Ms. McHugh and national broadcaster

StackSteevens

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

Will that be another party to add to mix of Solidarity / PBP / Rise etc? Starting to get complicated.

Doesn't really matter what party she joins - she's still unelectable. Mouth consistently opens and garbage emerges before brain is engaged.

Arghus

LawBoy2018 wrote: »

I really like Saoirse. I actually gave her my first preference vote in February. There is definitely a certain demographic that hates everything she stands for, but I think she embodies how a large percentage of young voters feel about Ireland and our political system. I would rather see a young, idealistic, radical woman representing my views in the Dáil, rather than a dozey Eamon Ryan catching a few undeserved Zzz's before he's awoken to vote against workers rights.

Also, Saoirse received more first preference votes than Neasa Hourigan, Roderic O'Gorman, Ossian Smith, Marc Ó Cathasaigh, Brian Leddin & Patrick Costello, in pobably the most difficult constituency in Ireland to break through as a Green TD. She didn't benefit from the 'vote left' movement like some of her more suburban colleagues, making her feat all the more impressive. Don't be so disengenous and cheap by labelling her as a 'serial loser'. The only losers are the ones too cowardly to ever put themselves forward like she did and instead sit on Boards all day whinging and chatting **** about TDs.

Good post in, like another poster has said, a thread full of mud.

As, usual with most topics discussed around here, a lot of people don't know what they are talking about.

She came very close to becoming an MEP, despite having a pretty low profile before the race and running in a part of the country that wouldn't be traditionally inclined to vote Green. She was always an outside bet in the GE, but like you said she got more first preferences than many of her colleagues who did become TD's. She ran in a very competitive constituency and would have had to fight against a certain amount of the electorate who would never vote Green under any circumstance. It's an easier ride to electoral success for a lot of Greens in suburban areas throughout.

A few weeks ago Stephen Donnelley was the subject of a lot of discussion on here. The general argument was that he was an opportunist and without any principles, ready to jump ship when opportunity knocked. Now Saoirse McHugh is being knocked because she left the Green party on principle; typical Boards.

Unfortunately, reading boards is increasingly like getting a snap shot of how the uninformed and out of touch are feeling about any particular issue. Place is getting old and cranky.

StackSteevens

KyussB wrote: »

No, I don't view them as supporting austerity - capitulating to it under the Troika, yes - but not supporting it. As I said from 2015 they have been dismantling austerity.

Meanwhile, here we have a government that agreed to very likely austerity in ~2 years, for absolutely no reason at all.

Too true, alas! No reason whatsoever. :rolleyes:

For, as we all know, that Covid 19 thing is fake news and doesn't even exist.

KiKi III

The determination not to give McHugh any credit for her success to date is interesting.

Was she lifted by a tide that saw the Greens resurgence? Yes, certainly a factor.

Did she impress in a nationally televised debate? Yes, she absolutely did. She rinsed Peter Casey.

Did she find ways to connect with farmers who are naturally skeptical of the Green Party? Yes, she did.

The reluctance to give credit where credit’s due says a lot more about the posters here than it does about her.

Former Former

KyussB wrote: »

They capitulated to the Troika without fighting the way Greece did (I don't endorse the latter) - and then when they returned to government in 2015 they began dismantling austerity.

They capitulated to but certainly don't endorse austerity.

Nobody endorses austerity. Certainly none of the Irish parties. Some recognised it as unavoidable and as short-term pain for long-term gain (and were proved right), but that is not endorsement.

The main difference between the political parties in Ireland is not right and left-wing, it's the willingness to make unpopular decisions and to put forward viable policies that distinguishes them. Unfortunately, a growing number of people are unable to recognise fantasy politics when they see it.

StackSteevens

Arghus wrote: »

Unfortunately, reading boards is increasingly like getting a snap shot of how the uniformed and out of touch are feeling about any particular issue.

Then why not stop doing it? Surely there's an empty pulpit somewhere in your neighbourhood that would welcome your well-informed presence?

Furthermore, from a pulpit, no-one would notice that you can't even spell Donnelly correctly.

Former Former

Arghus wrote: »

Unfortunately, reading boards is increasingly like getting a snap shot of how the uniformed and out of touch are feeling about any particular issue. Place is getting old and cranky.

You're dead right. Every time I log on, it's f**king postmen, supermarket workers and schoolkids posting here.

Where can those of us who just wear our own clothes to work find a voice? Was Saoirse going to stand up for us?

riffmongous

riffmongous wrote: »

Not if you are part of an unpopular program that sees you destroyed at the next election. This is the constant danger for green parties when they are still very much a minority, a quick sellout might only do more damage in the long run

thats a fair rejoinder but im not sure that it holds up

minority interest parties can exist as the powerless voice of conscience in opposition but is that really the advice? it would seem to fall right into "hurler on the ditch" trope.

or is the idea that idealistic firebrand greens go outside parliamentary democracy to achieve their goals? what would that look like, in all seriousness? i doubt it would achieve half as much as the pfg does in the same timeframe.

i dont see either as a serious alternative to doing a deal and getting some elements of your agenda in the mix.

unless you think that the greens had or have another couple of govts of growth on the sidelines, which is a risky bet tbh

by the time climate change does or doesnt get to that level of electoral influence it will already be mandated as a major influence over the other parties or EU legislation anyway, one would have thought

leading through compromise is a hard but honest path here imo

StackSteevens

KiKi III wrote: »

The determination not to give McHugh any credit for her success to date is interesting.

Was she lifted by a tide that saw the Greens resurgence? Yes, certainly a factor.

Did she impress in a nationally televised debate? Yes, she absolutely did. She rinsed Peter Casey.

Did she find ways to connect with farmers who are naturally skeptical of the Green Party? Yes, she did.

The reluctance to give credit where credit’s due says a lot more about the posters here than it does about her.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but given the Green wave in 2019 it is beyond rational argument that any Green candidate capable of tying their shoelaces and opening a package of tofu would have ended up with about the same percentage of the vote as your pin up did.

The fact that she has walked away from the Greens in a childish huff after they had poured so many resources into trying to get her elected - thrice - reveals her to be a disgusting and unprincipled mé féiner. They are well rid of her.

KiKi III

StackSteevens wrote: »

Sorry to burst your bubble, but given the Green wave in 2019 it is beyond rational argument that any Green candidate capable of tying their shoelaces and opening a package of tofu would have ended up with about the same percentage of the vote as your pin up did.

The fact that she has walked away from the Greens in a childish huff after they had poured so many resources into trying to get her elected - thrice - reveals her to be a disgusting and unprincipled mé féiner. They are well rid of her.

Again, the idea that Saoirse McHugh deserves none of the credit for the 51,000 votes she got is patently farcical.

Tell me how

StackSteevens wrote: »

Sorry to burst your bubble, but given the Green wave in 2019 it is beyond rational argument that any Green candidate capable of tying their shoelaces and opening a package of tofu would have ended up with about the same percentage of the vote as your pin up did.

The fact that she has walked away from the Greens in a childish huff after they had poured so many resources into trying to get her elected - thrice - reveals her to be a disgusting and unprincipled mé féiner. They are well rid of her.

That's a very strong term for someone who has also carried themselves with dignity. It is precisely because she is not a mé féiner that she is walking away.

MrMusician18

KiKi III wrote: »

The determination not to give McHugh any credit for her success to date is interesting.

Was she lifted by a tide that saw the Greens resurgence? Yes, certainly a factor.

Did she impress in a nationally televised debate? Yes, she absolutely did. She rinsed Peter Casey.

Did she find ways to connect with farmers who are naturally skeptical of the Green Party? Yes, she did.

The reluctance to give credit where credit’s due says a lot more about the posters here than it does about her.

You could agree with all that to be honest and still wonder why she's getting such media attention. The fact that the green party have junior ministers with less profile says everything that's needed to be said about how she's being elevated by the media.

And good luck to her, she should take the opportunities that present themselves to her. The question is more for RTE and it's editorial staff tbh.

That said RTE have articles on Rosanna Davidson having twins, who gives a **** about that? Why is that national news?

KyussB

Former Former wrote: »

Nobody endorses austerity. Certainly none of the Irish parties. Some recognised it as unavoidable and as short-term pain for long-term gain (and were proved right), but that is not endorsement.

The main difference between the political parties in Ireland is not right and left-wing, it's the willingness to make unpopular decisions and to put forward viable policies that distinguishes them. Unfortunately, a growing number of people are unable to recognise fantasy politics when they see it.

FF, FG and the Greens just agreed to a Programme for Government that has an almost certainty of leading to austerity in ~2 years, for no reason at all...this is absolutely supporitve of and an endorsement of austerity, by these parties.

Austerity is neither unavoidable nor does it lead to any long-term gain - it serves no economic purpose - it explicitly slows down economic recovery, prolonging economic crises, for no reason at all.

ThunbergsAreGo

duffman13 wrote: »

Paul Murphy has been screaming for GP members to join RISE, if he's not banging down her door id be surprised, an opportunist man like him. But yeah, i don't think she'll go back to politics, without the green machine around her she'll struggle. Gogarty is an ex green but if he was still in would have arguably got a seat in the last election or at least been a lot closer.

I dont know where she goes from here though, a career in activism doesn't pay well but her media profile might get her a cushy number somewhere

What does she do now/currently ? An unelected politician cant pay well

Arghus

StackSteevens wrote: »

Then why not stop doing it? Surely there's an empty pulpit somewhere in your neighbourhood that would welcome your well-informed presence?

Furthermore, from a pulpit, no-one would notice that you can't even spell Donnelly correctly.

If pointing out a missing "n" was your best response, then you mustn't really have a great of substance to say.

Clutching at straws. Weak.

Arghus

Former Former wrote: »

You're dead right. Every time I log on, it's f**king postmen, supermarket workers and schoolkids posting here.

Where can those of us who just wear our own clothes to work find a voice? Was Saoirse going to stand up for us?

Thanks for pointing that out.

No real actual points to make apart from that?

Coillte_Bhoy

Arghus wrote: »

Good post in, like another poster has said, a thread full of mud.

As, usual with most topics discussed around here, a lot of people don't know what they are talking about.

She came very close to becoming an MEP, despite having a pretty low profile before the race and running in a part of the country that wouldn't be traditionally inclined to vote Green. She was always an outside bet in the GE, but like you said she got more first preferences than many of her colleagues who did become TD's. She ran in a very competitive constituency and would have had to fight against a certain amount of the electorate who would never vote Green under any circumstance. It's an easier ride to electoral success for a lot of Greens in suburban areas throughout.

A few weeks ago Stephen Donnelley was the subject of a lot of discussion on here. The general argument was that he was an opportunist and without any principles, ready to jump ship when opportunity knocked. Now Saoirse McHugh is being knocked because she left the Green party on principle; typical Boards.

Unfortunately, reading boards is increasingly like getting a snap shot of how the uninformed and out of touch are feeling about any particular issue. Place is getting old and cranky.

She was also in largely the same part of the constituency as the female SF candidate. On another day she might have well have got in.

MrMusician18

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

She was also in largely the same part of the constituency as the female SF candidate. On another day she might have well have got in.

My auntie had balls she'd be my uncle. What ifs, they are irrelevant. She didn't get elected.

Magicmatilda

I have to say I wondered the same thing. A party member leaves a party. Why is that news.

As far as I am aware she has never held political office so not sure why she is even referred to as a politician.

I say that as someone who knows very little about her other than she is a green party member (or was) who ran for office and was not elected. I can't for the life of me understand why her opinion matters anymore than any one else.

very odd.

That said I don't thinks it necessarily some conspiracy by RTE....

Poor_old_gill

Poor_old_gill wrote: »

Patronising nonsense.

The fact that people are questioning why she is getting so much airtime is completely normal - she's a politician who has never won an election.

Everyone gets airtime in ireland including.justin barrett



If such critism was genuine....people would ask,why are labour getting more airtime than soc dems,despite holding equal numbers

Rodney Bathgate

KiKi III wrote: »

The determination not to give McHugh any credit for her success to date is interesting.

Was she lifted by a tide that saw the Greens resurgence? Yes, certainly a factor.

Did she impress in a nationally televised debate? Yes, she absolutely did. She rinsed Peter Casey.

Did she find ways to connect with farmers who are naturally skeptical of the Green Party? Yes, she did.

The reluctance to give credit where credit’s due says a lot more about the posters here than it does about her.

What credit is she due? Please clearly quantify the credit she is due and we can revisit.

As for ‘her success’, success in politics is generally judged on getting elected.

Tell me how

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

What credit is she due? Please clearly quantify the credit she is due and we can revisit.

She deserves credit for showing the vacuum behind Peter Casey's provocative words during the Presidential election debates.

She deserves credit for being a respected voice in drawing attention to the need for climate action.

She deserves credit for being a good communicator of the need to find climate solutions which benefited the people of rural Ireland.

She deserves credit for increasing Green vote percentage four fold in the recent European elections and five fold in the recent general election.

There is no need to revisit anything, the world will keep turning in spite of a few anonymous online accounts declaring that someone who put themselves out there is undeserving of merit.

Rodney Bathgate

She deserves no more or no less credit than any other failed politician.

Strange that some people would think otherwise.

Fred Cryton

Just as "Karen" has become a meme to describe middle aged entitled women going nuts, we should start using "Saoirse" to describe their younger Irish equivalent - young women largely brainwashed on radical left issues - marxist, naive, pro Green, pro-migrants, and pro any type of social justice movement they can get their hands on. The self entitled and self appointed thought police. And by God, if you dare to disagree with them, hell hath no fury...

topper75

Tell me how wrote: »

... declaring that someone who put themselves out there is undeserving of merit.

I wouldn't say she is undeserving of merit. I wouldn't dismiss anybody in such a way.

But I would definitely state that a person who has never been elected, never actually become a political representative, being covered in national news because they quit membership of a minor party is rather peculiar.
Is this view wrong?

Yurt2

Fred Cryton wrote: »

Just as "Karen" has become a meme to describe middle aged entitled women going nuts, we should start using "Saoirse" to describe their younger Irish equivalent - young women largely brainwashed on radical left issues - marxist, naive, pro Green, pro-migrants, and pro any type of social justice movement they can get their hands on. The self entitled and self appointed thought police. And by God, if you dare to disagree with them, hell hath no fury...

How would you mark yourself on that part of the scorecard Fred? Take a deep breath and count to ten before you reply now...

KiKi III

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

What credit is she due? Please clearly quantify the credit she is due and we can revisit.

As for ‘her success’, success in politics is generally judged on getting elected.

51,000 people voted for her in an anti-Green constituency where she had no previous profile.

Tell me how

topper75 wrote: »

But I would definitely state that a person who has never been elected, never actually become a political representative, being covered in national news because they quit membership of a minor party is rather peculiar.
Am I wrong?

I think you are wrong given that if any candidate had come from nowhere and gained massive popularity during a Presidential debate, was in a good position in early counting to gain an EU seat and was a very significant social media voice (a growing medium) and commentator for and on her party and also achieved very impressive first preference votes in a very difficult constituency, then they would be commented on if they had stepped away in the same manner.

It's not just about Saoirse, it is about the PFG and how it has been received by her (and other young green voices including Dublin Lord Mayor) and how at best it can be seen as an unpopular (but accepted document).

LiquidZeb

circadian wrote: »

And a massive tube, as they'd say in up Creggan.

He had a big fanbase amongst the anti minorities/LGBTQIA+/anti Islam anti everything crowd here. Surprise surprise

Tell me how

Fred Cryton wrote: »

Just as "Karen" has become a meme to describe middle aged entitled women going nuts, we should start using "Saoirse" to describe their younger Irish equivalent - young women largely brainwashed on radical left issues - marxist, naive, pro Green, pro-migrants, and pro any type of social justice movement they can get their hands on. The self entitled and self appointed thought police. And by God, if you dare to disagree with them, hell hath no fury...

It's surprising how so many on here feel so threatened by any voice advocating for compassion .

Is everything you do solely and specifically for your benefit or would you describe yourself as 'marxist, naive, pro Green, pro-migrants, and pro any type of social justice'?