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Barry Cowen sacked

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    #1622
    Cute Hoor
    Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭Cute Hoor


    Auguste Comte wrote: »
    I don't understand why Micheál didn't deal with it when the story first broke.

    Does Micheál have all the details (including all the questions left unanswered publicly by Cowen), it doesn't say much for him if he hasn't, if he has it's difficult to see why he hasn't asked Cowen to step down.


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    #1623
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    I thought that was pretty pointed alright, there are probably hundreds if not thousands who would be aware of this outside of the Pulse system.

    A lad that doesn't pay his bills is going to find it very difficult to keep secrets.


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    #1624
    Acosta
    Registered Users Posts: 2,378 ✭✭✭Acosta


    Darc19 wrote: »
    I would guess this is bravado talk.

    Do you believe everything someone tells you???

    These days a garda has to login to pulse and that login and the information they looked at is logged.

    And misuse can result in disciplinary action.

    Unless the garda is a complete eejit, it didn't happen.

    I've heard it from three different people that are related to Guards. I would have no reason to doubt them really. Two of them was over 10 years ago, but the thing I mentioned previously was only a couple of years back.

    What disciplinary action? Considering such large numbers can get away with falsifying breath tests and cancelling speeding fines without any action being taken, why would anything happen regarding things most outside the force no nothing about?


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    #1625
    wrangler
    Registered Users Posts: 11,177 ✭✭✭✭wrangler


    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    I thought that was pretty pointed alright, there are probably hundreds if not thousands who would be aware of this outside of the Pulse system.

    Even if he succeeds in 'correcting' the report as he says, no one will believe him or even the guards.


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    #1626
    Cute Hoor
    Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭Cute Hoor


    wrangler wrote: »
    Even if he succeeds in 'correcting' the report as he says, no one will believe him or even the guards.

    To get the report corrected, 2 or more Gardai will have to accept they reported incorrectly, putting their careers on the line.


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    #1627
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    Cute Hoor wrote: »
    To get the report corrected, 2 or more Gardai will have to accept they reported incorrectly, putting their careers on the line.

    You would have to ask, what would be their motivation to do so, and how would they benefit?


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    #1628
    NickNickleby
    Registered Users Posts: 1,823 ✭✭✭NickNickleby


    Acosta wrote: »
    I've heard it from three different people that are related to Guards. I would have no reason to doubt them really. Two of them was over 10 years ago, but the thing I mentioned previously was only a couple of years back.

    What disciplinary action? Considering such large numbers can get away with falsifying breath tests and cancelling speeding fines without any action being taken, why would anything happen regarding things most outside the force no nothing about?

    I actually know a person who was sacked from the Civil Service for passing on information. this wasn't something that was all over the papers hence requiring some sort of response from officialdom. It was something that by a stroke of good/bad (depending on your viewpoint) luck came to light. Bang, Gone! I think the info perhaps was being passed to journos, but can't be sure. What shocked me was that while the person involved was at a low enough level, they wouldn't have been badly paid, and I always say : how much is your job worth to you? Is it worth a million, to jeopardise it? Or a few grand? Or the price of a few pints? (yes, the decider should be the legality of your actions).

    Anyway, this is just an attempted smokescreen by Cowen. Divert/ confuse / obfuscate, bit like on Boards. He's attempting to 'derail the thread'. I expect that the record in question is all in order, and he's trying to misrepresent what it implies. After all, a lot of the discussion is now about whether or not a Garda leaked info. Of course, if he now has a copy of said record, shouldn't he reveal its contents, rather than make misleading comments about it.


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    #1629
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    NickNickleby wrote: »
    I actually know a person who was sacked from the Civil Service for passing on information. this wasn't something that was all over the papers hence requiring some sort of response from officialdom. It was something that by a stroke of good/bad (depending on your viewpoint) luck came to light. Bang, Gone! I think the info perhaps was being passed to journos, but can't be sure. What shocked me was that while the person involved was at a low enough level, they wouldn't have been badly paid, and I always say : how much is your job worth to you? Is it worth a million, to jeopardise it? Or a few grand? Or the price of a few pints? (yes, the decider should be the legality of your actions).

    Anyway, this is just an attempted smokescreen by Cowen. Divert/ confuse / obfuscate, bit like on Boards. He's attempting to 'derail the thread'. I expect that the record in question is all in order, and he's trying to misrepresent what it implies. After all, a lot of the discussion is now about whether or not a Garda leaked info. Of course, if he now has a copy of said record, shouldn't he reveal its contents, rather than make misleading comments about it.

    There was a guy who worked for social welfare passing details to debt collectors, he was sacked and charged


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    #1630
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    NickNickleby wrote: »
    I actually know a person who was sacked from the Civil Service for passing on information. this wasn't something that was all over the papers hence requiring some sort of response from officialdom. It was something that by a stroke of good/bad (depending on your viewpoint) luck came to light. Bang, Gone! I think the info perhaps was being passed to journos, but can't be sure. What shocked me was that while the person involved was at a low enough level, they wouldn't have been badly paid, and I always say : how much is your job worth to you? Is it worth a million, to jeopardise it? Or a few grand? Or the price of a few pints? (yes, the decider should be the legality of your actions).

    Anyway, this is just an attempted smokescreen by Cowen. Divert/ confuse / obfuscate, bit like on Boards. He's attempting to 'derail the thread'. I expect that the record in question is all in order, and he's trying to misrepresent what it implies. After all, a lot of the discussion is now about whether or not a Garda leaked info. Of course, if he now has a copy of said record, shouldn't he reveal its contents, rather than make misleading comments about it.

    There was a guy who worked for social welfare passing details to debt collectors, he was sacked and charged


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    #1631
    NickNickleby
    Registered Users Posts: 1,823 ✭✭✭NickNickleby


    RandomViewer wrote: »
    There was a guy who worked for social welfare passing details to debt collectors, he was sacked and charged

    My one was a woman. I didn't hear anything about her being charged, just sacked.


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    #1632
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    NickNickleby wrote: »
    My one was a woman. I didn't hear anything about her being charged, just sacked.

    Think this guy was paid a few hundred for each search, was only charged for a few but he was probably making a nice penny

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/social-protection-worker-charged-with-divulging-information-1.1805411


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    #1633
    RandomViewer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    Wouldn't correcting the records open the floodgates to others


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    #1634
    Sephiroth_dude
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 80,548 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sephiroth_dude


    StackSteevens wrote: »
    Congrats on your elevation to trainee Moderator. Presumably the Boards.ie selection panel overlooked your mental age.




    .

    Mod

    Do not post in this thread again.


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    #1635
    KaneToad
    Registered Users Posts: 3,388 ✭✭✭KaneToad


    Has anyone asked Cowen if he ever turned away from a checkpoint and was pursued?

    He's adamant that it didn't occur the time he was disqualified in 2016. But he seems to be specifying the 2016 incident too much.

    Just a thought...


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    #1636
    theoneeyedman
    Registered Users Posts: 6,546 ✭✭✭theoneeyedman


    mr_edge_to_you wrote: »
    Incidentally, at the end of his report a few minutes ago Paul Reynolds was pointing out that the source of the leak could also have been from justice, legal or (shock horror....) the political system.

    Reynolds is hardly a balanced source in this though is he, relies on Garda sources to feed him stories all the time, a good ally of them over the years.

    I've no truck with Cowan, but this is a carefully orchestrated campaign, around what is really a non story at this stage.


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    #1637
    Jizique
    Registered Users Posts: 1,911 ✭✭✭Jizique


    theoneeyedman wrote: »
    Reynolds is hardly a balanced source in this though is he, relies on Garda sources to feed him stories all the time, a good ally of them over the years.

    I've no truck with Cowan, but this is a carefully orchestrated campaign, around what is really a non story at this stage.

    It is such a non-story that he should have let it die; he seems to want to keep it going, which says more about him than anything else.
    I am interested in news and politics but had no idea about any possible attempt to avoid a checkpoint until he made a deal out of it.


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    #1638
    Auguste Comte
    Registered Users Posts: 1,143 ✭✭✭Auguste Comte


    KaneToad wrote: »
    Has anyone asked Cowen if he ever turned away from a checkpoint and was pursued?

    He's adamant that it didn't occur the time he was disqualified in 2016. But he seems to be specifying the 2016 incident too much.

    Just a thought...

    He's adamant that he didn't attempt to evade the guards, he never said he didn't turn away from a checkpoint.


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    #1639
    mr_edge_to_you
    Registered Users Posts: 3,116 ✭✭✭mr_edge_to_you


    theoneeyedman wrote: »
    Reynolds is hardly a balanced source in this though is he, relies on Garda sources to feed him stories all the time, a good ally of them over the years.

    I've no truck with Cowan, but this is a carefully orchestrated campaign, around what is really a non story at this stage.

    Agree with you on Reynolds but I thought the comment itself was interesting.


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    #1640
    KaneToad
    Registered Users Posts: 3,388 ✭✭✭KaneToad


    Auguste Comte wrote: »
    He's adamant that he didn't attempt to evade the guards, he never said he didn't turn away from a checkpoint.

    True. Looking at the statement, it would tie in with your point.

    Mr Cowen said: “I did not evade, or attempt to evade, a Garda. Such an act would constitute a serious criminal offence and I was not charged with such an offence.”

    He's saying he wasn't charged with evading a guard. Therefore it didn't happen.

    Is it plausible that guarda would see him turning away from checkpoint, catch up with him and then follow through on the drink driving end of things and not bother pursuing the evasion end of things. Is the proving a evasion a higher bar to reach and therefore not pursued?


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    #1641
    Snow Garden
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Snow Garden


    When is Cowen going to stop hiding behind Dail speeches and statements and actually answer straight questions?

    Maybe a Sean Sean Sean interview would be good?


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    #1642
    jam_mac_jam
    Registered Users Posts: 4,731 ✭✭✭jam_mac_jam


    If it's true he evaded a check then he needs to go.


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    #1643
    expectationlost
    Registered Users Posts: 11,943 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    what would they charge somebody turning around from a checkpoint and being pursued and caught with?

    to me it seems they would usually just charge them with the drunk driving charge if he was found to be drunk and thats it.


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    #1644
    KaneToad
    Registered Users Posts: 3,388 ✭✭✭KaneToad


    jam_mac_jam wrote: »
    If it's true he evaded a check then he needs to go.

    He's saying he wasn't charged with evading a check. Getting into semantics...


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    #1645
    jam_mac_jam
    Registered Users Posts: 4,731 ✭✭✭jam_mac_jam


    KaneToad wrote: »
    He's saying he wasn't charged with evading a check. Getting into semantics...

    Which to me sounds a bit like I did not have sexual relations with that woman.


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    #1646
    oceanman
    Registered Users Posts: 1,757 ✭✭✭oceanman


    theoneeyedman wrote: »
    Reynolds is hardly a balanced source in this though is he, relies on Garda sources to feed him stories all the time, a good ally of them over the years.

    I've no truck with Cowan, but this is a carefully orchestrated campaign, around what is really a non story at this stage.

    very true...reynolds is simply a puppet for the cops, what a great force we have. ect...


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    #1647
    Sunny Disposition
    Registered Users Posts: 2,779 ✭✭✭Sunny Disposition


    The Guards involved had nothing to gain from recording that Cowen tried to turn around before reaching them.
    Extremely, extremely unlikely they lied about it and then kept it quiet for years!
    Amazing how unfortunate one can be to drink and drive for the first time in your whole life ,have a very small amount, then get caught hours later and then have the Guards make up a story about you trying to drive away!!!😅


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    #1648
    lawrencesummers
    Registered Users Posts: 8,595 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Cowen is playing a dangerous game taking on the Garda version of events, considering he was the one who had been drinking.


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    #1649
    DellyBelly
    Registered Users Posts: 3,083 ✭✭✭DellyBelly


    lawrencesummers wrote: »
    Cowen is playing a dangerous game taking on the Garda version of events, considering he was the one who had been drinking.

    Exactly. I felt a little sorry for him but the fact he knowingly did a u-turn at a checkpoint makes what he did even worse. Surprised he hasn't stepped down


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    #1650
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,470 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    KaneToad wrote: »
    True. Looking at the statement, it would tie in with your point.

    Mr Cowen said: “I did not evade, or attempt to evade, a Garda. Such an act would constitute a serious criminal offence and I was not charged with such an offence.”

    He's saying he wasn't charged with evading a guard. Therefore it didn't happen.

    Is it plausible that guarda would see him turning away from checkpoint, catch up with him and then follow through on the drink driving end of things and not bother pursuing the evasion end of things. Is the proving a evasion a higher bar to reach and therefore not pursued?

    there is no offence of turning away from a checkpoint.


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    #1651
    Snow Garden
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Snow Garden


    DellyBelly wrote: »
    Surprised he hasn't stepped down

    Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive.

    This will be a tough week for Cowen but you'd be surprised how brazen FFG TDs have become in recent years.

    He will be praying a bigger story comes around this week or he will need to start answering straight questions rather than hiding behind statements.


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