Second hand tractors are gone expensive

Hard Knocks

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Looks a bit like a Zetir but I do not think they were involved with Usrus at that stage.. Came across this article on it in the FJ you have to scroll down to find the Usrus.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.farmersjournal.ie/amp/plan-your-tractor-purchases-carefully-at-ploughing-165322

It has a Perkins Euro 3 engine and a Carraro transmission. Might not be too bad a yoke. Manual shuttle.36k might be a bit strong for it. Parts for engine and transmission should be ok to get.

Isn’t Massey Ferguson, Zetor & Ursus all owned by the same company
Think there’s a 4th tractor brand too

cathy427

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Isn’t Massey Ferguson, Zetor & Ursus all owned by the same company
Think there’s a 4th tractor brand too

No, Massey is in the same group/stable as Fendt and Valtra
(possible one of the reasons why valtra gained market share relatively quickly)

cathy427

MIKEKC wrote: »

Asked a question as regards value of this tractor here a few weeks ago . Got no opinions. He hadent the price advertised at that stage. I feel you would be married to it (not saying that would be a bad thing) . Since they started re-importing them about five years ago, don't see any new ones around. Wonder how many were sold?

Ok, interesting - ya probably be married to it in fairness; which would be ok with, just if keeping for long time want to be relatively happy with how it drives.
Test driving is a problem, obviously, at the mo. Would it drive like the older zetors?

You still interested? I actually went on to see the zetor 9641 he has and then wondering do I need to up the budget.

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Looks a bit like a Zetir but I do not think they were involved with Usrus at that stage.. Came across this article on it in the FJ you have to scroll down to find the Usrus.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.farmersjournal.ie/amp/plan-your-tractor-purchases-carefully-at-ploughing-165322

It has a Perkins Euro 3 engine and a Carraro transmission. Might not be too bad a yoke. Manual shuttle.36k might be a bit strong for it. Parts for engine and transmission should be ok to get.

Ya, looks very very similar.
Prob is a bit strong but what else do you get at the hp, with loader and 1100 hours for 36k?

Would a manual shuttle be a bad buy at this stage given where other makes are at?

MIKEKC

cathy427 wrote: »

Ok, interesting - ya probably be married to it in fairness; which would be ok with, just if keeping for long time want to be relatively happy with how it drives.
Test driving is a problem, obviously, at the mo. Would it drive like the older zetors?

You still interested? I actually went on to see the zetor 9641 he has and then wondering do I need to up the budget.



Ya, looks very very similar.
Prob is a bit strong but what else do you get at the hp, with loader and 1100 hours for 36k?

Would a manual shuttle be a bad buy at this stage given where other makes are at?

Have a Zetor 6341 here for last 8or 9 years. 4600 hours . New clutch 2 years ago .Brake cylinder stuck so replaced both. No other problems. Really no need to change. Would imagine with the variety of tractors available it would be hard enough to sell. Would a comparable Zetor be much more?

Hard Knocks

cathy427 wrote: »

No, Massey is in the same group/stable as Fendt and Valtra
(possible one of the reasons why valtra gained market share relatively quickly)

Valtra became popular around here as they had a 40k box when the 3 series Massey didn’t
Also contractors found them better on soft ground than the MF

Remember seeing the technology used on the 4wd on the MF 3 series was the same as used by Zetor on the Crystal

MfMan

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Isn’t Massey Ferguson, Zetor & Ursus all owned by the same company
Think there’s a 4th tractor brand too

Ursus nearly gone to the wall I think... really bad way financially.

lakill Farm

MIKEKC wrote: »

Asked a question as regards value of this tractor here a few weeks ago . Got no opinions. He hadent the price advertised at that stage. I feel you would be married to it (not saying that would be a bad thing) . Since they started re-importing them about five years ago, don't see any new ones around. Wonder how many were sold?

No experience of the newer ursus but years ago I worked summers with a suckler farmer and he bought a new 1995 2wd 4512 ursus and in 2001 bought a 490 mercury 4wd. Good honest little tractors in fairness newer gave a seconds trouble as far as I know. very basic inside but did its job

Actually went looking for a 4512 or 4514 for a lad lately and they are mad money

K.G.

Why is it so hard to buy a tractor straight from the previous user.looking around at the moment and 90 %of tractors are selling from dealers either large or small.i d prefer to buy straight from the owner and with the advent of dd i would have thought that there would be more selling direct

jaymla627

K.G. wrote: »

Why is it so hard to buy a tractor straight from the previous user.looking around at the moment and 90 %of tractors are selling from dealers either large or small.i d prefer to buy straight from the owner and with the advent of dd i would have thought that there would be more selling direct

HP outstanding would be a lot of it, another issue is with second hand prices gone up so much if a lad is selling private and gets 35k he has a nice tax bill, if trading against another tractor in a dealers they would usually value it lower and discount the difference of the new one

cute geoge

K.G. wrote: »

Why is it so hard to buy a tractor straight from the previous user.looking around at the moment and 90 %of tractors are selling from dealers either large or small.i d prefer to buy straight from the owner and with the advent of dd i would have thought that there would be more selling direct

Do the dealers still give an inflatted price for trade in ,this being added on to the price of the newer tractor .

declanflynn

Thinking of buying a new Same 110 with a loader, being quoated €63 Inc vat, what do lads here think of them

cute geoge

declanflynn wrote: »

Thinking of buying a new Same 110 with a loader, being quoated €63 Inc vat, what do lads here think of them

Throwing a curve ball at you ,what year nh/jd/mf would you get for the same money

paddysdream

K.G. wrote: »

Why is it so hard to buy a tractor straight from the previous user.looking around at the moment and 90 %of tractors are selling from dealers either large or small.i d prefer to buy straight from the owner and with the advent of dd i would have thought that there would be more selling direct

Amyone selling a tractor,or any machine really ,worth anything more than 10k or so will have a very limited market.
Up to a few years ago it was possible to finance a machine from a private seller.That changed and finance company usually insisted it was from a registered business.
Could have changed recently as its 3 years since i had to purchases.
Looking again at the moment but haven't looked into finance yet.
Also most dealers will offer some type of warranty and if you are local or repeat business then some sort of comeback is usual.

degetme

K.G. wrote: »

Why is it so hard to buy a tractor straight from the previous user.looking around at the moment and 90 %of tractors are selling from dealers either large or small.i d prefer to buy straight from the owner and with the advent of dd i would have thought that there would be more selling direct

I was on the lookout for a tractor last autumn. Was looking at buying new but I couldn't justify the price and I came across a t6.175 with 2840hrs. I was talking to the previous owner who bought new again. He seemed genuine. I'm a happy with her so far. She's a tractor that came with a loader but didn't do much loader work for the previous owner as he used his digger for loader work.

K.G.

jaymla627 wrote: »

HP outstanding would be a lot of it, another issue is with second hand prices gone up so much if a lad is selling private and gets 35k he has a nice tax bill, if trading against another tractor in a dealers they would usually value it lower and discount the difference of the new one

Are you saying fellas dont want to buy because of the hp risk .by the way anyone selling a 130 or 140 hp 10 years + with a loader let us know.wont be financing

paddysdream

cute geoge wrote: »

Do the dealers still give an inflatted price for trade in ,this being added on to the price of the newer tractor .

Cost to change is tbe important figure.

Bought a tractor 3 years ago.
Looking 48k and cost 28k along with trade in.
My trade in was worth 12/14 k at the very most so real value of tractor was probably 40k .

Dunedin

degetme wrote: »

I was on the lookout for a tractor last autumn. Was looking at buying new but I couldn't justify the price and I came across a t6.175 with 2840hrs. I was talking to the previous owner who bought new again. He seemed genuine. I'm a happy with her so far. She's a tractor that came with a loader but didn't do much loader work for the previous owner as he used his digger for loader work.

How do like the keltec bale slice?

paddysdream

cute geoge wrote: »

Throwing a curve ball at you ,what year nh/jd/mf would you get for the same money

Friend was enquiring about a 2012 JD 6430 premium with loader this week.Think around 4/5k hours.
Looking 46k plus vat on phone.Presume bit of movement on that but not sure.
Looking at NH 6030 with loader neighbour bought recently. About 8k hours good tyres and was told 35k inc vat.

degetme

Dunedin wrote: »

How do like the keltec bale slice?

I'm happy with it. I have two bales on the back of the tractor for when I'm using the bale slice. You would want the weight on the back tho. Think tis 480kg empty. I think that bale slice suits us best with it cutting from beneath rather the other 1s having to have them up in the air

declanflynn

Jd 115 hp 2200 hours 2016, looks like new on donedeal 50k plus vat
That's frying my head now

paddysdream

declanflynn wrote: »

Jd 115 hp 2200 hours 2016, looks like new on donedeal 50k plus vat
That's frying my head now

That the one in Laois ?

No TLS , basic gearbox , no weights ,no mention of air con or air seat ,no beltline lights and its 70k inc.vat

paddysdream

paddysdream wrote: »

That the one in Laois ?

No TLS , basic gearbox , no weights ,no mention of air con or air seat ,no beltline lights and its 70k inc.vat

Surely air-con and air seat are standred on a 2016?

paddysdream

Deleted User wrote: »

Surely air-con and air seat are standred on a 2016?

Well know if I was paying that sort of money would be a non runner without them

declanflynn

paddysdream wrote: »

That the one in Laois ?

No TLS , basic gearbox , no weights ,no mention of air con or air seat ,no beltline lights and its 70k inc.vat

It says on the ad 50000 plus vat??

paddysdream

declanflynn wrote: »

It says on the ad 50000 plus vat??

Oops my mistake that would be 60k so

declanflynn

paddysdream wrote: »

Oops my mistake that would be 60k so

No loader

For 60k you get an 8+ year old 4500+ hours top brand tractor with a loader, v new same
Do which is best?

straight

declanflynn wrote: »

No loader

For 60k you get an 8+ year old 4500+ hours top brand tractor with a loader, v new same
Do which is best?

Same is worth a closer look at least. Can't be a bad yoke.

hopeso

Deleted User wrote: »

Surely air-con and air seat are standred on a 2016?

She has an air seat anyway. Can't say from the photos, but I'd be almost certain that she has air con too...

paddysdream

declanflynn wrote: »

No loader

For 60k you get an 8+ year old 4500+ hours top brand tractor with a loader, v new same
Do which is best?

How long is a piece of string ?

All depends really.
Are you going to sit on it 10/12 hours a day or just an hour or two at a time.
Will you be changing it in 5 years or is it a tractor for 10 years plus ?
Will you finance it over 3/4/5 years and go again or put new one over 7 years and keep for 10 plus years.
What sort of hours will be on in a few years ?
Premium brand will still be saleable with 10 or 12k hours at a price but cheaper brand almost worthless at tbat stage.
What hp class you looking at ? "Farmers" tractor up to say 120/130 hp always in demand compared to 150 hp plus tractor

declanflynn

paddysdream wrote: »

How long is a piece of string ?

All depends really.
Are you going to sit on it 10/12 hours a day or just an hour or two at a time.
Will you be changing it in 5 years or is it a tractor for 10 years plus ?
Will you finance it over 3/4/5 years and go again or put new one over 7 years and keep for 10 plus years.
What sort of hours will be on in a few years ?
Premium brand will still be saleable with 10 or 12k hours at a price but cheaper brand almost worthless at tbat stage.
What hp class you looking at ? "Farmers" tractor up to say 120/130 hp always in demand compared to 150 hp plus tractor

about 500 hours a year, I'd look after a tractor, trading a 9641 zetor with 8000 hours( a super tractor)
Would finance it over 5 years zetor worth 15 and have 5 cash
Would keep new one forever

funkey_monkey

declanflynn wrote: »

No loader

For 60k you get an 8+ year old 4500+ hours top brand tractor with a loader, v new same
Do which is best?

Have you checked the dimensions of your shed to see what fits in where?
I see from previous page you were looking at a 6115M - that's a big lump of a tractor - compared to the Same.
Do you need a heavier tractor for slurry on steep ground etc?

What transmission is in the Same - Deutz do the engine so that should be fine.

straight

paddysdream wrote: »

How long is a piece of string ?

All depends really.
Are you going to sit on it 10/12 hours a day or just an hour or two at a time.
Will you be changing it in 5 years or is it a tractor for 10 years plus ?
Will you finance it over 3/4/5 years and go again or put new one over 7 years and keep for 10 plus years.
What sort of hours will be on in a few years ?
Premium brand will still be saleable with 10 or 12k hours at a price but cheaper brand almost worthless at tbat stage.
What hp class you looking at ? "Farmers" tractor up to say 120/130 hp always in demand compared to 150 hp plus tractor

Where can I find one of these worthless tractors?

straight

declanflynn wrote: »

about 500 hours a year, I'd look after a tractor, trading a 9641 zetor with 8000 hours( a super tractor)
Would finance it over 5 years zetor worth 15 and have 5 cash
Would keep new one forever

Did you price a new zetor seeing as you are so happy with the 9641.

twin_beacon

Just seen an ad on donedeal for a 33 year old 390 for 20k. And id say he will get close to the asking price too!

Dunedin

degetme wrote: »

I'm happy with it. I have two bales on the back of the tractor for when I'm using the bale slice. You would want the weight on the back tho. Think tis 480kg empty. I think that bale slice suits us best with it cutting from beneath rather the other 1s having to have them up in the air

2 bales on the back seems a lot. Have you tried it with one bale?

I’ve looked at a few and agree the keltic one cutting from the bottom seems the best. I’m on concrete and would assume 1 bale on the back would do. I have a case 105u and would never have anything on the back when foddering bales with the normal bale handler.

degetme

Dunedin wrote: »

2 bales on the back seems a lot. Have you tried it with one bale?

I’ve looked at a few and agree the keltic one cutting from the bottom seems the best. I’m on concrete and would assume 1 bale on the back would do. I have a case 105u and would never have anything on the back when foddering bales with the normal bale handler.

I haven't tried it yet anyway with 1 bale or no bale. I think weight is important to counter the weight at the front. I only have two bales on the bale when using the slice. I think the front axle could be made ****e of by having two much weight at the front

Castlekeeper

cute geoge wrote: »

Throwing a curve ball at you ,what year nh/jd/mf would you get for the same money

Saw 2 17's with loaders with 2-3000 hrs sell for about 60 incl vat lately in a local garage, MF and NH.

Castlekeeper

Dunedin wrote: »

2 bales on the back seems a lot. Have you tried it with one bale?

I’ve looked at a few and agree the keltic one cutting from the bottom seems the best. I’m on concrete and would assume 1 bale on the back would do. I have a case 105u and would never have anything on the back when foddering bales with the normal bale handler.

The Keltec is an awful big yoke for a tractor like yours, I couldn't see it working without a tonne on the back, esp on any slopes.
Did you look at the Rohan one? He makes a handyish one for smaller tractors and they work really well.

kk.man

twin_beacon wrote: »

Just seen an ad on donedeal for a 33 year old 390 for 20k. And id say he will get close to the asking price too!

Great tractor too. They never lost their value. I sold one a few years back I Made 1800 more than what I paid for it!

straight

Castlekeeper wrote: »

Saw 2 17's with loaders with 2-3000 hrs sell for about 60 incl vat lately in a local garage, MF and NH.

What hp were they?

twin_beacon

kk.man wrote: »

Great tractor too. They never lost their value. I sold one a few years back I Made 1800 more than what I paid for it!

If anyone wants a safe investment if they have 15-20k sitting in their bank account, try to find a late 390 or 390T with no loader, under 5k hours, and in good original condition. If you park it up for 5 years, and sold it on, you would get a much better return your money than any interest rate offered by any bank at the moment.

Dunedin

Castlekeeper wrote: »

The Keltec is an awful big yoke for a tractor like yours, I couldn't see it working without a tonne on the back, esp on any slopes.
Did you look at the Rohan one? He makes a handyish one for smaller tractors and they work really well.

To be honest, that’s the reason i haven’t got one yet as would be worried about the weight. I’ve looked at a few and I like the design of the keltec the best. Also liked the cashels one but it cuts from the top but the reason I liked it probably was more to do with the size and compactness of it. A neighbour has the cashel and I looked at it and he’s very happy with it. Can’t remember what size tractor he has it on.

Haven’t saw the Rohan one.

JustJoe7240

twin_beacon wrote: »

If anyone wants a safe investment if they have 15-20k sitting in their bank account, try to find a late 390 or 390T with no loader, under 5k hours, and in good original condition. If you park it up for 5 years, and sold it on, you would get a much better return your money than any interest rate offered by any bank at the moment.

And by that stage that tractor will be what, 30 years old? Hold it's value maybe but that depends on a buyer being available, and those buyers are getting more and more scarce.

Birdnuts

I was talking to a dealer yesterday and he said the disruption associated with Brexit has really distorted the second market here with ongoing difficulties get second hand stock into the country:(

Reggie.

Birdnuts wrote: »

I was talking to a dealer yesterday and he said the disruption associated with Brexit has really distorted the second market here with ongoing difficulties get second hand stock into the country:(

It was bound to happen

Castlekeeper

straight wrote: »

What hp were they?

110,120

straight

Birdnuts wrote: »

I was talking to a dealer yesterday and he said the disruption associated with Brexit has really distorted the second market here with ongoing difficulties get second hand stock into the country:(

I would say that's just typical dealers talk. With the prices they're charging your better off go new. 130 hp tractor is at least 10k overpriced since before Brexit.

Gawddawggonnit

Birdnuts wrote: »

I was talking to a dealer yesterday and he said the disruption associated with Brexit has really distorted the second market here with ongoing difficulties get second hand stock into the country:(

A grain of salt...
Plenty ‘English’ tractors (etc) have been imported from France to the UK, for further export into Ireland. I know of several UK dealers gathering a couple of loads a week out of here for eventual export to Ireland.
Lads thinking that they bought the ultimate bargain UK tractor (off a large estate!) could be looking at a tractor that originated off a small French farm...

One popular Irish dealer has been sourcing huge numbers of tractors from here with years...all supposedly British.
Methinks dealers are using Brexit as an excuse to hike up prices. French/Irish trade lines are as smooth and seemless as ever and French 2nd hand tractors are cheaper than UK tractors as per usual.

jimmy G M

Dunedin wrote: »

To be honest, that’s the reason i haven’t got one yet as would be worried about the weight. I’ve looked at a few and I like the design of the keltec the best. Also liked the cashels one but it cuts from the top but the reason I liked it probably was more to do with the size and compactness of it. A neighbour has the cashel and I looked at it and he’s very happy with it. Can’t remember what size tractor he has it on.

Haven’t saw the Rohan one.

We have Nugent one on a MF 4255 around 100hp. Handles it fine but we have a 600kg weight on the back. I would not like to be operating it without a weight on the back on any 4 cylinder tractor. I think the grab alone is around 400kg, add a bale 800 - 900kg to that ..The Keltec is even heavier. We didn't like it as not as goof feeding in a shed.... would be excellent filling a diet feeder tho.

Bass Reeves

jimmy G M wrote: »

We have Nugent one on a MF 4255 around 100hp. Handles it fine but we have a 600kg weight on the back. I would not like to be operating it without a weight on the back on any 4 cylinder tractor. I think the grab alone is around 400kg, add a bale 800 - 900kg to that ..The Keltec is even heavier. We didn't like it as not as goof feeding in a shed.... would be excellent filling a diet feeder tho.

You would want to be.very sure that the bale slice would always do as it says on the tin and catch and release netting and twine.

I have dry chopped silage. Bales are on the flat on the clamp. I take the front circle of plastic off them before starting. I spoke as low as possible. I take bales to the front of the cattle pen. This is the only time I have to get down for each bale and I remove plastic and netting. Back on he tractor I place bale on ground and spike it around the half way mark. I lift the bake and shake the bale falls apart about 2/3 is usually on the ground but sometimes less.

I place what is on the spike in front of the pen and push in the bit on the ground. The two tine bale spike bale came for about 220 euro. I have a CX90. I never have weights on the back.