Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VIII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

dalyboy

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Bolton also said

Grand. My point still stands intact then.

StringerBell

dalyboy wrote: »

Grand. My point still stands intact then.

Your point that having weighed up the balance of probabilities that the claims are true or false, seen that the balance points at them being true and have decided they are false because that suits your point of view better?

Yes that point still stands.

Doesn't carry any more weight than someone who says they believe the earth is flat, bill gates is trying to control your mind or that reptilians control the planet.

dalyboy

StringerBell wrote: »

Your point that having weighed up the balance of probabilities that the claims are true or false, seen that the balance points at them being true and have decided they are false because that suits your point of view better?

Yes that point still stands.

Doesn't carry any more weight than someone who says they believe the earth is flat, bill gates is trying to control your mind or that reptilians control the planet.

Cat calling the kettle black much ?

Leroy42

dalyboy wrote: »

Cat calling the kettle black much ?

Not sure I follow.

We know Trump has disparaged captured servicemen in the past.

We know he has disparaged Gold star families in the past.

We know he doesn't think much of the generals.

We know he doesn't think much of military service, having opted out of it himself.

We know he didn't bother to go the event due to the weather being a bit poor, so he doesn't hold the event in much regard.

We know he disparages everyone that he thinks is no longer useful to him anymore.

We know that Trump lies about everything and that his supporters are happy to lie for him.

And on you side you have that some of his supporters say it didn't happen.

They are not even close to being equal

Carfacemandog

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Hardly news , a bunch of me feiners using their god-given right to do what they want regardless of the consequences to others. It's the American dream

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/05/trump-boat-parade-lake-travis-texas

Yeah, odds are these are the types who make a nuisance of themselves in small numbers around a bunch of other boat owners/sailors/etc, ruining the experience for everyone else but not caring because others are acting responsibly to mitigate the problems they are causing meaning things don't get bad enough to cause real problems. The thing is, when you put them all together, they prove what happens if everyone were to act that way.

It's quite a good analogy for Trump and a lot of what he and his supporters stand for, to be honest.

amandstu

Carfacemandog wrote: »

Yeah, odds are these are the types who make a nuisance of themselves in small numbers around a bunch of other boat owners/sailors/etc, ruining the experience for everyone else but not caring because others are acting responsibly to mitigate the problems they are causing meaning things don't get bad enough to cause real problems. The thing is, when you put them all together, they prove what happens if everyone were to act that way.

It's quite a good analogy for Trump and a lot of what he and his supporters stand for, to be honest.

I see . Uncritical mass?

ancapailldorcha

dalyboy wrote: »

Cat calling the kettle black much ?

Post constructively or not at all please. Enough of the sniping.

Muahahaha

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

Imagine being a relative of one of the 200,000 dead from Covid this year wondering if your loved one be alive if only you lived in a normal country, not one where Trump ensured they have the highest death rates.

Yeah and with it coming up to 200,000 dead its safe to assume several million people directly know someone who has died of Covid. And with 6.3m cases everyone knows someone directly or indirectly who has caught it. These are big numbers of people who have been affected by it and many are voters unhappy with Trumps covid response.

Its the same with calling the military suckers and losers. There are circa 1.3 million active service personal in in the armed forces the US right now. Thata a lot of people to be insulting by calling them suckers and losers. Then you have to multiply that by their parents, brothers, sisters, etc again many of whom are voters, primarily Republican ones too. I can only imagine the amount of military mothers and fathers out there who are disgusted with Trumps comments that their sons & daughters are suckers for serving in the military and losers if they get killed while in action.

Then on top of the 1.3m currently serving in the US there are 17 million veterans or 7% of the entire population. Again they are a big Republican voting cohort and again they all have families and friends. Thats a lot of people Trump has taken the piss out of and in all a country where members of the military both active and retired are venerated.

The Biden campaign must be thinking all their Christmasses and birthdays have come at once. Just eight weeks out from an election and Trump has gone and insulted around 18.3m active and retired military personnel and all their families and friends on top of it. Its pretty hard to think how Trump could have shot himself in the foot any better than that.

Igotadose

Muahahaha wrote: »

The Biden campaign must be thinking all their Christmasses and birthdays have come at once. Just eight weeks out from an election and Trump has gone and insulted around 18.3m active and retired military personnel and all their families and friends on top of it. Its pretty hard to think how Trump could have shot himself in the foot any better than that.

Anecdotal evidence, but personal experience is around 100% of Americans I know have a relative who was or is in military service. If it's 18.3million active & retired, it's well over 100 million 'involved.'

But, hey, the #IMPOTUS campaign tried to criticize Biden for visiting his children's graves on a Sunday after church. There's no depth they won't dive to, led by the #IMPOTUS.

Rjd2

Quin_Dub wrote: »

He also tried a new angle on the "Respect the Military" piece.

Said that the soldiers love him (Polls say different) because he's bringing them home but that the Generals and the Pentagon hate him because all they are interested in is starting wars to keep the Military Industrial Complex happy.

Interesting angle from the man who has increased Military spending to record levels and who hired all those leaders in the Pentagon .

Really not sure what group of people he's trying to win over with that one.

He's correct to call out the military industrial complex to be fair and its something their needs to be a debate about it in America especially looking at America's horrific foreign policies with last few presidents.

Obviously though he is has been fine for the MIC though, but I do think they loath him more than Biden as now and then probably by accident he will blow apart the MIC.

Biden on the other hand who is backed by numerous war mongers in the Republican party will be just as effective for the MIC ,,,heck maybe even more so than by trump as he is a hawk and looks like he will surround himself with hawks.

Igotadose

Rjd2 wrote: »

He's correct to call out the military industrial complex to be fair and its something their needs to be a debate about it in America especially looking at America's horrific foreign policies with last few presidents.

Obviously though he is has been fine for the MIC though, but I do think they loath him more than Biden as now and then probably by accident he will blow apart the MIC.

Biden on the other hand who is backed by numerous war mongers in the Republican party will be just as effective for the MIC ,,,heck maybe even more so than by trump as he is a hawk and looks like he will surround himself with hawks.

During the Labor day campaign event masquerading as a press conference, he rabbitted on about how the bombs being built were great because they were built in the USA. He's totally cool with producing armaments. He wants more nukes and fewer restrictions on their use. And, lest we forget, there's always Space Force, which is a military endeavor.

So, the #IMPOTUS being anti-military-industrial complex is laughable.

listermint

Rjd2 wrote: »

He's correct to call out the military industrial complex to be fair and its something their needs to be a debate about it in America especially looking at America's horrific foreign policies with last few presidents.

Obviously though he is has been fine for the MIC though, but I do think they loath him more than Biden as now and then probably by accident he will blow apart the MIC.

Biden on the other hand who is backed by numerous war mongers in the Republican party will be just as effective for the MIC ,,,heck maybe even more so than by trump as he is a hawk and looks like he will surround himself with hawks.

Wait,

Do you think trump is 'calling out the military industrial complex'


As in you seriously think this ?

Leroy42

Rjd2 wrote: »

He's correct to call out the military industrial complex to be fair and its something their needs to be a debate about it in America especially looking at America's horrific foreign policies with last few presidents.

Obviously though he is has been fine for the MIC though, but I do think they loath him more than Biden as now and then probably by accident he will blow apart the MIC.

Biden on the other hand who is backed by numerous war mongers in the Republican party will be just as effective for the MIC ,,,heck maybe even more so than by trump as he is a hawk and looks like he will surround himself with hawks.

Trump gifted them 200bn over the last 4 years with no strong attached.

Has he suddenly come to this idea or did he always think it? What are his plans to reduce the spend and where can those savings now be made?

Does think call into question the future of Space Force which is going to be a major funding source for the MIC in the next couple of years based on Trumps announcements.

Rjd2

listermint wrote: »

Wait,

Do you think trump is 'calling out the military industrial complex'


As in you seriously think this ?

He is and he isn't.

Its good to criticise them but I also acknowledged that he has been fine for them.

We have a man in Biden a hawk who supported the Iraq war been cheered on by some of the worst neocons who will be president soon.

He most certainly won't be discussing it, if Trump by stupidity can get a debate going on it then happy days.

Carfacemandog

Rjd2 wrote: »

We have a man in Biden a hawk who supported the Iraq war been cheered on by some of the worst neocons who will be president soon.

So did Trump, in fairness. He wasn't in government to vote for or against, but is on record supporting the Iraq War.

Rjd2

Carfacemandog wrote: »

So did Trump, in fairness. He wasn't in government to vote for or against, but is on record supporting the Iraq War.

Of course.

Anyone who says Trump is any sort of dove is an idiot as the previous few years have shown.

Ideally supporting the Iraq war in 2020 should be something that disqualifies anyone becoming president but alas America going to America.

Leroy42

The point being that Trump is not really looking to open a debate on it, it is just something he thinks might work well. Its a flag he is flying.

Trump fires off ideas like this all the time, and it still amazes me that people jump on it as if it is actually serious or has had any thought put into it.

Remember the injecting disinfectant, or more to the point he whole debacle over repeal and replace.

That is why I asked what his new policy was. What was he planning to do, what areas is he looking to cut, and what he planned to do instead or use the money in other areas.

As usual he doesn't have it, and my bet is that he never will.

Muahahaha

Igotadose wrote: »

And, lest we forget, there's always Space Force, which is a military endeavor.

So, the #IMPOTUS being anti-military-industrial complex is laughable.

If Biden gets elected what happens to the Space Force/Back to the Moon mission? Has he a stated policy on it?

Also anyone know where Biden stands with a US-UK trade deal post Brexit? Trump seems to want to get straight on with it probably so maximum concessions can be dragged out of the British while they're desperate. But I havent heard what Bidens position is here.

Zillah

listermint wrote: »

Wait,

Do you think trump is 'calling out the military industrial complex'


As in you seriously think this ?

Trump: insults dead veterans in their graves
This guy: "What a sophisticated commentary on the modern overly-integrated military-industrial complex."

Igotadose

It's just reprising "#IMPOTUS will be better than HRC because she's this awful hawk." Nothing new here. #IMPOTUS was a wildly bad choice for President in 2016, 4 years later, he's proven it.

Overheal

Rjd2 wrote: »

He is and he isn't.

Its good to criticise them but I also acknowledged that he has been fine for them.

We have a man in Biden a hawk who supported the Iraq war been cheered on by some of the worst neocons who will be president soon.

He most certainly won't be discussing it, if Trump by stupidity can get a debate going on it then happy days.

He's given the MIC $100,000,000,000's of taxpayer funds and not to mention a $350,000,000,000 arms deal with Saudi Arabia. It would be farcical to proceed with any sort of narrative that Trump is somehow not actually a great enabler of the MIC and that Biden would somehow be more sinister

rossie1977

The amount of Americans that were against some kind of retribution in the wake of 9/11 are few and far between, amount of politicians or those interested in politics even less.

Bernie Sanders is probably only politician who was.

Thing is if the US pulled all their forces from every foreign country how long do you thing it would take Russia or China to then fill that void?

aloyisious

I've been watching Trump pushing the line over the past few days that there'll be a vaccine before the election and the various Pharma Co rep's along with the FDA advising the public that they will not be pushing the boundaries on testing before releasing any vaccines to the medics and drug stores. Well and good for them. The thing is that Trump may not be pushing the vaccine release line just to boost his poll ratings [another election promise kept] he may actually be pushing for an earlier than expected FDA/Pharma release of a vaccine in order to get people fit for voting-booth queues. It might seem outlandish to suggest Trump might have fit and able voting-queues in mind but he is fighting for his political life at this moment in time.

Roanmore

aloyisious wrote: »

I've been watching Trump pushing the line over the past few days that there'll be a vaccine before the election and the various Pharma Co rep's along with the FDA advising the public that they will not be pushing the boundaries on testing before releasing any vaccines to the medics and drug stores. Well and good for them. The thing is that Trump may not be pushing the vaccine release line just to boost his poll ratings [another election promise kept] he may actually be pushing for an earlier than expected FDA/Pharma release of a vaccine in order to get people fit for voting-booth queues. It might seem outlandish to suggest Trump might have fit and able voting-queues in mind but he is fighting for his political life at this moment in time.

I think it's more to do with when the vaccine doesn't come out he'll say the Democrats and Big Pharma are colluding to keep it from the American people.

Retr0gamer

aloyisious wrote: »

I've been watching Trump pushing the line over the past few days that there'll be a vaccine before the election and the various Pharma Co rep's along with the FDA advising the public that they will not be pushing the boundaries on testing before releasing any vaccines to the medics and drug stores. Well and good for them. The thing is that Trump may not be pushing the vaccine release line just to boost his poll ratings [another election promise kept] he may actually be pushing for an earlier than expected FDA/Pharma release of a vaccine in order to get people fit for voting-booth queues. It might seem outlandish to suggest Trump might have fit and able voting-queues in mind but he is fighting for his political life at this moment in time.

As some one that works in pharma there's no way the FDA will rush the vaccine anymore than they already are and there's no way it will be ready for November. No pharma company is going to risk another thalidomide just to appease a stupid oaf that looks like he won't be in office come November and will be fighting to stay out of jail.

Just more lies from Trump.

retalivity

Trump had a rally in North Carolina last night, where state guidelines limit gatherings to less than 50 and require people to wear masks in public.
A crowd of a couple of hundred maskless people, singing along with knocking on heavens door as they waited for him, and cheering when he laid into biden for practicing social distancing.

https://therecount.com/wire/trumps-largely-maskless-nondistanced-crowd/2645862092

Timberrrrrrrr

retalivity wrote: »

Trump had a rally in North Carolina last night, where state guidelines limit gatherings to less than 50 and require people to wear masks in public.
A crowd of a couple of hundred maskless people, singing along with knocking on heavens door as they waited for him, and cheering when he laid into biden for practicing social distancing.

https://therecount.com/wire/trumps-largely-maskless-nondistanced-crowd/2645862092

He's an idiot, and the people there are just as stupid as him, honestly I would have zero sympathy for anyone there that gets sick. Hopefully they won't pass it on to anyone vulnerable.

PropJoe10

retalivity wrote: »

Trump had a rally in North Carolina last night, where state guidelines limit gatherings to less than 50 and require people to wear masks in public.
A crowd of a couple of hundred maskless people, singing along with knocking on heavens door as they waited for him, and cheering when he laid into biden for practicing social distancing.

https://therecount.com/wire/trumps-largely-maskless-nondistanced-crowd/2645862092

"I love the poorly educated" indeed. Staggering stupidity.

duploelabs

retalivity wrote: »

Trump had a rally in North Carolina last night, where state guidelines limit gatherings to less than 50 and require people to wear masks in public.
A crowd of a couple of hundred maskless people, singing along with knocking on heavens door as they waited for him, and cheering when he laid into biden for practicing social distancing.

https://therecount.com/wire/trumps-largely-maskless-nondistanced-crowd/2645862092

Singing 'Knocking on heavens door' whilst not wearing a mask, it's a very strong message

salmocab

duploelabs wrote: »

Singing 'Knocking on heavens door' whilst not wearing a mask, it's a very strong message

I’m confident the irony was wasted on them