Ireland to contribute €16 billion more than it receives to EU in next 7 years

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It should be pointed out that the figure claimed in the initial post would appear to be “unofficial” at best since the actual conclusion from the European Council do NOT break down figures for revenue and state that the methodology of calculating two out of three of the revenue sources is due to be revised.

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blanch152 wrote: »

If we weren't in the EU, all of us would be a lot worse off than just €460 per year.

Indeed anyone who thinks our multinationals are here due to the size of the Irish market is delusional. Rather they are here due to be size of the EU market that we are a part of (and our low tax rates).

mick087

blanch152 wrote: »

If we weren't in the EU, all of us would be a lot worse off than just €460 per year.

Then we should look at wealth equality.

ExMachina1000

Podge_irl wrote: »

Do you even know how the contributions are calculated? Its not done via some backroom deals where we have come out poorly. It is a well established calculation.

The EU is, for the most part, incredibly transparent in how it conducts business.

Regardless of if its transparent or not our contributions are now second highest in Europe per gdp.

We are now 5th highest overall.
Italy and Spain will be enjoying 130 billion shared between them. We will be paying back 16 billion. 3200 for every man woman and child

When people realise the cuts that will have to be made and at a time of economic turmoil it may finally hit home.

Do you think that the billions of euro is just sitting in a pile?

We need everything we have. FF have rolled over again

Remember this when we receive our first tax increase

Graham

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Regardless of if its transparent or not our contributions are now second highest in Europe per gdp.

Wow.

When you think how many years we were getting that paid into the country...

ExMachina1000

Graham wrote: »

Wow.

When you think how many years we were getting that paid into the country...

Pascal donahue managed to try and save for a rainy day fund. There will be a 2 billion year shortfall now.

This affects all if us. You seem happy to see a cut in public spending. I hope you are financially secure

Graham

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Pascal donahue managed to try and save for a rainy day fund. There will be a 2 billion year shortfall now.

I'd see that €2 billion as an investment with much bigger returns than €2 billion.

Then again, I'm not under the illusion we should just be gifted EU membership with zero contributions.

Podge_irl

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Pascal donahue managed to try and save for a rainy day fund. There will be a 2 billion year shortfall now.

This affects all if us. You seem happy to see a cut in public spending. I hope you are financially secure

Seriously, what on earth is your point?

You may as well be complaining your tax bill has gone up cause you have moved to a higher paying job.

ExMachina1000

Podge_irl wrote: »

Seriously, what on earth is your point?

You may as well be complaining your tax bill has gone up cause you have moved to a higher paying job.

The point is to pay for this new budget public services will have to be cut. Healthcare spending cut, social services cut.

This will affect everyone of us. Some don't realise that they are about to lose out.
They dont see that Ireland paying extra money is actually the tax payers money. Your money, my money, public money.

This affects your life . There will be 3200 for every man, woman and child less money to spend on Irelands services and support infrastructure.

Everything from housing to health to infrastructure to welfare.

Podge_irl

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

The point is to pay for this new budget public services will have to be cut. Healthcare spending cut, social services cut.

This will affect everyone of us. Some don't realise that they are about to lose out.
They dont see that Ireland paying extra money is actually the tax payers money. Your money, my money, public money.

This affects your life

Actually no. Nothing necessarily needs to be cut based off this. Because it is a payment that brings back returns multiple fold.

This is akin to someone complaining they are losing the dole because they got a job.

Again though - outside of complaining for the sake of it about having to actually pay for things in life - what is your point? What would you rather see?

ExMachina1000

Podge_irl wrote: »

Actually no. Nothing necessarily needs to be cut based off this. Because it is a payment that brings back returns multiple fold.

This is akin to someone complaining they are losing the dole because they got a job.

Again though - outside of complaining for the sake of it about having to actually pay for things in life - what is your point? What would you rather see?

No it's not. Its basic economics.
Your analogies aren't real.

We take in x amount of money each year through taxation. We also spend y amount of money to run the country and its services. The idea is to have a bit left over to save or give back in the form of tax cuts or welfare increases.

Because we now have an extra 2 billion a year to pay to Europe there will be nothing left . We had 1.4 billion of a surplus in 2019. With the EU increased cost we would be 600 million in the red.

Those are 2019 pre covid growing economy figures. Look at the state of the economy now. There wont be any money for public spending for a long time.

None of us win. The country suffers

circadian

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

You seem to think that there is a pile of money ust sitting there to hand out. Lol.
There isn't. Are you forgetting the current and ongoing economic situation

I don't think you are getting it. It's you me and everyone else who will lose out. Expect cuts to services, welfare and everything else in one way or another. Expect tax increases.

It's not Ireland who is paying this bill. Its taxpayers. Me , you and everyone else.

This will hit you in your own pocket.

11th highest gdp but making 5th highest contributions

LOL. I'm not getting it.

Right so.

ExMachina1000

circadian wrote: »

LOL. I'm not getting it.

Right so.

Clearly not

Risteard81

mick087 wrote: »

If surport grows then thats good for the EU.
If the majority of people in Ireland wish to stay in the EU then so we should.

No we shouldn't because the sovereignty and unity of the 32-County Irish Republic are inalienable and non-judicable.

Charles Babbage

A few years ago I paid a lot of tax because I received a lot of money. I wasn't complaining.

Risteard81 wrote: »

No we shouldn't because the sovereignty and unity of the 32-County Irish Republic are inalienable and non-judicable.

As Robert Emmet said, Ireland should take her place among the nations of the world, if that means the people of Ireland forming alliances and collective bodies with those nations, then great.

Clarence Boddiker

Podge_irl wrote: »

Because it is a payment that brings back returns multiple fold.

Can you elaborate on these huge returns we'll be receiving?

micosoft

mick087 wrote: »

For you maybe yes, but does everyone belive 460 per year is a price worth paying?

84% vs the 7% who don't.

micosoft

Clarence Boddiker wrote: »

Can you elaborate on these huge returns we'll be receiving?

It's already been elaborated on the thread many times. But frankly neither hard to find or hard to grasp how membership of the EU has and does result in a huge return for Ireland.

circadian

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Clearly not

So, are you advocating leaving the EU?

ExMachina1000

micosoft wrote: »

84% vs the 7% who don't.

It's not about leaving the eu. That would be madness. It's the deal we just got. Its extremely expensive for Ireland. Really bad deal

ExMachina1000

circadian wrote: »

So, are you advocating leaving the EU?

No

mick087

Risteard81 wrote: »

No we shouldn't because the sovereignty and unity of the 32-County Irish Republic are inalienable and non-judicable.

That sounds like a political party view position.

circadian

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

It's not about leaving the eu. That would be madness. It's the deal we just got. Its extremely expensive for Ireland. Really bad deal

You haven't a notion.

micosoft

Mr. teddywinkles wrote: »

If it's e16 b over 7 years. What's our contribution going to be over 40 years. A e100 b?

If we end up making a contribution of 100b over 40 years we should be celebrating as it means we will have become one of the consistently wealthiest countries in the world. We are already in the top six so it suggests we would be the richest country in the world AND in history. I'll celebrate in my house of gold and rocket car tbh.

I have to say the irrational own goals of some of the "commentators" here.

ExMachina1000

circadian wrote: »

You haven't a notion.

Those are the figures. Where do you think the extra 2 billion will come from?

You haven't a notion. Ireland paying more means Irish people missing out

mick087

micosoft wrote: »

84% vs the 7% who don't.

Yes today 84% wish to stay in the EU, like i say once the majority wish to stay in the EU then we should.

ronivek

Why are some people saying there will be a shortfall?

We're already paying into the EU every year (€2.3 billion in 2018); as far as I can tell there's absolutely nothing new in this thread other then the fact we're still in a position to continue contributing at a similar rate.

Am I missing something here?

micosoft

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

It's not about leaving the eu. That would be madness. It's the deal we just got. Its extremely expensive for Ireland. Really bad deal

And as has been pointed out repeatedly:
- It's an investment that results in an astonishing return for Ireland of >20 times.
- If it's a high contribution it's because we are a rich country.

Any challenges with our health system, social services, housing are all matters for our national government to solve.

All the facts demonstrate that we've gotten a great deal with the EU.

micosoft

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Those are the figures. Where do you think the extra 2 billion will come from?

You haven't a notion. Ireland paying more means Irish people missing out

No it doesn't. If Irish people are missing out it's because of Irish policies.

The simple evidence is the UK where despite Brexit even more people are missing out because of British government policies.

Ireland quadrupled its contribution to the WHO this year. Do you think that means Irish people lose out?

ExMachina1000

micosoft wrote: »

And as has been pointed out repeatedly:
- It's an investment that results in an astonishing return for Ireland of >20 times.
- If it's a high contribution it's because we are a rich country.

Any challenges with our health system, social services, housing are all matters for our national government to solve.

All the facts demonstrate that we've gotten a great deal with the EU.

I'm not arguing that that Ireland has benefited massively from eu membership. That is without doubt.

I'm saying that this budget deal is terrible for Ireland. An extra 2 billion a year. That is two billion that we cant actually afford to pay.

If you expect any real progress on housing or healthcare through increased spending you can forget it.

Think of it this way. Ireland announced a 7 billion stimulus package. 2 billion of that is now spent already on the eu budget.

More public housing? There is 2 billion euro less to spend
Etc.

Spain and Italy have been given 130 billion euro between them to spend.

It is a bad budget for Ireland. By Ireland I mean me,you and everyone else.