Ireland to contribute €16 billion more than it receives to EU in next 7 years

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Zebra3 wrote: »

Which isn't really much use when everyone else can respond in kind.

As those policies can and do result in the devaluation of other countries’ currencies, there is no reason why they would not have resulted in the devaluation of the DM had Germany chosen to pursue them. It is absurd to suggest that Germany was somehow exempt from being able to do so.

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mick087 wrote: »

Leaving the EU would not be easy and would not be a good idea for Ireland at the moment.

I think within the next few years if the EU does not change then you might find opinions will change towards the EU.

There is no obvious reason for Ireland to leave the EU. Nor indeed do we appear to have any major grievance with how the EU is that would result in Ireland tabling formal proposals for changes to the EU, as we are free to do so under the EU Treaties in the European Council.

Podge_irl

mick087 wrote: »

Leaving the EU would not be easy and would not be a good idea for Ireland at the moment.

I think within the next few years if the EU does not change then you might find opinions will change towards the EU.

The Eurobarometer would suggest that support for the EU is in fact increasing over the previous few years. No doubt linked to the ****show that is Brexit.

Listening to the doom-mongers the EU has been a few years or one crisis away from collapse for several decades.

Mr. teddywinkles

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Let me get this straight

Ireland has recieved over 40 Billion from the EU, Over the years, now that they are a net contribution country you don't think they should have to pay?

If it's e16 b over 7 years. What's our contribution going to be over 40 years. A e100 b?

Podge_irl

Zebra3 wrote: »

The establishment here (the media and FFFG/Lab) will tell you it's great you don't have to change your money when you go on holiers, and it's because Germany is a benevolent nation making up for WWII.

As a result of this we get interest rates that are set to Germany's demands, and loads of cheap money loaned to banks here by irresponsible foreign banks that Irish taxpayers have had to foot the bill for.

Absolutely no one is suggesting Germany are doing anything out of benevolence. Anyone with an iota of understanding of how international politics works understands that everything is about trade offs. Also anyone with any understanding of the EU and its machinations knows that nothing is done to suit any one particular country - the idea that Germany really runs the EU is childish nonsense.

circadian

10000maniacs wrote: »

Ireland will contribute vastly more to the seven-year EU budget (which is separate to the recovery fund) than we get back. In fact, according to a German MEP who has the official figures, Ireland will contribute almost €16billion more than it receives, while Italy and Spain will be net beneficiaries.
Hmmm. Are we being taken for mugs?

No, you just have absolutely no idea how the EU works.

Zebra3

View wrote: »

As those policies can and do result in the devaluation of other countries’ currencies, there is no reason why they would not have resulted in the devaluation of the DM had Germany chosen to pursue them. It is absurd to suggest that Germany was somehow exempt from being able to do so.

And when everyone is devaluing their currency nobody is.

But when you effectively take over the show it's a different story.

Podge_irl wrote: »

Absolutely no one is suggesting Germany are doing anything out of benevolence. Anyone with an iota of understanding of how international politics works understands that everything is about trade offs. Also anyone with any understanding of the EU and its machinations knows that nothing is done to suit any one particular country - the idea that Germany really runs the EU is childish nonsense.

Which excludes a lot of people who get fed myths instead.

And the idea of Germany not having a massive influence when its' their currency that is basically the euro is childish nonsense.

KyussB

The EU budget is a measely ~1% of GNI for the whole of the EU - they should just have the ECB directly pay for it really, for all member states.

Graham

Zebra3 wrote: »

And the idea of Germany not having a massive influence when its' their currency

No matter how many times you say it, it's still not right..

Podge_irl

Zebra3 wrote: »

And the idea of Germany not having a massive influence when its' their currency that is basically the euro is childish nonsense.

"Their" currency is not basically the euro.

Of course they have a large influence, they are a large country and a large economy. They also regularly do not get their way - they just don't make a big song and dance about it when it happens.

sameoldname

KyussB wrote: »

The EU budget is a measely ~1% of GNI for the whole of the EU - they should just have the ECB directly pay for it really, for all member states.

To be fair, your solution for all government spending has been to just get the central bank to print it. I remember you arguing years ago under a different account name that you can just print money to give everyone who is unemployed a job or something along those lines. You never had a good answer for how to prevent hyper-inflation under such a plan as far as I can recall.

mick087

Podge_irl wrote: »

The Eurobarometer would suggest that support for the EU is in fact increasing over the previous few years. No doubt linked to the ****show that is Brexit.

Listening to the doom-mongers the EU has been a few years or one crisis away from collapse for several decades.

Well im not sure if surpport for the EU is growing in its current format maybe surrport if it changes yes.
Brexit-Europe is watching the UK, if they succeed and do well the EU will have issues.

mick087

View wrote: »

There is no obvious reason for Ireland to leave the EU. Nor indeed do we appear to have any major grievance with how the EU is that would result in Ireland tabling formal proposals for changes to the EU, as we are free to do so under the EU Treaties in the European Council.

Yes i hope you are correct when we do decide to leave the EU we should be free to do so.

ExMachina1000

Now 2nd highest contributor per capita. Was 10th last year

Ireland paying in 16 billion to budget. Spain, Italy who are countries with many times the population of Ireland will benefit to the tune of about a hundred and thirty billion euro between them.

16 billion net. That's 3200 per per person in Ireland twice the amount a German will pay.

Brits saying the media have buried it. The government have gotten a terrible deal.

Timberrrrrrrr

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Now 2nd highest contributor per capita. Was 10th last year

Ireland paying in 16 billion to budget. Spain, Italy who are countries with many times the population of Ireland will benefit to the tune of about a hundred and thirty billion euro between them.

16 billion net. That's 3200 per per person in Ireland twice the amount a German will pay.

Brits saying the media have buried it. The government have gotten a terrible deal.

And how much have those countries contributed over the years to help Ireland?

Every single person posting here as benefited since birth from EU membership, and now that Ireland has been asked to contribute back they are qhinging about it.

circadian

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Now 2nd highest contributor per capita. Was 10th last year

Ireland paying in 16 billion to budget. Spain, Italy who are countries with many times the population of Ireland will benefit to the tune of about a hundred and thirty billion euro between them.

16 billion net. That's 3200 per per person in Ireland twice the amount a German will pay.

Brits saying the media have buried it. The government have gotten a terrible deal.

How much did Ireland get out of the fund before becoming a net contributer?

Graham

€40+ billion

Zebra3

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

And how much have those countries contributed over the years to help Ireland?

Every single person posting here as benefited since birth from EU membership, and now that Ireland has been asked to contribute back they are qhinging about it.

Imagine that.

People in a democracy discussing and debating what happens to their taxes.

But hey we've benefited from the EU in the past so we just lie down like good aul' croppies?

ExMachina1000

circadian wrote: »

How much did Ireland get out of the fund before becoming a net contributer?

You seem to think that there is a pile of money ust sitting there to hand out. Lol.
There isn't. Are you forgetting the current and ongoing economic situation

I don't think you are getting it. It's you me and everyone else who will lose out. Expect cuts to services, welfare and everything else in one way or another. Expect tax increases.

It's not Ireland who is paying this bill. Its taxpayers. Me , you and everyone else.

This will hit you in your own pocket.

11th highest gdp but making 5th highest contributions

ExMachina1000

I don't think you get it but this is going to directly affect your life and the public services for the country in one way or another.

Worst deal since the banks were bailed out.

sameoldname

Zebra3 wrote: »

Imagine that.

People in a democracy discussing and debating what happens to their taxes.

But hey we've benefited from the EU in the past so we just lie down like good aul' croppies?

There's no discussion here. People claim certain things about the EU, it gets disproved and then in about 5 hours they make the same claims again. Round and round it goes.

And just so I can be on the record: ~€460 a year per person is a price worth paying to be a member of the EU.

mick087

sameoldname wrote: »

And just so I can be on the record: ~€460 a year per person is a price worth paying to be a member of the EU.

For you maybe yes, but does everyone belive 460 per year is a price worth paying?

Graham

Looking at the abject failure of any sort of Irexit movement, it would appear they do.

For balance, we're talking about the sort of money Ireland received from the EU every year for most of the 90s.

Cal4567

sameoldname wrote: »

There's no discussion here. People claim certain things about the EU, it gets disproved and then in about 5 hours they make the same claims again. Round and round it goes.

And just so I can be on the record: ~€460 a year per person is a price worth paying to be a member of the EU.

There's a lot in that, yea.

Like to see how the UK does in the next 10 years. If they do just fine, or better than the EU bloc, then it will probably lead to an increase in more populist EU trends.

If they don't, then it will more than likely put paid to much more EU skepticism.

Podge_irl

mick087 wrote: »

Well im not sure if surpport for the EU is growing in its current format maybe surrport if it changes yes.

Ok. Well I am sure that support for the EU in its current format is growing because they measure these things.

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/press-room/20190417IPR41755/support-for-eu-remains-at-historically-high-level-despite-sceptics

Podge_irl

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Brits saying the media have buried it. The government have gotten a terrible deal.

Do you even know how the contributions are calculated? Its not done via some backroom deals where we have come out poorly. It is a well established calculation.

The EU is, for the most part, incredibly transparent in how it conducts business.

Graham

Podge_irl wrote: »

The EU is, for the most part, incredibly transparent in how it conducts business.

There's many a barstool yet to receive that detail.

mick087

Podge_irl wrote: »

Ok. Well I am sure that support for the EU in its current format is growing because they measure these things.

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/press-room/20190417IPR41755/support-for-eu-remains-at-historically-high-level-despite-sceptics

If surport grows then thats good for the EU.
If the majority of people in Ireland wish to stay in the EU then so we should.

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Zebra3 wrote: »

And when everyone is devaluing their currency nobody is.

Who said everyone would devalue their currency? That’s a massive assumption you are making there.

The reality is that many countries such as the U.K. and Italy saw the values of their currencies devalue (wrt other currencies) due to the policies they chose to pursue over decades. That though didn’t mean that other countries raced to devalue their currencies to match them.

blanch152

mick087 wrote: »

For you maybe yes, but does everyone belive 460 per year is a price worth paying?

If we weren't in the EU, all of us would be a lot worse off than just €460 per year.