Defund RTE

GT89 · 22-07-2020 2:08pm

fly_agaric wrote: »

No arguments. Just boils down to not having an Irish tv station to feel up all the right wing crank pleasure centres (Orange man good, Leftys Bad, virus - what virus?, Irexit now!!!).

Thought Trump was elected wasn't he, must be doing something right, coronavirus has a 99% survival rate and 51.89%

fly_agaric · 22-07-2020 2:12pm

GT89 wrote: »

Thought Trump was elected wasn't he, must be doing something right

This does not follow. Anyway, carry on.
As I said your problem with RTE is that while you have to pay for it if you are an adult living here it does not reflect your...very, very, very far out there in an Irish context political views back to you.

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 2:22pm

Invidious wrote: »

I'd say that something has cultural value if it enriches us as a nation.

Like what? I don't particularly like classical music, but I see its merits, so I would be aghast if we got rid of orchestras.

How do you decide what's culturally appropriate? Thankfully we have organisations and experts in cultural fields that get to do that on our behalf and reactionary sorts like yourself are far away from the decision-making process.

Just because a show has a large indigenous audience doesn't mean it has cultural value. What exactly is the cultural value of Winning Streak, Dancing with the Stars, or Room to Improve?

Winning Streak is actually an oddly irish programme and one that most of us have a fond relationship with.

You seem to oddly equate a lack of popularity with cultural significance.

Would you get rid of TG4?

I don't buy the rationale that every household must pay a regressive tax of €160 a year to keep Irish-based production companies in business. If these people are as highly skilled as you indicate, surely they can manage to make a living under their own steam?

Oh, the pull-up the bootstraps argument.

Do you think on-spec TV is a rational way to operate?

You clearly haven't a notion.

GT89 · 22-07-2020 2:22pm

Russia = Bad is is another one I don't like

James Brown · 22-07-2020 2:25pm

pjohnson wrote: »

I think Lottie Ryan and Ryan Tubridy would have a more useful opinion than any conspiracist crank on "bitchute"

Two legacies in a publicly owned institution. I bet they would.

The Tetrarch · 22-07-2020 2:25pm

GT89 wrote: »

I see in the UK there is a campaign to defund the BBC why not do the same for RTE.

We wouldn't wants to be imitating the UK - keep funding.

kenmm · 22-07-2020 2:51pm

Public service broadcasting plays a very important role. They should be protected and be politically neutral (and protected from interference).

Many things on RTE (or BBC) TV/Radio/web I would disagree with. Same as where a lot of my tax money goes - but do I want to see these institutions gone forever? And replaced by companies that have their own agendas - not a chance.

The BBC has this protection, and there is an agenda to diminish it. Not because it is actually overly left wing, but because it is naturally neutral and therefore *not* completely right wing (Similarly the licence fee debate is another line of attack - i.e. cut BBC public funding and push the "decision" to means test the fee onto them - they had little choice but to do so. If the current UK Gov wanted to give free TV to the over 75s, all they had to do was not cut it).

And by getting involved in this debate we are playing up to this. The Question should really be - how can we make RTE/BBC better - i.e. more neutral, better more quality repoting (That looks at the facts and not lazily trotting out press releases) and with better spending of funds.

Companies like 'defund the BBC' and the ilk are very sinister lobbyist corporations masquerading as "Campaigns" - do we want to go down that route here?

end of the road · 22-07-2020 4:49pm

Invidious wrote: »

I'm not arguing for "hurting" anyone.

A stripped-down RTE should cost far less to run, and so the public would benefit from a reduced licence fee. People who want to watch commercial content like The Simpsons or Grey's Anatomy can do so via any number of other platforms.

RTE currently employs around 2,000 staff plus numerous independent contractors, many of them on bloated salaries. It is a bloated, inefficient organization kept afloat by what is essentially a regressive tax on the public.

what reduced license fee.
the license fee would not reduce whatever happens at rte.
the license exists for having apparatus to recieve a terrestrial television signal, so would exist even if rte no longer existed.
it's not an rte tax but a tax for having a television which happens to go to rte.
there isn't anything regressive about it as such as there are taxes on all sorts of things other then income tax.

golfball37 wrote: »

Is is a bad thing to present all sides of an argument? If they are what you say they are they’ll soon be found out. A public service remit should facilitate alternative views. Anything less is censorship

rte's public service remit does facilitate alternative views, just not crackpot or racist views and rightly so.

Diceicle wrote: »

I would be very much in favour of putting RTE on diet and diverting a large portion of licence fee to other stations with a mandate that they provide a level of PSB. Scrap 2fm and RTE2. Let D'arcy, Tubs et al test the market. On that note, it will be interesting to see what the JNLR figures are for some key RTE shows with 2 Big Names gone - Finucane and O'Rourke - have their listenerships held up since their departure?

To give RTE its dues - Prime Time can do good PSB. Their show on the 'irish right' wasn't a hatchet-job. Their discussion on Trans issues didn't cave to moaners and did feature Graham Linehan as a voice of opposition despite said protests. Wasn't a great show but at least they did it.
They also do radio documentaries quite well. Their doc on the the belfast rugby trial was very informative.

RTE TV is limited in its Current Affiars output and therefore limited in how often it can host reasonable alternative opion. By reasonable alternative opinion I don't mean hosting every quack out there - but there is scope - particularly on RTE Radio, to allow EU Critical voices, Controlled immigation opinions, Climate realists / pro-nuclear arguments etc.

All we have at the moment is group-think.

I also see little reason why RTE will end up any different to the BBC in the long-run. An overwhelmingly left-leaning organisation detached from the ordinary person - hiring based on identity rather than talent.

as a license fee payer, i do not wish for the fee to be diverted to other stations, i do not believe it is my job to subsidize other stations via the license fee.
if it is deemed worthy to give money to other stations, then a separate fund can be set up for it, or perhapse a donations system.
the bbc isn't left leaning over all, all though i agree it has certain issues due to expectations from all sorts of quarters, hence the forced divercity/quota stuff which i disagree with, even though i agree on that divercity when it happens organically is a good thing.

Superfoods · 22-07-2020 5:07pm

People complaining, it is €160 euro per year. Hardly breaking the bank

ancapailldorcha · 22-07-2020 5:08pm

Superfoods wrote: »

People complaining, it is €160 euro per year. Hardly breaking the bank

That's the weakest excuse yet. Some people struggle to make ends meet.

Superfoods · 22-07-2020 5:11pm

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

That's the weakest excuse yet. Some people struggle to make ends meet.

It's not a argument. One person posting about Netflix and then talking about a reduced TV license.

You don't seem to care about people struggling earlier when you suggest they pay for Freeview installations etc?

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 5:14pm

GT89 wrote: »

Russia = Bad is is another one I don't like

But Russia are bad though.

What's your counter-argument that you feel is not being aired enough?

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 5:15pm

end of the road wrote: »

what reduced license fee.
the license fee would not reduce whatever happens at rte.
the license exists for having apparatus to recieve a terrestrial television signal, so would exist even if rte no longer existed.
it's not an rte tax but a tax for having a television which happens to go to rte.
there isn't anything regressive about it as such as there are taxes on all sorts of things other then income tax.

rte's public service remit does facilitate alternative views, just not crackpot or racist views and rightly so.

as a license fee payer, i do not wish for the fee to be diverted to other stations, i do not believe it is my job to subsidize other stations via the license fee.
if it is deemed worthy to give money to other stations, then a separate fund can be set up for it, or perhapse a donations system.
the bbc isn't left leaning over all, all though i agree it has certain issues due to expectations from all sorts of quarters, hence the forced divercity/quota stuff which i disagree with, even though i agree on that divercity when it happens organically is a good thing.

The BAI have such funds. Every weekend you hear documentaries and programming on NT and Today FM which were funded by these schemes.

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 5:17pm

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

That's the weakest excuse yet. Some people struggle to make ends meet.

They do. But it's funny how people managed to pay it years ago with stamps and the like in the Post Office.

If it was reduced to €80 for those, we would still have issue with it. Some people just don't want to pay for anything in society so they will moan and moan no matter what.

Bob24 · 22-07-2020 5:20pm

BonnieSituation wrote: »

What public opinons are not being represented?

You do realise we're a very centrist country at heart.

Contrarian opinions for the sake of contrarian opinions should be avoided at all costs.

Look at the results for the referendums we’ve had in the past 10 years and in each case ask yourself if the percentages of votes from the general public is matching the percentage you would expect amongst RTÉ journalists and editors. If you’re being honest, in most case the answer is no - and sometimes by a huge margin.

Extending it to the western world, a very clear exemple close to us is in the U.K. with Brexit. It is very clear that an overwhelming majority of BBC journalists voted remain (probably almost all of them) while a bit over half of the general public voted to leave. This is why they have those movements about defunding the BBC: when half the country thinks their viewS are not represented within the national broadcaster, that broadcaster becomes a force to divide the nation rather than a force which brings the nation toghether by representing the diversity of opinions in the country (and on top of that it becomes a bad media because by losing touch so much with the reality of part of the population, it is caught completely off-guard by certain events which it couldn’t even conceive as possible).

In any case, as I said the simplest way to settle this is a referendum on funding. If you are right that there is no issue RTE doesn’t need to change anything and people will vote to keep things as they are. If I am right they will either need to change or to face a vote of the people which would darken their future.

super_furry · 22-07-2020 5:20pm

GT89 wrote: »

Russia = Bad is is another one I don't like

So maybe you should make your own TV channel. With blackjack and hookers.

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 5:25pm

Bob24 wrote: »

Look at the results for the referendums we’ve had in the past 10 years and in each case ask yourself if the percentages of votes from the general public is marching the percentage you would expect amongst RTÉ journalists and editors. If you’re being honest, in most case the answer is no - and sometimes by a huge margin.

Extending it to the western world, a very clear exemple close to us is in the U.K. with Brexit. It is very clear that an overwhelming majority of BBC journalists voted remain (probably almost all of them) while a bit over half of the general public voted to leave. This is why they have those movements about defunding the BBC: when half the country thinks their viewS are not represented within the national broadcaster, that broadcaster becomes a force to divide the nation rather than a force which brings the nation toghether by representing the diversity of opinions in the country (and on top of that it becomes a bad media because by losing touch so much with the reality of part of the population, it is caught completely off-guard by certain events which it couldn’t even conceive as possible).

You're saying that the BBC over-represented Remainers opinions' before and since?

Are you for real?

What about the bias during the Scottish Independence ref?

Honestly, I don't think you know what bias is.

Do you think ALL opinions deserve airing or be giving the same weight?

Bob24 · 22-07-2020 5:26pm

BonnieSituation wrote: »

You're saying that the BBC over-represented Remainers opinions' before and since?

Are you for real?

What about the bias during the Scottish Independence ref?

Honestly, I don't think you know what bias is.

Do you think ALL opinions deserve airing or be giving the same weight?

What percentage of BBC journalists would you say are leavers?

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 5:27pm

Bob24 wrote: »

What percentage of BBC journalists would you say are leavers?

You're the one making the accusation.

Perhaps you should go investigate it and present your findings. You know how this works, right?

Bob24 · 22-07-2020 5:40pm

BonnieSituation wrote: »

You're the one making the accusation.

Perhaps you should go investigate it and present your findings. You know how this works, right?

I am just asking you what you think since you seem to disagree with my assessment but haven't given yours ... what percentage of BBC journalists would you say are brexiters?

GT89 · 22-07-2020 5:42pm

super_furry wrote: »

So maybe you should make your own TV channel. With blackjack and hookers.

At least another channel wouldn't look for a licence fee that's illegal not to pay

OMM 0000 · 22-07-2020 5:46pm

RTE news is good, everything else is ****. I also hate their left wing bias and how they try to pretend we're some sort of diverse country full of black people (why do they do this?)

Here's three articles on RTE.ie today:

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/fashion/2020/0722/1154810-things-to-know-before-your-next-hair-appointment/
https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/food/2020/0717/1153895-7-things-you-didnt-know-about-pasta/
https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/living/2020/0625/1149541-from-wet-wipes-to-toys-5-easy-eco-friendly-ideas-for-new-parents/

Notice the people are black.

I would expect this in the UK, as black people are very much a significant part of the population, but Ireland is mostly white, so what are RTE playing at? Why are they lying about this? What else are they lying about? And why would they do this? It's just so odd...

Note I would feel the same way if Nigeria's national TV station were pretending there are white people everywhere.

kenmm · 22-07-2020 5:54pm

Bob24 wrote: »

.. when half the country thinks their viewS are not represented within the national broadcaster, that broadcaster becomes a force to divide the nation rather than a force which brings the nation toghether by representing the diversity of opinions in the country ....

.

It is certainly been painted that way.. Almost like certain people have an agenda to do so.

But why let facts get in the way of some headlines and press releases.

James Brown · 22-07-2020 5:54pm

OMM 0000 wrote: »

RTE news is good, everything else is ****. I also hate their left wing bias and how they try to pretend we're some sort of diverse country full of black people (why do they do this?)

Here's three articles on RTE.ie today:

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/fashion/2020/0722/1154810-things-to-know-before-your-next-hair-appointment/
https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/food/2020/0717/1153895-7-things-you-didnt-know-about-pasta/
https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/living/2020/0625/1149541-from-wet-wipes-to-toys-5-easy-eco-friendly-ideas-for-new-parents/

Notice the people are black.

I would expect this in the UK, as black people are very much a significant part of the population, but Ireland is mostly white, so what are RTE playing at? Why are they lying about this? What else are they lying about? And why would they do this? It's just so odd...

Note I would feel the same way if Nigeria's national TV station were pretending there are white people everywhere.

Would Dobbo calling protesters 'Fools' on the flagship main evening news constitute as 'left wing bias'? How about leaving Sinn Fein and others out of the televised election debates?
I take it the next debates will only feature FF and SF in the interest of consistency :rolleyes:

VinLieger · 22-07-2020 5:55pm

OMM 0000 wrote: »

RTE news is good, everything else is ****. I also hate their left wing bias and how they try to pretend we're some sort of diverse country full of black people (why do they do this?)

Here's three articles on RTE.ie today:

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/fashion/2020/0722/1154810-things-to-know-before-your-next-hair-appointment/
https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/food/2020/0717/1153895-7-things-you-didnt-know-about-pasta/
https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/living/2020/0625/1149541-from-wet-wipes-to-toys-5-easy-eco-friendly-ideas-for-new-parents/

Notice the people are black.

I would expect this in the UK, as black people are very much a significant part of the population, but Ireland is mostly white, so what are RTE playing at? Why are they lying about this? What else are they lying about? And why would they do this? It's just so odd...

Note I would feel the same way if Nigeria's national TV station were pretending there are white people everywhere.

Jesus christ...... Gemmas back

kenmm · 22-07-2020 5:59pm

OMM 0000 wrote: »

RTE news is good, everything else is ****. I also hate their left wing bias and ow they try to pretend we're some sort of diverse country full of black people (why do they do this?)

..

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/food/2020/0717/1153895-7-things-you-didnt-know-about-pasta/

Notice the people are black.

There are also at least two Americans of Italian heritage (I think) and two animated dogs - you think they are trying to pretend we are overrun by animated dogs?

(There is a small bit of a serious point where perception of trying to be fair and non biased is often the case)

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 6:00pm

Bob24 wrote: »

I am just asking you what you think since you seem to disagree with my assessment but haven't given yours ... what percentage of BBC journalists would you say are brexiters?

Right...

I stated above how I feel the BBC are not biased in the way that you seem to think they are, and now I have to calculate the level of Brexiters at the Corporation?

Are you for real? The state of this.

BonnieSituation · 22-07-2020 6:02pm

GT89 wrote: »

At least another channel wouldn't look for a licence fee that's illegal not to pay

So which is it?

Do you have an issue with the licence fee or do you have an issue with RTÉ's output?

Mad_maxx · 22-07-2020 6:04pm

kenmm wrote: »

This is a troll post, right?

Which part of it bothers you?

tjhook · 22-07-2020 6:05pm

I'd be happier if RTE would just give up trying to produce "comedy".

Defund RTE

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