Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

mahoney_j

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Well great for you if you had existing storage for what stock you already had
It's not that simple for alot of guys who might have faced hard times through the the period of first grants
If you didn't get compliant in the first TAMS you were locked out of the rest
Hardly fair
If you had preexisting loans and couldnt afford to borrow more with out bringing the cows first how do you do it mj?
Shows your lack of understanding

I got no installation aid ,parents missed out on early retirement after it was pulled over night ,I had storage and facilities for the 50 cows I was milking when I took over I’ve added cows snd infrastructure over time in tandem ,got no grants and supported parents on top
Cheap shot saying lack of understanding ,very cheap shot ……that mantra of adding cows and worry about everything else later has landed lots where they are now .opportunities to taken on more land and then more cows came along and then adequate storage and facilities kicked further down road this meant lots have had to spread out of season

whelan2

Jesus lads do ye ever give up

mahoney_j

whelan2 wrote: »

Jesus lads do ye ever give up

Just making a point ….appologies if anyone offended …..sun shining off to do a bit of topping and spread a bit of fertiliser

Finty Lemon

straight wrote: »

According to the regs I have oceans of storage so there is someone wrong

You are answering your own question Chief. 20 weeks minimum for the country on the way

Green&Red

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Well great for you if you had existing storage for what stock you already had
It's not that simple for alot of guys who might have faced hard times through the the period of first grants
If you didn't get compliant in the first TAMS you were locked out of the rest
Hardly fair
If you had preexisting loans and couldnt afford to borrow more with out bringing the cows first how do you do it mj?
Shows your lack of understanding

You don't do it surely? You hold off on expansion until you're in a position to make the investment. Rules around compliance have to be there because its been proven that people won't comply unless they have to. You've to cut your cloth to measure.

We can complain all we like but we can see now whats coming down the tracks, the planning starts now. I've a lagoon, lots of rainwater off the yard going into it, I've five years to plan and sort it out. But I can't turn around in 2026 and be enraged that this is being foisted on me

We can see the closed period is going to be extended at some stage, we can't act like it'll be a shock when it comes. Your options will be to either provide more storage, B&B the cows to someone or, shocker, cut back on numbers


As for not taking a wage for five years, the mind f**king boggles

straight

Finty Lemon wrote: »

You are answering your own question Chief. 20 weeks minimum for the country on the way

I've loads of storage but my milking parlour tank fills up. I can pump it into 4 other tanks I have but that's a bit pointless. Its nice to get it out before calving kicks off. Farmers are going to have to learn where to draw the line. I read in the farmers journal last night that alot of "profitable" farmers have to borrow now to pay tax bills. That is just not on. No way is that sustainable. I'd like to say it would never happen here but it will be one sad day if it does.

mahoney_j

straight wrote: »

I've loads of storage but my milking parlour tank fills up. I can pump it into 4 other tanks I have but that's a bit pointless. Its nice to get it out before calving kicks off. Farmers are going to have to learn where to draw the line. I read in the farmers journal last night that alot of "profitable" farmers have to borrow now to pay tax bills. That is just not on. No way is that sustainable. I'd like to say it would never happen here but it will be one sad day if it does.

Our advisory body has is here …yes we didn’t have to follow the advice ….but it was pushed and pushed lots of farms now facing a crossroads ….the bps cheque getting smaller ….compliance measures getting stricter …..incomes getting volatile

GrasstoMilk

Green&Red wrote: »

You don't do it surely? You hold off on expansion until you're in a position to make the investment. Rules around compliance have to be there because its been proven that people won't comply unless they have to. You've to cut your cloth to measure.

We can complain all we like but we can see now whats coming down the tracks, the planning starts now. I've a lagoon, lots of rainwater off the yard going into it, I've five years to plan and sort it out. But I can't turn around in 2026 and be enraged that this is being foisted on me

We can see the closed period is going to be extended at some stage, we can't act like it'll be a shock when it comes. Your options will be to either provide more storage, B&B the cows to someone or, shocker, cut back on numbers


As for not taking a wage for five years, the mind f**king boggles

I'm not going to post our whole life storey here but was simply no other way for us
My father was in his late 60s, had bought a farm, moved to it, sold a farm, lost all bar 20 cows, siblings in college, 2 grandparents in nursing home, up to our ears in coop debt
I wanted to farm, if I didn't make it work with what we had we'd have been on the roadside

Hence my point of farmers being excluded from tams if non compliant which is completely wrong, all we've gotten a grant on here 2 date is a milk tank
Hence my point of lack of understanding, wasn't meant as a jib
in my area is very it's very extensive sheep/beef plus intensive tillage

No slurry tanks or sheds to rent, you'd be lucky to come across a crop of silage to buy

If you come home to a fairly well functioning farm with low debt your In a great position imo

cute geoge

I suppose you were lucky in the sense you have a decent land base ,plenty of lads stuck on small plots of 30/40 acres and now finding it difficult to rent any additional land .Fair dues to your father having the hindsight to sell his farm to buy a bigger place not an easy thing to do

Green&Red

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

I'm not going to post our whole life storey here but was simply no other way for us
My father was in his late 60s, had bought a farm, moved to it, sold a farm, lost all bar 20 cows, siblings in college, 2 grandparents in nursing home, up to our ears in coop debt
I wanted to farm, if I didn't make it work with what we had we'd have been on the roadside

Hence my point of farmers being excluded from tams if non compliant which is completely wrong, all we've gotten a grant on here 2 date is a milk tank
Hence my point of lack of understanding, wasn't meant as a jib
in my area is very it's very extensive sheep/beef plus intensive tillage

No slurry tanks or sheds to rent, you'd be lucky to come across a crop of silage to buy

If you come home to a fairly well functioning farm with low debt your In a great position imo

And I won’t comment on your situation but rules and regulations can’t be about the exception, they have to be made for the masses. That’s what any law is and there’ll always be people on the margins who are affected.

The point about there being no tanks or sheds to rent is precisely my point.. You can’t just say it’s not there but I’m milking over what I can hold regardless.. Farmers have to take responsibility for their own decisions. Like I said we know what’s coming down the line. If the storage isn’t there then you need to make alternative arrangements

GrasstoMilk

Green&Red wrote: »

And I won’t comment on your situation but rules and regulations can’t be about the exception, they have to be made for the masses. That’s what any law is and there’ll always be people on the margins who are affected.

The point about there being no tanks or sheds to rent is precisely my point.. You can’t just say it’s not there but I’m milking over what I can hold regardless.. Farmers have to take responsibility for their own decisions. Like I said we know what’s coming down the line. If the storage isn’t there then you need to make alternative arrangements

I completely agree, I'd have loved to have poured the concrete day one like all my mates did but just wasnt feasible
We're currently at a job that was supposed to leave us with extra slurry storage a nice bit over what we needed
If these new rules come in will just have enough for current numbers

Mooooo

Lads, everyone has different backgrounds situations etc but complaining of this/ that or the other thing isn't going to change much.
The game is changing and we'll have to adapt, or get out, in order to suit it and us. Its the not knowing exactly what we may be able to do re stocking rates etc what I find the most frustrating. I must upgrade facilities here whether or not numbers go up down or stay the same. Being allowed to use current allowable stocking rates will make it a lot easier to pay for. If dero goes, I'm back in cow numbers and so making the upgrades will become more difficult and that then puts us into the category of looking for work elsewhere. Not a mind the side affect of the lad working between here and another dero farm with 4 kids who'll be out of a job also.
If putting in extra storage or changes to spreading date helps keeps dero we may well have to just take it in order to stay where we are. Would have been against clover with the nature of our ground and management issues but it is likely the most measurable way of reducing our fert use and ergo our emissions so will just have to crack on with learning to deal with it.
All these things can be brought in with the ink from a pen but will take us time to implement so can we afford not to make a start in order to keep up?

K.G.

What ever about regs,you just can't have enough slurry storage,you shouldn't spread when conditions aren't suitable and dribble/trailing is nicer to your neighbors.

Green&Red

Moooo that’s exactly my point. These things are coming, in some form of other.
We can’t wait until the wolf is at the door and then cry foul.
When farmers talk about taking responsibility, well this is what responsibility looks like. Storage is the most basic requirement we’ll be asked for

Green&Red

K.G. wrote: »

What ever about regs,you just can't have enough slurry storage,you shouldn't spread when conditions aren't suitable and dribble/trailing is nicer to your neighbors.

And the farmer is getting more from the slurry

mahoney_j

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

I'm not going to post our whole life storey here but was simply no other way for us
My father was in his late 60s, had bought a farm, moved to it, sold a farm, lost all bar 20 cows, siblings in college, 2 grandparents in nursing home, up to our ears in coop debt
I wanted to farm, if I didn't make it work with what we had we'd have been on the roadside

Hence my point of farmers being excluded from tams if non compliant which is completely wrong, all we've gotten a grant on here 2 date is a milk tank
Hence my point of lack of understanding, wasn't meant as a jib
in my area is very it's very extensive sheep/beef plus intensive tillage

No slurry tanks or sheds to rent, you'd be lucky to come across a crop of silage to buy

If you come home to a fairly well functioning farm with low debt your In a great position imo

And fair play to you and def your parents for getting to where u are now ……don’t take me the wrong way but you bent the rules (we all do from time to time )maby I’m different but I wasn’t prepared to work for nothing for all the hours I worked nor was I prepared to work in sub standard conditions ,spread slurry out of season etc etc (my choice )I had a mortgage before I took over ,the loss of installation aid and in particular early retirement scheme for dad was some hit to my pocket but I was young and bank backed me and I took on a fair chunk of debt to get where I am now which thankfully I can see an end to .milk block same now as when I took over snd milking double what I did when started current proposals will see a need for more storage staying at current nos where I’m more than happy with
Just drives me mad to see lads ploughing on regardless ,rail roading others for land and know they are the lads that will be out at Christmas ,November etc at slurry ,do things by the book your laughed at ….I’m thick skinned and couldn’t care less about that

Green&Red

For reseeding, anyone spray off silage ground before mowing? What was the effect on silage quality?
Anything to be cautious of?

Green&Red

Castlekeeper wrote: »

It's not a good idea to be introducing glyphosate directly into the food chain, it should be illegal.
It's an even worse idea to post it up here.

It’s a discussion board, I’ve asked a simple question. Thanks for the first sentence of your reply

Edit: it was something suggested to me, it sounds illogical

cosatron

Green&Red wrote: »

It’s a discussion board, I’ve asked a simple question. Thanks for the first sentence of your reply

Edit: it was something suggested to me, it sounds illogical

I think what means is that you just know who reads this forum

green daries

Green&Red wrote: »

You don't do it surely? You hold off on expansion until you're in a position to make the investment. Rules around compliance have to be there because its been proven that people won't comply unless they have to. You've to cut your cloth to measure.

We can complain all we like but we can see now whats coming down the tracks, the planning starts now. I've a lagoon, lots of rainwater off the yard going into it, I've five years to plan and sort it out. But I can't turn around in 2026 and be enraged that this is being foisted on me

We can see the closed period is going to be extended at some stage, we can't act like it'll be a shock when it comes. Your options will be to either provide more storage, B&B the cows to someone or, shocker, cut back on numbers


As for not taking a wage for five years, the mind f**king boggles

As for the wage bit I totally agree with you but this is what all the advisors say 5_7 years with no return

green daries

Castlekeeper wrote: »

It's not a good idea to be introducing glyphosate directly into the food chain, it should be illegal.
It's an even worse idea to post it up here.

Sad thing is that most of the grain crops are sprayed with glypos pre harvest now that should really be illegal 😢

Reggie.

Green&Red wrote: »

It’s a discussion board, I’ve asked a simple question. Thanks for the first sentence of your reply

Edit: it was something suggested to me, it sounds illogical

Has been done but has to be mowed on day 7 regardless

Dinzee Conlee

Castlekeeper wrote: »

It's not a good idea to be introducing glyphosate directly into the food chain, it should be illegal.
It's an even worse idea to post it up here.

I don’t agree with it, but as far as I know it isn’t illegal.
I dont see what’s wrong with posting it up here - this is a place to get information...

mahoney_j

green daries wrote: »

As for the wage bit I totally agree with you but this is what all the advisors say 5_7 years with no return

Easy for them promote that when there not the one doing it ….I worked off farm for 10 years ,best experience I got ,met people I’d of never met if I went straight home got life experience and traveled again both of which o would t of got to the extent I did if I went straight home ….I also got a wage every week and I was damned if when I went farming that would stop…..farming is a business snd long hours put in at times ,doing these hours and not drawing a decent wage shouldn’t be seen as a badge of honour ….labour even own labour should always be rewarded

Jb1989

Dinzee Conlee wrote: »

I don’t agree with it, but as far as I know it isn’t illegal.
I dont see what’s wrong with posting it up here - this is a place to get information...

Exactly.
It mightened make sense, but it is a common occurence, to take place before reseeding, and as such, I presume, it is not illegal.

Green&Red

Dinzee Conlee wrote: »

I don’t agree with it, but as far as I know it isn’t illegal.
I dont see what’s wrong with posting it up here - this is a place to get information...

I asked someone in RL, he made the same point about glyphosate, that it should just be fed to dry cows, which raised alarms with me anyway. In fairness the message makes sense

Castlekeeper

cosatron wrote: »

I think what means is that you just know who reads this forum

Exactly, which is why I've removed it, for all of our sakes.

Castlekeeper

green daries wrote: »

Sad thing is that most of the grain crops are sprayed with glypos pre harvest now that should really be illegal 😢

Afaik not any more, but I'm not a tillage farmer.

jaymla627

Castlekeeper wrote: »

Afaik not any more, but I'm not a tillage farmer.

Malting barley cant get the liquid sunshine, but feed barley its still perfectly legally, half the crops in the country in a wet year wouldnt be harvested without it

Mf310

jaymla627 wrote: »

Malting barley cant get the liquid sunshine, but feed barley its still perfectly legally, half the crops in the country in a wet year wouldnt be harvested without it

Even see an advertisement in the journal this week from round up “pre harvest weed control” and showing all the benefits of round up on the crop before harvest , maybe fair enough in a broken year but alot of lads using it on every crop in their place , wrong from even a farmers point of view whatever about a consumer looking in