What if no Vaccines work?

blackvalley

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Every 2 weeks whoever has it no longer has it, those they interact with are the problem, it takes the idiot having it to infect the idiot getting it, if everyone assumed everyone had it the virus would die.

By the way i would like if possible to hold an adult discussion on the subject rather than hurl around juvenile taunts like referring to people with other opinions as idiots

Atlantic Dawn

blackvalley wrote: »

By the way i would like if possible to hold an adult discussion on the subject rather than hurl around juvenile taunts like referring to people with other opinions as idiots

2 week infection period is fact, not interacting with anyone while infected for those 2 weeks kills it, simple. How it infects people has been wall to wall every single day for nearly a year, anyone not knowing this is not fit to hold an adult discussion.

blackvalley

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

2 week infection period is fact, not interacting with anyone while infected for those 2 weeks kills it, simple. How it infects people has been wall to wall every single day for nearly a year, anyone not knowing this is not fit to hold an adult discussion.

Ok so going back to the original question ( and apologies if i was short with you )
what would we be doing today if no vaccine was imminent

Atlantic Dawn

blackvalley wrote: »

Ok so going back to the original question ( and apologies if i was short with you )
what would we be doing today if no vaccine was imminent

As a healthy person I'd be going for deliberate infection and isolation for those 2 weeks following it. It would give me control over my life for 6 months plus.

blackvalley

So that approach would be to create the " herd immunity " that we hear about .

suicide_circus

We'd just have to accept that this virus was a feature of life and get on with it. Death is the inevitable consequence of life.

Cooled

Is this really a hypothetical question given that studies suggest the vacines won't work against sone of the new variants of covid?

is_that_so

Cooled wrote: »

Is this really a hypothetical question given that studies suggest the vaccines won't work against some of the new variants of covid?

One small study on one variant. Some of these vaccines can be adjusted very quickly.

Beasty

Threads merged

Mr. Karate

Gael23 wrote: »

This won’t happen again in the lifetime of anyone reading this post.

Now that people have shown that they will meekly obey anything the Government tells them to do you can bet that whether we regain normality this year or next year its only a matter of time until they try this again.

This virus has been good at spotlighting who the wannabe tyrants are.

BattleCorp

Mr. Karate wrote: »

Now that people have shown that they will meekly obey anything the Government tells them to do you can bet that whether we regain normality this year or next year its only a matter of time until they try this again.

Are you suggesting we should abandon the public health advice given by the NPHET, the HSE and the Government?

CalamariFritti

If the vaccines wouldnt work then there is really only one option. Let it go through the population and gain immunity that way. It would have to be done in a somewhat controlled fashion but not at a snails pace either.

Some may say we should have done that all along.

And for all the worriers about news strains and variants and whatnot...
As sad as the whole thing is we couldnt let it allow to destroy us either. Another year or two of this and life is not worth living anymore.
A not so wise man once said, the cure cant be worse than the disease. He may be an idiot but he's not wrong on that one.

saabsaab

The premise of the thread is now out of date as the vaccines are working!
Maybe a variant will come along that will be resistant but if the roll out is big enough and quick enough that shouldn't happen.

Cerveza

China will come out with another variant yet, they haven’t played their hand of cards yet.

SouthWesterly

saabsaab wrote: »

The premise of the thread is now out of date as the vaccines are working!
Maybe a variant will come along that will be resistant but if the roll out is big enough and quick enough that shouldn't happen.

We don't know if the vaccines are working. Most are on their first injection. It will be months before we know if they've been effective.

Dempo1

I am curious at the lack of data from countries who've successfully rolled out vaccines, Israel being an example. I would have thought some initial data on whether vaccines making a difference.

The UK is a concern, I'm not getting this odd decision to extend the time between getting first and 2nd shot, 12 weeks seems an extraordinary time and goes against clear recommendations of vaccine suppliers.

CalamariFritti

Dempo1 wrote: »

I am curious at the lack of data from countries who've successfully rolled out vaccines, Israel being an example. I would have thought some initial data on whether vaccines making a difference.

The UK is a concern, I'm not getting this odd decision to extend the time between getting first and 2nd shot, 12 weeks seems an extraordinary time and goes against clear recommendations of vaccine suppliers.

There is plenty of data on Israel. They're not just rolling it out. They're accompanying it with at least two control studies I know of. Like I guess anyone would. There are even preliminary results out on those which are very encouraging.

kowloon

BattleCorp wrote: »

Are you suggesting we should abandon the public health advice given by the NPHET, the HSE and the Government?

"BuT The ECoNomeEE!"

That's how they always frame it. They rarely have the courage to just admit they miss the pub more than they'll miss whoever it spreads to.

saabsaab

CalamariFritti wrote: »

There is plenty of data on Israel. They're not just rolling it out. They're accompanying it with at least two control studies I know of. Like I guess anyone would. There are even preliminary results out on those which are very encouraging.

+1 It looks like that it is working.

hblock21

CalamariFritti wrote: »

There is plenty of data on Israel. They're not just rolling it out. They're accompanying it with at least two control studies I know of. Like I guess anyone would. There are even preliminary results out on those which are very encouraging.

Any links? thanks

Even the first Jab takes 14 days to impart the partial immunity that it does, and the second jab needs time as well.

Anyway it looks like the first jab is from 40-60% successful, hopefully the second jab is better.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-data-shows-50-reduction-in-infections-14-days-after-first-vaccine-shot/

The British claim of 86% after the first jab is disputed.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-vaccine-dose-gap-israel-b1789781.html

breezy1985

CalamariFritti wrote: »

If the vaccines wouldnt work then there is really only one option. Let it go through the population and gain immunity that way. It would have to be done in a somewhat controlled fashion but not at a snails pace either.

Some may say we should have done that all along.

And for all the worriers about news strains and variants and whatnot...
As sad as the whole thing is we couldnt let it allow to destroy us either. Another year or two of this and life is not worth living anymore.
A not so wise man once said, the cure cant be worse than the disease. He may be an idiot but he's not wrong on that one.

Cool but we need to build some big field hospices outside the major population centres to send all the sick to die sad lonely horrible deaths.

That's the pay off if you are willing to go your way

SafeSurfer

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

2 week infection period is fact, not interacting with anyone while infected for those 2 weeks kills it, simple. How it infects people has been wall to wall every single day for nearly a year, anyone not knowing this is not fit to hold an adult discussion.

The number of people who died with Covid has been given wall to wall coverage here for almost a year but we still don’t know how many people have died from Covid.

is_that_so

SafeSurfer wrote: »

The number of people who died with Covid has been given wall to wall coverage here for almost a year but we still don’t know how many people have died from Covid.

People do seem to be fixated on this and it's always going to be estimated but it's not Ebola. The problem with COVID is the range of symptoms and how many of those end up putting huge pressures on health systems, which potentially leads to more deaths.

Hector Savage

kowloon wrote: »

"BuT The ECoNomeEE!"

That's how they always frame it. They rarely have the courage to just admit they miss the pub more than they'll miss whoever it spreads to.

Nonsense, how about yourself ? working from home with zero impact on your finances ?

kowloon

Hector Savage wrote: »

Nonsense, how about yourself ? working from home with zero impact on your finances ?

Kind of proving my point there. Straight into finances because that's what matters most. Amazing how some people suddenly care so much about other people's money and mental health all of a sudden.
Obvious selfish agenda is obvious.

kowloon

kowloon wrote: »

Kind of proving my point there. Straight into finances because that's what matters most. Amazing how some people suddenly care so much about other people's money and mental health all of a sudden.
Obvious selfish agenda is obvious.

Has the pandemic caused your life to change much or at all?

Richard Hillman

SafeSurfer wrote: »

The number of people who died with Covid has been given wall to wall coverage here for almost a year but we still don’t know how many people have died from Covid.

This is why they are always vague on the deaths. Nearly 1 year on and we still don't know what an underlying illness actually quantifies at.

We have been absolutely betrayed by the media in this too. They are the only people with access to ask questions and but they have been toeing the line to keep their access. And that's before we get to the likes of the Journal with their dodgy "fact, checking"

It's a very important question. How many people have died purely from covid?

Why are these things being kept so secretive?

saabsaab

SafeSurfer wrote: »

The number of people who died with Covid has been given wall to wall coverage here for almost a year but we still don’t know how many people have died from Covid.

I don't get the fascination of dying with/of Covid. Does it really matter? People die with Cancer or of Cancer. i.e. many Cancer patients die of pneumonia or heart failure but the cause is really Cancer.

CalamariFritti

hblock21 wrote: »

Any links? thanks

Sorry try to be not on here so much.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/25/world/middleeast/israels-vaccine-data.html

Summary with links.