Dole holidays curtailed

walshb

Connacht15 wrote: »

Heather Humpheries on Newstalk news clip had said jobseekers going to green list countries will be ok!
So Greenland, Monaco and Gibraltar will be fine!

Yes, and the Benny Hill roadshow Covid pandemic rolls on..

Calamitous....

Government be best to just STOP now, leave the PUP as it is for the time being, and when we come out of this, then phase it out

The time, effort, confusion at the moment is wasting far more money than some people hopping on planes for a birra sun with their PUP in their skyrocket.

Wanderer78

weldoninhio wrote: »

Households create money by earning it. Jesus.

in the modern world, there are effectively only two ways to create money, government created bonds and financial institutions created credit, if a household is creating money its called counterfeiting, and is obviously highly illegal, but a household can indeed 'earn' money, which was originally created via the methods mentioned above

Wanderer78

weldoninhio wrote: »

Saving money that’s spend on cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, gambling etc would collapse the economy?? Sure thing.

it more than likely would could cause serve disruption of our economy, significantly reducing money velocity, which would have significant impacts to our economy, particularly at the moment

weldoninhio

Wanderer78 wrote: »

in the modern world, there are effectively only two ways to create money, government created bonds and financial institutions created credit, if a household is creating money its called counterfeiting, and is obviously highly illegal, but a household can indeed 'earn' money, which was originally created via the methods mentioned above

Before I started work I’d no money. I created money for myself by earning it. It’s a novel concept to some.

Wanderer78

weldoninhio wrote: »

Before I started work I’d no money. I created money for myself by earning it. It’s a novel concept to some.

again, you didnt create it, as explained above, you 'earned' it

whisky_galore

U turn now.
Political cowardice.

Imo everyone and anyone should be discouraged from holidays abroad at this time.

Fann Linn

Fann Linn wrote: »

Same criteria for pensioners..........

For the NC pension, yes, great idea.
Those on the contributory pension should be able to spend it on whatever they like

weldoninhio

Wanderer78 wrote: »

again, you didnt create it, as explained above, you 'earned' it

Semantics. You know exactly what I meant.

Dempo1

Eric Cartman wrote: »

can we not keep one f*ckin thing. Like the government were rock solid over keeping USC or any of the tax raises, but when its water charges or dole holidays and "de most vunderable in societeee" giving out they coil back in a few days.

serious lack of spines in Leinster house.

Am I sensing a little bitterness?

Wanderer78

weldoninhio wrote: »

Semantics. You know exactly what I meant.

its very important to get this right, its commonly misused and misunderstood

joeysoap

I don't know why they don't come out and say what % of those stopped PUP were leaving the country permanently.

tritriagain

I'm going to uk the middle of August to do a 2.5 week course which will allow me to become self employed. At my own considerable expense. I am currently on jsb. Could I effectively lose jsb because of this

Eric Cartman

tritriagain wrote: »

I'm going to uk the middle of August to do a 2.5 week course which will allow me to become self employed. At my own considerable expense. I am currently on jsb. Could I effectively lose jsb because of this

that would be covered under essential, you won't lose your payment if you inform the welfare dept.

this thread is not really about the edge cases such as yourself. this is about foreign workers on PUP who have no intention to return, those on JSA going for a holiday etc...

Dempo1

joeysoap wrote: »

I don't know why they don't come out and say what % of those stopped PUP were leaving the country permanently.

Simple really, it's all lies, like the entire debacle.

Quitely changing criteria on their websites and then claiming they didn't, saying part of normal updates.

Saying information got at airports, than claining it wasn't, but wait, then said info collated from passengers, then realised that's not permitted without reasonable suspicion of a fraud, crime taking place.

Denying there was discrimination when various legal experts stating the opposite

I coukd go on, a deceitful, disgraceful ploy to hound PUP recepients now they think the Covid19 dust has settled, thankfully there was enough public representatives who cared enough to force the issue. What is Intriguing is it only FG TD's pushing this and other nonsense, very, very telling, even the greens claiming they were not informed of any proposed changes.

Dempo1

Eric Cartman wrote: »

that would be covered under essential, you won't lose your payment if you inform the welfare dept.

this thread is not really about the edge cases such as yourself. this is about foreign workers on PUP who have no intention to return, those on JSA going for a holiday etc...

No it is not, Foreign workers on PUP, what are you spouting, nonsense I suspect, its about blatant discrimination affecting ALL pup recipients and I might add, the few examples exposed did not involve "Foreign" pup recepients as you referred too them ss, shameful assertion and ill informed, grow up or better still read some real news, there's plenty available that might enlighten you.

Panch18

Dempo1 wrote: »

No it is not, Foreign workers on PUP, what are you spouting, nonsense I suspect, its about blatant discrimination affecting ALL pup recipients and I might add, the few examples exposed did not involve "Foreign" pup recepients as you referred too them ss, shameful assertion and ill informed, grow up or better still read some real news, there's plenty available that might enlighten you.

Discrimination???

Anyone in receipt of funding from the state because they are out of work should be going on foreign holidays and trips - it's always been a joke but now it's just there are so many in receipt of state money that it just shouldn't be tolerated

Shame on the government for caving in so easily on this - they had the support of the general population - I can't believe they succumbed to this lefty media tirade as usual

Dempo1

Panch18 wrote: »

Discrimination???

Anyone in receipt of funding from the state because they are out of work should be going on foreign holidays and trips - it's always been a joke but now it's just there are so many in receipt of state money that it just shouldn't be tolerated

Shame on the government for caving in so easily on this - they had the support of the general population - I can't believe they succumbed to this lefty media tirade as usual

Hillarious, you've clearly not being following either this thread, the news and subsequent fall out, I would hardly describe FLAC or the data protection commission lefties and there's also been some commentary from government TD's, not greens I might add.

It's a fantastic result, as clearly as painful as it is for you.

Just a thought, any comments on TWSS?, The scheme that's allows 3 aquaintences of mine get almost full salary, paid by your taxes, neither have worked since March, how's that making you feel exactly? €3000 net per month and it's all OK, PUP recepients demonised because the mere mention of unemployment in its title causes offence

whisky_galore

whisky_galore wrote: »

U turn now.
Political cowardice.

Imo everyone and anyone should be discouraged from holidays abroad at this time.

This. For the sake of our health and the economy, all travel out of and into the country should be stopped. Friends haven’t been able to attend immediate family funerals in the Uk. They accepted this due to the pandemic. Then they are seeing unemployed people going abroad. Sickening.

James Brown

Panch18 wrote: »

Discrimination???

Anyone in receipt of funding from the state because they are out of work should be going on foreign holidays and trips - it's always been a joke but now it's just there are so many in receipt of state money that it just shouldn't be tolerated

Shame on the government for caving in so easily on this - they had the support of the general population - I can't believe they succumbed to this lefty media tirade as usual

They didn't cave. They tried to pull a fast one and it backfired on them. If it was about health and safety they wouldn't have lifted the travel ban. It is and always was about them doing as they like and pointing the finger at sections of the public for deflection.

Eric Cartman

Dempo1 wrote: »

No it is not, Foreign workers on PUP, what are you spouting, nonsense I suspect, its about blatant discrimination affecting ALL pup recipients and I might add, the few examples exposed did not involve "Foreign" pup recepients as you referred too them ss, shameful assertion and ill informed, grow up or better still read some real news, there's plenty available that might enlighten you.

they caught over 1000 people travelling on PUP , 250 of them confirmed Brazilians returning home for good. thats a sizeable chunk already, facts aren't discrimination.

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

This. For the sake of our health and the economy, all travel out of and into the country should be stopped. Friends haven’t been able to attend immediate family funerals in the Uk. They accepted this due to the pandemic. Then they are seeing unemployed people going abroad. Sickening.

I agree nobody should be travelling abroad.
The problem was FF/FG were trying to cherry pick who could while saying we shouldn't, but allowing it. Complete farce.

Dempo1

Eric Cartman wrote: »

they caught over 1000 people travelling on PUP , 250 of them confirmed Brazilians returning home for good. thats a sizeable chunk already, facts aren't discrimination.

Heresay, never confirmed or proven. Even if it where true, we're were the rest from? Timbuktu?

Numerous Dail Representatives can't get a definitive breakdown, so why you assume this story is true is beyond me, a blanket comment, "this is about Foreign PUP recepients is outrageous

Pkiernan

Don't worry layabouts.

The Govt has done a U turn.

You can layabout abroad now...


What a screwed up country we live in.

Bowie

Bowie wrote: »

I agree nobody should be travelling abroad.
The problem was FF/FG were trying to cherry pick who could while saying we shouldn't, but allowing it. Complete farce.

I don’t think that they were cherry picking. PUP is an exceptional payment paid to people who find themselves out of work due to Covid 19. It’s not implemented the same as unemployment benefit/assistance. The fact that people have to self isolate on their return from many countries means that if their employment becomes available again while they are away, then their employers won be able to carry out their business as expected due to self isolation.
The checks were proved necessary by the number of people leaving the country, with no intention of returning, while in receipt of the Covid PUP.

Antares35

weldoninhio wrote: »

Pensioners will have earned it, unless they are lifetime dolers. I’d have minimum pension for lifetime wasters and an increased one for those who contributed to the pot.

Disabled people disabled id have to look into. Don’t know too much about that.

Carers should be paid more, being a carer is a full time job. With the savings from the wasters we’d be able to do this.

Yup. Always thought it was shameful that the non contributory pension is only like twenty quid less than the contributory one

SusieBlue

meeeeh wrote: »

You can't ban travel. Do you want to ban those who need to travel forwork or those who need to visit sick or dying relatives? Banning nonessential travel would mean planes would be grounded and besides that there would be complete mess deciding what is essential and what is not essential. Connectivity with the rest of the world is more important than holiday refunds. I have sympathy for people who are stuck in this mess but loosing 5k on flights isn't the worst that can happen to someone.

Travelling for work or to visit dying relatives would fall under essential travel. Two weeks in the Canaries wouldn’t, and people who had booked such holidays would be able to get refunds.

I don’t know what planet you’re on but losing an additional 5 grand of your hard earned cash after already losing your job to the pandemic would be an absolutely awful thing to happen to a person.
5k is a huge amount of money to most, these people have already sacrificed and lost enough and they should be entitled to financial recourse in the form of refunds or vouchers for these holidays if the government is adamant they don’t want people to travel. It’s only fair.

Dempo1

Pkiernan wrote: »

Don't worry layabouts.

The Govt has done a U turn.

You can layabout abroad now...


What a screwed up country we live in.

I'm actually about to lay about in the house I purchased over 20 years of hard work, I just might look at holidays, with some of my hard earned savings, just confused, Greenland or Monaco, I've plenty of time as my job not re starting until mid August, it really is a hard life, you know how it is, work all your life. Buy a house, god forbid save for a holiday and then a pandemic crisis and laid off for a few months, it coukd be better, if I was in TWSS, I'd be getting nearly 3,000 pm net whilst at home,

This must drive you crazy but I do appreciate your support

meeeeh

Dempo1 wrote: »

Just a thought, any comments on TWSS?, The scheme that's allows 3 aquaintences of mine get almost full salary, paid by your taxes, neither have worked since March, how's that making you feel exactly? €3000 net per month and it's all OK, PUP recepients demonised because the mere mention of unemployment in its title causes offence

This is besides the point but that kind of numbers are complete nonsense. TWSS doesn't come anywhere near 3000 net. They might be getting 3000 net but TWSS is about half of that. The other half would be employer top up and tax credits that they will have to repay.

meeeeh

SusieBlue wrote: »

Travelling for work or to visit dying relatives would fall under essential travel. Two weeks in the Canaries wouldn’t, and people who had booked such holidays would be able to get refunds.

I don’t know what planet you’re on but losing an additional 5 grand of your hard earned cash after already losing your job to the pandemic would be an absolutely awful thing to happen to a person.
5k is a huge amount of money to most, these people have already sacrificed and lost enough and they should be entitled to financial recourse in the form of refunds or vouchers for these holidays if the government is adamant they don’t want people to travel. It’s only fair.

Who is going to pay for all this? Can we afford more job losses with airlines going bust or letting off even more people than they already will.

Dempo1

meeeeh wrote: »

This is besides the point but that kind of numbers are complete nonsense. TWSS doesn't come anywhere near 3000 net. They might be getting 3000 net but TWSS is about half of that. The other half would be employer top up and tax credits that they will have to repay.

O I beg to differ, €2890 net last month with 25% of that the top up. And its not besides the point, people are so exercised about PUP and yet 1000"s on TWSS and getting far more and still furlough Ed, in essence a glorified PUP, I can also tell you 2 other friends have advised me that when the new EWSS starts they'll be offered redundancy, so in essence about 10k has been paid out to at least 5 I know, even though they were always advised, redundancy likely. I don't begrude them, actually happy for them but PUP is not the only taxpayer scheme in existence but its more esthetically pleasing. I won't even start about 1000s of business's also claiming from this scheme even though business not affected in the slightest