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Irish Property Market 2020 Part 2
Comments
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The point is not who try save what.The point is that some people telling us stories about supply and demand,savings and how much people spend.They does not care about what is going on and were we go.But things what happening now is far way not good for property market at all .0
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neutral guy wrote: »The point is not who try save what.The point is that some people telling us stories about supply and demand,savings and how much people spend.They does not care about what is going on and were we go.But things what happening now is far way not good for property market at all .
And yet people need somewhere to live what are their choices and remember the choices are limited due to a severe lack of supply
Pay the price for the house
pay the rent for a house
stay with mam and dad0 -
Ireland does not have lack of supply.fliball123 wrote: »And yet people need somewhere to live what are their choices and remember the choices are limited due to a severe lack of supply
Pay the price for the house
pay the rent for a house
stay with mam and dad
Ireland has problem lack off supply at right Price !
Only things we hear is lack of supply at 400K price
We dont hear about lack of supply at 100K price
That is the moment of truth !
Please stop measure Ireland by property price in Dublin !
When in Dublin will lack of supply of 3 beds house at 150K in County Louth this will be lack of supply
At the moment I dont see lack of supply at 150K in Dublin !0 -
neutral guy wrote: »Ireland does not have lack of supply.
Ireland has problem lack off supply at right Price !
Only things we hear is lack of supply at 400K price
We dont hear about lack of supply at 100K price
That is the moment of truth !
Please stop measure Ireland by property price in Dublin !
When in Dublin will lack of supply of 3 beds house at 150K in County Louth this will be lack of supply
At the moment I dont see lack of supply at 150K in Dublin !
Ok so we dont have a housing problem or a homeless one?
The problem is no one wants to live or very few want to live outside of the big cities so I will rephrase Ireland has a severe lack of decent supply in its higher density areas.0 -
As I said beforefliball123 wrote: »Ok so we dont have a housing problem or a homeless one?
The problem is no one wants to live or very few want to live outside of the big cities so I will rephrase Ireland has a severe lack of decent supply in its higher density areas.
We have homeless problem at 450K price
We dont have homeless problems at 150K price
The problem is price not supply
The problem is buyer not supplier0 -
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neutral guy wrote: »As I said before
We have homeless problem at 450K price
We dont have homeless problems at 150K price
The problem is price not supply
The problem is buyer not supplier
The price is the price I am afraid and if property continues to dwindle on the supply side the price will remain. Price is a factor of supply and demand0 -
Guys,I tell you how this things call
It is Corruption
The NAMA takes site from developer
AnD NAMA sell the site to another developer
Because site price from 1 million from previous developer go to 5 million to NAMA
Prices of houses built on this land go from 200K to 500K
Nama ( government ) says to builder No problem Bro,we will help you with First time Buyer program !
And lobby do them job
People buy houses with government First time buyer support
Government pay the bills on borrowing market by money from NAMA
Guys,do you still believe that miracles happen ?
Do you know how many builders will go on doll if this miracles will not happen ?0 -
neutral guy wrote: »Guys,I tell you how this things call
It is Corruption
The NAMA takes site from developer
AnD NAMA sell the site to another developer
Because site price from 1 million from previous developer go to 5 million to NAMA
Prices of houses built on this land go from 200K to 500K
Nama ( government ) says to builder No problem Bro,we will help you with First time Buyer program !
And lobby do them job
People buy houses with government First time buyer support
Government pay the bills on borrowing market by money from NAMA
Guys,do you still believe that miracles happen ?
Do you know how many builders will go on doll if this miracles will not happen ?
And it was the builders who blew up the Twin towers as well as shot JFK its a nice conspiracy theory have you any facts to back it up? I think you are giving our government way to much props for having even the intelligence to concoct what your saying.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 5888
BP selling central London offices to move to WFH hybrid:The coronavirus pandemic has led many businesses to rethink how they use their office space, with BP (BP) the latest to draw up plans to sell its headquarters.
The oil giant, which employs 6,500 staff in its London and Surrey-based offices, plans to lease the building back from the new owner for up to two years until moving out permanently, according to reports in the Sunday Times.
The report noted that BP chief Bernard Looney has previously said the FTSE 100 company will move to a more “hybrid work style,” balancing home and office working.
BP is an energy multinational. Anybody who thinks WFH is only suited to tech firms is shortsighted.
I cannot see how Dublin is going to escape a similiar a shift in policy.0 -
BP selling central London offices to move to WFH hybrid:
BP is an energy multinational. Anybody who thinks WFH is only suited to tech firms is shortsighted.
I cannot see how Dublin is going to escape a similiar a shift in policy.
Seems likely. In the case if BP and the challenges that industry will have is wonder how many of that 6.5k staff they will have in 2 years.
Also a good opportunity for BP to lease another building in London at a cheaper rent in 2 years when commercial property prices have fallen?0 -
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Hi All
Been dropping in on this thread periodically over last few months. Interesting comments-im currently right in the middle of selling/buying so i thought id throw my situation out there, what im hearing and seeing, might be of help or of interest to some of you. (il hold back some of the specifics if you dont mind!)
Im selling an apt, in a much sought after location in one of the (non-dublin) cities. Since late last year i had been thinking of selling early this year as I felt the market was leveling off, however Covid hit and put the brakes on. I was worried we were going to see a big drop in prices on the back of this-but it seems the opposite-in the short term anyways.
As soon as the restrictions were lifted I got a few agents in to value it-I had an idea of what i thought it was worth pre-covid-based on watching similar properties the previous 6 months, but really I wasnt sure what they were going to suggest.
They all came back at least 10-15% more than what i had imagined-some even suggesting 25%.
They all said that on the back of covid people have basically lost the run of themselves and are trying to cash in their mortgage approval before a second wave/potential job loss or wage cut. Seemed like madness to me.
I went with a price around 15% above what i had initially thought-as i felt some of the higher estimates were just looking to hook me and werent realistic. Here we are 3 weeks later-were almost at asking but with many more viewings booked for the coming week-not sure where it will end up. Interestingly-a lot of the bidders are investors.
The plan then is to buy a 3/4bed house a little further from the city, so on the flip side-i have had a look at a few houses but i feel are just way overpriced, (again based on keeping an eye in this are for the last 6-12months) but i guess this is not surprising. From talking to agents they seem to be largely meeting the asking prices.
I see the arguments for prices to fall and to stay the same-certainly supply at the minute seems slow, and a lot of valid points. However what I am seeing in the thick of it is there is bit of madness going on right now.
Hopefully, il be a beneficiary of that-il prob hold off and rent in the short term, and hope to get more bang for my buck early next year. Its hard to be sure where it will go-and im debating whether waiting is a good idea, but then if i ask myself-'will my current property would go for the same, or more next year?' i def would not take that risk-so i guess i answered my own question!
Interested to hear from anyone else in the middle of it?0 -
Hi All
They all said that on the back of covid people have basically lost the run of themselves and are trying to cash in their mortgage approval before a second wave/potential job loss or wage cut. Seemed like madness to me.
I went with a price around 15% above what i had initially thought-as i felt some of the higher estimates were just looking to hook me and werent realistic. Here we are 3 weeks later-were almost at asking but with many more viewings booked for the coming week-not sure where it will end up. Interestingly-a lot of the bidders are investors.
The plan then is to buy a 3/4bed house a little further from the city, so on the flip side-i have had a look at a few houses but i feel are just way overpriced, (again based on keeping an eye in this are for the last 6-12months) but i guess this is not surprising. From talking to agents they seem to be largely meeting the asking prices.
I see the arguments for prices to fall and to stay the same-certainly supply at the minute seems slow, and a lot of valid points. However what I am seeing in the thick of it is there is bit of madness going on right now.
Hopefully, il be a beneficiary of that-il prob hold off and rent in the short term, and hope to get more bang for my buck early next year. Its hard to be sure where it will go-and im debating whether waiting is a good idea, but then if i ask myself-'will my current property would go for the same, or more next year?' i def would not take that risk-so i guess i answered my own question!
Interested to hear from anyone else in the middle of it?
I’m looking to buy and was looking before covid. I found houses that were sitting for a year on the market as overpriced before covid have gone sale agreed for asking or more after covid. There is a run on houses at the moment and a lot of madness there. We didn’t feel under pressure at start of year as prices seems to level but now, when we are bidding, we usually get a counter bid within a few hours. We have been outbid a few times and finding the prices the houses got are overpriced.
I’m finding asking prices have increased and bidding is going over.
If I’m was selling, I’d want to have sold by Christmas as I don’t think there is a better time to sell than now.
I agree with your reasons for this:
1. People are afraid they will get less money next year from a bank so are cashing in on AIP
2. More people are working from home so maybe the place they are renting is no longer suitable if one or two people are working from home
3. People are worried about another lockdown and maybe want more space to want to trade up.
Supply is low and I think a lot of people are coming up against the same issue you are - they want to sell but can’t find anything to buy and do not want to go into the rental market (which is also increasing in prices in Cork).0 -
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/commercial-property/johnny-ronan-s-rivals-for-irish-glass-bottle-site-circle-as-deal-drags-1.4346026
Johnny Ronan with Colony Capital appear to have failed to close on the Glass Bottle Site deal; Colony of course defaulted on its obligations in the US a few months ago though the article does not say why this deal did not complete when it was supposed to.
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/commercial-property/aviva-tests-strength-of-market-with-80m-sale-of-royal-hibernian-way-1.4343825
Also, seems like a long time coming, before Covid was ever a thing in Ireland, property funds in Ireland and the UK had to freeze redemptions as there were runs on the funds (Green REIT seemed to get out at the peak of the market when it sold up when it did), perhaps people fearing the game was up at that stage? One of the Aviva property funds is trying to offload some assets although the reason given is to redeploy capital in other projects and not funds redemptions.
Property is an extremely risky investment and one good thing from the FG approach of the last few years was to offload the risk. We can see with commercial property, there is a significant risk of a collapse in yields and property values but luckily the risk is to investors most of whom are foreign-based which insulates the tax payer. Such a risk to commercial property could make investment in residential property more appealing which will lead to even greater supply to the residential market (as there is a lot of supply in construction and planning which is already coming onto the market (albeit mainly BTL)).0 -
Hi All
Been dropping in on this thread periodically over last few months. Interesting comments-im currently right in the middle of selling/buying so i thought id throw my situation out there, what im hearing and seeing, might be of help or of interest to some of you. (il hold back some of the specifics if you dont mind!)
Im selling an apt, in a much sought after location in one of the (non-dublin) cities. Since late last year i had been thinking of selling early this year as I felt the market was leveling off, however Covid hit and put the brakes on. I was worried we were going to see a big drop in prices on the back of this-but it seems the opposite-in the short term anyways.
As soon as the restrictions were lifted I got a few agents in to value it-I had an idea of what i thought it was worth pre-covid-based on watching similar properties the previous 6 months, but really I wasnt sure what they were going to suggest.
They all came back at least 10-15% more than what i had imagined-some even suggesting 25%.
They all said that on the back of covid people have basically lost the run of themselves and are trying to cash in their mortgage approval before a second wave/potential job loss or wage cut. Seemed like madness to me.
I went with a price around 15% above what i had initially thought-as i felt some of the higher estimates were just looking to hook me and werent realistic. Here we are 3 weeks later-were almost at asking but with many more viewings booked for the coming week-not sure where it will end up. Interestingly-a lot of the bidders are investors.
The plan then is to buy a 3/4bed house a little further from the city, so on the flip side-i have had a look at a few houses but i feel are just way overpriced, (again based on keeping an eye in this are for the last 6-12months) but i guess this is not surprising. From talking to agents they seem to be largely meeting the asking prices.
I see the arguments for prices to fall and to stay the same-certainly supply at the minute seems slow, and a lot of valid points. However what I am seeing in the thick of it is there is bit of madness going on right now.
Hopefully, il be a beneficiary of that-il prob hold off and rent in the short term, and hope to get more bang for my buck early next year. Its hard to be sure where it will go-and im debating whether waiting is a good idea, but then if i ask myself-'will my current property would go for the same, or more next year?' i def would not take that risk-so i guess i answered my own question!
Interested to hear from anyone else in the middle of it?
We're in the thick of it & I agree that the market at the moment is pretty manic. We sold before Christmas & we're happy with that because we're free to buy but it has its downside as we have small kids & are going between our parents houses.
We're bidding on a house at the moment & will most likely walk away shortly because there are other bidders & nobody is giving up! Its nuts. I'm reluctant to go back to square one but we're not going to over pay when things are so uncertain.
I don't personally see prices plummeting & think if they do drop any significant amount that it will take a couple of years to materialise. Who knows? Its a great advantage not being in a chain but it seems there are plenty in our position & with big budgets. Strange times we're living in0 -
Hi All
Been dropping in on this thread periodically over last few months. Interesting comments-im currently right in the middle of selling/buying so i thought id throw my situation out there, what im hearing and seeing, might be of help or of interest to some of you. (il hold back some of the specifics if you dont mind!)
Im selling an apt, in a much sought after location in one of the (non-dublin) cities. Since late last year i had been thinking of selling early this year as I felt the market was leveling off, however Covid hit and put the brakes on. I was worried we were going to see a big drop in prices on the back of this-but it seems the opposite-in the short term anyways.
As soon as the restrictions were lifted I got a few agents in to value it-I had an idea of what i thought it was worth pre-covid-based on watching similar properties the previous 6 months, but really I wasnt sure what they were going to suggest.
They all came back at least 10-15% more than what i had imagined-some even suggesting 25%.
They all said that on the back of covid people have basically lost the run of themselves and are trying to cash in their mortgage approval before a second wave/potential job loss or wage cut. Seemed like madness to me.
I went with a price around 15% above what i had initially thought-as i felt some of the higher estimates were just looking to hook me and werent realistic. Here we are 3 weeks later-were almost at asking but with many more viewings booked for the coming week-not sure where it will end up. Interestingly-a lot of the bidders are investors.
The plan then is to buy a 3/4bed house a little further from the city, so on the flip side-i have had a look at a few houses but i feel are just way overpriced, (again based on keeping an eye in this are for the last 6-12months) but i guess this is not surprising. From talking to agents they seem to be largely meeting the asking prices.
I see the arguments for prices to fall and to stay the same-certainly supply at the minute seems slow, and a lot of valid points. However what I am seeing in the thick of it is there is bit of madness going on right now.
Hopefully, il be a beneficiary of that-il prob hold off and rent in the short term, and hope to get more bang for my buck early next year. Its hard to be sure where it will go-and im debating whether waiting is a good idea, but then if i ask myself-'will my current property would go for the same, or more next year?' i def would not take that risk-so i guess i answered my own question!
Interested to hear from anyone else in the middle of it?
Similar situation myself, selling a house but I was shocked how much our property was valued at. It is in a so so area, agents have priced it around 15% higher than we expected and seem to expect it may get more.
We are actually looking at buying an older property and they seem to be priced a bit differently, ours is a new build and they seem to be really popular.
We considered renting as it’s inevitable there will be a drop in prices (who knows how much?) but we have a young child and we are not prepared to rent incase we can’t get back in to the market.
There are just far too many variables for any of us to really know
COVID
Brexit
Unemployment
Interest rates
Supply
Lending etc etc
For us if we find a house in an area we like and can stay in for 20 years we will go for it, otherwise we will stay put.0 -
neutral guy wrote: »In couple words the more we spend for bread the less we have for property because our wages will not growing with same speed as inflation.For that reason property prices will fall because not many people will have money..For that reason we will have deflation.
If we look at inflation/deflation curves during the recessions we will see that the more billions was printed the bigger deflation we had ! With every last recession we had bigger deflation and bigger property prices fall .
The ECB printed billions in last 10 years did not moved inflation forward.
Why ? Because money was printed for banks not for people
In this recession we will have even bigger deflation but only if government will not give money for free as they did during Covid
As far we see now the government cut people access to free money what mean we will have deflation again
The wage subsidy cut,same as other options to get free money.
Every bussines which takes free loans has serious bancruptcy risk because money has to be returned !
There has to be some explanation for the lack of inflation during QE and it would appear that by only giving it to investment banks it has inflated the stock markets and property but not much else.0 -
We're in the thick of it & I agree that the market at the moment is pretty manic. We sold before Christmas & we're happy with that because we're free to buy but it has its downside as we have small kids & are going between our parents houses.
We're bidding on a house at the moment & will most likely walk away shortly because there are other bidders & nobody is giving up! Its nuts. I'm reluctant to go back to square one but we're not going to over pay when things are so uncertain.
I don't personally see prices plummeting & think if they do drop any significant amount that it will take a couple of years to materialise. Who knows? Its a great advantage not being in a chain but it seems there are plenty in our position & with big budgets. Strange times we're living in
Luckily, we dont have kids-i can only imagine the stress!
Looking at rentals it is crazy how little there is-and were not even fussy-a studio apt in the country would do us for a few months. Very little on Daft. Worst case we can move in with the in-laws for a few months. Will worry about that when we get to it. I think its def better to get sale done and dusted asap.
BTW-had a discussion with an agent yesterday when viewing a house-he said there was about a 2 month madness period in Jun/July and that it is settling down again. He said he never seen anything like it-and this man was in his 60's.
In his opinion there is only one way that prices are going and that is down. Now im not sure why he was sharing that information with me as a potential buyer-possibly because the house i was viewing was already at asking, and they were happy with the price, and im sure he could tell i was not really interested at the asking price.
But also he just seemed like a guy who was jaded by it all, possibly soon to retire and wanted to impart a bit of friendly advice to a young fella!
Who know-hopefully though if the madness period is tapering off- there might be some value on the horizon for you soon.0 -
Not a usual source for news on the property market, but a bit of a distraction all the same.
Irish Mirror: "The most unwanted Irish homes that have been on the market for up to 13 years"
Link to Irish Mirror Article here: https://www.irishmirror.ie/lifestyle/homes-and-property/most-unwanted-irish-homes-been-226237720 -
Surely it will suit those people who are in secure employment and can comfortably afford to take on a mortgage?
i.e the banks will lend less, because there are less people in employment, but they will continue to lend affordable mortgages to people with secure incomes.
The best solution is an oversupply coupled with steady falls in a full employment economy. However, given the the Landlord party (Fine Gael) and the builders party are in power (Fianna Fáil) this is highly unlikely0 -
Join Date:Posts: 5888
Hi All
Been dropping in on this thread periodically over last few months. Interesting comments-im currently right in the middle of selling/buying so i thought id throw my situation out there, what im hearing and seeing, might be of help or of interest to some of you. (il hold back some of the specifics if you dont mind!)
Thanks for posting, interesting to hear things from sellers perspective.They all said that on the back of covid people have basically lost the run of themselves and are trying to cash in their mortgage approval before a second wave/potential job loss or wage cut.
Anecdotally this certainly seems to be happening. It's a demand shock caused by COVID that will inevitably wind down as those approvals are spent. In order for demand to remain at this level banks need to maintain these lending levels, which seems unlikely.Interestingly-a lot of the bidders are investors.
This is very interesting, as anecdotally we are told landlords leaving the market in droves. There is a decent chance these are cash rich investors which lends weight to the inflation hedging theory. Watch this space!Its hard to be sure where it will go-and im debating whether waiting is a good idea, but then if i ask myself-'will my current property would go for the same, or more next year?' i def would not take that risk-so i guess i answered my own question!
Completely agree with you. Just looking at the balance of probabilities suggests the risk is not worth it.
I'd love to be selling now, but unfortunately due to kids schooling etc it is not really a viable option. My gut is we will have to take a lower price in 2021.0 -
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Luckily, we dont have kids-i can only imagine the stress!
Looking at rentals it is crazy how little there is-and were not even fussy-a studio apt in the country would do us for a few months. Very little on Daft. Worst case we can move in with the in-laws for a few months. Will worry about that when we get to it. I think its def better to get sale done and dusted asap.
BTW-had a discussion with an agent yesterday when viewing a house-he said there was about a 2 month madness period in Jun/July and that it is settling down again. He said he never seen anything like it-and this man was in his 60's.
In his opinion there is only one way that prices are going and that is down. Now im not sure why he was sharing that information with me as a potential buyer-possibly because the house i was viewing was already at asking, and they were happy with the price, and im sure he could tell i was not really interested at the asking price.
But also he just seemed like a guy who was jaded by it all, possibly soon to retire and wanted to impart a bit of friendly advice to a young fella!
Who know-hopefully though if the madness period is tapering off- there might be some value on the horizon for you soon.
I do think its worth selling & being chain free, particularly in your position. We'll probably have to rent because the current situation isn't working for us. We'll probably get a rental as we have a friend who is a letting agent but we'll still pay dearly for it & that eats into our saving ability in the interim.
Our broker maintains that there is very little movement in our price range (trading up, 500k +) but I'd describe the situation we're in as feverish & my instincts are telling me that we should walk but we'll hang in there another little while! The EA we're dealing with has gone from pleasant but professional when we were the only bidders to arrogant & snide now that theres a bidding war..hate that but the market is far from the buyers paradise that was predicted months ago! The supply has dried up completely for our needs & location but it may pick up this month...hopefully!0 -
This is very interesting, as anecdotally we are told landlords leaving the market in droves. There is a decent chance these are cash rich investors which lends weight to the inflation hedging theory. Watch this space!
ya- im sure investors have worked out exactly what its worth and wont go any higher..-Will be interesting to see if that figure is higher or lower than the average Joe.
Maybe thats the figure we are already at now? Expect il know a lot more this time next week.
Also-i was amazed at the amount of people looking at buying for their kid(s) in college nearby. It not something i had even thought of until my agent said it, sure enough they make up a good chunk of the viewers also.
I suppose if you have the money it makes perfect sense-rather than paying their rent.0 -
Join Date:Posts: 30620
PropQueries wrote: »Not a usual source for news on the property market, but a bit of a distraction all the same.
Irish Mirror: "The most unwanted Irish homes that have been on the market for up to 13 years"
Link to Irish Mirror Article here: https://www.irishmirror.ie/lifestyle/homes-and-property/most-unwanted-irish-homes-been-22623772
The location, and the perception that they require considerable work- would seem to be the reason that some properties won't shift (even if priced appropriately) and some of those units- are simply too expensive- 280k for Valentia island- for a property in questionable condition, is just greedy.
It would seem that the prospective sellers- don't really care or have any great motivation to make an appropriate effort to sell their properties.
The one in Mayo on 21 acres @ 150k- would almost be worth the asking for the land alone- if you could think of some use for the land that didn't necessitate improbable amounts of time/input from the owner (perhaps forestry?)
So- I'd question how serious the prospective owners are about actually selling- they don't seem motivated to shift their units........0 -
This is very interesting, as anecdotally we are told landlords leaving the market in droves. There is a decent chance these are cash rich investors which lends weight to the inflation hedging theory. Watch this space!
I don't think landlords are leaving the market in their "droves" or likely entering the market in significant numbers either. I think many of the more insolvent ones got out between 2012 and 2014. I also think to make it as a landlord you do have to pay cash and purchase the property at the bottom of the market or inherit the property. Any investor buying now is most likely buying at the very top of the market.
Here's the landlord registration figures 2007 - 2020. The number of registered landlords actually increased between 2016 and 2017. Fell between 2017 and 2018. Remained fairly static between 2018 and 2019. Then fell 2% between 2019 and 2020. Hardly the avalanche of private landlords leaving the sector that some commentators want everyone to believe. It also doesn't take into account the thousands of apartments owned by REITS etc., who would be counted as one landlord instead of thousands of additional individual landlords as would have been the case prior to them entering the market.
2007: 92,000
2008: 100,000
2009: 116,577
2010: 145,000
2011: 182,000
2012: 212,000
2013: 179,000
2014: 160,000
2015: 170,000
2016: 175,250
2017: 176,946
2018: 173,951
2019: 173 675
2020: 169,593
In relation to the 2% fall between 2019 and 2020, I think it's more to do with landlords/ investors who bought investment properties between 2012 and 2014 to take advantage of the capital gains tax reliefs.
As you can see from the above, the big drop between 2012 and 2014 coincides with the landlords and other property investors who bought between 2012 and 2014 to capitalise on the capital gains tax reliefs.
That's why I think the small fall (3%) in the number of registered landlords between 2016 and 2020 is more to do with landlords/ investors who bought investment properties between 2012 and 2014 to take advantage of these capital gains tax reliefs. This tax relief only applies to properties purchased between 2012 and 2014.
They initially had to hold onto them for 7 years to take advantage of this tax relief. Two budgets ago, that was reduced to 6 years. I think this explains the slight c. 3% fall in registered landlords between 2016 and 2020.
Yes, some are selling up (3% between 2016 and 2020). But it appears to be primarily to capitalise on the tax free profit they can now crystalise and not due to the "unprofitablility" in the sector that some commentators have being peddling.0 -
Pepper Money retreats from Irish market, citing ‘challenging conditions’
"Mortgage servicing and lending firm Pepper Ireland is to cease commercial lending in Ireland, citing increasingly challenging market conditions.
The Shannon-based group, which services about 60,000 residential mortgages on behalf of third parties as well providing finance itself, informed clients it had ceased originating commercial loans here following a strategic review of operations."
Irish Times article here: https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/pepper-money-retreats-from-irish-market-citing-challenging-conditions-1.43466460 -
The commercial landlords are whose pushing the drive back to the office in the UK0
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Luckily, we dont have kids-i can only imagine the stress!
Looking at rentals it is crazy how little there is-and were not even fussy-a studio apt in the country would do us for a few months. Very little on Daft. Worst case we can move in with the in-laws for a few months. Will worry about that when we get to it. I think its def better to get sale done and dusted asap.
BTW-had a discussion with an agent yesterday when viewing a house-he said there was about a 2 month madness period in Jun/July and that it is settling down again. He said he never seen anything like it-and this man was in his 60's.
In his opinion there is only one way that prices are going and that is down. Now im not sure why he was sharing that information with me as a potential buyer-possibly because the house i was viewing was already at asking, and they were happy with the price, and im sure he could tell i was not really interested at the asking price.
But also he just seemed like a guy who was jaded by it all, possibly soon to retire and wanted to impart a bit of friendly advice to a young fella!
Who know-hopefully though if the madness period is tapering off- there might be some value on the horizon for you soon.
Are you looking in Dublin or elsewhere at rentals? I've been keeping an eye on Dublin rentals and am surprised at the high levels of 2 bed apartments that are available for "reasonable" rents - say €1600 to €1700 versus over €2k for the REITs and funds.
Anecdotal evidence but know people looking and every property they've emailed to enquire about a viewing has replied compared to when they were looking 12 months ago.
I can't see why cash investors would be flocking into the market for apartments unless they plan to rent at market rents for HAP tenancies.0 -
PropQueries wrote: »Pepper Money retreats from Irish market, citing ‘challenging conditions’
"Mortgage servicing and lending firm Pepper Ireland is to cease commercial lending in Ireland, citing increasingly challenging market conditions.
The Shannon-based group, which services about 60,000 residential mortgages on behalf of third parties as well providing finance itself, informed clients it had ceased originating commercial loans here following a strategic review of operations."
Irish Times article here: https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/pepper-money-retreats-from-irish-market-citing-challenging-conditions-1.4346646
Articles also says:"A spokesman said commercial lending accounted for less than 5 per cent of Pepper Ireland’s total revenues in 2019, and its commercial loan book had roughly 200 clients."Not exactly a major player in Ireland. I wouldn't be reading too much into this - not exactly unsurprising at this time given its not a core part of their business. Pepper also sold their residential loan book to Finance Ireland in 2018.0 -
I think we will see heavily taxed land lords and more support for those who pay rents.
For that reason more and more land lords will leave renting business.
We have understand that poverty will rising and the government will have less and less money fight against it.
The heavily property taxation is also on way,many councils will have survive because many businisses does not pay rates
I think after budget 2021 people will stop believe in bright future of property in Ireland.0 -
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I work in carpentry/cabinet making and many of us does not see any recession we are Mad busy.Hi All
Been dropping in on this thread periodically over last few months. Interesting comments-im currently right in the middle of selling/buying so i thought id throw my situation out there, what im hearing and seeing, might be of help or of interest to some of you. (il hold back some of the specifics if you dont mind!)
Im selling an apt, in a much sought after location in one of the (non-dublin) cities. Since late last year i had been thinking of selling early this year as I felt the market was leveling off, however Covid hit and put the brakes on. I was worried we were going to see a big drop in prices on the back of this-but it seems the opposite-in the short term anyways.
As soon as the restrictions were lifted I got a few agents in to value it-I had an idea of what i thought it was worth pre-covid-based on watching similar properties the previous 6 months, but really I wasnt sure what they were going to suggest.
They all came back at least 10-15% more than what i had imagined-some even suggesting 25%.
They all said that on the back of covid people have basically lost the run of themselves and are trying to cash in their mortgage approval before a second wave/potential job loss or wage cut. Seemed like madness to me.
I went with a price around 15% above what i had initially thought-as i felt some of the higher estimates were just looking to hook me and werent realistic. Here we are 3 weeks later-were almost at asking but with many more viewings booked for the coming week-not sure where it will end up. Interestingly-a lot of the bidders are investors.
The plan then is to buy a 3/4bed house a little further from the city, so on the flip side-i have had a look at a few houses but i feel are just way overpriced, (again based on keeping an eye in this are for the last 6-12months) but i guess this is not surprising. From talking to agents they seem to be largely meeting the asking prices.
I see the arguments for prices to fall and to stay the same-certainly supply at the minute seems slow, and a lot of valid points. However what I am seeing in the thick of it is there is bit of madness going on right now.
Hopefully, il be a beneficiary of that-il prob hold off and rent in the short term, and hope to get more bang for my buck early next year. Its hard to be sure where it will go-and im debating whether waiting is a good idea, but then if i ask myself-'will my current property would go for the same, or more next year?' i def would not take that risk-so i guess i answered my own question!
Interested to hear from anyone else in the middle of it?
I do research with our customers and what is really surprised me the all has the same opinions
1) We bought house because it was our last chance before we will lose jobs
2) We bought kitchen because we are on mortgage holidays
About investors with money
Some of them good investors in bitcoin but they has no understanding about investment to property
Some still believe that buying house is better than buy gold and inflation on way
Some do IT jobs and does not know what is going on in reality because they live in parallel world
Some made money on stock market because acces to invest on it the same like in USA before Great Depression and which is historicaly high position at the moment
Some just emotional and still believe media
I heard that Covid news gonna be reduced in media to create more positive people thinking.But how this gonna help when there is sign about masks on every shop door I dont know.
Any way many of as in carpentry has own opinions as well
Some believe that nothing gonna happen because they are busy as never before
Some of us waiting with horror what gonna happen when wage subsidies and mortgage holidays will be ended.0
This discussion has been closed.
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