Barry Cowen sacked

Auguste Comte

walshb wrote: »

It is a ridiculously tough gig, and even tougher than years gone by. Because today you have every little scrote out to slate you and discredit you, because every scrote now has a voice...

When you talk about every little "scrote" having a voice, would you be talking about citizens, voters?

Would you prefer if the voters you don't agree with had their voice silenced?

Yurt2

walshb wrote: »

I did not even imply it..

You are talking rubbish!

Getting prickly over a drink driver TD getting scrutinized? 'Every scrote has a voice?' I'd say you were.

And not exactly the sentiments of a democrat

Bannasidhe

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Would being in possession of explosives be included?

Doubt it, a chara.

Importing arms?

Nah.

Oh I dunno.
Haughey's involvement with arms was well known but he still got to be Taoiseach.

But let's not keep banging on about conflicts that ended decade ago.

Do you have something to say about future candidates being vetted before they run for election?

walshb

Yurt! wrote: »

Getting prickly over a drink driver TD getting scrutinized? 'Every scrote has a voice?' I'd say you were.

And not exactly the sentiments of a democrat

My views on drink driving Cowen are clear..

My post that you are tackling is a general post about politicians in Irish life!

walshb

Auguste Comte wrote: »

When you talk about every little "scrote" having a voice, would you be talking about citizens, voters?

Would you prefer if the voters you don't agree with had their voice silenced?

I think you know what I mean...

No issue at all with questioning and challenging and quizzing and scrutinising...

I am not a scrote, and I don’t think you are..

I don’t think 99 percent politicians are in it for themselves...

The very nature of the position is to serve, to be judged, and to get things done for the betterment of society..and of course, there are great politicians and not so great; such is life...

But many of them want to do good..

Brendan Bendar

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Oh I dunno.
Haughey's involvement with arms was well known but he still got to be Taoiseach.

But let's not keep banging on about conflicts that ended decade ago.

Do you have something to say about future candidates being vetted before they run for election?

Uhmmmm......if we differentiate betweeen what some refer to as ‘conflicts’ and others refer to as criminality we might find it difficult to find many suitable to go forward for election.

If we have party leaders driving a coach and four through State regulations, I’m afraid the process would be difficult to police.

I wouldt as a taxpayer feel like paying folk to ‘sit down’ and try to see what would ‘bar’ folk from going forward for election or not.

We’d have punters arguing on the head of a pin for.......well... experience says around 10 years.

BonnieSituation

Muahahaha wrote: »

Just reading in the Phoenix there that amongst FFers there is an atmosphere of 'let those without sin' doing the rounds and that FFers are widely circulating a 2004 invoice to Michael Martin for his two night stay in the Hotel de Bergues in Geneva at a cost of 3,800 euro to the taxpayer. He was Minister for Health at the time.

Its a nothing story really and the details were aired before anyway. Plus an invoice isnt going to change anything from way back in 2004 when we all knew they were partying.

But nonetheless its most enjoyable watching Fianna Fail eating themselves from the inside out.

I remember that well. God, simpler times.

mikeym

But County Offaly dont have a minister anymore.

Oh well what a pity, we move on and some other politician will be disgraced.

Bannasidhe

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Uhmmmm......if we differentiate betweeen what some refer to as ‘conflicts’ and others refer to as criminality we might find it difficult to find many suitable to go forward for election.

If we have party leaders driving a coach and four through State regulations, I’m afraid the process would be difficult to police.

I wouldt as a taxpayer feel like paying folk to ‘sit down’ and try to see what would ‘bar’ folk from going forward for election or not.

We’d have punters arguing on the head of a pin for.......well... experience says around 10 years.

Yes or No Brendan.

Do you think candidates for election should be vetted and obliged to supply full disclosure to their prospective employers i.e. the electorate?

BonnieSituation

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Uhmmmm......if we differentiate betweeen what some refer to as ‘conflicts’ and others refer to as criminality we might find it difficult to find many suitable to go forward for election.

If we have party leaders driving a coach and four through State regulations, I’m afraid the process would be difficult to police.

I wouldt as a taxpayer feel like paying folk to ‘sit down’ and try to see what would ‘bar’ folk from going forward for election or not.

We’d have punters arguing on the head of a pin for.......well... experience says around 10 years.

Fighting the good fight there BB.

Seriously, what's the longest you've gone in a post without bringing up SF either directly or indirectly?

BonnieSituation

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Yes or No Brendan.

Do you think candidates for election should be vetted and obliged to supply full disclosure to their prospective employers i.e. the electorate?

I don't think candidates should be vetted as you say. I think ministers and judges etc at that level should be or at least made declare anything potentially "hoary" in their pasts'.

I think that criminals (ie. those not subject to an amnesty negotiated as part of a peace process) and tax defaulters should be barred from parliament. Like say, Lowry and Wallace should never have darkened the Dáil as long as they have/did.

SouthWesterly

BonnieSituation wrote: »

I don't think candidates should be vetted as you say. I think ministers and judges etc at that level should be or at least made declare anything potentially "hoary" in their pasts'.

I think that criminals (ie. those not subject to an amnesty negotiated as part of a peace process) and tax defaulters should be barred from parliament. Like say, Lowry and Wallace should never have darkened the Dáil as long as they have/did.

Lowry and Wallace say as much about the type of people in their constituencies as about themselves.
The voters knowing what they know are still more than willing to put them in again and again.

ExMachina1000

Home safe and sound

Bannasidhe

BonnieSituation wrote: »

I don't think candidates should be vetted as you say. I think ministers and judges etc at that level should be or at least made declare anything potentially "hoary" in their pasts'.

I think that criminals (ie. those not subject to an amnesty negotiated as part of a peace process) and tax defaulters should be barred from parliament. Like say, Lowry and Wallace should never have darkened the Dáil as long as they have/did.

The more I think about it the more I'm in favour of it.

I'm regularly vetted for various jobs I do (why there isn't a simple annual vetting rather than having to do a separate one for separate things is a mystery and a pain in the hole but off topic) and can't start doing those jobs (some are unpaid volunteer, some have a bit of an influence on people's futures, some I may come into contact with children) until I have been certified as not convicted of anything.

None of those jobs will ever put me in a position where I will be voting on legislation.

I honestly think that we have the right to know if those who will be well paid to write, frame, vote on, enact the laws of the land have respected the laws of the land.

It's time we treated candidates as prospective employees not possible fixers.

Zebra3

There is a register of interest for members of the Oireachtas to keep updated in the interests of democracy.

I don't see why those running for public office should not have to disclose those interests in advance as well as any law breaking since they were 18.

CrankyHaus

The problem is that barring "criminals" from politics opens the door to criminalising dissent and weakening the legitimacy of the democratic system, perhaps fatally.
It seems like a remote prospect in Ireland in 2020, but was it one in Ireland in 1980, or 1920?
Or in other EU countries today, like Spain with Catalan separatists, or many Central or Eastern European countries. Arguably Russia's well down that path already.

Plumbthedepths

The calibre of Irish politicians, it's a pity we don't pay them more.


Irish politician has to be woken up to vote

https://news.sky.com/video/share-12030178

Bannasidhe

CrankyHaus wrote: »

The problem is that barring "criminals" from politics opens the door to criminalising dissent and weakening the legitimacy of the democratic system, perhaps fatally.
It seems like a remote prospect in Ireland in 2020, but was it one in Ireland in 1980, or 1920?
Or in other EU countries today, like Spain with Catalan separatists, or many Central or Eastern European countries. Arguably Russia's well down that path already.

I never mentioned barring.

I suggested that as prospective employees all candidates should let their prospective employers (the electorate) know in advance about any issues of a legal nature.
It is then up to the employers (the electorate) if they wish to hire that candidate or not.

People handing out food to the homeless are vetting.
People who decide the laws of the land aren't.
Strikes me as being a bit arseways.

Full disclosure up front.
Certainly better than finding out years later and having the Dáil spend days discussing it when frankly it has far more important things to focus on.

LillySV

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

The calibre of Irish politicians, it's a pity we don't pay them more.


Irish politician has to be woken up to vote

https://news.sky.com/video/share-12030178

Fukin brilliant description by sky news... independent/fg.ie wouldn’t show it that way

BonnieSituation

CrankyHaus wrote: »

The problem is that barring "criminals" from politics opens the door to criminalising dissent and weakening the legitimacy of the democratic system, perhaps fatally.
It seems like a remote prospect in Ireland in 2020, but was it one in Ireland in 1980, or 1920?
Or in other EU countries today, like Spain with Catalan separatists, or many Central or Eastern European countries. Arguably Russia's well down that path already.

You're right, but I think say, gaining a criminal conviction while in the Dáil should probably get you kicked out and barred from running from office again.

Anyway, more to the point, the Drink Driving is not what got him sacked it was the thick headedness.

Liamo57

Ber Cowan reared 2 great contributors to Irish society. On behalf of Ireland Ber, thank you. I am so sorry that Barry was shafted over a few pints......disgraceful is what it is.....who never drank 2 pints and drove a car.....for God sake. Up Clara.

Jesus wept.

Brendan Bendar

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Fighting the good fight there BB.

Seriously, what's the longest you've gone in a post without bringing up SF either directly or indirectly?

Gotta fight fire with fire, Bee.

Liamo57

Liamo57 wrote: »

Ber Cowan reared 2 great contributors to Irish society. On behalf of Ireland Ber, thank you. I am so sorry that Barry was shafted over a few pints......disgraceful is what it is.....who never drank 2 pints and drove a car.....for God sake. Up Clara.

Tonight's GAA Lotto Draw will be held in The Pike Bar. All welcome.
Would the owner of a 02-OY Volkswagon Jetta please remove it from the entrance to the church, Ciss Kennedy is blocked
The blessings of the graves will take place on the first Tuesday of August, weather permitting.
This concludes the Clara announcements.

Cute Hoor

Liamo57 wrote: »

Ber Cowan reared 2 great contributors to Irish society. On behalf of Ireland Ber, thank you. I am so sorry that Barry was shafted over a few pints......disgraceful is what it is.....who never drank 2 pints and drove a car.....for God sake. Up Clara.

True, and don't forget those 2 pints were 6 hours earlier and Barry, having watched the match from the stands, then had a light meal before driving. Disgraceful the way he's been treated, up Clara.

It wasnt me123

SouthWesterly wrote: »

Lowry and Wallace say as much about the type of people in their constituencies as about themselves.
The voters knowing what they know are still more than willing to put them in again and again.

No they aren’t. I live in Tipperary and I’m fed up with North Tipp continually voting Lowry in - its disgusting - he’s been proven to be crooked and still they vote for him - I’m embarrassed every election when he tops the poll in North Tipp. Our TDS should grow a pair and put in stricter conditions for people apply for high office. We should demand our political representatives are of a much higher calibre

Yurt2

It wasnt me123 wrote: »

No they aren’t. I live in Tipperary and I’m fed up with North Tipp continually voting Lowry in - its disgusting - he’s been proven to be crooked and still they vote for him - I’m embarrassed every election when he tops the poll in North Tipp. Our TDS should grow a pair and put in stricter conditions for people apply for high office. We should demand our political representatives are of a much higher calibre

Lowry has some sort of voodoo hex over the people of Tipperary. You'd be ran out of it with pikes in certain parts of the county if you dared to criticize him.

The ghost of Kim Il Sung looks on jealously at his personality cult.

walshb

It wasnt me123 wrote: »

No they aren’t. I live in Tipperary and I’m fed up with North Tipp continually voting Lowry in - its disgusting - he’s been proven to be crooked and still they vote for him - I’m embarrassed every election when he tops the poll in North Tipp. Our TDS should grow a pair and put in stricter conditions for people apply for high office. We should demand our political representatives are of a much higher calibre

The issue is that the man shouldn't be permitted to run....

The voters are not the issue here. The system that allows him to run is!

Brendan Bendar

walshb wrote: »

The issue is that the man shouldn't be permitted to run....

The voters are not the issue here. The system that allows him to run is!

The issue is the voters........

eagle eye

walshb wrote:

My views on drink driving Cowen are clear..
My post that you are tackling is a general post about politicians in Irish life!

What's your opinion on Buckley?