Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

green daries

The pollution debate in my opinion is stacked against agriculture when you have the simple action of the carbon footprint of all the food grown and exported from Ireland is accounted for in Ireland but also all of the oil used in Ireland is accounted for in Ireland its double accounting
Export the carbon footprint of our exported high quality foods to where there actually consumed agriculture in Ireland is probably the most greenhouse gases efficient industry in most of the world it just suits an agenda at the moment to bash agriculture and not concentrate on people's own greenhouse gases production

Morris Moss

charolais0153 wrote: »

If the lads can't spread in good conditions for 30 weeks of the year what makes u think that they'll spread in good conditions on Christmas week. You don't even get a response from slurry in January

I'll make it really simple for you to understand, if you could spread slurry when the weather is good and ground conditions allow you wouldn't have the usual thing of waiting for the opening dates and spreading no matter what the weather is like.

As for not getting a response for slurry in January, from comparing fields that got it and those that didn't, it's night and day.

Siamsa Sessions

Bull question here - I left an Angus bull to heifers on Monday and he was quiet the first few days, grazing away and not taking much notice of the heifers. He’s not a yearling bull, but I only hired him and haven’t got the movement permit yet so don’t know how old he is. Could be 2 or 3 maybe?

Since yesterday (Friday) he’s stopping them from getting to the water trough. There’s a lick bucket in the field and he’s keeping them away from that too. He’s generally just bullying them now, grazing a bit himself but then making a run for any heifer that comes near him.

He’s not at it the whole time; e.g. he’s just lying down with them all now as I type this. It seems to be whenever one of them moves or does something he sees as a threat.

Will he settle in after a few more days?

Or should I call the man I hired him from and get a replacement ASAP?

cute geoge

Thats why they are called bulls ,a bully .Dont worry yet wait until he sees a heifer mounting and he will spring in to action .By the ways what cost is the hire and for how long

coffee table jazz

green daries wrote: »

The pollution debate in my opinion is stacked against agriculture when you have the simple action of the carbon footprint of all the food grown and exported from Ireland is accounted for in Ireland but also all of the oil used in Ireland is accounted for in Ireland its double accounting
Export the carbon footprint of our exported high quality foods to where there actually consumed agriculture in Ireland is probably the most greenhouse gases efficient industry in most of the world it just suits an agenda at the moment to bash agriculture and not concentrate on people's own greenhouse gases production

Would you be ok with us having to take account of the carbon footprint for all the products we import from factories in China etc? We import steel and construction materials and all these heavy industry polluting things. Every country needs to do their bit to reduce their footprint.

Mooooo

coffee table jazz wrote: »

Would you be ok with us having to take account of the carbon footprint for all the products we import from factories in China etc? We import steel and construction materials and all these heavy industry polluting things. Every country needs to do their bit to reduce their footprint.

No ones dismissing that. Food producing/ exporting nations were put at a disadvantage straight off the bat as all emissions associated with it were put on the country of origin, without discounting the carbon used in growing grass etc I might add, whereas the likes or Norway, the middle east etc didn't have to take account the billions of dollars of fossil fuels they extract and sell which adds new co2 to the atmosphere...

straight

Alot of the problem is that everybody these days seem to think they're an expert. I saw someone comment on social media the other day about why cows backs were all blood. It was tail paint. We never sprayed a ditch under wire here until they stopped us cutting the hedges. We used to lightly trim all our hedgerows every year and we had hedges to be proud of. Now its every three years and if you don't get a good autumn its 4 or 5 years. You end up destroying the hedge and compacting the ground with all the extra passes. My point is that the experts are doing more harm than good with alot of their bright ideas. Teagasc took it a bit far lately recommending wire being moved out from water courses, etc. and getting the whole thing written into law.

Say my name

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Bull question here - I left an Angus bull to heifers on Monday and he was quiet the first few days, grazing away and not taking much notice of the heifers. He’s not a yearling bull, but I only hired him and haven’t got the movement permit yet so don’t know how old he is. Could be 2 or 3 maybe?

Since yesterday (Friday) he’s stopping them from getting to the water trough. There’s a lick bucket in the field and he’s keeping them away from that too. He’s generally just bullying them now, grazing a bit himself but then making a run for any heifer that comes near him.

He’s not at it the whole time; e.g. he’s just lying down with them all now as I type this. It seems to be whenever one of them moves or does something he sees as a threat.

Will he settle in after a few more days?

Or should I call the man I hired him from and get a replacement ASAP?

I nearly would look for a replacement.

Is the hire thing legal? Well he's going into your herd number I suppose. But anyway..

Since yesterday (friday too) my fr bull with the cows has started rounding up the cows away from the entrance to the paddock and I'm having an awful job to try and get the cows to break free from the mob created by the bull near milking time. What I have to do now is try and run the bull in first and then the cows will come.
I'm easily sorted though I'm swapping the bulls around this evening between cows and heifers.

I put this bulls behaviour down to a lot of commotion and noise (reversing beepers) and strange smell for him from next door these past few days. The Angus bull with the heifers is in that direction too so it all adds to the anxiety.

Siamsa Sessions

cute geoge wrote: »

Thats why they are called bulls ,a bully .Dont worry yet wait until he sees a heifer mounting and he will spring in to action .By the ways what cost is the hire and for how long

Thanks for that. I’ll give him a few more days. This is my first time hiring a bull so it’s all new to me. I only want him for 6 weeks. I think it’s around €500 but the man I got him from owes me a favour after I bought cattle from his father last year. That’s a whole other story though!

Siamsa Sessions

Say my name wrote: »

I nearly would look for a replacement.

Is the hire thing legal? Well he's going into your herd number I suppose. But anyway..

Since yesterday (friday too) my fr bull with the cows has started rounding up the cows away from the entrance to the paddock and I'm having an awful job to try and get the cows to break free from the mob created by the bull near milking time. What I have to do now is try and run the bull in first and then the cows will come.
I'm easily sorted though I'm swapping the bulls around this evening between cows and heifers.

I put this bulls behaviour down to a lot of commotion and noise (reversing beepers) and strange smell for him from next door these past few days. The Angus bull with the heifers is in that direction too so it all adds to the anxiety.

Thanks for that. There was a FR bull across the road when he arrived last week so maybe that set him off. That bull is gone a few days now though.

If he doesn’t settle and starting bulling anything that moves in the next few days then I’ll get rid.

Telling ya, I have even more respect for dairy farmers after the last few months. The figures are not what Teagasc portray in the media, the investment needed is massive, the time/labour is huge, and breeding is “stressful” to put it mildly.

green daries

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Thanks for that. I’ll give him a few more days. This is my first time hiring a bull so it’s all new to me. I only want him for 6 weeks. I think it’s around €500 but the man I got him from owes me a favour after I bought cattle from his father last year. That’s a whole other story though!

Just be wary of him and see does he settle it can be the first sign of a bull getting cross if he doesn't settle when the heifers start coming. Then out the gate immediately

green daries

straight wrote: »

Alot of the problem is that everybody these days seem to think they're an expert. I saw someone comment on social media the other day about why cows backs were all blood. It was tail paint. We never sprayed a ditch under wire here until they stopped us cutting the hedges. We used to lightly trim all our hedgerows every year and we had hedges to be proud of. Now its every three years and if you don't get a good autumn its 4 or 5 years. You end up destroying the hedge and compacting the ground with all the extra passes. My point is that the experts are doing more harm than good with alot of their bright ideas. Teagasc took it a bit far lately recommending wire being moved out from water courses, etc. and getting the whole thing written into law.

Yup everything has an unintended consequence
And yep everyone including me has an opinion.
And definitely some people think cos they have an opinion their an expert

Say my name

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Thanks for that. There was a FR bull across the road when he arrived last week so maybe that set him off. That bull is gone a few days now though.

If he doesn’t settle and starting bulling anything that moves in the next few days then I’ll get rid.

Telling ya, I have even more respect for dairy farmers after the last few months. The figures are not what Teagasc portray in the media, the investment needed is massive, the time/labour is huge, and breeding is “stressful” to put it mildly.

The rosy picture is portrayed but it's a bit more complicated when you get down to it.
Likewise too from the anti dairy who don't actually do it but know it all, it's not as bad or financially bad as made out to be either.
It's a life but the same as any you can go stupid on it too and you do need help no matter what anyone says.

timple23

Say my name wrote: »

I nearly would look for a replacement.

Is the hire thing legal? Well he's going into your herd number I suppose. But anyway..

Since yesterday (friday too) my fr bull with the cows has started rounding up the cows away from the entrance to the paddock and I'm having an awful job to try and get the cows to break free from the mob created by the bull near milking time. What I have to do now is try and run the bull in first and then the cows will come.
I'm easily sorted though I'm swapping the bulls around this evening between cows and heifers.

I put this bulls behaviour down to a lot of commotion and noise (reversing beepers) and strange smell for him from next door these past few days. The Angus bull with the heifers is in that direction too so it all adds to the anxiety.

Had similar problem with an AA bull we have for a number of years. Was fine first few weeks. Then would stop them from going into parlour. Lasted about a week, back fine again.

green daries

coffee table jazz wrote: »

Would you be ok with us having to take account of the carbon footprint for all the products we import from factories in China etc? We import steel and construction materials and all these heavy industry polluting things. Every country needs to do their bit to reduce their

What's lost in this argument is that agriculture is the only industry that actually physically sequester carbon emissions the only industry that has any claim to be able to be green and environmentally friendly we are the keepers of the countryside we are the only people who look after it outside of the few state owned lands farmer's give all other businesses the ability for green washing

green daries

green daries wrote: »

coffee table jazz wrote: »

Would you be ok with us having to take account of the carbon footprint for all the products we import from factories in China etc? We import steel and construction materials and all these heavy industry polluting things. Every country needs to do their bit to reduce their

What's lost in this argument is that agriculture is the only industry that actually physically sequester carbon emissions the only industry that has any claim to be able to be green and environmentally friendly we are the keepers of the countryside we are the only people who look after it outside of the few state owned lands farmer's give all other businesses the ability for green washing

No matter what you do every day you get up and live on this planet ( and may we live a long and happy life here) your a net contributer to green house gases there is no other way around that fact

straight

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Thanks for that. There was a FR bull across the road when he arrived last week so maybe that set him off. That bull is gone a few days now though.

If he doesn’t settle and starting bulling anything that moves in the next few days then I’ll get rid.

Telling ya, I have even more respect for dairy farmers after the last few months. The figures are not what Teagasc portray in the media, the investment needed is massive, the time/labour is huge, and breeding is “stressful” to put it mildly.

Thats right. Breeding is worse than calving but experience helps and I think its important not to overthink it and just have patience.

Green&Red

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Thanks for that. I’ll give him a few more days. This is my first time hiring a bull so it’s all new to me. I only want him for 6 weeks. I think it’s around €500 but the man I got him from owes me a favour after I bought cattle from his father last year. That’s a whole other story though!

Are the heifers not showing heat as it is?

Siamsa Sessions

Green&Red wrote: »

Are the heifers not showing heat as it is?

I’m guessing it’s just coincidence but they were bulling away until the bull arrived. I haven’t tail-painted them so can’t be sure. Will tail-paint them on Monday

yosemitesam1

straight wrote: »

Alot of the problem is that everybody these days seem to think they're an expert. I saw someone comment on social media the other day about why cows backs were all blood. It was tail paint. We never sprayed a ditch under wire here until they stopped us cutting the hedges. We used to lightly trim all our hedgerows every year and we had hedges to be proud of. Now its every three years and if you don't get a good autumn its 4 or 5 years. You end up destroying the hedge and compacting the ground with all the extra passes. My point is that the experts are doing more harm than good with alot of their bright ideas. Teagasc took it a bit far lately recommending wire being moved out from water courses, etc. and getting the whole thing written into law.

The biggest problem is that the world is changing out there. Dragging our heels and whingeing about changes simply means that change is enforced legally from above instead of from the ground up. I know which option I'd prefer but it's not the one that we will be getting

Mooooo

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

The biggest problem is that the world is changing out there. Dragging our heels and whingeing about changes simply means that change is enforced legally from above instead of from the ground up. I know which option I'd prefer but it's not the one that we will be getting

What changes we are making seem to be ignored, what would you have the countries farmers do?

charolais0153

Morris Moss wrote: »

I'll make it really simple for you to understand, if you could spread slurry when the weather is good and ground conditions allow you wouldn't have the usual thing of waiting for the opening dates and spreading no matter what the weather is like.

As for not getting a response for slurry in January, from comparing fields that got it and those that didn't, it's night and day.

I was working for a pig fella there a while ago, he has 32 weeks storage, 32! . God forbid lads have a bit more storage to take them past the 13th of January.
Some nutrients used in January , not all, night and day between fields that got it in march and Jan .

green daries

Mooooo wrote: »

What changes we are making seem to be ignored, what would you have the countries farmers do?

Call it off get a three legged stool an milk a cow for the house she'll have to be a high yielding cow as well now so that'll be a balls for a lot of lads .............
A sow a cow and a horsey plough
Look its all a load of bollix really in comparison to the state of certain countries and types of pollution from people but we're the easy targets and yes in afraid any improvements will be brushed over it doesn't suit the agenda

straight

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

The biggest problem is that the world is changing out there. Dragging our heels and whingeing about changes simply means that change is enforced legally from above instead of from the ground up. I know which option I'd prefer but it's not the one that we will be getting

The world is always changing but people still have to eat. Farmers are being made scapegoats of unfairly. It's bad trial of our representative and research bodies that they can't yet get accurate figures for a farmers carbon footprint.

richie123

Mooooo wrote: »

What changes we are making seem to be ignored, what would you have the countries farmers do?

Stop spreading slurry in the closed period and put in more storage.
Its not rocket science.
The head needs to be taken out of the sand and stop dragging the heels.
The argument for spreading slurry in closed period is well lost at this stage.

We need to move on from that for once and for all.

richie123

straight wrote: »

The world is always changing but people still have to eat. Farmers are being made scapegoats of unfairly. It's bad trial of our representative and research bodies that they can't yet get accurate figures for a farmers carbon footprint.

We need to stop handing the likes of an taisce open goals.
Take the Inititive and implement the nesscessary changes ourselves.

30 per cent water pollution comes from agri sector.

Sewerage and industry make up the rest.
There **** all we can do about that but we can control what goes on in our own yards and call out lads putting expansion before facilities and poor practice.

Grueller

coffee table jazz wrote: »

Would you be ok with us having to take account of the carbon footprint for all the products we import from factories in China etc? We import steel and construction materials and all these heavy industry polluting things. Every country needs to do their bit to reduce their footprint.

Absolutely OK with that

Mooooo

richie123 wrote: »

Stop spreading slurry in the closed period and put in more storage.
Its not rocket science.
The head needs to be taken out of the sand and stop dragging the heels.
The argument for spreading slurry in closed period is well lost at this stage.

We need to move on from that for once and for all.

That's enforcement of existing rules, nobody is arguing for closed period spreading anymore and a different issue. My point was LESS, protected urea etc all other tools we are using are being ignored which is why I asked what else should we be doing? Even looking for fairness in treatment with regard to carbon capture is being brushed away.

raindodger

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

I’m guessing it’s just coincidence but they were bulling away until the bull arrived. I haven’t tail-painted them so can’t be sure. Will tail-paint them on Monday

have found that tail painting heifers not much use they are not heavy enough to knock off paint scratch cards better

roosterman71

The thing is that for years farmers have been doing their best. But the best is never good enough. A few years ago it was have x storage on site. Now they are saying that needs to be covered. It's money money money money the whole time with little to no appreciation for a) the efforts put in, b) the cost and c) the fact farming is arguably the only sector that will capture carbon. They can't even calculate how much we capture but by jaysus they are well able to estimate how much we produce!

Ya can pay to offset carbon when ya board a plane. WTF? Is a €10 going to offset the carbon. Not a hope.

Look at the work farmers have done re. storage, etc. Knowledge of soil health is very good now. Lads have clued in. Education was/is key. Protected urea all the rage. LESS as well. GPS guidence and section control. Grants available and being taken up. Investments being made. But mark my words, it won't be enough for the crowd setting these rules and regulations.

We could bend over backwards, be 100% carbon neutral but some city boy will see cows farting and be up in arms while buying clothes in Pennys shipped across the world and disposing instead of washing them, drinking a latte that they paid a fiver for with almond milk and wasting an unbelievable % of the food they buy each week in a discount store and demanding that food be cheap while ignoring to costs (financial and environmental) of producing that food. All the while saying how great Bitcoin is while ignoring the environmental cost of mining that ****e.

The whole thing boils my wee wee