Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

Siamsa Sessions

Say my name wrote: »

But the flavour of all environmentalists here is anti livestock so we'll run with that.

I think An Taisce left the mask slip a little when they pulled out of the Ag Strategy 2030 consultations. They listed out various complaints they had about not being listened to, etc. and one of the bullet points was about reducing livestock numbers and it not being discussed enough

GrasstoMilk

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

The Belview issue comes from Glanbia's poor management more than An Taisce's meddling.

An Taisce didn't encourage expansion and seek new entrants all over the country, only to realise their eyes were bigger than their belly, and they couldn't process all the milk. Neither was it An Taisce's plan B to simply pass the pain onto farmers while refusing to even consider temporarily suspending their 3.2% margin.

I don't think An Taisce were right to take advantage of the planning laws, and I've no link with them whatsoever, but Glanbia are the ones who let the farmers down here not some random little environmental group.

What kind of multinational giant like Glanbia doesn't have a proper contingency plan in place?

You can't have a contingency plan for a 140million spend
This has never happened before
I'm a glanbia supplier and that is not a fair statement imo
It's just not possible to have a second plan for such a volume of milk

The plant was going to create high value cheese and provide a completely different market than cheese to Britain, it was and is the project to do to add value
More dryers for powder isn't the answer and that's the alternative

Say my name

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

I think An Taisce left the mask slip a little when they pulled out of the Ag Strategy 2030 consultations. They listed out various complaints they had about not being listened to, etc. and one of the bullet points was about reducing livestock numbers and it not being discussed enough

Cara Augustenborg is another member I'd say.
She blatantly on every show on newstalk tells everyone how livestock is bad for the planet and how people should reduce and eliminate meat and dairy from their diet.
It was whispered at first by influencers in the groups and now it's being shouted out by all in these groups now they know they're able to get away with it.

Nothing at all to do with environment and absolutely nothing to do with carbon and soil health but 100% to do with the idea of animals being killed for food and how they abhor that and they'll use as much influence as they can to end the practice.

Hence no eye is turned to tillage farming as they equate that to vegetable growing practice and the nitrate loss to water from the practice as there's feck all carbon in the soil to hold onto it from being abused so much.

Green&Red

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

You can't have a contingency plan for a 140million spend
This has never happened before
I'm a glanbia supplier and that is not a fair statement imo
It's just not possible to have a second plan for such a volume of milk

The plant was going to create high value cheese and provide a completely different market than cheese to Britain, it was and is the project to do to add value
More dryers for powder isn't the answer and that's the alternative

I’d agree with this, a new plant like this is a fine line to thread. Start it too early and you’re paying the cost of finance for an asset which already has a ramp-up time until its able to pay for itself. Delayed and you have the current situation.


On Taisce, I wouldn’t describe them as some random little environmental group, it’s partly state funded and has a statutory role in planning. They are a dangerous animal and tends to be run by people who have very little interest in commerce.

In a previous life I worked in renewable energy policy and planning, they were a nightmare to deal with there

yosemitesam1

Say my name wrote: »

Cara Augustenborg is another member I'd say.
She blatantly on every show on newstalk tells everyone how livestock is bad for the planet and how people should reduce and eliminate meat and dairy from their diet.
It was whispered at first by influencers in the groups and now it's being shouted out by all in these groups now they know they're able to get away with it.

Nothing at all to do with environment and absolutely nothing to do with carbon and soil health but 100% to do with the idea of animals being killed for food and how they abhor that and they'll use as much influence as they can to end the practice.

Hence no eye is turned to tillage farming as they equate that to vegetable growing practice and the nitrate loss to water from the practice as there's feck all carbon in the soil to hold onto it from being abused so much.

It's always worth remembering some of the worst nitrate leaching in the world occurs under organic veg production in california

Say my name

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

It's always worth remembering some of the worst nitrate leaching in the world occurs under organic veg production in california

You've read the same books as I have I'm guessing. You've much the same farming experience I'm not guessing based on your posts.
We know soils under tillage can't hold onto nitrogen unless there's adequate life and carbon from that life which they don't have from the very act of being tilled.
I haven't got it with me but I believe David Montgomery the soil and geological professor had it that 80% of the carbon dioxide since the industrial revolution came from tilling land. It mightnt be 80 could be more or less but it was a big number.

Even in project drawdown (that world wide collaboration of scientists ) to find ways of combating climate change. Had 5 or 6 examples of using livestock positively in the top twenty of things that could be done.
Biochar was way down the list to show how highly they thought of livestock farming.

Here it's livestock bad, veg good. And nobody says boo. It's lazy and insidious commentary.
And I don't let teagasc off the hook.
Their recommendations for buffer between sowed ground and watercourses is very small. Is it something like 2m if there's no grass margin and 1m if there's a grass margin? And how would there be no grass margin unless it was tilled or sprayed off.

Ah anyway it's a whole bugbear of mine when everyone doesn't get treated equally.

Water John

Really disingenuous when animals and the environment are used as cover by veganism. Lets do the science and base decisions on that.

Birdnuts

Say my name wrote: »

Cara Augustenborg is another member I'd say.
S

She is a dose alright - like a female Eamon Ryan ie. a wall of noise and cliches but very poor on actual facts including knowledge of the real pressures that continue to impact natural heritage in this country.

dmakc

https://connachttribune.ie/over-270-dead-calves-are-taken-from-farm-687/

What's the right punishment here? We'll all no doubt be tarnished as one due to this * * * * (mod snip)

tismesoitis

dmakc wrote: »

https://connachttribune.ie/over-270-dead-calves-are-taken-from-farm-687/

What's the right punishment here? We'll all no doubt be tarnished as one due to this ****

There must be some degree of mental illness with that case. Lets be straight,no one in their right mind would allow 4 or 5 calves to lie dead let alone that many. Having said that i think the herd number should be removed until such a time as this person can prove themselves capable of looking after livestock.

Base price

dmakc wrote: »

https://connachttribune.ie/over-270-dead-calves-are-taken-from-farm-687/

What's the right punishment here? We'll all no doubt be tarnished as one due to this ****

I'd prefer to hold judgement until we hear the full details. A bad outbreak of a nastie like crypto could run through a shed resulting in calves dying of malnutrition and respiratory ailments. The article did say that the number of calves had died over recent weeks. Was the farmers own Vet in attendance, etc.

Green&Red

Are there any heat detection systems which don’t require a vasectomised bull?

straight

dmakc wrote: »

https://connachttribune.ie/over-270-dead-calves-are-taken-from-farm-687/

What's the right punishment here? We'll all no doubt be tarnished as one due to this ****

Madness having that many calves in the first place. Numbers gone to fellas heads

greysides

dmakc wrote: »

https://connachttribune.ie/over-270-dead-calves-are-taken-from-farm-687/

What's the right punishment here? We'll all no doubt be tarnished as one due to this ****

With the scale needed to have that many calves, there was more than the farmer alone on the farm.

whelan2

greysides wrote: »

With the scale needed to have that many calves, there was more than the farmer alone on the farm.

Could be bought in?

straight

Oh the excitement...

New Study points to EU agricultural production falling at least 25%


https://www.irishexaminer.com/farming/arid-40272194.html

Siamsa Sessions

straight wrote: »

Oh the excitement...

New Study points to EU agricultural production falling at least 25%


https://www.irishexaminer.com/farming/arid-40272194.html

It's hard to get your head around where people think food will come from in the years ahead. Even if Europe exports food, it doesn't export it to outer space - someone someplace in the world eats it.

I'm hoping it's not the same thinking that's behind stopping turf production here in Ireland, only to import the stuff in from Germany. And I'm really hoping those middle-class environment types are not actually just NIMBYs in disguise, who are happy to let the poor suffer so they can feel good about themselves "saving the planet".

Base price

straight wrote: »

Madness having that many calves in the first place. Numbers gone to fellas heads

Up to a couple of years ago myself and OH would have 200+ bought in FR bull calves here in the months of Feb & Mar.

straight

Base price wrote: »

Up to a couple of years ago myself and OH would have 200+ bought in FR bull calves here in the months of Feb & Mar.

Well that **** had 270 dead ones

whelan2

straight wrote: »

Well that fool had 270 dead ones

I wouldn't be calling anyone a **** or a ****. None of us know the full story

K.G.

dmakc wrote: »

https://connachttribune.ie/over-270-dead-calves-are-taken-from-farm-687/

What's the right punishment here? We'll all no doubt be tarnished as one due to this ****

To be honest less said about this this the better.i suspect this is more about human health than calf health

mahoney_j

K.G. wrote: »

To be honest less said about this this the better.i suspect this is more about human health than calf health

Exactly no point speculating when I’m betting little to any of us know anything about the story bar what’s in that headline

straight

whelan2 wrote: »

I wouldn't be calling anyone a **** or a ****. None of us know the full story

I know. Its obviously a human tragedy first and foremost but all the pushing of numbers and glorification of the dairy heros in the media has led alot of people down a bad path imo. Its the path they were led down i was talking about when I called them a ****. But I have huge sympathy for the person involved and those surrounding them. Wishing them the best to get back on track.

liosnagceann75

Where is the Kerry Co op thread gone?

Sacrolyte

liosnagceann75 wrote: »

Where is the Kerry Co op thread gone?

I suspect it’s gone to the same place the JV has

Sacrolyte

straight wrote: »

I know. Its obviously a human tragedy first and foremost but all the pushing of numbers and glorification of the dairy heros in the media has led alot of people down a bad path imo. Its the path they were led down i was talking about when I called them a ****. But I have huge sympathy for the person involved and those surrounding them. Wishing them the best to get back on track.

I’ve yet to hear of one farmer say he was sorry he increased cows too much. All that oul talk is just simple begrudgery.

straight

Sacrolyte wrote: »

I suspect it’s gone to the same place the JV has

Or the same place the leading milk price contract went to.

straight

Sacrolyte wrote: »

I’ve yet to hear of one farmer say he was sorry he increased cows too much. All that oul talk is just simple begrudgery.

There's plenty of them in the graveyard. Alot of people were led down the wrong road in my opinion and there is no begrudging here, only pity for alot of them.

Castlekeeper

Sacrolyte wrote: »

I’ve yet to hear of one farmer say he was sorry he increased cows too much. All that oul talk is just simple begrudgery.

Hi there, I increased cow numbers, it didn't suit us, I reduced cow numbers again.
There you go, box ticked.
Your welcome.

Sacrolyte

Castlekeeper wrote: »

Hi there, I increased cow numbers, it didn't suit us, I reduced cow numbers again.
There you go, box ticked.
Your welcome.

Ok. I know 1.