New Colleague Dilemma

Etc

Hi all, looking for some perspectives, I have a new colleague that started roughly 6 weeks ago. I'd agreed with my boss to transition some of my responsibilities over to them which I've done. I put together a comprehensive transition plan and have spent a lot of time with them since they started giving them background, context and pointing them in the right direction with regard to the ongoing activities. Given the lockdown and working from home I appreciate that it's not like sitting next to somebody asking a quick question so I've been patient.

I'd interviewed them twice and on both occasions fed back that I didn't think they were suitable as they had a very high level appreciation of the role but had no real understanding of the mechanics. I wasn't the only one to give the same feedback.

This is becoming very evident now. I should be completely transitioned out to my new activities now, the problem is the new starter keeps looking for time with me to explain how to do things (basics for the role) or do the thinking regarding projects or activities.

I've been distancing as much as possible but they keep asking for more time.

I guess my question is how do I tell them they need to start standing on their own two feet or start using their initiative as I'm not responsible for their ongoing induction ? It's getting very frustrating at this point.

Thanks !

seannash

6 weeks isnt that long. Are they improving and understanding a bit more or are they stagnant.
These are exceptionally tough times to train someone in, give them a bit more time I think

Etc

Thanks for the response, I do appreciate the current situation isn't ideal and have been making allowances. I guess my issue is that we work at quite a senior level and the activities that I'm needing to spend time on is stuff that should be bread and butter for the role.

They were also told that the expectation was they'd hit the ground running. I had tidied up the vast majority of the outstanding work to the point the new person is commenting that it's very quiet so it's not like they don't have time to invest in doing some of their own thinking.

Augme

Pass this onto your boss. Ultimately it is not your job (from what I gather in your OP anyway) to manage him. I am not sure how you have been trying to distance yourself but here are a few options

1. "I'm very busy at the moment with X project ( or whatever), I'll be able to give you some help next week."

2. "I'm very busy at the moment with X project ( or whatever), however *managers name* will be able to help you."

Ultimately you need to be very clear that he won't get help from you quickly. Have a chat with the manager first before dropping in number 2.

I could be wrong on this OP, but too often I see people on your situation say something like "I am really busy the moment so give it a try and if you are really stick let me know". And then the other person's tends to half heartedly try and will just resort to asking for help. And this often isn't out of badness or lazyness, it's often just a lack of self confidence.

MrMusician18

Augme wrote: »

Pass this onto your boss. Ultimately it is not your job (from what I gather in your OP anyway) to manage him. I am not sure how you have been trying to distance yourself but here are a few options

1. "I'm very busy at the moment with X project ( or whatever), I'll be able to give you some help next week."

2. "I'm very busy at the moment with X project ( or whatever), however *managers name* will be able to help you."

Ultimately you need to be very clear that he won't get help from you quickly. Have a chat with the manager first before dropping in number 2.

I could be wrong on this OP, but too often I see people on your situation say something like "I am really busy the moment so give it a try and if you are really stick let me know". And then the other person's tends to half heartedly try and will just resort to asking for help. And this often isn't out of badness or lazyness, it's often just a lack of self confidence.

I'd absolutely hate to be your new colleague. They have been upfront about their ability and the person that was meant to help them wants to dump them. What are they going to do but flounder, if there is no one to train them? There are few things worse than being in a job you can't do because you haven't been shown - just expect to know.

With attitudes like the OPs if it's not any wonder that so many new hires end up in failure and leaving jobs in the first year.

Etc

Augme wrote: »

I could be wrong on this OP, but too often I see people on your situation say something like "I am really busy the moment so give it a try and if you are really stick let me know". And then the other person's tends to half heartedly try and will just resort to asking for help. And this often isn't out of badness or lazyness, it's often just a lack of self confidence.

Thanks for the reply, you've made a really good point above and I was guilty in the first couple of weeks of telling them to reach out as and when they had questions. A also really like the approach in point 1.

Our boss overruled the objections on suitability and made the decision to hire for fear of loosing a headcount rather than waiting for the right person so I'm reticent to approach them yet, they've already asked me how the new hire is getting on and I put a diplomatic spin on it. But if it continues over the next couple of weeks I will outline my concerns.

Etc

MrMusician18 wrote: »

I'd absolutely hate to be your new colleague. They have been upfront about their ability and the person that was meant to help them wants to dump them. What are they going to do but flounder, if there is no one to train them? There are few things worse than being in a job you can't do because you haven't been shown - just expect to know.

With attitudes like the OPs if it's not any wonder that so many new hires end up in failure and leaving jobs in the first year.

Suggest you read my posts again, that's not the position at all.

MrMusician18

Etc wrote: »

Suggest you read my posts again, that's not the position at all.

You've said you've been distancing as much as possible - I've read that as you've reduced your availability to answer their questions. I don't know the complexity of your work - but if it's any way technical or requires ISO systems and the like to be followed, it's unlikely to be able to be picked up intuitively. How are they meant to learn? I'm not suggesting you have, but I've received the ****ty induction of the "read that" 300 page training manual and it isn't good enough. Proper training in is essential if you don't want a failed hire.

When I was a graduate I had colleagues just like that, reduced availability - it was incredibly demoralising. The back turned, the headphones on, "busy". It made me not want to be there..I didn't stay.

thefa

The person seems to have grown used to you providing regular support to validate their work. Given that 6 weeks is not enough to pick up all the nuances of a job, I think you should still make small windows available for the person to clarify things with you but preferable that they are right before a meeting or something you can’t be late for. I have been guilty in the past of trainings that have gone past the slot I put on the calendar.

If it is the bread and butter items that you have shown him on multiple occasions, it represents something that would be a greater concern and worth highlighting to management how you’re time is being eaten into showing this person how to do the basics repeatedly.

I would make it clear that you won’t be available to participate/do the thinking for projects and activities as you don’t have the time.

Etc

MrMusician18 wrote: »

You've said you've been distancing as much as possible - I've read that as you've reduced your availability to answer their questions. I don't know the complexity of your work - but if it's any way technical or requires ISO systems and the like to be followed, it's unlikely to be able to be picked up intuitively.

When I was a graduate I had colleagues just like that, reduced availability - it was incredibly demoralising. The back turned, the headphones on, "busy". It made me not want to be there..I didn't stay.

It is a highly regulated industry and the role requires a high degree of technical knowledge. The new hire is a long way from being a graduate like myself and just like an accountant or an architect or a chemist should have the fundamentals after many years of work.

In this instance my new colleague doesn't have these skills however convinced my boss that they could do the job and hit the ground running however they don't and I'm having to provide support to ensure that the work I handed off is completed satisfactorily and to the required standard. This shouldn't be the case. I also have my own substantial workload and have inherited new projects and activities that I need to get up to speed on.

MrMusician18

Etc wrote: »

It is a highly regulated industry and the role requires a high degree of technical knowledge. The new hire is a long way from being a graduate like myself and just like an accountant or an architect or a chemist should have the fundamentals after many years of work.

In this instance my new colleague doesn't have these skills however convinced my boss that they could do the job and hit the ground running however they don't and I'm having to provide support to ensure that the work I handed off is completed satisfactorily and to the required standard. This shouldn't be the case. I also have my own substantial workload and have inherited new projects and activities that I need to get up to speed on.

We are getting to the nub of the issue then, you're questioning the fundamental competence of your new colleague. Is it a case now where you though them unsuited and now want to show that to next in the line?

No one can walk into a job and be fully on top of their brief within 6 weeks, no matter how much it might have been sold. And assuming your technical rule is office it's likely WFH near full time? That would make it near impossible.

wally1990

Out of interest

What is your standard working work (hours wise)

How many hours are you currently spending with this new colleague per week (meetings, calls, texting)?

Strumms

Don’t wait for the phone to ring and listen to them looking for help, guidance or assistance...be proactive, by being supportive and build for them a support structure and schedule a daily end of day briefing call, every work day, if they are rostered to finish at 5.pm... at 16.40 you are going to arrange a ten or fifteen minute call.

Being supportive proactively like this is the way forward..

Monday - call might be two minutes, no issues.

Tuesday - they had issues with ABC report, the parameters of it whatever, they are unsure of how to proceed. You listen, advise and will talk more tomorrow.

Wednesday - no issues from that day but you feedback that report is 100%

Thursday - No issues from the day..

Friday - they talk about management from a different dept. giving them a rough ride, over an e-mail...you advise how to deal.

Ten minutes approx daily, about 50 mins to an hour out of a 40 hour week... the support, the expertise is there but you are encouraging them to work and resolve and be proactive but the support IS there too.

Etc

wally1990 wrote: »

Out of interest

What is your standard working work (hours wise)

How many hours are you currently spending with this new colleague per week (meetings, calls, texting)?

Hi,

std work hours and approximately 4 hours. I possibly should have mentioned that another colleague was identified as the official on-boarder, not me.

Batgurl

6 weeks might have been ample time to “hit the ground running” when you were in the office and working under normal circumstances but we aren’t in normal circumstances.

Have you considered that your colleague is trying to keep down a job while simultaneously trying to homeschool and look after kids?

Or maybe they are living in a house share with 4 other people who are also WFH and limits are being reached.

Or maybe they have a sick relative who has Covid or can’t get treatment for another disease because of Covid.

Or maybe this person is stressed because they’ve just changed jobs in a climate where 1 out of every 5 person is losing theirs.

I know people shouldn’t be allowing their personal lives to affect their professional lives but not being in the office and able to read body language and nuances means that we tend to project our own experiences onto others without thinking. I don’t think it would harm you to be a little more tolerant with your colleague in the current circumstances.

Etc

Batgurl wrote: »

6 weeks might have been ample time to “hit the ground running” when you were in the office and working under normal circumstances but we aren’t in normal circumstances.

Have you considered that your colleague is trying to keep down a job while simultaneously trying to homeschool and look after kids?

Or maybe they are living in a house share with 4 other people who are also WFH and limits are being reached.

Or maybe they have a sick relative who has Covid or can’t get treatment for another disease because of Covid.

Or maybe this person is stressed because they’ve just changed jobs in a climate where 1 out of every 5 person is losing theirs.

I know people shouldn’t be allowing their personal lives to affect their professional lives but not being in the office and able to read body language and nuances means that we tend to project our own experiences onto others without thinking. I don’t think it would harm you to be a little more tolerant with your colleague in the current circumstances.

I may have those issues too

listermint

Etc wrote: »

I may have those issues too

Then I suppose you can comprehend and understand the stress ?

Etc

listermint wrote: »

Then I suppose you can comprehend and understand the stress ?

Yes I can, if that's a factor. However if you look at my previous posts I've mentioned that the person has commented that it's very quiet work wise and that's because I left things in a very tidy state prior to handover.

So it's an ideal time for them to be starting a new job as work is very manageable.

Batgurl

Etc wrote: »

Yes I can, if that's a factor.

Maybe you can be tolerant with your colleague without needing to know whether it’s a factor or not?

And I don’t think anyone would say it’s an “ideal” time to start a new job.

If you aren’t willing to be tolerant, then just tell your colleague you don’t have time to help them any more and they should approach their manager. It’s not that hard.

Wombatman

Etc wrote: »

It is a highly regulated industry and the role requires a high degree of technical knowledge. The new hire is a long way from being a graduate like myself and just like an accountant or an architect or a chemist should have the fundamentals after many years of work.

In this instance my new colleague doesn't have these skills however convinced my boss that they could do the job and hit the ground running however they don't and I'm having to provide support to ensure that the work I handed off is completed satisfactorily and to the required standard. This shouldn't be the case. I also have my own substantial workload and have inherited new projects and activities that I need to get up to speed on.

Be careful of the "The Expectancy Effect". You believed this person wasn't right for the role before they started. Might you subconsciously be trying to prove yourself right?

If it is true that It is a highly regulated industry and that the role requires a high degree of technical knowledge, your process and procedures should be well defined and documented. Maybe your training materials substandard if this person keeps needing face time to help understand their role.

Why not flip this on its head and take it on the challenge of turning this person into a star? You said it's very quite work wise. Ideal opportunity and you will feel great about it in the long run and hopefully create a long term ally in the organisation.

Augme

I would be very careful of voluntarily taking on the role of star maker. Not everyone is competent or capable no matter how much training/help they get. It would look terrible if you voluntarily took on the role as his mentor (away from the assigned mentor) and he ends up not being good enough anyway. The person actually assigned to him will be pissed because it also makes him look bad and he can then blame you for it too. Your manager above you will also wonder why you did such a poor job and will wonder if maybe you purposely did a bad job out of spite since you didn't want him in the first place. There is far too much risk for such little reward imo.

I would very diplomatically start to withdraw and push this guy onto his assigned trainer staff member.

Strumms

Augme wrote: »

I would be very careful of voluntarily taking on the role of star maker. Not everyone is competent or capable no matter how much training/help they get. It would look terrible if you voluntarily took on the role as his mentor (away from the assigned mentor) and he ends up not being good enough anyway. The person actually assigned to him will be pissed because it also makes him look bad and he can then blame you for it too. Your manager above you will also wonder why you did such a poor job and will wonder if maybe you purposely did a bad job out of spite since you didn't want him in the first place. There is far too much risk for such little reward imo.

I would very diplomatically start to withdraw and push this guy onto his assigned trainer staff member.

Yes 100%. It can be very gratifying and rewarding for you to mentor somebody who was looking ‘borderline’ competent to the point that they are doing their job well and showing a good deal of promise... however if that doesn’t happen you ‘might’ well will in a lot of cases be seen as a fall guy... “yeah Strumms was supposed to be looking after him, it’s still taking him 2 hours though to do ABC report, and the financial projections were off by xxx”. STRUMMS !!!!!!!!

I know as a trainer I’d have zero issue failing somebody who was not exhibiting the required competence both in exam situations at the end of the training and initial on the job too..no room for that..

Purple Mountain

OP, I think you are directing your frustration at the newbie when in fact your frustration is actually at your boss who offered them the job.

Thoie

Rather than allowing an ad hoc arrangement where they contact you whenever with questions, how about setting up two half hour calls a week (maybe Tuesdays/Thursdays) to go through any questions they're having? If you set up the appointment, you can set it for the next 6 weeks. That sets a time limit and an expectation that they save up their questions for those sessions.

Alternatively 15 minutes a day might work better for you - suit yourself. If there's a big issue that will require more time to review, separate sessions can be arranged, but keep those to a minimum.

As you've already acknowledged, it's been a difficult time for everyone. By controlling the interactions you can concentrate on your own work without interruptions about the previous role outside those times.

For the bits where they want you to "do the thinking", tell them to draft their report/project plan/thingummy, and you'll take a glance at it when you get a chance. Don't rewrite it for them though, but feedback could include "I don't see any mention of <giant fatal flaw> - you might want to include a section on that".

Etc

Purple Mountain wrote: »

OP, I think you are directing your frustration at the newbie when in fact your frustration is actually at your boss who offered them the job.

Hi, thanks for the comment, however that isn't the case.