Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VIII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

Faugheen

Kellyanne Conway was one of the best people Trump had. She’s a deplorable woman but every appearance she made was to put the Trump message out there and she did so without being in any way rattled.

She was excellent in that regard, and Trump’s campaign faltered big time as she spent more time away from it.

Christy42

PropJoe10 wrote: »

George Conway seems to think that the only way Trump can avoid legal jeopardy over that phone conversation is if he claims he's gone insane. That's where we are now.

Where are the Trump defenders gone?

Still on the Donald. win. Still making as much sense as they ever did. Claiming everything and anything is proof of fraud.

PropJoe10

Faugheen wrote: »

Kellyanne Conway was one of the best people Trump had. She’s a deplorable woman but every appearance she made was to put the Trump message out there and she did so without being in any way rattled.

She was excellent in that regard, and Trump’s campaign faltered big time as she spent more time away from it.

Quite right. If you watch a lot of her interviews with CNN, she spends most of it deflecting and changing the subject, rather than flat-out lying. Which is a lot cleverer than the likes of Huckabee Sanders or McEnany, who are just barefaced liars.

There's no doubt that KAC is an expert in what she does, like her or despise her. And she'll doubtless get more well-paid jobs as a political spin-doctor.

Water John

Akabusi wrote: »

Just listened to the tape, I'm now fearful for what he will try to do in the next 2 weeks.

Carl Bernstein indicated last night, the the military have had already to push back on ideas Trump was floating. Iran would be the obvious danger point here. Trump throws in the proverbial grenade and leaves the mess to Biden.

Leroy42

Water John wrote: »

Carl Bernstein indicated last night, the the military have had already to push back on ideas Trump was floating. Iran would be the obvious danger point here. Trump throws in the proverbial grenade and leaves the mess to Biden.

An earlier post opined that this entire 'Stop the steal' was initially considered to be merely Trump looking for an escape route, a way to massage his fragile ego. But it is clear that while that may well have played a part, Trump is not simply shouting at clouds, he is actively attempting to reverse the result and undertake what is, essentially, a coup.

The US needs to be very wary of the threat that Trump poses both directly and indirectly at this point in time. He has the capacity, and clearly the intention, of doing whatever is necessary to get what he wants. His previous history in business would point that he doesn't care about what damage he leaves in his wake, once he gets out relatively unscathed.

Even when he is removed, his access to classified intel provides a very clear and obvious threat to the security of the US. He has shown his willingness to attack and denigrate almost every institution of the US, there is no reason to believe that he would baulk at selling state intel for personal gain in the future.

prawnsambo

Leroy42 wrote: »

An earlier post opined that this entire 'Stop the steal' was merely Trump looking for an escape route, a way to massage his fragile ego. But it is clear that while that may well have played a part, Trump is not simply shouting at clouds, he is actively attempting to reverse the result and undertake what is, essentially, a coup.

The US needs to be very wary of the threat that Trump poses both directly and indirectly at this point in time. He has the capacity, and clearly the intention, of doing whatever is necessary to get what he wants. His previous history in business would point that he doesn't care about what damage he leaves in his wake, once he gets out relatively unscathed.

Even when he is removed, his access to classified intel provides a very clear and obvious threat to the security of the US. He has shown his willingness to attack and denigrate almost every institution of the US, there is no reason to believe that he would baulk at selling state intel for personal gain in the future.

I'm now of the opinion that he believes all the conspiracy theories about the election. He can't admit that he lost, so he's adopted every crazy theory out there that says otherwise. On that call, saying he won by hundreds of thousands of votes. It's nuts, but he clearly has himself convinced. He'll either have to be dragged out of the WH or else he'll try and leg it somewhere that he can escape extradition. I'm not sure which horse to back on that one.

robinph

Leroy42 wrote: »

Even when he is removed, his access to classified intel provides a very clear and obvious threat to the security of the US. He has shown his willingness to attack and denigrate almost every institution of the US, there is no reason to believe that he would baulk at selling state intel for personal gain in the future.

I wouldn't be too worried about any intel he has. If he actually has been told anything sensitive then he'd have been unable to keep himself from blurting it out to prove a point about how clever he was, the fact that all he's done is suggest bleach and UV lights as a cure for covid means that they haven't told him anything that wasn't immediately relevant to whatever was happening at that precise moment...and even then I doubt they told him a whole lot. Not like he's been given secret details on the agents involved in the missile hit they made on Iran this time last year as if they did he'd have said something stupid about them and given up their names.

The most secret thing he knew was the name of some dog a couple of years ago whose name he divulged, which then meant the dog and handler were taken off whatever service they were on at the time so he gave the dog a medal. They don't tell him anything they are not prepared to have public knowledge.

Leroy42

prawnsambo wrote: »

I'm now of the opinion that he believes all the conspiracy theories about the election. He can't admit that he lost, so he's adopted every crazy theory out there that says otherwise. On that call, saying he won by hundreds of thousands of votes. It's nuts, but he clearly has himself convinced. He'll either have to be dragged out of the WH or else he'll try and leg it somewhere that he can escape extradition. I'm not sure which horse to back on that one.

I actually think the opposite. I don't think he believes any of the conspiracy theories (Obviously I have no way of knowing either way) but he sees it as a way to try to get back what he lost.

He sees them, like the birther movement, as merely a facilitation of getting that. I don't think he actually thinks there is fraud, hence why he asked that they find 11k votes for him. He doesn't care how they do it, just that they do it.

The aim is to try to stay as POTUS, if spreading conspiracies get enough people to buy into his cause then that is what he will do. Him believing has nothing to do with it.

For example, he never really believed HC should be locked up, but it played well with the voters so he ran with it.

prawnsambo

Leroy42 wrote: »

I actually think the opposite. I don't think he believes any of the conspiracy theories (Obviously I have no way of knowing either way) but he sees it as a way to try to get back what he lost.

He sees them, like the birther movement, as merely a facilitation of getting that. I don't think he actually thinks there is fraud, hence why he asked that they find 11k votes for him. He doesn't care how they do it, just that they do it.

The aim is to try to stay as POTUS, if spreading conspiracies get enough people to buy into his cause then that is what he will do. Him believing has nothing to do with it.

For example, he never really believed HC should be locked up, but it played well with the voters so he ran with it.

Yeah, but none of that stuff; "Lock her up" etc. affected him directly. The election loss on the other hand goes directly to the heart of his psychosis. Comparing rally attendances, crowd sizes, all his followers, these feed his narcissism. Even before both elections, he was playing the "they can only beat me if they cheat" card. Back in 2016 he couldn't believe that Ted Cruz beat him in the Iowa caucuses and accused him of cheating.

Leroy42

To me, that just proves my point. He didn't actually believe Cruz had won fraudulently, only that he needed an excuse on why he hadn't won. He is very well aware of the power of momentum, and the power of power itself. Being seen as a loser is never a good look, far easier to blame 'fraud' rather than have to talk about why you lost.

You see it all the time from football managers, they focus on some referring decision as the reason they lost, which even if correct, they had the rest of the 90 minutes to have won the game themselves. But it moves the talking point away from the performance.

Overheal

Cody montana wrote: »

Can you imagine if Obama or Hillary was recorded saying those things.

The gop would try to send them to a firing squad.

I think it would be great if Obama and some other Democrats read a Re enactment. It would drive people on the right insane.

At the moment though the denial is already setting in (and Lizard Squad is trending - do not ask) “he didn’t say it and if he did say it he didn’t mean it and if he did mean it he was just trying to get the RINOs to admit the truth that he won”

MICKEYG

robinph wrote: »

I wouldn't be too worried about any intel he has. If he actually has been told anything sensitive then he'd have been unable to keep himself from blurting it out to prove a point about how clever he was, the fact that all he's done is suggest bleach and UV lights as a cure for covid means that they haven't told him anything that wasn't immediately relevant to whatever was happening at that precise moment...and even then I doubt they told him a whole lot. Not like he's been given secret details on the agents involved in the missile hit they made on Iran this time last year as if they did he'd have said something stupid about them and given up their names.

The most secret thing he knew was the name of some dog a couple of years ago whose name he divulged, which then meant the dog and handler were taken off whatever service they were on at the time so he gave the dog a medal. They don't tell him anything they are not prepared to have public knowledge.

This is also scary. Who is "they" that decide what the president sees and does not see. That in itself is a coup.
I think Trump should have been removed from office long ago (if the Republicans had any backbone) but if "they" can decide what to share with a president it does raise other serious questions.

To be clear, I am in no way defending him. He has damaged the country and its institutions in a way that will take a generation to repair given the divide he has created in the US. He is the worst kind of person I can imagine and it says a lot about the US today that 74m people still voted for him.

Water John

At this point Trump actually has lost touch with the reality, which most of us use to process information. He doesn't have the filter to differentiate the facts from his needs.

prawnsambo

MICKEYG wrote: »

This is also scary. Who is "they" that decide what the president sees and does not see. That in itself is a coup.
I think Trump should have been removed from office long ago (if the Republicans had any backbone) but if "they" can decide what to share with a president it does raise other serious questions.

To be clear, I am in no way defending him. He has damaged the country and its institutions in a way that will take a generation to repair given the divide he has created in the US. He is the worst kind of person I can imagine and it says a lot about the US today that 74m people still voted for him.

There are checks and balances. 'They' also have to inform Congress depending on what area the information comes from. So the House Committee on Intelligence would get the same briefings as the President on intelligence matters. It was one of the reasons Joe Biden wasn't too bothered about not getting transition access since Kamala Harris was on a number of House Committees that would have been briefed anyway.

duploelabs

MICKEYG wrote: »

This is also scary. Who is "they" that decide what the president sees and does not see. That in itself is a coup.
I think Trump should have been removed from office long ago (if the Republicans had any backbone) but if "they" can decide what to share with a president it does raise other serious questions.

To be clear, I am in no way defending him. He has damaged the country and its institutions in a way that will take a generation to repair given the divide he has created in the US. He is the worst kind of person I can imagine and it says a lot about the US today that 74m people still voted for him.

I would say that trump's future intelligence briefings, not that he paid much attention to the ones that he held in office, will be heavily redacted and perhaps intentionally incorrect to check his integrity to 'keep shtum', much like littlefinger's maneuver in season 2 of GOT

Slightly more bizarre news, there's ongoing speculation that Trump is considering fleeing to Scotland... :pac:

https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1346179632182091776

Carfacemandog

Water John wrote: »

At this point Trump actually has lost touch with the reality, which most of us use to process information. He doesn't have the filter to differentiate the facts from his needs.

Thats been the case for at least 4 or 5 years, hence why he was already angling at this leasing into not just this election, but the 2016 one too.

aloyisious

The Democrat party leadership has probably been thanking it's lucky stars for years now that Trump left it and hitched the GOP to his wagon. Imagine the scenario otherwise: No Obama in the White House, no Pelosi as chair in the house, the party riven by the kooks and sharks that Trump, as president, has brought to the fore in the GOP. Now with Trump being their best friend by giving them a chance at the three positions of elected government power in the U.S, they just have to keep quiet, make no comment about impeachment if asked by anyone and let Trump finish off the GOP for them. I have no idea why Trump switched party, though one could consider that he sensed the GOP would be the easier party to "con" and have his way with.

aloyisious

Deleted User wrote: »

Slightly more bizarre news, there's ongoing speculation that Trump is considering fleeing to Scotland... :pac:

https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1346179632182091776

Maybe some-one should tell him the U.K has gone into level 5 lockdown, no travel outside the home except for essential workers and seeing as he'll be a retired person, that "privilege" wont apply to him.

volchitsa

aloyisious wrote: »

Maybe some-one should tell him the U.K has gone into level 5 lockdown, no travel outside the home except for essential workers and seeing as he'll be a retired person, that "privilege" wont apply to him.

God no, don't tell him anything of the sort until he's already there - think of the peace we'd all have if he was stuck on his golf course in Scotland unable to do one of his "meetings" for his fans. It'd be such a relief to the rest of us.

Headshot

Oh wow

It's kicking off now

Georgia election official Gabriel Sterling going off on Trump and he's baseless lies on Georgia Voting

dogbert27

volchitsa wrote: »

God no, don't tell him anything of the sort until he's already there - think of the peace we'd all have if he was stuck on his golf course in Scotland unable to do one of his "meetings" for his fans. It'd be such a relief to the rest of us.

Maybe he'd join the SNP to try and become president of an independent Scotland!! :pac:

looksee

Can you imagine the number of police that would have to be diverted to keep an eye on him, no sir, we do know who you are and it doesn't make any difference, you can't go anywhere!

aloyisious

aloyisious wrote: »

The Democrat party leadership has probably been thanking it's lucky stars for years now that Trump left it and hitched the GOP to his wagon. Imagine the scenario otherwise: No Obama in the White House, no Pelosi as chair in the house, the party riven by the kooks and sharks that Trump, as president, has brought to the fore in the GOP. Now with Trump being their best friend by giving them a chance at the three positions of elected government power in the U.S, they just have to keep quiet, make no comment about impeachment if asked by anyone and let Trump finish off the GOP for them. I have no idea why Trump switched party, though one could consider that he sensed the GOP would be the easier party to "con" and have his way with.

Fairly sure that a quote attributed to him from years ago saying that he would run as a republican/conservative because they were easier to manipulate has been posted a few times.

L1011

DubInMeath wrote: »

Fairly sure that a quote attributed to him from years ago saying that he would run as a republican/conservative because they were easier to manipulate has been posted a few times.

I think that ones unsourced / probably not true, unfortunately.

looksee

https://www.democracydocket.com/cases/district-of-columbia-trump-election-challenge/

This is a doozy, even if you don't read the lawsuit, read the opinion. One of my favourite lines is

Given that time is short and the legal errors underpinning this action manifold, the Court treats only the central ones

and

As a result, at the conclusion of this litigation, the Court will determine whether to issue an order
to show cause why this matter should not be referred to its Committee on Grievances for
potential discipline of Plaintiffs’ counsel.

Larbre34

DubInMeath wrote: »

Fairly sure that a quote attributed to him from years ago saying that he would run as a republican/conservative because they were easier to manipulate has been posted a few times.

A quote attributed to a People Magazine interview of Trump a long time back was fabricated, never happened. He was a registered Democrat for donkeys years however.

aloyisious

Headshot wrote: »

Oh wow

It's kicking off now

Georgia election official Gabriel Sterling going off on Trump and he's baseless lies on Georgia Voting

From what is popping up on the net on keying in his name and [former?] job, he's been going off about the integrity of the system since 04 Dec. The list of complaints he's made include one about a woman who sold him her home some years ago but went on to register to vote from that address in the election. Allegedly he only became aware of her registering to vote using his address when the organisation Fair Fight sent her a reminder at his address about the vote. Stranger and stranger....

Edit. I got the title of the organisation wrong above, it's Fair Fight, not VOTE RIGHT. That organisation may be under investigation by the Georgia Sec of State office for voter fraud. If so, one might ask if Gabriel Sterling was being set up as a patsy to darken the name of the Georgia State office running the election rules.

aloyisious

looksee wrote: »

Can you imagine the number of police that would have to be diverted to keep an eye on him, no sir, we do know who you are and it doesn't make any difference, you can't go anywhere!

Oh God. I hope so. It'd mean we'd get off lightly here with no visit to Kerry.

froog

Dems have written a letter to the fbi asking for a criminal investigation into trumps call, citing clearly 2 federal and one state law he clearly broke. As its a criminal matter, hard to see him wriggling out of it.