Polish Presidential election

kooreczka

I grew up in rural Poland in a good home with catholic values. I've seen how badly gay people were treated and when I realised I was gay myself I wanted give up and die as it was totally unacceptable to be gay in Poland. I decided to leave when graduated from college. I live in Ireland for last 14 years and not planning to go back home even though I miss it badly. Choosing Duda for president seems like nothing changed for passed 14 years and will not change in the neartest future, sadly.
As per previous comments I just love how PiS supporters point at muslim countries being worse than Poland. They are not in Europe and have different values altogether. Typical politics of what PiS does in Poland to turn head from real problem and point out on something else/worse and their problem doesn't seem so bad then. This is a huge problem young people will commit suicides because of lack of tolerance and resoursces to deal with their indentity in the "lgbt free zones" and the sad part is this is so avoidalbe. Duda is not a president for everyone he is not even sticking to his own mind he will sign everything Kaczynski ask for and politics of hate is what they do. Wonder who they gonna target in next election...

strandroad

kooreczka wrote: »

I grew up in rural Poland in a good home with catholic values. I've seen how badly gay people were treated and when I realised I was gay myself I wanted give up and die as it was totally unacceptable to be gay in Poland. I decided to leave when graduated from college. I live in Ireland for last 14 years and not planning to go back home even though I miss it badly. Choosing Duda for president seems like nothing changed for passed 14 years and will not change in the neartest future, sadly.
As per previous comments I just love how PiS supporters point at muslim countries being worse than Poland. They are not in Europe and have different values altogether. Typical politics of what PiS does in Poland to turn head from real problem and point out on something else/worse and their problem doesn't seem so bad then. This is a huge problem young people will commit suicides because of lack of tolerance and resoursces to deal with their indentity in the "lgbt free zones" and the sad part is this is so avoidalbe. Duda is not a president for everyone he is not even sticking to his own mind he will sign everything Kaczynski ask for and politics of hate is what they do. Wonder who they gonna target in next election...

I'm sorry it happened to you and I hope that Ireland offers you a better life. It's hard to read the posts above, extolling the virtues of a country for treating its own like it's treated you.

Edgware

Poland Hungary Netherlands Austria are all E.U. countries signed up to European ideals of human rights etc.
Poland and Hungary have governments whose main aim is to max benefits from the E.U. without abiding by Europeans laws. Austria and The Netherlands have been moving more to the right and taking strong antiim imimmigrant stances

Dyr

Edgware wrote: »

Poland Hungary Netherlands Austria are all E.U. countries signed up to European ideals of human rights etc.
Poland and Hungary have governments whose main aim is to max benefits from the E.U. without abiding by Europeans laws. Austria and The Netherlands have been moving more to the right and taking strong antiim imimmigrant stances

What are these European Ideals?

Bonniedog

Edgware wrote: »

Poland Hungary Netherlands Austria are all E.U. countries signed up to European ideals of human rights etc.
Poland and Hungary have governments whose main aim is to max benefits from the E.U. without abiding by Europeans laws. Austria and The Netherlands have been moving more to the right and taking strong antiim imimmigrant stances

What is "right wing" about immigration control? Main beneficiaries from lack of controls are low wage employers. As evidenced in Leicester slavery scandal which seems to have been missed by the BLM brigade.

Do many migrants move to Cuba or North Korea or China? Not that anyone would wish to but they wouldn't be allowed anyway!

All the former socialist states hardly let anyone leave, never mind come to live in them!

Frankie Machine

kooreczka wrote: »

I grew up in rural Poland in a good home with catholic values. I've seen how badly gay people were treated and when I realised I was gay myself I wanted give up and die as it was totally unacceptable to be gay in Poland. I decided to leave when graduated from college. I live in Ireland for last 14 years and not planning to go back home even though I miss it badly. Choosing Duda for president seems like nothing changed for passed 14 years and will not change in the neartest future, sadly.
As per previous comments I just love how PiS supporters point at muslim countries being worse than Poland. They are not in Europe and have different values altogether. Typical politics of what PiS does in Poland to turn head from real problem and point out on something else/worse and their problem doesn't seem so bad then. This is a huge problem young people will commit suicides because of lack of tolerance and resoursces to deal with their indentity in the "lgbt free zones" and the sad part is this is so avoidalbe. Duda is not a president for everyone he is not even sticking to his own mind he will sign everything Kaczynski ask for and politics of hate is what they do. Wonder who they gonna target in next election...

You say it was 'totally unacceptable' to be gay in Poland, yet in 2011 Poland swore in an openly gay member (Robert Biedron) of the Sejm, and an openly transsexual one (Anna Grodzka).

Interestingly, (with reference to the voting map already posted here), Biedron comes from a small town in Podkarpackie, right on the southeastern tip of Poland.

But certainly coming from a rural place, whether Poland or Ireland or anywhere else, is always going to be more difficult for anyone who stands out.

As to your comments about Muslim countries not being in Europe and having 'different values altogether', well, that is what Dominik Tarczynski has been saying, to the dismay of the EU.

Bonniedog

Bonniedog wrote: »

What is "right wing" about immigration control? Main beneficiaries from lack of controls are low wage employers. As evidenced in Leicester slavery scandal which seems to have been missed by the BLM brigade.

Do many migrants move to Cuba or North Korea or China? Not that anyone would wish to but they wouldn't be allowed anyway!

All the former socialist states hardly let anyone leave, never mind come to live in them!

There were literal nazis marching the streets last year. It's become an annual event.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-poland-independence-march/polish-far-right-groups-march-on-independence-anniversary-idUSKBN1XL22R

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/11/polish-officials-march-nationalists-independence-day-181111093227508.html

weldoninhio

[Deleted User] wrote: »

There were literal nazis marching the streets last year. It's become an annual event.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-poland-independence-march/polish-far-right-groups-march-on-independence-anniversary-idUSKBN1XL22R

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/11/polish-officials-march-nationalists-independence-day-181111093227508.html

Patriotism is a crime now.

Frankie Machine

Deleted User wrote: »

There were literal nazis marching the streets last year. It's become an annual event.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-poland-independence-march/polish-far-right-groups-march-on-independence-anniversary-idUSKBN1XL22R

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/11/polish-officials-march-nationalists-independence-day-181111093227508.html

But happily, according to your own link...

The march was dissolved (...) due to hate-speech (anti-Semitism)... the vice-president of the Wroclaw City Council, Bartlomiej Ciazynski, wrote on Facebook, adding that several hundred people took part in the march.

I personally didn't see any of that element in Katowice last November.

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

Patriotism is a crime now.

This the sort of patriotism you're aiming for?

The procession marks the first time Polish officials took part in the "Independence March" - an event that tends to feature racist, anti-immigrant, homophobic and white supremacist slogans.

Frankie Machine wrote: »

But happily, according to your own link...


I personally didn't see any of that element in Katowice last November.

That was a separate march...

weldoninhio

[Deleted User] wrote: »

This the sort of patriotism you're aiming for?




That was a separate march...

You missed the next paragraph.

“Most participants at this year's event were peaceful, raising the Polish flag and chanting patriotic slogans.

"We are here because we are patriots," said Elzbieta, 57, from Warsaw. "This is a beautiful day."

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

You missed the next paragraph.

“Most participants at this year's event were peaceful, raising the Polish flag and chanting patriotic slogans.

"We are here because we are patriots," said Elzbieta, 57, from Warsaw. "This is a beautiful day."

Regardless, the march has been operating under those ideals since 2010. If you browse photos of the event you'll even find swastikas..

Frankie Machine

Deleted User wrote: »

That was a separate march...

I meant that I did not personally see any sign of that element in Katowice at all, that weekend.

1800_Ladladlad

spurious wrote: »

A Polish friend tonight described it as putting Poland back 40 years.

A polish mate of mine does not share that sentiment at all. He is delighted

weldoninhio

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Regardless, the march has been operating under those ideals since 2010. If you browse photos of the event you'll even find swastikas..

Want a hand with the goalposts??

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

Want a hand with the goalposts??

I never mentioned violence. So what goalposts have moved? You referenced patriotism and I pointed out what the event is known for. If anything you moved the goalposts, the relevance of far right nationalists being peaceful doesn't negate what the march represents.

Bonniedog

Any Pole waving a Swastika at an independence rally would be as welcome as a union jack at the GPO for a republican Easter rally.

Collaboration with the Nazis was far rarer in Poland than in some great European states like France, and where the penalties were far more severe.

Bonniedog

Deleted User wrote: »

I never mentioned violence. So what goalposts have moved? You referenced patriotism and I pointed out what the event is known for. If anything you moved the goalposts, the relevance of far right nationalists being peaceful doesn't negate what the march represents.

Ponder for a moment why Polish nationalists, right, left or centre might not be exactly enamoured of Nazism

Cordell

weldoninhio wrote: »

Patriotism is a crime now.

No, it's not. But it's often used as a justification for committing crimes.
Patriots aim to make their country a better place, and these people will do the opposite, if they will have their way the country will be a worse place for everyone including themselves.
Let's take for example Ireland and Poland, I think it's obvious which country is better and which one is moving in the right direction. Those people marching want Poland to move in the opposite direction.

Bonniedog

Bonniedog wrote: »

Ponder for a moment why Polish nationalists, right, left or centre might not be exactly enamoured of Nazism

Below is an excerpt from an eu discussion on banning fascist and neo nazi rallies.

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-8-2018-0428_EN.html?redirect

whereas in November 2017 to mark Poland’s independence day, far-right organisations organised a large demonstration in Warsaw, gathering more than 60 000 people; whereas the demonstrators were holding xenophobic banners with slogans such as ‘white Europe of brotherly nations’, including some depicting the ‘falanga’, a fascist symbol from the 1930s;

Can see some photos as examples here.
https://eeradicalization.com/extremism-in-poland/

gmisk

kooreczka wrote: »

I grew up in rural Poland in a good home with catholic values. I've seen how badly gay people were treated and when I realised I was gay myself I wanted give up and die as it was totally unacceptable to be gay in Poland. I decided to leave when graduated from college. I live in Ireland for last 14 years and not planning to go back home even though I miss it badly. Choosing Duda for president seems like nothing changed for passed 14 years and will not change in the neartest future, sadly.
As per previous comments I just love how PiS supporters point at muslim countries being worse than Poland. They are not in Europe and have different values altogether. Typical politics of what PiS does in Poland to turn head from real problem and point out on something else/worse and their problem doesn't seem so bad then. This is a huge problem young people will commit suicides because of lack of tolerance and resoursces to deal with their indentity in the "lgbt free zones" and the sad part is this is so avoidalbe. Duda is not a president for everyone he is not even sticking to his own mind he will sign everything Kaczynski ask for and politics of hate is what they do. Wonder who they gonna target in next election...

Wow that was powerful stuff, thanks for sharing.
I know a gay couple who are polish they did similar got out of Poland as soon as they feasibly could, one of them was very badly assaulted in a homophobic attack. They now are happily married and living in Germany. They miss Poland as well but doubt they would move back.

Bonniedog

Deleted User wrote: »

Below is an excerpt from an eu discussion on banning fascist and neo nazi rallies.

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-8-2018-0428_EN.html?redirect




Can see some photos as examples here.
https://eeradicalization.com/extremism-in-poland/

No swastikas.

"A group of marginal characters with hardly any influence in Poland," is what your link describes them as, but you have attempted to taint the fkn government with this infantile cr@p

Seamai

kooreczka wrote: »

I grew up in rural Poland in a good home with catholic values. I've seen how badly gay people were treated and when I realised I was gay myself I wanted give up and die as it was totally unacceptable to be gay in Poland. I decided to leave when graduated from college. I live in Ireland for last 14 years and not planning to go back home even though I miss it badly. Choosing Duda for president seems like nothing changed for passed 14 years and will not change in the neartest future, sadly.
As per previous comments I just love how PiS supporters point at muslim countries being worse than Poland. They are not in Europe and have different values altogether. Typical politics of what PiS does in Poland to turn head from real problem and point out on something else/worse and their problem doesn't seem so bad then. This is a huge problem young people will commit suicides because of lack of tolerance and resoursces to deal with their indentity in the "lgbt free zones" and the sad part is this is so avoidalbe. Duda is not a president for everyone he is not even sticking to his own mind he will sign everything Kaczynski ask for and politics of hate is what they do. Wonder who they gonna target in next election...

I hope you have a happy life here Kooreczka though you shouldn't have to leave your own country to find it and I know part of you will always miss your family and friends and what you left behind.

If I can offer you just a little glimmer of hope, the Ireland I grew up in, coming out in the early 80's wasn't a great place to be gay, now I don't think it was as bad as Poland but many gay people left, to Britain and the US mainly, half of my friends did to make new lives for themselves, thankfully many have returned and to a country that as a gay person they barely recognize. If someone told me even 15 years ago that that 63% of people here would vote for same sex marriage or that we'd have an openly gay Taoiseach I wouldn't have believed them.
In some ways it doesn't feel like the country I grew up in but what it proves to me is that people's attitudes towards the LGBT community can change, unfortunately we have only one life and that change may not happen in time for some.

Mr. Karate

Limpy wrote: »

Regarding the election, I was surprised it was that tight. I thought Duda would of won More comfortably.

If Bosak didn't run he probably would have.

gmisk

Mr. Karate wrote: »

If Bosak didn't run he probably would have.

Bosak wasn't in the run off...it was a two horse race.

Bonniedog

If Bosak hadn't run in the first round Duda would most likely have won without a second round. They had over 50% combined.

Sir Oxman

I'm very happy Poles of various opinions are posting in this thread - interesting to hear the different perspectives.

weldoninhio

Cordell wrote: »

No, it's not. But it's often used as a justification for committing crimes.
Patriots aim to make their country a better place, and these people will do the opposite, if they will have their way the country will be a worse place for everyone including themselves.
Let's take for example Ireland and Poland, I think it's obvious which country is better and which one is moving in the right direction. Those people marching want Poland to move in the opposite direction.

I was in Poland a few months ago visiting a friend who transferred there in work. Wroclaw. Beautiful city, cost of living is very low, couldn’t spend money. Saw no crime while over there. No junkies or beggars, apart from the occasional Roma who the police dealt with extremely quickly. If I spoke the language I’d be living over there in a shot. But Ireland is better because multiculturalism or something. Me arse.

Mr. Karate

weldoninhio wrote: »

I was in Poland a few months ago visiting a friend who transferred there in work. Wroclaw. Beautiful city, cost of living is very low, couldn’t spend money. Saw no crime while over there. No junkies or beggars, apart from the occasional Roma who the police dealt with extremely quickly. If I spoke the language I’d be living over there in a shot. But Ireland is better because multiculturalism or something. Me arse.

I don't speak Polish and I want to move there. I was in Warsaw back in 2018 and loved every minute of it. Let the West burn. This Plastic Paddy ain't going to defend the people who call me plastic paddy against who they call "New Irish".

JoChervil

suicide_circus wrote: »

a picture paints a thousand words

Well, so what will you say about this map? On the left are provinces on the right are counties. Duda won in villages and small towns in the east, while Trzaskowski won in big cities in the west more modern part of Poland.