Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

yosemitesam1

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Will the environmental changes ultimately mean lower milk production?

You can see on here that farmers are mentally preparing for stricter environmental controls but there seems to be a reluctance to come out strong on what’s needed at Government/Teagasc level.

Are they more concerned about curbing exports than the fines coming from the EU for missing climate targets?

Teagasc view everything through the lens of what can we sell to farmers? They dont look to see how could they completely redesign things for the better. Hence we get small actions that give small benefits without addressing the underlying issues

greenfield21

jaymla627 wrote: »

Aware have bought a plant recently in Belgium i think with a milk pool of 300 odd million litres, that big tillage farm that sold in the Midlands recently for 10 million was ment to be converted to a 1000 cow dairy unit, an taisce put in a objection and now its on ice with a tillage man having it rented on a four year lease, lads where losing the running of themselves to be honest

So they refused the application because it was a dairy farm and nothing more? I think we are missing a bit of the story here.

lab man

mahoney_j wrote: »

Glanbia have said this if farmers just plough on they will be hit with the peak penalties snd if it comes to it and no home can be found for the milk with another processor the milk will have to be dumped

Christ will they give it to fellas rearing calves

Say my name

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

Teagasc view everything through the lens of what can we sell to farmers? They dont look to see how could they completely redesign things for the better. Hence we get small actions that give small benefits without addressing the underlying issues

I may stop replying to posts! :pac:

I'll probably forget all about this myself now.
You have to give credit where it's due though.

https://twitter.com/PallasTb/status/1393875675753467917?s=20

Pinsnbushings

lab man wrote: »

Why will the farmers have to dump milk?

What I heard because lads were willing to plough on regardless and take the 30percent penalty on the excess milk, glanbia are talking about just not collecting your milk once you reach your peak monthly allocation.

Worst thing is still know of a couple of new entrants starting with glanbia next spring, and recent new entrants can supply 550000 litres no bother at all.

Morris Moss

Pinsnbushings wrote: »

What I heard because lads were willing to plough on regardless and take the 30percent penalty on the excess milk, glanbia are talking about just not collecting your milk once you reach your peak monthly allocation.

Worst thing is still know of a couple of new entrants starting with glanbia next spring, and recent new entrants can supply 550000 litres no bother at all.

They can't not collect the milk, but they can charge to take it, think 35cl is what I read.

Pinsnbushings

Morris Moss wrote: »

They can't not collect the milk, but they can charge to take it, think 35cl is what I read.

I thought that too but this is what a lad told me, you wouldn't know what to believe at the moment.. I can't understand how they can take on new entrants this year or next year either..surely it's creating unfair competition amongst farmers, 1 guy restricted and 1 guy not, supplying the same business.. creating divisions amongst farmers and bitterness.

whelan2

Pinsnbushings wrote: »

I thought that too but this is what a lad told me, you wouldn't know what to believe at the moment.. I can't understand how they can take on new entrants this year or next year either..surely it's creating unfair competition amongst farmers, 1 guy restricted and 1 guy not, supplying the same business.. creating divisions amongst farmers and bitterness.

Should be looking after the suppliers they have now

Siamsa Sessions

lab man wrote: »

Christ will they give it to fellas rearing calves

Might suit lads contract rearing if they’re not too far from the calves home farm. And can transport and store it.

moneyheer

It's called divide and conquer

GrasstoMilk

Pinsnbushings wrote: »

I thought that too but this is what a lad told me, you wouldn't know what to believe at the moment.. I can't understand how they can take on new entrants this year or next year either..surely it's creating unfair competition amongst farmers, 1 guy restricted and 1 guy not, supplying the same business.. creating divisions amongst farmers and bitterness.

Your last point is what came to my mind lately

Glanbia have taken on 17 new entrants for thus year and next year

They should have looked after there existing suppliers as whelan says

Gawddawggonnit

green daries wrote: »

In all fairness dawg you should understand Irelands situation better than most the starting point of farm holdings in Ireland has been a major issue for Irish farms
This situation hasn't happened anywhere else in Europe the 100 acre average farm mentioned probably would have 20 of those acres rented in and that percentage only grows further north and west

I understand perfectly the situation.
If you’ve been reading the tripe I’ve posted over the years, you will know that I argued against the Teagasc model of ‘load on the cows and worry about facilities (etc) after’.
I’ve nothing against expansion per se, but nobody took one jot of notice about the repercussions on the environment, society etc. There’s been a very cavalier attitude to expansion.

Gawddawggonnit

whelan2 wrote: »

Should be looking after the suppliers they have now

Ah now, that’s completely against the ethos of a Cooperative.
Is Glanbia a Coop or a Club?

Anyhow wild claims of dumping milk, charging for collecting and dumping etc, are just to wind up some serious reaction from politicians and suppliers with a view to influencing any decisions.

minerleague

Say my name wrote: »

That still wouldn't filter out nitrates. You could have clear water but high in nitrates.

You'd need a carbon trap to catch the nitrates. People are using woodchip, biochar.

And spread the biochar on land at some stage?
Whats your opinion on slurry separators? seem to leave a stable solid material and a liquid that could be injected. Could someone build a big unit in intensive areas?

mahoney_j

whelan2 wrote: »

Should be looking after the suppliers they have now

I fully agree on this ,every coop should do same and stop taking new entrants ,who for most part are coming in at a big scale ,if they want in they should have to pay handsomely for it .I make no appologies for saying this .existing suppliers have to be protected ,coops ,Tegasc etc all have to pull there head out of clouds too ,same auld advice coming out for years ,no change

mahoney_j

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

I understand perfectly the situation.
If you’ve been reading the tripe I’ve posted over the years, you will know that I argued against the Teagasc model of ‘load on the cows and worry about facilities (etc) after’.
I’ve nothing against expansion per se, but nobody took one jot of notice about the repercussions on the environment, society etc. There’s been a very cavalier attitude to expansion.

Tbf your right on this and you have been saying it for a long time

mahoney_j

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Ah now, that’s completely against the ethos of a Cooperative.
Is Glanbia a Coop or a Club?

Anyhow wild claims of dumping milk, charging for collecting and dumping etc, are just to wind up some serious reaction from politicians and suppliers with a view to influencing any decisions.

It’s a reality of the situation Glanbia are facing and what’s ahead for other coops ,if lads stay ploughing on milk will have to be dumped as other processors won’t be able to take it in ,new markets will have to be explored and better use made of plants 12 months of year ,

green daries

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

I understand perfectly the situation.
If you’ve been reading the tripe I’ve posted over the years, you will know that I argued against the Teagasc model of ‘load on the cows and worry about facilities (etc) after’.
I’ve nothing against expansion per se, but nobody took one jot of notice about the repercussions on the environment, society etc. There’s been a very cavalier attitude to expansion.

Ya and that I totally agree with you on these points but many many farmers haven't gone down that route and many are environmentally aware its not the majority round here anyway
You can't tar all with the one brush

Timmaay

Pinsnbushings wrote: »

What I heard because lads were willing to plough on regardless and take the 30percent penalty on the excess milk, glanbia are talking about just not collecting your milk once you reach your peak monthly allocation.

Worst thing is still know of a couple of new entrants starting with glanbia next spring, and recent new entrants can supply 550000 litres no bother at all.

Efficient high solids spring lads with the room to expand could definitely absorb the 30% for the 3months and drive on, the obvious major risk here is everyone did it and Glanbia charge you the full 100% of the milk and not just 30%. I'll probably end up pushing it by 4 or 5 cows, but that's about it (I've the land to easily go another 20 cows if I wanted)

I hear the retirement scheme so far isn't as popular as hoped,meaning 2 things,looks like,we're not going to get the extra pool from that but we will still be paying the same into its fund

tanko

Marine Layer wrote: »

I hear the retirement scheme so far isn't as popular as hoped,meaning 2 things,looks like,we're not going to get the extra pool from that but we will still be paying the same into its fund

Roughly how much a year would it be worth to a farmer milking 50 cows?

tanko

tanko wrote: »

Roughly how much a year would it be worth to a farmer milking 50 cows?

Max payment is 15000 on 500,000 litres
Pro rata drop from there
7500 for 250000 litres
Still 15000 for 750000 litres
Based on 2020 volume delivered
Not very enticing I'd say except to someone already retiring

Gawddawggonnit

green daries wrote: »

Ya and that I totally agree with you on these points but many many farmers haven't gone down that route and many are environmentally aware its not the majority round here anyway
You can't tar all with the one brush

True.

Gawddawggonnit

mahoney_j wrote: »

It’s a reality of the situation Glanbia are facing and what’s ahead for other coops ,if lads stay ploughing on milk will have to be dumped as other processors won’t be able to take it in ,new markets will have to be explored and better use made of plants 12 months of year ,

Pull up the ladder and shut the door??
It’s a Coop!

It’s a good example of how little thought and planning went into expansion.

Birdnuts

Say my name wrote: »

You can check out your own river water quality status here and attribute then to what's in the area.

https://gis.epa.ie/EPAMaps/

Every catchment has its own story in terms of water quality pressures - and they all need to be tackled from poor sewage treatment, poor slurry handling/storage and last but not least the impacts of drainage for conifer forestry and windfarm development in the uplands.

Birdnuts

mahoney_j wrote: »

I fully agree on this ,every coop should do same and stop taking new entrants ,who for most part are coming in at a big scale ,if they want in they should have to pay handsomely for it .I make no appologies for saying this .existing suppliers have to be protected ,coops ,Tegasc etc all have to pull there head out of clouds too ,same auld advice coming out for years ,no change

Good point - knowing a few dairy farmers from the home place back in Kildare that have been milking for 40 plus years, they are of the opinion that its alot of the new entrants that are giving the industry a bad name in terms of slurry management, calf welfare etc.

GrasstoMilk

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Pull up the ladder and shut the door??
It’s a Coop!

It’s a good example of how little thought and planning went into expansion.

It's a coop when it suits glanbia, other times the plc is its master

Timmaay

Marine Layer wrote: »

Max payment is 15000 on 500,000 litres
Pro rata drop from there
7500 for 250000 litres
Still 15000 for 750000 litres
Based on 2020 volume delivered
Not very enticing I'd say except to someone already retiring

Hmm don't think your right there, the retirement form we got said it would pay us 75k over 5yrs. And don't for one second let anyone think Glanbia are paying that, it comes out of an extra levy on continuing suppliers.

Say my name

Birdnuts wrote: »

Every catchment has its own story in terms of water quality pressures - and they all need to be tackled from poor sewage treatment, poor slurry handling/storage and last but not least the impacts of drainage for conifer forestry and windfarm development in the uplands.

I had an idea to charge up a sack of char with the nutrients in a stream on the farm here.
Reckoned it'd be win win on all fronts.
I was going to use it then further back with the cow manure and on the soil.
Luckily I snapped myself out of the idea after I remembered the village sewage plant discharges their water at the head of the stream.

It really is terrible though that in a hundred years it's come to this. There'd be guarranteed antibiotics and medications passing through, then all the cleaning products, and then all the things that shouldn't be flushed down the toilet but people do..engine oil to antifreeze to waste non bio garden products.

Only hopeful thing now with these incoming electric vehicles is engine oil and antifreeze will be gone.
Then garden products need be tackled too.

Say my name

minerleague wrote: »

And spread the biochar on land at some stage?
Whats your opinion on slurry separators? seem to leave a stable solid material and a liquid that could be injected. Could someone build a big unit in intensive areas?

If it's purely agricultural then yea spread it on land or use for horticultural use.

Slurry separators that liquid would still be high in nitrates with soluble phos.
The solid that's all your potash with small amounts of N. The only way you'd get that stuff back high in N again is have it stored in field on clay or just add worms in a dungstead. The worms would bring the N up. Adding char to that stuff would raise N too.