Handicap Question

You can't get around people fudging the system to begin with. If they have no handicap from elsewhere and nobody has any knowledge of their playing prowess or lack of it. That is why most Clubs restrict winning of majors in a players first year.

In terms of allocation the 3 cards are input into Golfnet and a suggested handicap is given to the handicap secretary. I am sure there is a fancy formula or algorithm at work in the background to do this. They may or may not choose this suggested handicap or amend slightly based on their knowledge.

Like everything with Golf there is a trust element that the person submitting the cards is playing to the best of their ability at the time.

prawnsambo

Exactly wrote: »

You can't get around people fudging the system to begin with. If they have no handicap from elsewhere and nobody has any knowledge of their playing prowess or lack of it. That is why most Clubs restrict winning of majors in a players first year.

In terms of allocation the 3 cards are input into Golfnet and a suggested handicap is given to the handicap secretary. I am sure there is a fancy formula or algorithm at work in the background to do this. They may or may not choose this suggested handicap or amend slightly based on their knowledge.

Like everything with Golf there is a trust element that the person submitting the cards is playing to the best of their ability at the time.

We require three qualifiers before being able to win a 'major' or medal. A lot of clubs do. The instances I'm seeing are all existing members in the 20 ish HC range who just struggled last year, but with the practice and lessons in recent weeks showing big improvements. Would be very uncomfortable classifying them as 'fudging'.

Initial handicap allocation is done automatically by the software (HowDidIDo etc.), not GolfNet, once the requisite number of cards are entered. At which point the handicap committee looks at it and 'tweaks' it based on the member's previous experience and (where possible) observation. It's very rare that what the software produces isn't adjusted slightly by the committee. It's never going to be perfect, but big scores will get big cuts.

Golf is my Game

prawnsambo wrote: »

Another factor here is the long break between qualifying competitions. We had no qualifying competitions before lockdown as the ground was too wet and placing everywhere. So you have the double whammy of no qualifying, almost daily practice before qualifying started back and lots of lads getting waaay better in the interim due to lots of practice and lessons.

It'll sort itself out very quickly though. Some big cuts going around.

Non qualifying comps shouldn't influence things. But again, If, the handicap sec his doing his job. You should be adjusting handicaps whether qualifying or not if their is a pattern, and in the middle of the winter you have the annual review. Winter leagues, hampers, winter scrambles, and the likes even though frequently no qualifying should always prokoke a few adjustments.

prawnsambo

Golf is my Game wrote: »

Non qualifying comps shouldn't influence things. But again, If, the handicap sec his doing his job. You should be adjusting handicaps whether qualifying or not if their is a pattern, and in the middle of the winter you have the annual review. Winter leagues, hampers, winter scrambles, and the likes even though frequently no qualifying should always prokoke a few adjustments.

You can't adjust a player's official handicap based on the results from non-qualifying competitions. Yes, you can make an end of year adjustment or any other handicap review and you can take NQ scores into account when making them. But they have to be reasonable and the scores returned have to stand out as exceptional against the rest of the field or the player's playing history.

But handicapping wasn't why I mentioned NQ competitions. It's because of the conditions that made them NQ in the first place. It was very wet and scores as a result were actually unusually low. Balls being lost in very soft fairways, high winds making the course play long etc.

PARlance

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You can't get around people fudging the system to begin with. If they have no handicap from elsewhere and nobody has any knowledge of their playing prowess or lack of it. That is why most Clubs restrict winning of majors in a players first year.

In terms of allocation the 3 cards are input into Golfnet and a suggested handicap is given to the handicap secretary. I am sure there is a fancy formula or algorithm at work in the background to do this. They may or may not choose this suggested handicap or amend slightly based on their knowledge.

Like everything with Golf there is a trust element that the person submitting the cards is playing to the best of their ability at the time.

I wasn't suggesting any fudging, think there's lots of reasons for big cuts in these circumstances. I was just surprised by the "generosity"* of our HC Sec though, but the new (to me) double par method would account for that. Bit of a daft change imo.

I know a few guys that handed in mid 90's cards. They were given 22-24HC which would have been 18ish under the old system but correct under this double par method.

REFLINE1

OP i was in a similar situation. Submitted three cards of 100, 102 and 105. Got given 26. (Par 71). Played first comp yesterday and scored 31 points.

Golf is my Game

PARlance wrote: »

I wasn't suggesting any fudging, think there's lots of reasons for big cuts in these circumstances. I was just surprised by the "generosity"* of our HC Sec though, but the new (to me) double par method would account for that. Bit of a daft change imo.

I know a few guys that handed in mid 90's cards. They were given 22-24HC which would have been 18ish under the old system but correct under this double par method.

I don't think you get that really. From the ones I done over the last couple of years I don't think I seen it move more than a shot in practice even though I thought it might lead to mad handicaps when they brought it in. When you look at your only taking their best card anyway and while there might be a few more than doubles in some cards, the one you use for the calculation might have none or one of them. The ones it made a difference to that I seen were only the very high ones from total beginners where they shot a 109 or something and so you end up giving them 32 or something when it would have been 28 before and are usually lads a long long way from featuring in a competition. I don't think it happens like you say. HC secs are never generous anyway, they just apply the mathematic, but as I said before where they slip up is not making quick correction soon enough with new lads like they should as we seen here where even keen golf people involved in the game didn't really know about it.

GreeBo

REFLINE1 wrote: »

OP i was in a similar situation. Submitted three cards of 100, 102 and 105. Got given 26. (Par 71). Played first comp yesterday and scored 31 points.

That would seem within the norm to me, I'm sure you can think of a bunch of places you could have saved 3-4 shots.

REFLINE1

GreeBo wrote: »

That would seem within the norm to me, I'm sure you can think of a bunch of places you could have saved 3-4 shots.

I've thought of very little else since i left the course. The golf bug has well and truly been caught But yes, could fairly easily have scored mid 30s.

REFLINE1

REFLINE1 wrote: »

I've thought of very little else since i left the course. The golf bug has well and truly been caught But yes, could fairly easily have scored mid 30s.

The higher your handicap the less consistent you are (normally) and play to your handicap less frequently compared to a lower handicap.

If you have the bug though I'm sure the handicap won't be long dropping.

Golf is my Game

REFLINE1 wrote: »

OP i was in a similar situation. Submitted three cards of 100, 102 and 105. Got given 26. (Par 71). Played first comp yesterday and scored 31 points.

That's probably spot on.

REFLINE1

Exactly wrote: »

The higher your handicap the less consistent you are (normally) and play to your handicap less frequently compared to a lower handicap.

If you have the bug though I'm sure the handicap won't be long dropping.

yes ive no complaints, seems fair to me. if i stopped 3 or 4 putting almost every hole it would help!

youcancallmeal

REFLINE1 wrote: »

OP i was in a similar situation. Submitted three cards of 100, 102 and 105. Got given 26. (Par 71). Played first comp yesterday and scored 31 points.

I got the exact same around late 2018 when I joined a club for the first time. Then winter league kicked in so no qualifying comps for 3 months, I played a lot during this time and improved dramatically. I won several competitions in 2019 and got my handicap down to 17. Came 3rd in golfer of the year standings. Anecdotally they now never give out handicaps like that any more because of me and another guy in a similar situation who actually won goty(He went from 25 to 15 last summer). Every new member I've played with in the last 9 months or so are saying the same thing, they've been given a low handicap they can't play to.

prawnsambo

youcancallmeal wrote: »

I got the exact same around late 2018 when I joined a club for the first time. Then winter league kicked in so no qualifying comps for 3 months, I played a lot during this time and improved dramatically. I won several competitions in 2019 and got my handicap down to 17. Came 3rd in golfer of the year standings. Anecdotally they now never give out handicaps like that any more because of me and another guy in a similar situation who actually won goty(He went from 25 to 15 last summer). Every new member I've played with in the last 9 months or so are saying the same thing, they've been given a low handicap they can't play to.

This really annoys me. I hear the same talk you mention above in my club from time to time about the danger of new members getting too big a handicap and I always give the same answer (although this will soon be moot): It's easy to correct a too high handicap, but a lot harder to correct a too low one. Lads dragging around the course, never getting more than twenty odd points will get p1ssed off and be minded to quit. It can literally take years for a mistake like that to self-correct unless the handicap committee decide to give them a few shots at the annual review. And in my experience, that's as rare as hen's teeth.

Fotish

I have just become an Away member of another club.
I now have two swipe cards , mo Home card and my Away card.

Does anyone know which card I should use when playing at my Away club.?

I need to know that my handicp will be maintained properly , obviously my Home
club is responsible for my Handicap.

dddmor

Hi everyone,

Quick question, I was playing off 12.5 and scored 40 points with SSS being 36 so I should be cut 4 units.
I believe 12.5 is the last bracket you get cut 0.3's

Will it work like this or have I got it wrong??

1 X 0.3 = 12.2
3 x 0.2 = 11.6

spacecoyote

dddmor wrote: »

Hi everyone,

Quick question, I was playing off 12.5 and scored 40 points with SSS being 36 so I should be cut 4 units.
I believe 12.5 is the last bracket you get cut 0.3's

Will it work like this or have I got it wrong??

1 X 0.3 = 12.2
3 x 0.2 = 11.6

It's actually the CSS that will determine the cuts, but assuming that's 36 too then you're correct

Seve OB

Fotish wrote: »

I have just become an Away member of another club.
I now have two swipe cards , mo Home card and my Away card.

Does anyone know which card I should use when playing at my Away club.?

I need to know that my handicp will be maintained properly , obviously my Home
club is responsible for my Handicap.

Home club card.
Put the away one in a drawer...... only useful if there is bar credit or something associated with it

prawnsambo

Fotish wrote: »

I have just become an Away member of another club.
I now have two swipe cards , mo Home card and my Away card.

Does anyone know which card I should use when playing at my Away club.?

I need to know that my handicp will be maintained properly , obviously my Home
club is responsible for my Handicap.

Use two numbers (cards) and you are effectively playing off two handicaps. Depending on how your home club view that when they find out (and they will), it could be a handicap suspension. Not suggesting that you would do that, but others reading this might not know what's involved. Your home club maintains your handicap record. You can only have one.

Ottoman_1000

Apologies if I am hijacking this thread. But I have a new member playing a casual 18 holes with me this evening and he asked me to mark his card so he can put it towards his lot for his handicap. How many strokes beyond par is he allowed before I tell him to pick it up? is a treble bogie the max on each hole?

Seve OB

Ottoman_1000 wrote: »

Apologies if I am hijacking this thread. But I have a new member playing a casual 18 holes with me this evening and he asked me to mark his card so he can put it towards his lot for his handicap. How many strokes beyond par is he allowed before I tell him to pick it up? is a treble bogie the max on each hole?

you seem to assume he is sh1te
just let him finish out everything, i think thats what you are supposed to do when getting a handicap (but stand to be corrected)

18 trebles is 54 over. thats the max handicap, but he won't get it if he shoots 18 trebles. if he shoots 18 10's then he might be in the running for a 54.