this own issues before blaming whites are also terrible people.

Without sounding like a monster, I'm sure there are fine people on both sides who empathise with their preferred agenda. (, Purposely evoking that infamous statement)

I'm pushing 40. Middle aged now I guess so I'm a boomer or some other phrase I don't get. God damn it. Bring back beavis and butthead.

Before I nip off to bed, I googled black people in Ireland and was given the result that 1.4% of the census (2016) were people who were black? Seems low.

Again, I'm way too tired to fact check but will respond in the morning, but if that is the case... Aren't black people over represented in media etc?

And again, I'm not beating a drum or wanting to argue. I think there is a conversation to be had. I just doubt it will happen

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

An incident involving 2 black women and their kids and the Secret Service of all things - they were planning on wading in the memorial pool (as people are wont to do in DC during hot weather) and Secret Service. On this visit, they never got there. After parking, Secret Service slammed their car into their front bumper and pointed guns at them:

It was a hot Thursday afternoon, so India Johnson, 26, and Yasmeen Winston, 25, decided to take their babies to splash in the fountains at the World War II Memorial. The women, best friends since seventh grade, parked on Constitution Avenue near the White House and readied themselves for the walk to the Mall.

Their babies were in the back seat, Mother Goose Club was singing through the car speakers, and the mothers were digging around in their diaper bags when they heard the crash and felt the jolt.

Johnson and Winston looked up. A Secret Service cruiser had driven into their front left bumper, Winston told The Washington Post. Within seconds, Winston recalled, a uniformed Secret Service officer was pointing a rifle at them, yelling “Get out!” and “Put your hands in the air!” More officers surrounded them with guns pulled, the women said.

Over the next hour, Winston and Johnson said, they were handcuffed without reason, separated from their crying babies, and handled by police who, at first, did not wear masks to protect against the novel coronavirus.

The women are now demanding that the Secret Service investigate the encounter and publicly release details of the incident which, they said, made them fear for their lives and the safety of their children.

“This incident took place near our national monuments across from the White House,” their attorney, Timothy Maloney, wrote in the letter demanding an investigation to Secret Service Director James Murray over the weekend. “It occurred after eight weeks of unprecedented national demonstrations about excessive police conduct, some of which took place right there on Constitution Avenue. Has the Secret Service learned nothing this summer?”

Initially, the women said, an officer told them the vehicle had been reported stolen and that the suspects were two Black men. But the women, both African American, said no men were with them and provided proof that Johnson was the owner. She told the Secret Service she had never reported the car stolen. Eventually, the women were released — without an apology or answers to their questions, Winston said.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/legal-issues/two-black-moms-took-their-kids-to-the-mall-secret-service-confronted-them-with-guns-they-said/2020/08/03/be4dfa8c-d4f1-11ea-9c3b-dfc394c03988_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-low_secretservicmoms-349pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory-ans#comments-wrapper

They're calling for Secret Service to give a public explanation, they say they are 'investigating' the incident. They're prepared to ask for a congressional inquiry if they drag on this.

I don't know of any situation where the Secret Service's scope was investigating suspected stolen cars in this manner.

new photo from the scene



Not the coat and tie division of the Secret Service that protects VIPs anyway