Dole holidays curtailed

Dempo1

This thread has certainly attracted interesting a diverse views, but I learned tonight that a couple heading to Bulgaria (wife naturilised Irish citizen, hubby Irish) with their two kids, early July, every passenger questioned by SW inspectors. Hubby being a law student refused, Gardai approached them afterwards, asked for their passports say part of immigration checks (on a flight departure???), wrote down passport details and let them board.

A number of weeks later after their return, their children's child benefits stopped, on explaining there is nothing stating child benefits can be cut for travelling, SW working on reinstating benifits, matters now under investigation and Gardai being asked to account for their actions.

So not just PUP or SW recepients being targeted

Beechwoodspark

Dempo1 wrote: »

This thread has certainly attracted interesting a diverse views, but I learned tonight that a couple heading to Bulgaria (wife naturilised Irish citizen, hubby Irish) with their two kids, early July, every passenger questioned by SW inspectors. Hubby being a law student refused, Gardai approached them afterwards, asked for their passports say part of immigration checks (on a flight departure???), wrote down passport details and let them board.

A number of weeks later after their return, their children's child benefits stopped, on explaining there is nothing stating child benefits can be cut for travelling, SW working on reinstating benifits, matters now under investigation and Gardai being asked to account for their actions.

So not just PUP or SW recepients being targeted

That’s the liveline guy?

Beechwoodspark

Quite honestly I’m disgusted

With ppl who want hard earned taxpayers money

To go on holidays

blanch152

homes_for_all wrote: »

So why shouldn't unemployed people be allowed to holiday? I think some here would like to see them brutalised and subsist on gruel. It's been a hard time for everyone, let's not look for a boogey man to be angry at.

Nobody should go on holiday.

Public servants can't go because they would have to quarantine on their own time, private sector workers can't go because either they lost their jobs, had their pay cut or were forced to take their annual leave during lockdown. None of them are taking up the airwaves, crowding Twitter or posting nonsense on boards about their situation.

The only people looking to go on holiday and complaining when they aren't let are the social welfare recipients. The entitlement culture gone mad.

I see sheep

Eric Cartman wrote: »

I think what my and many other posters keep banging on about is if we got closer to brutalisation and gruel that the numbers unemployed would fall sharply before you even got there. We have the worlds most generous welfare system and the proof in the pudding of its generosity is that suspending the payment of that welfare while they jet off to a sunny climate is a controversial topic.

If you think the dole is so great why don't you do it then?

Do you even have a job? I'm not sure I could keep my job going and still post here 100 times a day complaining about people on social welfare and explaining why being on the dole is the greatest life in the world.

blanch152

Dempo1 wrote: »

This thread has certainly attracted interesting a diverse views, but I learned tonight that a couple heading to Bulgaria (wife naturilised Irish citizen, hubby Irish) with their two kids, early July, every passenger questioned by SW inspectors. Hubby being a law student refused, Gardai approached them afterwards, asked for their passports say part of immigration checks (on a flight departure???), wrote down passport details and let them board.

A number of weeks later after their return, their children's child benefits stopped, on explaining there is nothing stating child benefits can be cut for travelling, SW working on reinstating benifits, matters now under investigation and Gardai being asked to account for their actions.

So not just PUP or SW recepients being targeted

Good, shouldn't be going on holiday.

As I understand it, if you leave Ireland to live abroad, child benefit is no longer payable. In order to get around the going on holiday issue, the couple probably told the gardai they were going home to Bulgaria. The gardai, taking them at their word, had the Child Benefit cancelled.

I see sheep

blanch152 wrote: »

Nobody should go on holiday.

private sector workers can't go because either they lost their jobs, had their pay cut or were forced to take their annual leave during lockdown.

What are you on about? Thousands of private sector workers have gone on holiday.

SusieBlue

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Quite honestly I’m disgusted

With ppl who want hard earned taxpayers money

To go on holidays

Did it ever occur to you that the majority of these people booked these holidays using their own hard earned wages long before coronavirus was a word we heard on the news every day?
And that after already being laid off, they won’t be entitled to any refunds because flights are still going ahead because the government won’t take a hard stance on travel?

And the fact that they are out of work through absolutely no fault of their own, and can only claim said social welfare because they themselves were also tax payers up till very recently?

ExMachina1000

Some of you dont seem to realise that there are a few hundred thousand foreign nationals working here and paying tax. They are entitled to the PUP also.

Gardai and social welfare officials are targeting them too as they are going home but not signing off the payment.

Massive potential loss to the tax payers

blanch152

SusieBlue wrote: »

Did it ever occur to you that the majority of these people booked these holidays using their own hard earned wages long before coronavirus was a word we heard on the news every day?
And that after already being laid off, they won’t be entitled to any refunds because flights are still going ahead because the government won’t take a hard stance on travel?

And the fact that they are out of work through absolutely no fault of their own, and can only claim said social welfare because they themselves were also tax payers up till very recently?

That is rubbish. If the government are advising against non-essential travel, they are entitled to a refund.

Dempo1

blanch152 wrote: »

Good, shouldn't be going on holiday.

As I understand it, if you leave Ireland to live abroad, child benefit is no longer payable. In order to get around the going on holiday issue, the couple probably told the gardai they were going home to Bulgaria. The gardai, taking them at their word, had the Child Benefit cancelled.

Living abroad is very different from holidaying abroad and as explained, payment being reinstated with grovelling apologies

theguzman

Its very easy to fly out of Belfast and connect from there to Heathrow or Amsterdam etc. This sort of SS like surveillance should be tolerated, either we pay welfare via food stamps or else it should be none of the states business how it is spent. I personally favour a complete dismantling of the welfare state and public healthcare system and funds should be diverted into extra policing and justice.

Dempo1

SusieBlue wrote: »

Did it ever occur to you that the majority of these people booked these holidays using their own hard earned wages long before coronavirus was a word we heard on the news every day?
And that after already being laid off, they won’t be entitled to any refunds because flights are still going ahead because the government won’t take a hard stance on travel?

And the fact that they are out of work through absolutely no fault of their own, and can only claim said social welfare because they themselves were also tax payers up till very recently?

Excellent point but sadly there are some quite narrow minded people out there, but at least "we are all in this together" unless of course your on PUP, amazing none of these saintly individuals not moaning about TWSS, the scheme that actually allows you 75% of your salary, with a top up and stay at home, yes indeed it's actually allowed, some earning over €2800 a month. What do the PUP bashers think of this, your taxes are paying for this

SusieBlue

blanch152 wrote: »

That is rubbish. If the government are advising against non-essential travel, they are entitled to a refund.

If the flight is going and you choose not to get on it, and the hotel is open but you choose not to go, you’re entitled to nothing. I was lucky enough to be able to get a refund/voucher for mine but I know other people who were not so lucky.
A man I heard on the radio this week stands to lose 5k on a family holiday that he can’t get a refund for.
He’s one of many stories I heard, a man who worked his whole life never claimed a cent who is now out of work through no fault of his own and who now stands to lose even more because the government won’t ban non essential travel.
By not banning it the government are giving airlines and travel agents a loophole to avoid reimbursing or rescheduling, that’s the problem here.

James Brown

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Some of you dont seem to realise that there are a few hundred thousand foreign nationals working here and paying tax. They are entitled to the PUP also.

Gardai and social welfare officials are targeting them too as they are going home but not signing off the payment.

Massive potential loss to the tax payers

That's very commendable.
Some cranks are trying to make it about unemployed people, Irish citizens, going on holiday. While I do not support it, it was a long running rule that they could once they gave welfare notice.

blanch152

SusieBlue wrote: »

If the flight is going and you choose not to get on it, and the hotel is open but you choose not to go, you’re entitled to nothing. I was lucky enough to be able to get a refund/voucher for mine but I know other people who were not so lucky.
A man I heard on the radio this week stands to lose 5k on a family holiday that he can’t get a refund for.
He’s one of many stories I heard, a man who worked his whole life never claimed a cent who is now out of work through no fault of his own and who now stands to lose even more because the government won’t ban non essential travel.
By not banning it the government are giving airlines and travel agents a loophole to avoid reimbursing or rescheduling, that’s the problem here.

If you booked with a travel agent, you are entitled to a refund.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/consumer/travel/travel_plans_and_covid19.html

Here is the link to the relevant guidelines.

The only issue would be where someone has booked all of the parts of the holiday themselves, and not through a tour operator or travel agent. In those cases, the advice has always been to have travel insurance, as you are not covered by the State guarantee to travel agents.

In the same way that if your house burns down without insurance, you are not covered, if you make your own travel plans without insurance, you are not covered.

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

That's very commendable.
Some cranks are trying to make it about unemployed people, Irish citizens, going on holiday. While I do not support it, it was a long running rule that they could once they gave welfare notice.

A long-running rule that was changed because of the advice not to travel abroad and put your fellow citizens at risk when you return.

Of course the entitlement class objected to this, they have no interest in the wellbeing of the hard working ordinary man who is paying for their week in Ibiza.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

A long-running rule that was changed because of the advice not to travel abroad and put your fellow citizens at risk when you return.

Of course the entitlement class objected to this, they have no interest in the wellbeing of the hard working ordinary man who is paying for their week in Ibiza.

They changed that rule while allowing foreign travel during a pandemic, for safety, sure.
Seems to me FFFG and the Greens are the entitlement class. Some of us get what we are due and no more while others get to give themselves pay rises. Nice 'work' if you can get it.

Dempo1

Interesting bed time reading

https://www.thejournal.ie/no-clear-legal-basis-to-removal-of-pup-for-travelling-abroad-5162465-Jul2020/

fritzelly

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1288220248307576835

Dempo1

fritzelly wrote: »

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1288220248307576835

Interesting, it was never going to succeed but delighted two government TD's show some character. This will rumble on no doubt and with the shocking incompetence shown over the past few weeks, this coalition, like it's appalling decisions is on shakey grounds.

God I hope there's no resurgs of Covid-19, with this shower, we are snookered and PUP recepients travelling will seem trivial by comparison.

blanch152

Dempo1 wrote: »

Interesting, it was never going to succeed but delighted two government TD's show some character. This will rumble on no doubt and with the shocking incompetence shown over the past few weeks, this coalition, like it's appalling decisions is on shakey grounds.

God I hope there's no resurgs of Covid-19, with this shower, we are snookered and PUP recepients travelling will seem trivial by comparison.

It won't rumble on, but if it does, it could cause more harm to Sinn Fein and the rest of the opposition. Ordinary working people are horrified that they keep working while the entitlement class feel that they can ignore all of the advice and travel at will.

ExMachina1000

fritzelly wrote: »

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1288220248307576835

Green is yes
Red is no

What is blue? I don't mind?

fritzelly

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Green is yes
Red is no

What is blue? I don't mind?

Abstained

Mad_maxx

Eric Cartman wrote: »

I think what my and many other posters keep banging on about is if we got closer to brutalisation and gruel that the numbers unemployed would fall sharply before you even got there. We have the worlds most generous welfare system and the proof in the pudding of its generosity is that suspending the payment of that welfare while they jet off to a sunny climate is a controversial topic.

That a perfectly sound decision was met with outrage is indicative of how far left our media and commentariat is

The narrative today insists that those who don't work are entitled to all of the same things as those who do

A country with those values is one that is in serious trouble and facing a troubled future

ChelseaRentBoy

Former Former wrote: »

Sooo, should you not be even more outraged than the rest of us by people claiming benefits to which they are not entitled, and so giving the wider community of welfare recipients a bad rep?

No.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

Pkiernan wrote: »

No one is calling pup recipients scroungers.

Do you honestly believe that taxpayers should pay for foreign holidays? Especially when our domestic tourism sector is gutted?

Personally I don't like paying 53% tax.

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We should be doing this anyway. If youre on the states dime you shouldnt be in a different country. I dont know what it is about how far ‘human rights’ have come , but a foreign holiday is not a human right or anywhere close to it.

Even those of us who get money from the state because we’re terminally ill and will never work again? We get funded by the taxpayer. Are we to stay in the country for good because of the source of our money? Maybe you think so but I bet you wouldn’t say that to my face.

ChelseaRentBoy

polesheep wrote: »

What the last few days has shown us is that we are not, and never were, all in this together.

And youve only realised that in the last few days?

ChelseaRentBoy

meeeeh wrote: »

They can holiday in Ireland.

Staying in Ireland isn't a holiday for the majority of people

Spanish Eyes

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Even those of us who get money from the state because we’re terminally ill and will never work again? We get funded by the taxpayer. Are we to stay in the country for good because of the source of our money? Maybe you think so but I bet you wouldn’t say that to my face.

Sorry that you are ill. But seriously would you risk travelling abroad now?

I know that wasn't your question, but the answer is obvious. Most people are pulling together and staying at home now. Those who don't or won't are selfish creatures in the main and hard left supporters I reckon. Some of them have to be given instructions.