Advice for a noob

dave_o_brien

Well, not quite a total noob, I guess...

I dabbled with a bit of mtb-ing 7 to 10 years ago, but was never any good. I've kept up road riding, but recently got myself a Cannondale Trail 4. It was also a time when there were far fewer people into it. Which leads me to my question:

Is there any time that it would be better to head to the likes of Ticknock that would be more suitable for nervous, slow and inexperienced riders? When I used to head there, the trails were quiet but experience running and walking up there shows there's a huge increase in bike traffic, which is great.

But I plan on heading up there over the weekend and some evenings. I am an experienced enough bike rider to be willing to be a bit bolshy about my space, but also don't want to be a d1ck and hold up others unnecessarily... With that in mind, I'd appreciate any advice people can give about whether there are any beginner focussed times or anything like that.

Also there seems to have been a huge increase in the trails and they all have names now. This confuses me... There used to be the route down from the mast towards the car park beside what was called boneshaker (an unofficial route) and an upper loop that brought you back to a fire road and up again to the mast. Which loops are these on all the maps?!

Thanks all in advance. Any advice would be welcome.

Bot1

dave_o_brien wrote: »

Well, not quite a total noob, I guess...

I dabbled with a bit of mtb-ing 7 to 10 years ago, but was never any good. I've kept up road riding, but recently got myself a Cannondale Trail 4. It was also a time when there were far fewer people into it. Which leads me to my question:

Is there any time that it would be better to head to the likes of Ticknock that would be more suitable for nervous, slow and inexperienced riders? When I used to head there, the trails were quiet but experience running and walking up there shows there's a huge increase in bike traffic, which is great.

But I plan on heading up there over the weekend and some evenings. I am an experienced enough bike rider to be willing to be a bit bolshy about my space, but also don't want to be a d1ck and hold up others unnecessarily... With that in mind, I'd appreciate any advice people can give about whether there are any beginner focussed times or anything like that.

Also there seems to have been a huge increase in the trails and they all have names now. This confuses me... There used to be the route down from the mast towards the car park beside what was called boneshaker (an unofficial route) and an upper loop that brought you back to a fire road and up again to the mast. Which loops are these on all the maps?!

Thanks all in advance. Any advice would be welcome.

Hi Dave

I was in a very similar situation to you about one year ago.

What I did was head up to Ticknock or Ballinastoe early (8am) while it's nice and quiet and just stick to the official Coilte trails until you get nice and confident on those.

Then maybe explore the blue trails at the Glencullen Adventure Park (GAP).

The bike you have will be perfect for this type of riding!

If in a few months you have stuck with the MTB and are looking for something more get back onto this forum and I'd have some further advice (enduro riding, natural trails and joining a club etc.)

Good luck with it!

Flagrantfolly

Good advice from Bot1...early morning is your best bet, it really builds up from 10am as that's when the rentals from Biking.ie start.

On the trails, the upper loops you mention are called Afterburner and Blazin Saddles. Afterburner is a flowy singletrack through the forest predominantly and Blazin Saddles starts a bit further up and is the more rocky, technical trail. The trail from the masts down to the carpark is now called Skyline. Great trail, fast and flowy.

Similarly to yourself, I used to be up there regularly around 2010/11 and only got back into it properly last year. I found it a good bit different in that the coillte trails are very well maintained now, whereas back in the day, everything felt a bit "off the beaten track". There's a single track loop now too, which I don't think was there back then (well I never found it anyway ), which gets you off the fireroad pretty early on for climbing up to the masts...while mostly uphill there's some nice flowy, fast sections too.

Fair play to you for getting back out...enjoy!

mad turnip

If your past riding the main coilte loops in ticknock and ballinastoe. The next spots I'd generally say are slade valley and ballinastoe natural trails.
Slade valley is quite tame and does be very quiet generally.
Ballinastoes natural trails don't really have any big features and are quite wide in parts although none are on the maps.

Check out trailforks website/app for map information on slade.
Ticknock does be mad busy these days and if you want some space to yourself to try get past some features its not really the place to be going.

As Bot1 said the trails up in the GAP are very beginner friendly and as you progress from the blues to the reds they introduce slightly bigger features, the trails are designed quite well and not as tight and technical as some of the natural stuff around Wicklow.

JazzyJ

dave_o_brien wrote: »

Well, not quite a total noob, I guess...

I dabbled with a bit of mtb-ing 7 to 10 years ago, but was never any good. I've kept up road riding, but recently got myself a Cannondale Trail 4. It was also a time when there were far fewer people into it. Which leads me to my question:

Is there any time that it would be better to head to the likes of Ticknock that would be more suitable for nervous, slow and inexperienced riders? When I used to head there, the trails were quiet but experience running and walking up there shows there's a huge increase in bike traffic, which is great.

But I plan on heading up there over the weekend and some evenings. I am an experienced enough bike rider to be willing to be a bit bolshy about my space, but also don't want to be a d1ck and hold up others unnecessarily... With that in mind, I'd appreciate any advice people can give about whether there are any beginner focussed times or anything like that.

Also there seems to have been a huge increase in the trails and they all have names now. This confuses me... There used to be the route down from the mast towards the car park beside what was called boneshaker (an unofficial route) and an upper loop that brought you back to a fire road and up again to the mast. Which loops are these on all the maps?!

Thanks all in advance. Any advice would be welcome.

See the map here:

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showpost.php?p=110486410&postcount=93

From the map, Boneshaker runs parallel to Skyline on the eastern edge of the forest. I'm guessing the other loop that you're thinking of is Afterburner (the old Metro 2!), or Blazin Saddles which is a branch off it built about 5 or 6 years ago.

No beginner focussed times - sure just get out there and enjoy it. Saying that Saturday and Sunday mornings/afternoons are probably the busiest.

Anyone that gives you grief is a dick - especially on the trail centre trails! Don't get too caught up on holding someone up - they should give you a warning that they're there, and you can pull over to the side to let them through when its safe for you - if its done right you won't even need to put your foot down. Beginners worry far too much about being in the way - we've all been there!

fatbhoy

The bike you have is more suited to the sanctioned/official Coillte trails because those are trails that contain easy features. The bike is a hardtail with short travel on the front, so it's not going to be nice to do rough trails that have drops and jumps and stuff like that.

For easy, Coillte trails, go to Ticknock (3 main trails) or Ballinastoe (about 8 trails there).

Trails are marked by signposts, and you can find them by following the signposts on the fireroads. Download the TrailForks app for Android or iPhone too. That has the trails mapped out too, and works a bit like Google Maps in that it shows your current position on the map, and the trails also.

Listen for riders approaching behind you, and then pull in on the trail and stop to let the riders past.

Quietest times:

Ticknock

Weekdays: during the day < 6pm, or late evening >8pm

Weekends: evening

Ballinastoe

Weekdays: all the time

Weekends: late afternoon and evening (> 4pm)

dave_o_brien

fatbhoy wrote: »

The bike you have is more suited to the sanctioned/official Coillte trails because those are trails that contain easy features. The bike is a hardtail with short travel on the front, so it's not going to be nice to do rough trails that have drops and jumps and stuff like that.

For easy, Coillte trails, go to Ticknock (3 main trails) or Ballinastoe (about 8 trails there).

Trails are marked by signposts, and you can find them by following the signposts on the fireroads. Download the TrailForks app for Android or iPhone too. That has the trails mapped out too, and works a bit like Google Maps in that it shows your current position on the map, and the trails also.

Listen for riders approaching behind you, and then pull in on the trail and stop to let the riders past.

Quietest times:

Ticknock

Weekdays: during the day < 6pm, or late evening >8pm

Weekends: evening

Ballinastoe

Weekdays: all the time

Weekends: late afternoon and evening (> 4pm)

All I intend on doing is straightforward enough single track for the time being! Back in the day I'd have been far more ballsy about drops on a hardtail with 80mm fork but now I've a kid to come home to! This is just to mix up my exercise a bit and enjoy myself.

Thanks for your advice too!

fatbhoy

dave_o_brien wrote: »

All I intend on doing is straightforward enough single track for the time being! Back in the day I'd have been far more ballsy about drops on a hardtail with 80mm fork but now I've a kid to come home to! This is just to mix up my exercise a bit and enjoy myself.

Thanks for your advice too!

Sounds like you'll be back to your old level in no time. Ballinastoe would be the perfect place to get the confidence because you probably wouldn't meet even a single person there at all, especially during the quiet times I mentioned.

The Gap, near Johnny Fox's pub, is worth going to too for the blue trails. You book online for a fiver (that gets you into the place for pedal-ups, as opposed to uplift vans, for the entire day), sign the waiver online too, call in to reception to mention your booking on the day, and they give you a coloured wrapper ticket for your handlebars. It's quiet during the day, busy enough at weekends, and busy enough on the only evening they open late: Thursday till 9pm.

dave_o_brien

fatbhoy wrote: »

Sounds like you'll be back to your old level in no time. Ballinastoe would be the perfect place to get the confidence because you probably wouldn't meet even a single person there at all, especially during the quiet times I mentioned.

The Gap, near Johnny Fox's pub, is worth going to too for the blue trails. You book online for a fiver (that gets you into the place for pedal-ups, as opposed to uplift vans, for the entire day), sign the waiver online too, call in to reception to mention your booking on the day, and they give you a coloured wrapper ticket for your handlebars. It's quiet during the day, busy enough at weekends, and busy enough on the only evening they open late: Thursday till 9pm.

My old level was still fairly rubbish, but look, I'm a faster cyclist than all the folk staying indoors.

prunudo

One to thing to keep in mind keep the focus on whats in front of you. Its up to the rider behind to stop or adjust their speed to suit yours. By all means let them know your intentions and pull in where possible but don't feel you have to drop the anchors at the sound of a rider behind.

One gripe I have with the Coillte trails is the lack of varying grading for different abilities. You have experienced riders mixing with complete beginners and families. A more open policy regarding natural trails would stop a lot of this.

dave_o_brien

So is the general consensus that the official trails are easier than they were previously? From memory, there was a couple of spots on Skyline you needed your wits about you to avoid a tree and one kind of half pp drop-and-up again that was always in bad nick and you really needed to "lift" the bike out of... Afterburner/ Blazin Saddles had a reasonably tricky rocky section with a bit of descending you kind of had to commit to to get through handy. Have these been made easier?

(I'd be delighted if they had, for my current purposes!)

Flagrantfolly

Yep, defo easier than what they used to be. Blazin Saddles, particularly at the top, still needs a fair bit of commitment and speed but After Burner and Skyline can be cruised down at whatever speed suits

nak

Ticknock is busy at the weekends but we're not talking Whistler busy its mostly walkers. Have been up there Saturday mornings and haven't met that many on the official loop - maybe 1 or 2 people.

dave_o_brien

Went up this morning and frankly had a great time. Was lovely and quiet, only 3 other cyclists at the car park who I never saw again. The time and rain clearly keeping it quiet this morning!

Observations:

The trails - there are more of them and they're all in better condition. There seems to have been a split in the upper trail which I take it is Afterburner or Blazin Saddles. I reckon I stuck to Afterburner and it was great glad to have avoided the more technical stuff for a solo first spin.

The bike - loved it. Why was there ever any debate on 29ers?! The only thing I'll change are the pedals and the position of the shifters. Even the pedals, I think I'm better off holding on to the flats for a bit before getting spd's. One question I'd have is why don't people use bar ends?! I know they look rubbish, but they'd have been good to have for the fire roads.

Me - I'm happy with that for a 1st spin. Got through all but one rocky patch, which was early (in devils elbow I think) and am confident I would have gotten through it had it been later in thr spin and my confidence had grown. Need to be more mindful of pedal strike too.

Strava link below:

https://strava.app.link/mIYqeBCAd8

iwillhtfu

dave_o_brien wrote: »

I think I'm better off holding on to the flats for a bit before getting spd's. One question I'd have is why don't people use bar ends?! I know they look rubbish, but they'd have been good to have for the fire roads.

The less things that can impale you on your bike the better and yes they also look pants unless your bike packing then maybe

*****Warning this is graphic*****

Cedric Gracia impaling himself with his brake lever :eek:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsHz1IlLVyg

dave_o_brien

iwillhtfu wrote: »

The less things that can impale you on your bike the better and yes they also look pants unless your bike packing then maybe

*****Warning this is graphic*****

Cedric Gracia impaling himself with his brake lever :eek:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsHz1IlLVyg

I'm neither gonna watch that nor remove my brake levers

iwillhtfu

dave_o_brien wrote: »

I'm neither gonna watch that nor remove my brake levers

Its certainly an eye opener on how quickly things can wrong.

dave_o_brien

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Its certainly an eye opener on how quickly things can wrong.

Not saying your point is unreasonable, by the way. Obviously crashes happen and the more pointy bits there, the more risks there are. I would be minded of the disc brake debate inbroad riding ("they'll cut through you like butter") which was nonsense. I accept that the benefits of disc brakes are much greater than the benefits of bar ends, don't get me qrong, but my hands were uncomfortable at time yesterday and I found myself hlding the end of the bars naturally on some of the fire roads thinking "you know what I'd like here?!".

It's small beer though. I had a blast and am looking forward to heading back up sooner rather than later

iwillhtfu

dave_o_brien wrote: »

Not saying your point is unreasonable, by the way. Obviously crashes happen and the more pointy bits there, the more risks there are. I would be minded of the disc brake debate inbroad riding ("they'll cut through you like butter") which was nonsense. I accept that the benefits of disc brakes are much greater than the benefits of bar ends, don't get me qrong, but my hands were uncomfortable at time yesterday and I found myself hlding the end of the bars naturally on some of the fire roads thinking "you know what I'd like here?!".

It's small beer though. I had a blast and am looking forward to heading back up sooner rather than later

The only issue with disc brakes particularly in mtb is the heat they get up to and the chances of your shin running into one of them should you stop in a bunch or crash.

If you want to run bar ends belt away, there's no hard and fast rules and who cares what anyone else thinks. Maybe try different grips or possibly one of those ergo type grip with the palm moulding

Lemming

dave_o_brien wrote: »

but my hands were uncomfortable at time yesterday and I found myself hlding the end of the bars naturally on some of the fire roads thinking "you know what I'd like here?!".

Once upon a time in hallowed antiquity ... it was the year of our lord 1892 - or maybe it was 1992, old age has my mind screwed these days - *ahem* pardon me; I'll start again ...

Way back when [bar ends were cool; purple ones were even cooler] rider position & general bike geometry was wildly different to today. Riser bars were not yet a thing, and bars that were wider than 560mm were considered wide in the extreme. Stems were also generally longer as a rule too meaning that you were 'stretched' out across the bike a bit more like a roadie if you can visualise that (and that I've not made a complete balls of describing it). As such, bar ends allowed for a hand position that was that little bit more wide and upright. In today's world, geometry has already taken care of that for us; wide, riser bars with different options for rise & backsweep angles, combined with shorter stems and a more centered, neutral rider position on the bike.

If you are finding your hands getting uncomfortable, I would look at your cockpit setup. Hopefully it's small adjustments and nothing crazy required. Also consider your gloves, and lastly your grips as not all grips are created equal. As iwillhtfu has suggested above there are also ergo-grips available too.

dave_o_brien

Lemming wrote: »

Once upon a time in hallowed antiquity ... it was the year of our lord 1892 - or maybe it was 1992, old age has my mind screwed these days - *ahem* pardon me; I'll start again ...

Way back when [bar ends were cool; purple ones were even cooler] rider position & general bike geometry was wildly different to today. Riser bars were not yet a thing, and bars that were 585mm were considered wide in the extreme. Stems were also generally longer as a rule too meaning that you were 'stretched' out across the bike a bit more like a roadie if you can visualise that (and that I've not made a complete balls of describing it). As such, bar ends allowed for a hand position that was that little bit more wide and upright. In today's world, geometry has already taken care of that for us; wide, riser bars with different options for rise & backsweep angles, combined with shorter stems and a more centered, neutral rider position on the bike.

If you are finding your hands getting uncomfortable, I would look at your cockpit setup. Hopefully it's small adjustments and nothing crazy required. Also consider your gloves, and lastly your grips as not all grips are created equal. As iwillhtfu has suggested above there are also ergo-grips available too.

Thanks, I do remember those days... I even remember just a decade ago how different bike geometry was for mtb's and having ridden this yesterday, I can say the changes have been positive!

So the position is good, but for climbing I find I'd prefer my hands to be more "neutral" and turned 90 degrees (same direction they'd be ifnhanging by my sides). There are a few tweaks I plan on making anyway to cockpit set up; turn the bars slightly up, brakes slightly down and in and shifter in towards the stem a good bit. All of this I hope will help hand fatigue while on single track. That's all to help get everything in the right place so I'm not "searching" for anything. Maybe that will sort it out! Just coming at this from a roadie's perspective, the lack of alternative positions is... surprising.

Maybe it's just a case of familiarity and adjusting the little things. I'm gonna make incremental tweaks.

I do think I'm gonna go to spd's again though. If anyone has a spare set...

dave_o_brien

Another question for people... It feels like my rear brake power has reduced substantially. I initially thought it was contaminated by lubricant or something so cleaned the rotor and the pads, but it still feels quite spongey. Would it be common for a new hydraulic brake to need bleeding after limited use?

nak

dave_o_brien wrote: »

Another question for people... It feels like my rear brake power has reduced substantially. I initially thought it was contaminated by lubricant or something so cleaned the rotor and the pads, but it still feels quite spongey. Would it be common for a new hydraulic brake to need bleeding after limited use?

Not common but it can happen.

calistro

New to the sport also and was planning on heading to Ballinastoe this afternoon, never been up there and was wondering if this rain does clear off what conditions would be like or is it better leaving it for a dryer day. Thanks.

Bot1

calistro wrote: »

New to the sport also and was planning on heading to Ballinastoe this afternoon, never been up there and was wondering if this rain does clear off what conditions would be like or is it better leaving it for a dryer day. Thanks.

Should be grand.

The trail centre official trails are designed to be all-weather.

Go for it.

dave_o_brien

I would say as a fellow noob that the trails in Ticknock last weekend (very wet Saturday morning) were in great condition with very little puddling, slop or areas I'd have worried about

calistro

Bot1 wrote: »

Should be grand.

The trail centre official trails are designed to be all-weather.

Go for it.

Cheers!!

saccades

I use bar ends on my modernish MTB with LLS geometry when doing long, adventure spins.

Does make the bars 840 which is getting on the wide side.

It's rare I think about them on a 2-3 hour spin.

xxyyzz

iwillhtfu wrote: »

The only issue with disc brakes particularly in mtb is the heat they get up to and the chances of your shin running into one of them should you stop in a bunch or crash.

Roadies absolutely lost their sh*t over disc brakes while being seemingly oblivious to the fact that they were all running bladed aero spokes. It was absolutely daft and half of them were riding CX with disc brakes at the same time. You couldn't make it up. They're all happily using them now and they'll tell you they always knew they were the greatest invention ever.

iwillhtfu

xxyyzz wrote: »

Roadies absolutely lost their sh*t over disc brakes while being seemingly oblivious to the fact that they were all running bladed aero spokes. It was absolutely daft and half of them were riding CX with disc brakes at the same time. You couldn't make it up. They're all happily using them now and they'll tell you they always knew they were the greatest invention ever.

Yeah the new best thing :pac:

I'd only ever worry about being burned off them much more like to be sliced open by actually hitting the ground than a disc

dave_o_brien

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iwillhtfu wrote: »

Yeah the new best thing :pac:

I'd only ever worry about being burned off them much more like to be sliced open by actually hitting the ground than a disc

The sliced open thing always baffled me.

Assume you're in a high speed road pile up (has to be high speed, cause otherwise the rotor wouldn't be hot): there will be spokes, chainrings, broken carbon fibre, the f**king road itself and assoociated furniture, cables, wheels, cavalcade, blah blah blah... And they focused in on one bit of metal, around 140mm in diameter, partially shrouded by the frame or the fork, in all of that detritus?

It was mad.