Irish Property Market 2020 Part 2

Hubertj

PropQueries wrote: »

Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown homeowners face 15% hike in property tax due to Covid crisis.

“In effectively increasing the local property taxes in Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown, councillors have ensured that those whose homes are worth between €400,000 and €450,000 will see bills increase from €650 per year to €765.”

Link to Irish Times article here: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/dún-laoghaire-rathdown-homeowners-face-15-hike-in-property-tax-due-to-covid-crisis-1.4354899

Makes sense that the discounts should not be applied as opposed to an increase as you misrepresent. I expect the other councils to follow and hopefully property tax will be properly addressed in the next 2 years. I will end up paying a lot more but it should be done in order to properly fund the provision of public services.

awec

brisan wrote: »

According to MyHome
In the last 3 months Greystones has seen
11 price increases
36 price decreases
Overall decrease of 4%
Wicklow has seen
46 price increases
146 price decreases
Overall decrease of 3%
They are the figures in isolation
How those prices compare to last years prices or to prices in certain more desirable areas I have no idea

How many prices didn’t change?

brisan

Springy Turf wrote: »

You are dreaming...if the house prices drop by 50% we'll all be back to subsistence farming to get by.

Happened last time around
Different set of circumstances this time so I cannot see it happening
NG will be a long time waiting

brisan

Geuze wrote: »

The current recession is already in the recovery phase.

Plenty of people can afford to borrow and buy houses.

Some people can't manage to pay inflated urban rents and save for a deposit, yes.

The housing market may soften due to uncertainty, yes.

The current recession is only waking up

brisan

awec wrote: »

How many prices didn’t change?

All the rest I would assume
47 changed 35 did not

brisan

awec wrote: »

How many prices didn’t change?

All the rest I would assume

mariaalice

This thread could be a great resource for someone buying if wasn't for the fantasist, and those for whom everything is a sign of a recession.

Like it or not there is a fairly large cohort of purchasers who can pay the guts of 500k for a house.

Having a coping strategy of 'hoping it all goes wrong for them' and house prices fall and trolling a thread like this is not a good coping mechanism.

They may or may not be a recession no one can say for definite, there might be one which only has minimal effects on house prices no one can say for certain.

In my opinion, paying the gusts of 500k for a 3/4 bed sounds like a lot of money but if a couple can get a mortgae or have the money and want to do it, it's their choice.

Cyrus

brisan wrote: »

Yes asking prices dropped
They obviously dropped because no one was interested at the original asking price

indeed, people may have priced too high, doesnt mean achieved prices are falling however.

Graham

mariaalice wrote: »

This thread could be a great resource for someone buying if wasn't for the fantasist, and those for whom everything is a sign of a recession.

We have a separate thread for that: Currently buying/selling a house?

Geuze

brisan wrote: »

The current recession is only waking up

Q3 data should be released in Dec.

You seem to expect GDP to fall?

All the evidence points to GDP rising currently.

beauf

Graham wrote: »

We have a separate thread for that: Currently buying/selling a house?

There is a stark difference in narrative in that thread to this one.

timmyntc

The majority of people to suffer in this latest "recession" were the low paid - mostly retail & hospitality workers.

Why would this lead to much of a drop in house prices at all? Many of the people who lost jobs weren't really in a position to buy anyways, and if they were it would be near the bottom of the market - a segment that's not really doing to drop any lower as plenty of average wage IT workers and so on will happily make up the shortfall in demand for those types of houses.

brisan

Cyrus wrote: »

indeed, people may have priced too high, doesnt mean achieved prices are falling however.

We will have to wait up to 6 months to see what the PPR reveals
However if a house priced at 500 k drops to 475 k after a few months on the market I think it’s safe to say it did not achieve 500k sale price.
Unles 2 bidders suddenly came onto the market at the same time and both wanted the house and both were prepared to pay 500k or more for the property
However we will never know
All we can do is look at the facts on MyHome and the PPR

Pelezico

beauf wrote: »

There is a stark difference in narrative in that thread to this one.

I prefer this one with its cynicism.

mariaalice

timmyntc wrote: »

The majority of people to suffer in this latest "recession" were the low paid - mostly retail & hospitality workers.

Why would this lead to much of a drop in house prices at all? Many of the people who lost jobs weren't really in a position to buy anyways, and if they were it would be near the bottom of the market - a segment that's not really doing to drop any lower as plenty of average wage IT workers and so on will happily make up the shortfall in demand for those types of houses.

That is not true my husband is a civil engineer and had to go to London for work commuted every week and came home at the weekend, but I suppose the point is he had the qualifications and experience to get a job elsewhere. Its one of the reasons why I would be ambivalent about telling teenagers third level education does not matter follow your dream.

Pelezico

brisan wrote: »

We will have to wait up to 6 months to see what the PPR reveals
However if a house priced at 500 k drops to 475 k after a few months on the market I think it’s safe to say it did not achieve 500k sale price.
Unles 2 bidders suddenly came onto the market at the same time and both wanted the house and both were prepared to pay 500k or more for the property
However we will never know
All we can do is look at the facts on MyHome and the PPR

Are you the guy with the final salary pension and no mortgage?

You must wake up every single day congratulating yourself.

brisan

Geuze wrote: »

Q3 data should be released in Dec.

You seem to expect GDP to fall?

All the evidence points to GDP rising currently.

I expect the full force of the recession to hit when the government pulls the plug on the life support it is currently providing to the economy on the form of wage supports
Then the true unemployment rate will hit as the tourism , retail and hospitality sector lay off workers

mariaalice

brisan wrote: »

I expect the full force of the recession to hit when the government pulls the plug on the life support it is currently providing to the economy on the form of wage supports
Then the true unemployment rate will hit as the tourism , retail and hospitality sector lay off workers

I could be wrong but I doubt tourism, hospitality, and retail worker are buying houses in the 400-500k bracket.

Markitron

Guys I am not sure if we should be taking Neutral Guy seriously, seen as how he is actively trying to become a slum lord in the coming recession.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058095099

brisan

Pelezico wrote: »

Are you the guy with the final salary pension and no mortgage?

You must wake up every single day congratulating yourself.

No I congratulate my late father who guided me out of construction 38 years ago into a well paid pensionable factory job and advised to start an AVC scheme in my early 20s
What I got was not by luck but by informed choices , hard work , unsociable shifts and taking responsibility for my own actions
I bought a house when I could and sacrificed for it as most of my generation did
I didn’t sit around waiting for price drops and government help
My advice to anybody looking to buy is simple
If you find a house you like in an area you like and you can afford it then buy it now
Once you have bought it don’t look at a property website until you want to sell
It’s a home not a disposable asset.
Oh and buy the worst house in the best area you can afford

PropQueries

PropQueries wrote: »

Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown homeowners face 15% hike in property tax due to Covid crisis.

“In effectively increasing the local property taxes in Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown, councillors have ensured that those whose homes are worth between €400,000 and €450,000 will see bills increase from €650 per year to €765.”

Link to Irish Times article here: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/dún-laoghaire-rathdown-homeowners-face-15-hike-in-property-tax-due-to-covid-crisis-1.4354899

I assume the hike in the LPT has nothing to do with this story in the Irish Times several months ago titled ‘Council chairman defends Dundrum lease deal with foreign cuckoo fund’:

"The Herbert Hill apartments are now set to be used as social housing with the council reportedly paying monthly rents of some €2,000 for one-bed apartments, €2,500 for two-bed units and €3,000 for three-bed units.

However, protesters argue that rent paid by the council over the next 25 years will end up exceeding what Realis paid for the complex, which stands in a prime location next to Dundrum Town Centre."

Link to Irish Times article here: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/council-chairman-defends-dundrum-lease-deal-with-foreign-cuckoo-fund-1.4108443

brisan

mariaalice wrote: »

I could be wrong but I doubt tourism, hospitality, and retail worker are buying houses in the 400-500k bracket.

Not them all no but some are ,
Those not in those industries will have to to pay the unemployment benefit of those in those industries alongside the mortgage on their 500k property if they can afford both
If they can’t then the mortgage will have to wait because the taxes won’t
I just hope we don’t go back to 58% top rate tax and 7and a half percent PRSI again
A recession affects everybody except billionaires
Ask the Quinn family , ask Gerard Keane ,
If you think a recession will not affect you I’m sorry to inform you you’re wrong
Boris doing his best to make it worse won’t help

The_Conductor

Assetbacked wrote: »

The Dept of Finance cheif economist's report as discussed in the IT article mentioned increasing stamp duty for house purchases over €1m as one potential money grabber I saw.

Just how many homes of >€1m are sold in Ireland on an annual basis? I suspect its a very small number (I could be wrong). As a measure- I don't think this would generate meaningful government revenue- it would be a hugely populist gesture, certainly, however, other than getting plaudits in the media for taxing the wealthy- I don't see how it would that it would make much of a difference.

This is a populist measure- nothing more, nothing less.

brisan

mariaalice wrote: »

I could be wrong but I doubt tourism, hospitality, and retail worker are buying houses in the 400-500k bracket.

A bit elitist that reply
A shop worker on 30k could be married to a tech employee on 100k
Loses his/ her job and suddenly their AIP drops by 105k

Leozord

timmyntc wrote: »

Why would this lead to much of a drop in house prices at all? Many of the people who lost jobs weren't really in a position to buy anyways, and if they were it would be near the bottom of the market - a segment that's not really doing to drop any lower as plenty of average wage IT workers and so on will happily make up the shortfall in demand for those types of houses.

you are absolutely right

I work in IT myself, most of my friends bought houses in the last 9 months

having many foreigners with 6-digit salary, in uncertain times, made loads of people purchase and ensure their place in Ireland

The top-bracket earners (some foreign couples working in the sector) are getting new 600k+ houses in south Dublin without much effort. It is a common thing.

And finally, anecdotally no IT professional was made redundant during covid, in fact it was quite the opposite: loads of job offers from remote workers. Some of the lads moved down to Tip, Tullamore, Lucan and are settled.

beauf

Leozord wrote: »

you are absolutely right

I work in IT myself, most of my friends bought houses in the last 9 months

having many foreigners with 6-digit salary, in uncertain times, made loads of people purchase and ensure their place in Ireland

The top-bracket earners (some foreign couples working in the sector) are getting new 600k+ houses in south Dublin without much effort. It is a common thing.

And finally, anecdotally no IT professional was made redundant during covid, in fact it was quite the opposite: loads of job offers from remote workers. Some of the lads moved down to Tip, Tullamore, Lucan and are settled.

That's not true. I know some IT worked who are in the travel and similar industries, they were all let go. That said some are back working with other companies hired and onboared all remotely. WFH.

hometruths

The_Conductor wrote: »

Just how many homes of >€1m are sold in Ireland on an annual basis? I suspect its a very small number (I could be wrong). As a measure- I don't think this would generate meaningful government revenue- it would be a hugely populist gesture, certainly, however, other than getting plaudits in the media for taxing the wealthy- I don't see how it would that it would make much of a difference.

This is a populist measure- nothing more, nothing less.

Leozord

beauf wrote: »

That's not true. I know some IT worked who are in the travel and similar industries, they were all let go. That said some are back working with other companies hired and onboared all remotely. WFH.

yeah, my bad

I should have be more specific: IT sector instead of IT professionals, so internet companies, services etc are doing great. FANGS specially.

highly affected industries (travel for eg) surely made loads redundant

mariaalice

A lot of how of how got the house we have now was just luck, I wouldn't have had a clue about planning for the future in my twenties, I do feel sorry for people who see houses getting out of there price range.

Pelezico

mariaalice wrote: »

A lot of how of how got the house we have now was just luck, I wouldn't have had a clue about planning for the future in my twenties, I do feel sorry for people who see houses getting out of there price range.

Feeling sorry for someone is a great way of feeling superior. Fair play to you.