Dole holidays curtailed

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

And I have no problem with the travel ban being lifted on Green list countries.

The issue has never been about social welfare recipients being able to travel abroad, it has been about social welfare recipients being able to go on non-essential travel to countries not on the green list and come home without penalty and put the most vulnerable people in our society at risk.

Why would the government or Garda monitor compliance with 'advice'?

What kind of legislation would cover enforcing 'advice'?

Either there's a rule in place or there isn't, I know with this government it's hard to keep track.

Since you brought it up...

The opposition and others said FF/FG were wrong to penalise SW and PUP recipients for taking holidays abroad when that ban had been lifted.
You took this as them willing to put peoples health at risk so those not working could take a holiday. An insult to workers. That was your claim and you never backed it up.
Now that FF/FG are on song and know it was wrong, you've no such claims on them.

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

Either there's a rule in place or there isn't, I know with this government it's hard to keep track.

Since you brought it up...

The opposition and others said FF/FG were wrong to penalise SW and PUP recipients for taking holidays abroad when that ban had been lifted.
You took this as them willing to put peoples health at risk so those not working could take a holiday. An insult to workers. That was your claim and you never backed it up.
Now that FF/FG are on song and know it was wrong, you've no such claims on them.

Correct, and that piece in bold remains my opinion. I am entitled to hold the opinion that the opposition were willing to put peoples health at risk so those not working could take a holiday. I won't apologise for holding such an opinion.

The green list didn't exist until the 21st July, the likes of RISE were complaining about those who were deducted payments earlier than that, when non-essential travel to all countries was advised against, so my opinion remains valid.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

Correct, and that piece in bold remains my opinion. I am entitled to hold the opinion that the opposition were willing to put peoples health at risk so those not working could take a holiday. I won't apologise for holding such an opinion.

The green list didn't exist until the 21st July, the likes of RISE were complaining about those who were deducted payments earlier than that, when non-essential travel to all countries was advised against, so my opinion remains valid.

Great. So you must share the same view on FF/FG? It's just you laid off that opinion after it fitted FF/FG.

Why would the government or Garda monitor compliance with 'advice'?

What kind of legislation would cover enforcing 'advice'?

Bowie

Bowie wrote: »

Great. So you must share the same view on FF/FG? It's just you laid off that opinion after it fitted FF/FG.

Why would the government or Garda monitor compliance with 'advice'?

What kind of legislation would cover enforcing 'advice'?

So, I take it that you’re ok with people getting a payment that they’re not entitled to?

“ In a statement this evening, the department said it had completed the review of those 2,500 cases:
This review has identified some 85 cases that have the potential to be entitled to the Pandemic Unemployment Payment for a holiday period. The department will be contacting the 85 individuals directly in the coming days to verify these cases.
Humphreys confirmed today that regulations will be signed to allow recipients of the PUP to travel to Green List countries.” https://www.thejournal.ie/pup-humphreys-5162819-Jul2020/

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

So, I take it that you’re ok with people getting a payment that they’re not entitled to?

“ In a statement this evening, the department said it had completed the review of those 2,500 cases:
This review has identified some 85 cases that have the potential to be entitled to the Pandemic Unemployment Payment for a holiday period. The department will be contacting the 85 individuals directly in the coming days to verify these cases.
Humphreys confirmed today that regulations will be signed to allow recipients of the PUP to travel to Green List countries.” https://www.thejournal.ie/pup-humphreys-5162819-Jul2020/

No. Where on earth did you pull that out of?
I've even issue with junior ministerial pay hikes and the like.

tritriagain

weldoninhio wrote: »

It’s grand. That’s what the loony left do. Take what they want from a sentence and discard the rest. Petty, immature and thoroughly predictable.

First time I've ever been labelled left. Sad thing is I agree with you that long term dolers are wasting their life in a lot of cases.however there are now thousands of people unemployed through no fault of their own. All I'm trying to say is it's not always as simple as going out to get a job now because the jobs are not there.

Connacht15

tritriagain wrote: »

First time I've ever been labelled left. Sad thing is I agree with you that long term dolers are wasting their life in a lot of cases.however there are now thousands of people unemployed through no fault of their own. All I'm trying to say is it's not always as simple as going out to get a job now because the jobs are not there.

Long terrm dolers wasting their lives - would they not be wasting their lives on the shopfloor of factories or shelf stacking for **** wages and conditions?


Many low grade jobs have the effect of destroying talents that you have e.g. communication abilities and they might be the only jobs available for those without contacts in most of the country regardless of education attained!

Eric Cartman

Connacht15 wrote: »

Long terrm dolers wasting their lives - would they not be wasting their lives on the shopfloor of factories or shelf stacking for **** wages and conditions?


Many low grade jobs have the effect of destroying talents that you have e.g. communication abilities and they might be the only jobs available for those without contacts in most of the country regardless of education attained!

You make it sound like getting any job above minimum wage is like an old boys club get a seat on the board of the fortune 500 company type job.

Realistically almost anyone in Ireland with a decent command of the english language and a completed leaving cert can get a job for 19-20k a year and after a few years be earning closer to 30k

I understand kids or illness blocking those paths for some , but I would much rather somebody ‘waste’ their life putting in 40 hours a week than on the dole no matter what the job

Connacht15

Connacht15 wrote: »

Long terrm dolers wasting their lives - would they not be wasting their lives on the shopfloor of factories or shelf stacking for **** wages and conditions?


Many low grade jobs have the effect of destroying talents that you have e.g. communication abilities and they might be the only jobs available for those without contacts in most of the country regardless of education attained!

Earning a living .... One has to start somewhere.... Or you can stay a waster dolehead.

Eric Cartman

Eric Cartman wrote: »

...

I understand kids or illness blocking those paths for some , but I would much rather somebody ‘waste’ their life putting in 40 hours a week than on the dole no matter what the job

The free house is a big carrot for those willing to put the hard years in though. They'll get one eventually.

MarkY91

Eric Cartman wrote: »

You make it sound like getting any job above minimum wage is like an old boys club get a seat on the board of the fortune 500 company type job.

Realistically almost anyone in Ireland with a decent command of the english language and a completed leaving cert can get a job for 19-20k a year and after a few years be earning closer to 30k

I understand kids or illness blocking those paths for some , but I would much rather somebody ‘waste’ their life putting in 40 hours a week than on the dole no matter what the job

Name a few examples.

Eric Cartman

MarkY91 wrote: »

Name a few examples.

Call centres - tech support, insurance sales, customer care / returns

Fast food - eddie rockets, mcdonalds and burger king all have robust training programs that allow you to build skills that can leave you being a retail manager in a handful of years

Office admin roles

Civil/public service general entry

An post, waterways Ireland, bord failte

Hotel admin / desk staff.

MarkY91

MarkY91 wrote: »

Name a few examples.

20k/annum is minimum wage...... To better oneself you change jobs or move roles in a company.

Basic enough concept surely

Connacht15

Augeo wrote: »

20k/annum is minimum wage...... To better oneself you change jobs or move roles in a company.

Basic enough concept surely

There are 3 different economies in Ireland -

Dublin and the pale
Borders, Midlands and West (BMW)
The rest

In The BMW area your employment opportunities are very limited in every way!
And the logical position you put forward is almost unheard of!

Over 40,000 in third level education in those locations - NUIG and the It's in Letterkenny, Sligo, Athlone and GMIT which would spew out 10K -
12K level 8/9 graduates annually in an area where there might be 20 graduate entry jobs per week - 1K per year!
Do the math and understand the implications!

Connacht15

Augeo wrote: »

20k/annum is minimum wage...... To better oneself you change jobs or move roles in a company.

Basic enough concept surely

There are 3 different economies in Ireland -

Dublin and the pale
Borders, Midlands and West (BMW)
The rest

In The BMW area your employment opportunities are very limited in every way!
And the logical position you put forward is almost unheard of!

Over 40,000 in third level education in those locations - NUIG and the It's in Letterkenny, Sligo, Athlone and GMIT which would spew out 10K -
12K level 8/9 graduates annually in an area where there might be 20 graduate entry jobs per week - 1K per year!
Do the math and understand the implications!