Dole holidays curtailed

Limpy

I gave up the sauce and anytime I was unfortunate enough to end up on JB I would still travel abroad. Id skip off on a flight for €30 and travel around the continent. Don't know what people's fixation is with pints, travel and the dole. It can be done, where the holiday is about seeing new city's, meeting people ect. If you need to lump drink and travel together then i feel sorry for you. Theres more to life then a pint.

Dempo1

tritriagain wrote: »

The amount of snobbery on this thread is unreal. I hope certain posters never find themselves in hard times. Yes there are certain people milking the system but most people are trying to make their way through life as best they can and are victims of circumstances i.e pandemics, economic downturns, illness etc.

Don't waste your time, it's after 9 and the trollers have no pubs to go too, they'll be on, trying to fill gaps in their quite sad lives

Dempo1

blanch152 wrote: »

You are clearly not following the news either.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0729/1156187-pandemic-unemployment-payment/

"If people want to travel to a non-green list country, it must be for essential reasons such as a bereavement or for health reasons", the minister said, adding that people must inform their Intreo office beforehand and their payment will not be affected."

The regulation is still in place for non-green-list countries i.e. the vast majority of places where people go on holidays like Spain, France, the UK and Portugal.


https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/irish_social_welfare_system/claiming_a_social_welfare_payment/going_abroad_and_social_welfare_payments.html


"Since 7 July 2020, you will only be paid for a holiday abroad that is in accordance with the General COVID-19 Travel Advisory in operation. You will also not be paid for the 14 days that you are required to self-isolate when you return from abroad."

The regulation was introduced on 7 July and applied to non-essential travel to all countries because there was no green list!!!!

The green list was only announced on 21 July. Hilarious that people think that this is a u-turn. Even Paul Murphy in the Dail realised it only applied to the green list. Where there was a mistake in communication was in not updating the advice due to the publication of the green list.

Not sure where you've been but alot has actually happened since your silliness yesterday

Dempo1

meeeeh wrote: »

You are talking complete nonsense. I do the wages and we were on TWSS when closed in April and May. We have quite a few who would be on around 3000 net and I know how much of subsidy we were getting for them. I think some limits were increased but max you can get per week is around 410, majority would get around 350 at the time we were on it.

Just to add, I don't think people on PUP are any different but because TWSS is paid as support to employer it can't be stopped if employee is leaving the country. All I can say is that unless our employees are using their holidays we won't pay for two weeks quarantine after holiday. I suspect majority of employers wouldn't pay the two weeks off weather they are on TWSS or not.

You've actually confirmed what I act said about TWSS, it's basic maths really and yes, thousands per month, I'm unsure what's the difference, a support payment for an employer or for an employee? But I will say, I predict quite a scandal when audits are done re TWSS.

Incidentally I do not begrudge anyone on TWSS, I've many friends on it, but I do belive those who wish to bash PUP recepients whilst also getting a state support are a little cheeky

Good night. I'm done with this thread

tritriagain

Pkiernan wrote: »

Then why dont you give them some money?
Nothing stopping you....or us it just other peoples money you want to give away?

I paid a lot of tax over the years. Thank God it hasn't made me as bitter as you. Tbh I'd prefer to got for a pint with someone on the dole that I'd paid for their pint than have one with a self righteous knob like you.

weldoninhio

Queasy Tadpole wrote: »

Go in with your friend. Buy them all their food on your food only dole card. They give you the cash they would have spent in the shop. You go off down the the drinks aisle for whatever you need and a pack of smokes on the way out.


Easily fooled that system.

And what do you eat?

weldoninhio

tritriagain wrote: »

Again I hope you never fall on hard times. If all you had to look forward to was a pint you know that life has not been kind to you. As I said I know some people can play the system but most people are just living day to day.

I’ve been out of work, years ago now, but I survived on my savings. If all you have to look forward to is a pint, then you have quite a pathetic life.

hatrickpatrick

meeeeh wrote: »

You can't ban travel. Do you want to ban those who need to travel forwork or those who need to visit sick or dying relatives? Banning nonessential travel would mean planes would be grounded and besides that there would be complete mess deciding what is essential and what is not essential. Connectivity with the rest of the world is more important than holiday refunds. I have sympathy for people who are stuck in this mess but loosing 5k on flights isn't the worst that can happen to someone.

During this pandemic? Absolutely. All non-essential travel should be declared illegal until the situation has stabilised, it's as simple as that.

None of this excuses government editing of documents in order to deceive the public, of course. Someone's head needs to roll over this.

tritriagain

weldoninhio wrote: »

I’ve been out of work, years ago now, but I survived on my savings. If all you have to look forward to is a pint, then you have quite a pathetic life.

I agree. But I think where we differ is these people imo are unfortunately not living life to it's potential whereas you seem to look down on them and pour scorn on them

weldoninhio

tritriagain wrote: »

I agree. But I think where we differ is these people imo are unfortunately not living life to it's potential whereas you seem to look down on them and pour scorn on them

No, I’m wanting them pushed out of their comfort zones. That’s where you learn new skills and live life to its potential. You seem happy for them go through life sat squarely in their comfort zone, not living life to their potential.

Which one is more limiting??

weldoninhio

RTÉ now reporting that of the 2500 who had their PUP stopped, all but 85 of them were leaving the country permanently.

tritriagain

weldoninhio wrote: »

No, I’m wanting them pushed out of their comfort zones. That’s where you learn new skills and live life to its potential. You seem happy for them go through life sat squarely in their comfort zone, not living life to their potential.

Which one is more limiting??

Again we agree to differ. I'm not happy for them to sit in their comfort zone but saying that someone who looks forward to a pint at the weekend has a pathetic life is far from encouraging

ThunbergsAreGo

weldoninhio wrote: »

RTÉ now reporting that of the 2500 who had their PUP stopped, all but 85 of them were leaving the country permanently.

So this has saved us almost a million a week, that can only be seen as good news.

ThunbergsAreGo

tritriagain wrote: »

Again we agree to differ. I'm not happy for them to sit in their comfort zone but saying that someone who looks forward to a pint at the weekend has a pathetic life is far from encouraging

I think he said if its ONLY a pint you are looking forward to

ChelseaRentBoy

tritriagain wrote: »

Again I hope you never fall on hard times. If all you had to look forward to was a pint you know that life has not been kind to you. As I said I know some people can play the system but most people are just living day to day.

Pointless attempting to explain it to them. A coward will always be a coward.

weldoninhio

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

I think he said if its ONLY a pint you are looking forward to

It’s grand. That’s what the loony left do. Take what they want from a sentence and discard the rest. Petty, immature and thoroughly predictable.

meeeeh

weldoninhio wrote: »

No, I’m wanting them pushed out of their comfort zones. That’s where you learn new skills and live life to its potential. You seem happy for them go through life sat squarely in their comfort zone, not living life to their potential.

Which one is more limiting??

What exactly do you want? A sound engineer to start doing a bit of welding till he can go to his previous profession. PuP won't be around forever but it also helps to keep people who are good at their job in their profession where they will be needed again soon.

That's completely separate from the fact that government can't pay you to act opposite to official advice.

blanch152

weldoninhio wrote: »

RTÉ now reporting that of the 2500 who had their PUP stopped, all but 85 of them were leaving the country permanently.

So all of the hysterics from the PBP lads was over people going home and exploiting the country?

joeysoap

weldoninhio wrote: »

RTÉ now reporting that of the 2500 who had their PUP stopped, all but 85 of them were leaving the country permanently.

Should have said this in the first place. But that's not pc.

Dempo1

Dempo1 wrote: »

Heresay, never confirmed or proven. Even if it where true, we're were the rest from? Timbuktu?

Numerous Dail Representatives can't get a definitive breakdown, so why you assume this story is true is beyond me, a blanket comment, "this is about Foreign PUP recepients is outrageous

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0729/1156187-pandemic-unemployment-payment/

And yet the facts say otherwise. Would you care to withdraw your comment, given the new evidence provided which is the exact opposite of "Heresay" (sic)?

blanch152

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0729/1156187-pandemic-unemployment-payment/

And yet the facts say otherwise. Would you care to withdraw your comment, given the new evidence provided which is the exact opposite of "Heresay" (sic)?

The hysterical rantings of the likes of RISE TD Paul Murphy and the anti-FG bandwagonners on here have been shown up to be just that.

Absolutely right that anyone who travels abroad for non-essential purposes to a country not on the green list should have their payments cut.

weldoninhio

meeeeh wrote: »

What exactly do you want? A sound engineer to start doing a bit of welding till he can go to his previous profession. PuP won't be around forever but it also helps to keep people who are good at their job in their profession where they will be needed again soon.

That's completely separate from the fact that government can't pay you to act opposite to official advice.

Do whatever needs done. “We’re all in this together” when people want handouts, quite the opposite when asked to do a short term job. I’m an office administrator, but in the times I wasn’t able to get a job there I worked in supermarkets, on the land, in a Chinese restaurant and on building sites labouring. Silly me, I should have just sat on my arse.

Fann Linn

weldoninhio wrote: »

Do whatever needs done. “We’re all in this together” when people want handouts, quite the opposite when asked to do a short term job.

I really don't think it's that simple. People are contracted to their previous employer, maybe okay for the likes of a student but some people may be employed for 5, 10,15 20 years in the same job, what then? Issues could arise regarding redundancy, tax, etc.
It's far too simplistic to just say 'look for something else'.

gmisk

blanch152 wrote: »

So all of the hysterics from the PBP lads was over people going home and exploiting the country?

They have to be in hysterics about someone or something even without knowing all the facts... it plays to their fanbase

Fann Linn

gmisk wrote: »

They have to be in hysterics about someone or something even without knowing all the facts... it plays to their fanbase

It's not over yet. IT and RTE reporting that there are still further questions and concerns regarding how Dept. of SW and their inspectors have carried out their work.

blanch152

Fann Linn wrote: »

It's not over yet. IT and RTE reporting that there are still further questions and concerns regarding how Dept. of SW and their inspectors have carried out their work.

If there are legislative gaps preventing the Department of Social Welfare and the gardai from enforcing rules to monitor compliance with government advice to avoid non-essential travel, then those legislative gaps should be closed.

Fann Linn

blanch152 wrote: »

If there are legislative gaps preventing the Department of Social Welfare and the gardai from enforcing rules to monitor compliance with government advice to avoid non-essential travel, then those legislative gaps should be closed.

Agreed. But cannot be closed retrospectively so were they acting 'ultra vires'?

blanch152

Fann Linn wrote: »

Agreed. But cannot be closed retrospectively so were they acting 'ultra vires'?

Does a national emergency allow for limited retrospectional legislative implementation of necessary executive decisions?

For example, if we had an enemy who simultaneously launched an invasion, assassinated the President and blew up the Dail with all our legislators in it, would the Army Chief of Staff be prevented from ordering the army out to defend the country?

Of course, that example is subject to us having (1) an enemy and (2) an army.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

If there are legislative gaps preventing the Department of Social Welfare and the gardai from enforcing rules to monitor compliance with government advice to avoid non-essential travel, then those legislative gaps should be closed.

Why would the government or Garda monitor compliance with 'advice'?

What kind of legislation would cover enforcing 'advice'?

You're tripping over yourself with the back peddling.
The travel ban was lifted on Green list countries, or have they once again amended their website over night?

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

Why would the government or Garda monitor compliance with 'advice'?

What kind of legislation would cover enforcing 'advice'?

You're tripping over yourself with the back peddling.
The travel ban was lifted on Green list countries, or have they once again amended their website over night?

And I have no problem with the travel ban being lifted on Green list countries.

The issue has never been about social welfare recipients being able to travel abroad, it has been about social welfare recipients being able to go on non-essential travel to countries not on the green list and come home without penalty and put the most vulnerable people in our society at risk.