BLM, or WLM? [MOD WARNING: FIRST POST]

Tell me how

Cupatae wrote: »

Just because you deny reality doesn't mean everyone else does these people are a mob they are animals , they attack homes, innocent people , they loot , they promote hate for white people , they instigate racism..

The only reason they have any sort of backing is because of a good media campaign and how they spun GF death drummed up mass sympathy,

Hopefully people over there excercise there rights and defend themselves and families and property from this righteous mob, they are fortunate to be able to bear arms to put these scumbags down if they get too aggressive with there attacks.

If everyone was like you with the blinkers on America would be well on its way to being the next south Africa!

If everyone was like you, they'd still be picking cotton being watched over by a man with a whip.

Tell me how

Another example of what looks like unacceptable police behaviour emerging tonight.

Impossible to argue that what is happening should continue.

Cupatae

Tell me how wrote: »

If everyone was like you, they'd still be picking cotton being watched over by a man with a whip.

Going by your account of things they pretty much still are!

The ultimate victims.

CertifiedSimp

So folks, after all the marches, the deaths during the marches, the rioting, burning, the profilers on facebook, the blackout on Instagram etc. what has changed?

CertifiedSimp

CertifiedSimp wrote: »

So folks, after all the marches, the deaths during the marches, the rioting, burning, the profilers on facebook, the blackout on Instagram etc. what has changed?

The identity politics, the divisions, the anger, etc has spread outside the US. Within the US, the extremists spouting anarchy, have gained support, and credibility among many. An effective campaign, all in all.

All you need to see are the numbers of people defending the more extreme elements of BLM to know that they've achieved so much. There will be change, but whether that change will be positive or negative is anyone's guess. Personally, considering the hate and double standards arising from all this, the changes will likely be mostly negative, especially in the long run.

ThunbergsAreGo

Deleted User wrote: »

The identity politics, the divisions, the anger, etc has spread outside the US. Within the US, the extremists spouting anarchy, have gained support, and credibility among many. An effective campaign, all in all.

All you need to see are the numbers of people defending the more extreme elements of BLM to know that they've achieved so much. There will be change, but whether that change will be positive or negative is anyone's guess. Personally, considering the hate and double standards arising from all this, the changes will likely be mostly negative, especially in the long run.

The next Presidential election might not be a bad one to lose.

Alot of turmoil coming in that country with the fallout to this and COVID

Tokyo

Cupatae wrote: »

If everyone was like you with the blinkers on America would be well on its way to being the next south Africa!

Tell me how wrote: »

If everyone was like you, they'd still be picking cotton being watched over by a man with a whip.

Mod: Both of you can take 48 hours away from the thread.

CertifiedSimp

I see another video viral of a cop shooting a black fella 7 times in the back.

I think 7 times might be excessive but he can't have any complaints. Cops were pointing their gun at him, he didn't care and went around to the car door. If I'm a cop I'd think there's a good chance he's getting a gun.

Common denominator in majority of these shootings is the victim does not comply with orders.

If George Floyd easily went into the back of the police car then he'd still be alive.

Chris_Heilong

Tell me how wrote: »

If everyone was like you, they'd still be picking cotton being watched over by a man with a whip.

What the hell are you talking about? You need a reality check.

Overheal

CertifiedSimp wrote: »

I see another video viral of a cop shooting a black fella 7 times in the back.

I think 7 times might be excessive but he can't have any complaints. Cops were pointing their gun at him, he didn't care and went around to the car door. If I'm a cop I'd think there's a good chance he's getting a gun.

Common denominator in majority of these shootings is the victim does not comply with orders.

If George Floyd easily went into the back of the police car then he'd still be alive.

They had plenty of time to take down the suspect non lethally.

https://twitter.com/nolimitchrizi/status/1297684746370252806?s=21

This is not how cops act in countries where they do not enjoy Qualified Immunity

The kicker is the we’re responding to a domestic dispute; the victim here was breaking up a fight between 2 women, was not the aggressor.

CertifiedSimp

Overheal wrote: »

They had plenty of time to take down the suspect non lethally.

https://twitter.com/nolimitchrizi/status/1297684746370252806?s=21

This is not how cops act in countries where they do not enjoy Qualified Immunity

The kicker is the we’re responding to a domestic dispute; the victim here was breaking up a fight between 2 women, was not the aggressor.

The cops have to protect themselves. Who knew if he had a knife or gun on him. Cops can't drop their guns and try take him down.

It's easy to stay alive, follow the orders of the cops.

Ush1

Overheal wrote: »

This is not how cops act in countries where they do not enjoy Qualified Immunity

The kicker is the we’re responding to a domestic dispute; the victim here was breaking up a fight between 2 women, was not the aggressor.

Other countries aren't as violent as America, its not a comparison that makes sense. Cops in the US are far more likely to be killed or witness to someone being killed than most other countries.

Foxtrol

CertifiedSimp wrote: »

The cops have to protect themselves. Who knew if he had a knife or gun on him. Cops can't drop their guns and try take him down.

It's easy to stay alive, follow the orders of the cops.

"Do what the cops say or they are entitled to kill you" - what utter bootlicking nonsense.

flazio

CertifiedSimp wrote: »

The cops have to protect themselves. Who knew if he had a knife or gun on him. Cops can't drop their guns and try take him down.

It's easy to stay alive, follow the orders of the cops.

But are these cops playing fair? And if they aren't. What must be done in order to change that?

stinkypinky

Foxtrol wrote: »

"Do what the cops say or they are entitled to kill you" - what utter bootlicking nonsense.

Your twisting of the situation is what's nonsense. He ignored instructions and reached into his car for what cops perceived to be a potential weapon whilst guns were drawn on him. What did he expect would happen, the cops to bend over and not protect themselves? Stupidity wins in this case.

1800_Ladladlad

Im dont understand how rioters like this gimp are able to openly stop police in the street, pointing a weapon at them, without being engaged. It really is gone to sh*t. The man in the video and people like him need to be put in a wooden coat.

https://twitter.com/livesmattershow/status/1297782565038891009

1800_Ladladlad

stinkypinky wrote: »

Your twisting of the situation is what's nonsense. He ignored instructions and reached into his car for what cops perceived to be a potential weapon whilst guns were drawn on him. What did he expect would happen, the cops to bend over and not protect themselves? Stupidity wins in this case.

Should be given a darwin award posthumously. . . .

Jimbob1977

It's a dilemma for the Mayor and Governor

If you call in the National Guard, it's an admission that you've lost control.

If you don't call in the National Guard, you are weak on crime and violent disorder.

And it's Election Year. Wisconsin is a key swing state to win

Manic Moran

Foxtrol wrote: »

"Do what the cops say or they are entitled to kill you" - what utter bootlicking nonsense.

There are plenty of examples of utterly non-compliant persons procuring a firearm from their car and engaging police, one is immediately provided in the twitter thread linked to. If 'do what you're told' is the only criterion, then why did they wait for him to walk all the way around the car, open the door, and reach inside before shooting?

Why did they not use a Taser or the like? Good question, I don't know. It strikes me on the limited information presented as being an excellent example of a situation where that would be appropriate. I agree that I don't understand why some non-lethal force was not used, I also agree that I have no idea why three cops had drawn firearms at the time the video starts. Perhaps the investigation or body/dash cameras will provide such information.

The reality is, though, that non-compliance with lawful instructions is a common denominator in a large majority of use-of-force incidents. Even if the instructions are non-lawful, the correct place to redress this is the courts after the fact. Being correct and dead is something of a Pyrrhic victory. The third category is a shooting even with compliance, which, thankfully, is very small as a proportion, even though it's still too much.

Foxtrol

stinkypinky wrote: »

Your twisting of the situation is what's nonsense. He ignored instructions and reached into his car for what cops perceived to be a potential weapon whilst guns were drawn on him. What did he expect would happen, the cops to bend over and not protect themselves? Stupidity wins in this case.

What did the cops expect to happen when 3 of them have their guns drawn, leaving them no way to deescalate or non-lethally subdue him if he didn't cooperate?

Once again the same tired excuse is rolled out, 'We have no option but to kill this black man after we didn't do our jobs and made a complete mess of the situation'.

Foxtrol

Manic Moran wrote: »

There are plenty of examples of utterly non-compliant persons procuring a firearm from their car and engaging police, one is immediately provided in the twitter thread linked to. If 'do what you're told' is the only criterion, then why did they wait for him to walk all the way around the car, open the door, and reach inside before shooting?

And there are plenty of examples of cops rolling up with guns drawn and escalating situations that cause the deaths of one of the people involved.

Why did they not use a Taser or the like? Good question, I don't know. It strikes me on the limited information presented as being an excellent example of a situation where that would be appropriate. I agree that I don't understand why some non-lethal force was not used, I also agree that I have no idea why three cops had drawn firearms at the time the video starts. Perhaps the investigation or body/dash cameras will provide such information.

The reality is, though, that non-compliance with lawful instructions is a common denominator in a large majority of use-of-force incidents. Even if the instructions are non-lawful, the correct place to redress this is the courts after the fact. Being correct and dead is something of a Pyrrhic victory. The third category is a shooting even with compliance, which, thankfully, is very small as a proportion, even though it's still too much.

I agree with nearly all of the rest of your post but with how the laws are written to protect police redress is near impossible for most that are impacted.

CertifiedSimp

Foxtrol wrote: »

"Do what the cops say or they are entitled to kill you" - what utter bootlicking nonsense.

I'll put that in other words.

"don't do what cops say and show yourself to be a threat to a cops life and you will possibly be shot."

The list of people who followed the cops orders and were shot is very small. Most prominent example would be a WHITE guy who was drunk and was shot when following orders.

Did you notice when they shot him? They shot him when he got to the door and was reaching in. If they wanted to kill a black person for being black, they could have shot him anytime. This cop will live with the fact he took anothers man life, rightly or wrongly. I don't believe cops for the most part want to murder people.

Foxtrol

CertifiedSimp wrote: »

I'll put that in other words.

"don't do what cops say and show yourself to be a threat to a cops life and you will possibly be shot."

The list of people who followed the cops orders and were shot is very small. Most prominent example would be a WHITE guy who was drunk and was shot when following orders.

Did you notice when they shot him? They shot him when he got to the door and was reaching in. If they wanted to kill a black person for being black, they could have shot him anytime. This cop will live with the fact he took anothers man life, rightly or wrongly. I don't believe cops for the most part want to murder people.

So you're saying there was no way they could have subdued him without shooting him 7 times in the back?

ThunbergsAreGo

Foxtrol wrote: »

What did the cops expect to happen when 3 of them have their guns drawn, leaving them no way to deescalate or non-lethally subdue him if he didn't cooperate?

Once again the same tired excuse is rolled out, 'We have no option but to kill this black man after we didn't do our jobs and made a complete mess of the situation'.

Dont know what race has to do with this shooting

ThunbergsAreGo

Foxtrol wrote: »

What did the cops expect to happen when 3 of them have their guns drawn, leaving them no way to deescalate or non-lethally subdue him if he didn't cooperate?

Once again the same tired excuse is rolled out, 'We have no option but to kill this black man after we didn't do our jobs and made a complete mess of the situation'.

They expected him to cooperate

1800_Ladladlad

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

Should be given a darwin award posthumously. . . .

As opposed to giving it to him while he was living?

Foxtrol

Foxtrol wrote: »

So you're saying there was no way they could have subdued him without shooting him 7 times in the back?

So what your saying is.... Lobsters....

No. That's not what anyone is saying.

Are you saying that the reason this man was shot was because he was black or because he didn't comply with instructions of law enforcement officers?

Foxtrol

Foxtrol wrote: »

"Do what the cops say or they are entitled to kill you" - what utter bootlicking nonsense.

Bootlicking... For **** sake.

Do you support any type of policing or are you an anarchist?

Sandor Clegane

Could they not of rushed him when he was strolling to the car door? he had nothing in his hands at the time and it would of been seven on one, could they not of tasered him or pepper sprayed him?

Anyway at this stage in the game it's hard to feel sorry for him, when police show up in America the potential for a violent/lethal confrontation is always just a moment away, you can be shot and killed for so much as farting in their direction, it's just the way it is over there, he should of just stopped.

Sandor Clegane

Sandor Clegane wrote: »

Could they not of rushed him when he was strolling to the car door? he had nothing in his hands at the time and it would of been seven on one, could they not of tasered him or pepper sprayed him?

Anyway at this stage in the game it's hard to feel sorry for him, when police show up in America the potential for a violent/lethal confrontation is always just a moment away, you can be shot and killed for so much as farting in their direction, it's just the way it is over there, he should of just stopped.

They could have. I am in no way saying that their actions were in any way the best possible protocol, but each case is different.

What I object to, is ****wits claiming this was an act of racism