Irish Property Market 2020 Part 2

Hubertj

Reversal wrote: »

How does the year as a whole compare? Considering lockdown effects will have compressed mortgage approvals into the months brokers and banks are actually open.

"mortgage approvals are down by 19 per cent in volume terms and 14 per cent in value terms in the first ten months of 2020 compared with the same period in 2019"

So despite the spin, there are less mortgage approved buyers out there than there was in 2019.

Considering what has happened this year I thought there would be been a far bigger decline.
Also whether desire gets mortgage approved or not the ability to purchase depends on availability and affordability. How many approved will be able to buy is the real measure I think

Cyrus

three putt wrote: »

All the houses in the new development in Prospect Hill, Blackrock seem to have been sold (all post Covid). Prices were in the 950k - €1.1m range. Few appearing on the price register, seems like all sold at - or very close to - listing prices.

do you know how many units they had?

nice development that.

Enderely in dalkey was a little different in that the prices ranged from 2.5m to 1m so some big expensive ones to offload.

nerrad01

Yara Rich Camouflage wrote: »

https://twitter.com/paulodonoghue93/status/1333717399087017986

Dublin rental market still going strong at least

I dont even know where to begin with that, the worst thing is it says let agreed :eek:

three putt

Cyrus wrote: »

do you know how many units they had?

nice development that.

Enderely in dalkey was a little different in that the prices ranged from 2.5m to 1m so some big expensive ones to offload.

7 houses in total, all are sold post Covid. Few of them on the property price register already.
Yeah, smashing development - as new build go, one of the nicer ones, both in terms of location and finish.
Instead of big concrete apartment blocks, they have Prospect House - a protected structure, and a beautiful building - converted into apartments.

Villa05

Yara Rich Camouflage wrote: »

https://twitter.com/paulodonoghue93/status/1333717399087017986

Dublin rental market still going strong at least

Would there be fire safety issues with having a bed in a kitchen. Is this legal?
The letting agency proudly display PSR Licence number

Yara Rich Camouflage

Yara Rich Camouflage wrote: »

Dublin rental market still going strong at least

Ah it's not though!
There are so many places just empty all year. I don't know but it must not matter to some people / companies that they are empty.

Cyrus

three putt wrote: »

7 houses in total, all are sold post Covid. Few of them on the property price register already.
Yeah, smashing development - as new build go, one of the nicer ones, both in terms of location and finish.
Instead of big concrete apartment blocks, they have Prospect House - a protected structure, and a beautiful building - converted into apartments.

yes i popped in for a nosey one day, its a similar scheme to the neptune house on then but with less houses and imo more attractive.

great location too.

cubatahavana

Yara Rich Camouflage wrote: »

https://twitter.com/paulodonoghue93/status/1333717399087017986

Dublin rental market still going strong at least

That toilet roll gonna get soggy

Pete123456

cubatahavana wrote: »

That toilet roll gonna get soggy

Ad is gone now it seems...

PropQueries

Looks like the state is still funding the development of office blocks and high-end apartments in Dublin and these are just in the past month. Given that Google recently pulled out of the sorting office and the OPW recently stated that they were examining all their office leases expiring over the next 5 years, it hardly appears to be worthwhile for the state to be still funding such developments. The same would go for the state funding more high-end apartments given how many are lying empty across the city IMO

According to the Irish Times:

"Developer Pat Crean’s Marlet Property Group has secured its first financing facility with State-backed lender Activate Capital. The loan for €101 million will be used by Marlet to fund the construction of its Shipping Office scheme on Sir John Rogerson’s Quay in Dublin’s south docklands. The latest deal comes just three weeks after the developer secured €74 million from another State-backed entity, Home Building Finance Ireland, to fund the construction of the 253 apartments it has planned for Green Acre Grange at Dundrum, south Dublin."

Link to article in the Irish Times here: https://www.irishtimes.com/business/commercial-property/marlet-secures-101m-from-state-backed-lender-for-dublin-docklands-offices-1.4414050

This is way too familiar to the boom years where the state lost untold millions in high profile property development speculation e.g. the docklands authority etc.

Villa05

The Irish government mantra

Sell low buy high

Funded from your taxes


Nuts to be investing in commercial Real Estate in the current environment

The same crowd are funding development in montrose, is that the rte land

PropQueries

Villa05 wrote: »

The Irish government mantra

Sell low buy high

Funded from your taxes


Nuts to be investing in commercial Real Estate in the current environment

The same crowd are funding development in montrose, is that the rte land

According to Activate Capital's website, they did provide €50 million to Cairn Homes to buy that site off RTE. The DCC then bought 61 of those apartments for €30 million before a sod was turned. Couldn't make it up.

Basically, in many cases, the taxpayer appears to be funding the purchase of the sites, then probably helps fund the development costs and then buys or leases the completed units. And they say the state can't manage the building of homes at scale.

According to Activate Capital's website "Activate Capital was founded in 2015 to address the shortage of debt capital available for property development in the Irish market. Benefitting from strong financial backing from the Ireland Strategic Investment Fund ("ISIF") and KKR, to date we have committed more than €950m across 58 sites with capacity to deliver over 14,500 homes. We take pride in this achievement."

Cyrus

PropQueries wrote: »

According to Activate Capital's website, they did provide €50 million to Cairn Homes to buy that site off RTE. The DCC then bought 61 of those apartments for €30 million before a sod was turned. Couldn't make it up.

Basically, in many cases, the taxpayer appears to be funding the purchase of the sites, then probably helps fund the development costs and then buys or leases the completed units. And they say the state can't manage the building of homes at scale.

According to Activate Capital's website "Activate Capital was founded in 2015 to address the shortage of debt capital available for property development in the Irish market. Benefitting from strong financial backing from the Ireland Strategic Investment Fund ("ISIF") and KKR, to date we have committed more than €950m across 58 sites with capacity to deliver over 14,500 homes. We take pride in this achievement."

lending to property and buying property isnt the same as physically building property, what about the above leads you to think the state can manage building homes at scale?

and one assumes money lent will be repaid with interest.

Smouse156

three putt wrote: »

All the houses in the new development in Prospect Hill, Blackrock seem to have been sold (all post Covid). Prices were in the 950k - €1.1m range. Few appearing on the price register, seems like all sold at - or very close to - listing prices.

If they are all “gone” as the agent claims yet haven’t appeared on the PPR then they are only reserved (the ones not on PPR). Reserved means a €10k fully refundable booking deposit which is basically an expression of interest. Could be dependent on their own houses selling first which is often the case. Many will come back on the market. My friend reserved a house in July and isn’t signing contracts till Jan.

Cyrus

Smouse156 wrote: »

If they are all “gone” as the agent claims yet haven’t appeared on the PPR then they are only reserved

this a simplistic interpretation, it can take some time from a sale closing to it appearing on the PPR.

brisan

Cyrus wrote: »

this a simplistic interpretation, it can take some time from a sale closing to it appearing on the PPR.

Is there a legal requirement on the time given to register a sale on the PPR ?

Hulk Hands

Hubertj wrote: »

If you’re looking to randomers on boards for advice on making the biggest purchase if your life then don’t buy. This thread is nearly as bad as some of the stuff on Covid. Mad stuff altogether.

And yet you've 887 posts in these Accommodation threads since April. If they're so full of muppets, as you say repeatedly, why do you check back in multiple times every day?

Cyrus

brisan wrote: »

Is there a legal requirement on the time given to register a sale on the PPR ?

yes, its linked to the stamp duty return so whatever the time frame around that is, i think its 4 weeks.

the Residential Property Price Register is produced by the Property Services Regulatory Authority (PSRA) pursuant to section 86 of the Property Services (Regulation) Act 2011. It includes Date of Sale, Price and Address of all residential properties purchased in Ireland since the 1st January 2010, as declared to the Revenue Commissioners for stamp duty purposes.

so 4 weeks after the whole sale procedure closes, could be 4 months after sale agreed at that rate.

JimmyVik

Cyrus wrote: »

yes, its linked to the stamp duty return so whatever the time frame around that is, i think its 4 weeks.

the Residential Property Price Register is produced by the Property Services Regulatory Authority (PSRA) pursuant to section 86 of the Property Services (Regulation) Act 2011. It includes Date of Sale, Price and Address of all residential properties purchased in Ireland since the 1st January 2010, as declared to the Revenue Commissioners for stamp duty purposes.

so 4 weeks after the whole sale procedure closes, could be 4 months after sale agreed at that rate.

Someone bought the house next door to my parents over a year ago now.
Of course we are dying to see what it was bought for, but it still isnt on the property price register, over a year later. Beginning to wonder if it will ever appear .

Cyrus

JimmyVik wrote: »

Someone bought the house next door to my parents over a year ago now.
Of course we are dying to see what it was bought for, but it still isnt on the property price register, over a year later. Beginning to wonder if it will ever appear .

check variants of spelling, adress in irish, etc etc,

JimmyVik

Cyrus wrote: »

check variants of spelling, adress in irish, etc etc,

We have gone through everything in the county, such are the nosy bunch we are

Cyrus

JimmyVik wrote: »

We have gone through everything in the county, such are the nosy bunch we are

thats odd then i must say, assume they have moved in so you would assume the sale has closed.

Smouse156

Cyrus wrote: »

this a simplistic interpretation, it can take some time from a sale closing to it appearing on the PPR.

Simplistic yes but it’s all the data one can believe. Can’t believe the EA bull**** “buy now or gone tomorrow”. Sure I had an EA tell me all the houses were “gone” in Daneswell Place only for 4 of them to reappear. Looking at PPR, there is still 11 unsold, 9 of these are “gone”.

Sesame

Cyrus wrote: »

thats odd then i must say, assume they have moved in so you would assume the sale has closed.

County wrong too, I noticed. If you enter Waterford in to the address and search by Cork, there are results for this year.
I'd leave out county and search by variations on the address.

Cyrus

Smouse156 wrote: »

Simplistic yes but it’s all the data one can believe. Can’t believe the EA bull**** “buy now or gone tomorrow”. Sure I had an EA tell me all the houses were “gone” in Daneswell Place only for 4 of them to reappear. Looking at PPR, there is still 11 unsold, 9 of these are “gone”.

they may or may not be unsold, they could conceivably be sold or at least have contracts signed and not be on the PPR either.

JimmyVik

Cyrus wrote: »

thats odd then i must say, assume they have moved in so you would assume the sale has closed.

For sale sign went up. Sale agree sign went up.
And then they moved in over a year ago, so we've been having a nose ever since.

Timing belt

Cyrus wrote: »

lending to property and buying property isnt the same as physically building property, what about the above leads you to think the state can manage building homes at scale?

and one assumes money lent will be repaid with interest.

Unfortunately it doesn’t look like the state can build houses. You just need to look at the social housing than went up in west Dublin a couple of years ago and the general acceptance of paying protection money to gangsters. Unfortunately when the state build it is seen as a gravy train with everyone looking for their piece of pie.

Bass Reeves

Mortgage approvals are streaking ahead. For all the talk and posting that banks would stop lending or reduce approval numbers it seems this is not happening. The mortgage values are about 10k ahead of similar mortgage rates last year. Mortgages numbers are about 35 percent ahead of last year. Hard to see prices falling in the short term and would indicate that supply will remain an issue.

https://www.bpfi.ie/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/BPFI-Mortgage-Approvals-Report-October-2020.pdf

woejus

JimmyVik wrote: »

For sale sign went up. Sale agree sign went up.
And then they moved in over a year ago, so we've been having a nose ever since.

Check if the registered title changed on the folio. It may give you the actual property name, which then should be on the price registry. You may need to pay €5 for your trouble, seems like it might be worth it to you :pac:

https://www.landdirect.ie/

PropQueries

According to the Irish Times today AIB will be vacating 3 of its 6 head office locations in Dublin as the leases expire:

"AIB earlier this week completed the exit from its former headquarters at Bankcentre, Ballsbridge and will leave adjacent premises at Hume House on 31 December. It is planning to vacate a further three of its six remaining Dublin head office locations as leases come up for renewal over the next few years.

Due to service overlaps in three urban areas, the bank will merge a small number of branches, all in close proximity to one another in Dublin, Cork and Galway in the first half of next year. In Dublin, AIB’s Westmoreland Street operations will move to its Dame Street branch; the Crumlin Cross branch to Crumlin Road and 52 Baggot Street to 1-4 Baggot Street. Eyre Square will move to Lynch’s Castle in Galway; and Patrick Street branch to 66, South Mall, Cork."

This follows a report last month that PTSB will surrender the lease on its Park Place offices when it expires in April 2021. Earlier this year, BOI said it would be looking at exiting its lease at the Burlington Plaza 2 premises, which had about 700 people working there but I think Amazon was looking at leasing that space.

Link to the Irish Times article on AIB leases here: https://www.irishtimes.com/business/financial-services/aib-plans-further-150m-cost-cuts-to-hit-delayed-financial-target-1.4425366