Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

green daries

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121790227#Comment_121790227

Jasus if Heineken did coop takeovers......... I detect that your not a believer in this scenario playing out 😁

K.G.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121790629#Comment_121790629

I don't see it being discussed in the boardrooms of west cork anyway.

kevthegaff

Are tipp Co op looking for buyers atm?

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121790668#Comment_121790668

Not in the best of financial shape …rumours circulating of Arrabawn interest

kevthegaff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121790674#Comment_121790674

Do u think it makes sense

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121790717#Comment_121790717

On paper possibly but financially probably not ….he’ll of a lot to f people around feel we should of went to them instead of down west when we merged with Midwest

stanflt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121790605#Comment_121790605

Avg wage of 100000 per 1 million litres a farmer produces

jaymla627

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121790773#Comment_121790773

The exchangeable bond of a quater of a billion due in 2027 is what worries me most, that and ongoing pension liabilities which are insane, the self-praise the current management give themselves when in reality their just funding the business through selling plc shares and financing them like the above is dumbfonding....

ginger22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121787932#Comment_121787932

AFAIK the CoOp can take back the shares from any shareholder at face value not trading with them or seen to be doing something detrimental to the CoOp, that would be a standard rule in all CoOp's. The thing is no shareholder is trading with Kerry CoOp, so what do they do. I dont ICOS have any answer either, they are keeping their head down.

cap.in.hand.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121791752#Comment_121791752

You can't trade with Kerry coop as a coop shareholder

Mooooo

Fcuk me some amount of rain falling again, scrapers broke and a surprise in the cubicles. Covered in muck but would be worse if scrapers were going. Pricking around pumping slurry from tank to tank instead of getting it out is getting tiresome with feckall time to do it

ginger22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121791842#Comment_121791842

What kind of a nonsense comment is that. The only reason shareholders can't trade with Kerry CoOp is because they don't have any active business any more.

cap.in.hand.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121792289#Comment_121792289

Was wondering why you even suggest reasons the coop would want to take back coop shares from shareholders as they are still valuable so any reason would want to be airtight.

ginger22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121792503#Comment_121792503

Who said they would want to take back shares. I said that in the CoOp rules there is that provision. It is standard in all CoOp rules.

It doesn't need to be adjudicated on. That power is there. It was there before you became a shareholder.

I didn't say they would want to do it.

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121788291#Comment_121788291

Everything us open to a court challenge. The latest cooperative law was pit in place in 2022 it has never been in a court case yet.

The problem for Kerry Co-op is it a Co-operative in the meaning gnof the law. It produces or sells nothing. It even has failed to enforce a leadng milk price. Even onnits own website it states the redemption value of the old co-op shares

https://www.kerryco-op.com/share

It has put a pro ess in pla e for tge redemption of shares. Therefore the idea that it could decide to use the shares of B&C shareholders to buy the milk processing and agri part of Kerry group to fund tge buy out would definitely be challenged in court. What way the courts decide is open to interpretation.

Therefore Denis Brosnan statement tgat dairy farmers need to find a way outside that to purchase the agri entity is correct. The case would be wrapped up in court for 5+ years. He is correct in stating that the make up of the board is open to a court challenge as a court interpretation could decide there is no active members or it could decide that all share holders are technically the same none being technically active suppliers or purchasers of any product to or from the Co-op

There are many entities out there whereby it was taught the body involved is covered by legislation all is challengable in law, whether its An Bord Pleanala, the Medical Council, the Law Society or a department of Agriculture ruling.

In a court case both side could lose as the court could decide that KCO is not a Co-operative as the law defines one but a holding company

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121792991#Comment_121792991

The problem for Kerry Co-Op taking back shares it recognises the value of shares as being a multiple of Kerry group shares at present. Therefore again any attempt to redeem shares at the original monetary value would be open to a court challenge.

Another issue for KCO is tgat in all likelyhood the co-op would have to fund both side of such a challenge especially at the initial judicial review state as a member would be challenging the interpretation of a board decision. As long as the challenge was not considered frivolous the Co-op would probably be picking up all legal costs.

ginger22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121796066#Comment_121796066

It would take someone with deeper pockets than you or me to take that court challenge and in the end the decision could go either way. Then there is the fact that when you became a CoOp member you signed up to the terms and conditions. It is beyond my pay grade to figure out a solution.

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121796132#Comment_121796132

I am not a co-op member or do not own co-op shares. My understanding at present the co-op holding in Kerry group is worth about 1.5 billion.

Technically you either need deep pockets or you need nothing at all. In between can be a problem.

However as I stated at the judicial review stage of a decision the Co-op would probably be picking up both legal bills.

People signed up to T&C in many cases 50+ years ago, it may have bern there parents or grandparents.

Denis Brosnan is a fairly sharp individual and he may or may not have both Kerry group or Kerry Co-op shares, but his opinion is the dairy farmers need to find a way that is not dependent on B&C shareholders to fund the buyback.

It's questionable whether a majority A shareholders would even back it with the age profile of dairy farmers

straight

Nice to get these messages during calving season...

HerdPlus Msg: We have received a request from multiple AI companies for animal(s) in your herd to be genotyped. Please assign contract offers on www.icbf.com.

cosatron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121796481#Comment_121796481

fair play what's the ai code of the lad you have in ai at the moment.

cjpm

@straight is your fella available sexed?

ginger22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121796223#Comment_121796223

Don't think a lot of active dairy men are anxious to buy it. I believe the feeling out there is let them sweat.

K.G.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121796132#Comment_121796132

It's starting to look like the only way foward for kerry suppliers and the coop could be selling their milk to the highest bidder and forget about processing. Even if they did a deal with the.plc no shareholders will be willing to stump the cash

awaywithyou

a few weeks ago Kerry had a forward price scheme available to sign up to.. price was 37c/l... they have another one opening for applications today.. price is 43c/l.... 6c/l in a few weeks is some jump.... some shower of gangsters the lot of them.... i think id nearly rather Morris O'Shea from killorglin running the business he'd hardly be as bad....

older by the day

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121792089#Comment_121792089

The place is floating after last night. It must have absolutely let it down. At least the Sally bushes are flowering today. A couple of dry days would do a lot.

whelan2

Went out to do a bit of fencing. Good to be out in the fields. Just on foot too wet for jeep yet but it's a start

atlantic mist

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121796739#Comment_121796739

or they can buy the milk processing facilities back at a reasonable value, the producer group pretty much makes it a non viable business to buy from an external buyer especially when under the icos umbrella we have plenty of processing capacity across the island for suppliers....

dry shareholders can hold tight and trust in the active members who have led them to this point to make right call, they dont have a choice if they dont like that approach and they should sell coop shares, it is easy spin out some of value in coop at later stage, the active members have contributed with profit being used to expand the plc to the value it is today.....50-80m a year adds up....dry shareholders have little to challenge.....same in tirlan

if they cash out the kerry coop and not buy processing it puts the active milk suppliers at a disadvantage as they have to go and share up with another coop....goes against icos rules....kerry milk coop is and always was a milk coop, that is precisely why we have it in the rules active milk suppliers have control of all voting and rule changes......its to stop management teams/dry shareholders destroying a coop.....its cut and dry for icos.....

the coop plc shares are the coops not individual shareholders, the coop holds the investment, no one is entitled to plc shares, coop should buy processing if possible and keep some shares to shore up processing and to have a strong balance sheet and then give a nice spin out to all....everyone is happy

there is a reasonable outcome for all, the plc are shooting themselves in the foot with poor carry on over milk price and lack of investment in facilities over past number of years that just decreases the price processing is worth, the coop can sit and wait every year the plc price rises and the dairy assets are depreciating...its in plc interest to get a deal done quick and move on, there just trying to get the best deal for themselves ....to get a low margin business off the books is a win long term, its a game of chess at the moment....

A,B,C shares, tell brosnan to put his money where is mouth is and take the case to ICOS.....he'll have 6/8 active milk coop members sitting across the table to adjudicate deciding the faith of his submission....hes only embarrassing his intelligence with his comments on a,b,c shares....

we dont recognise the court system on these rules...coop law was in place before the irish courts system....written over 100 years ago and they were genesis as its still applying today when a plc with all its money and clout is trying to push around a few suppliers, how could they foresee that

ginger22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121797241#Comment_121797241

Yes, agree with what you say, a good summation.

Base price

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121797131#Comment_121797131

I walked most of the fence lines in the last few weeks and took a mental note of where we need new stakes driven, cut back the overhead branched etc. I headed out with my trusty IH454 with the transport box, stakes, wire etc the other day and she sat down after the stone gap. The fields are saturated.

K.G.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121797241#Comment_121797241

What's a reasonable price for it and what are the proportions of dry shareholders to milking shareholders on the coop

Coolcormack1979

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121796775#Comment_121796775

That will tell u where the price is going to be.the milk won’t be there they will have to pay for it.cowboys Ted,cowboys