Rabbit population in your county. How did RHD and RHD2 get here

laoismanj

I live in county laois. About 10 years ago in my parish the rabbit population waa absouloutly thriving. Every field was walking with them. The mixi came and went, people hunted them with dogs and yet they still thrived then all of a slap almost overnight they all disapeared like a magic trick.
Rumor has it a poor me farmer with no money brought in the rhd virus because the rabbits were"aten his grash"
Can rabbits be relocated to old burrows that havent been used in years safely and how can the rabbit population be saved from this new rhd2 lab virus?

Cherry Blossom

Welcome to Boards OP. Please note that posting the same content across multiple forums is considered spam.
In my opinion the correct forum for this thread is Nature and Birdwatching. If you would like me to move the thread there drop me a pm or report the post giving the reason that you would like it moved. As you have also posted your query in Hunting which is often at odds with this forum, I will leave this closed unless I hear from you.

Thanks,
CB.

Cherry Blossom

Never mind, someone moved it while I was posting :pac:

OpenYourEyes

Mod Note: Thread moved at the behest of OP - note that the Hunting forum charter applies!

yubabill

laoismanj wrote: »

I live in county laois. About 10 years ago in my parish the rabbit population waa absouloutly thriving. Every field was walking with them. The mixi came and went, people hunted them with dogs and yet they still thrived then all of a slap almost overnight they all disapeared like a magic trick.
Rumor has it a poor me farmer with no money brought in the rhd virus because the rabbits were"aten his grash"
Can rabbits be relocated to old burrows that havent been used in years safely and how can the rabbit population be saved from this new rhd2 lab virus?

I knew a couple of old boys, long gone, who spent a lot of their spare time moving rabbits to new burrows. They said it worked, but it was impossible to prove after the fact, so I had to take their word when they pointed to burrows they said they had moved rabbits into.

I blame buzzards and pine martens for the drop here in recent years, but I was gladdened to see a re-appearance of numbers this year.

One thing that's changed is that the rabbits don't go more than about 2 metres from the burrow now, as far as I can see.

dodderangler

yubabill wrote: »

I knew a couple of old boys, long gone, who spent a lot of their spare time moving rabbits to new burrows. They said it worked, but it was impossible to prove after the fact, so I had to take their word when they pointed to burrows they said they had moved rabbits into.

I blame buzzards and pine martens for the drop here in recent years, but I was gladdened to see a re-appearance of numbers this year.

One thing that's changed is that the rabbits don't go more than about 2 metres from the burrow now, as far as I can see.

Buzzards and pine martens but ignore the feral cats, poachers and mixxy??
Buzzards will take young or sick rabbits. They are not capable of taking on the larger ones mate. Have you seen a buzzards feet? They're extremely small.

laoismanj

dodderangler wrote: »

Buzzards and pine martens but ignore the feral cats, poachers and mixxy??
Buzzards will take young or sick rabbits. They are not capable of taking on the larger ones mate. Have you seen a buzzards feet? They're extremely small.

Rhd and rhd2 virus is far worse than any amount of hunters and predators trust me it wipes them out so fast

laoismanj

yubabill wrote: »

I knew a couple of old boys, long gone, who spent a lot of their spare time moving rabbits to new burrows. They said it worked, but it was impossible to prove after the fact, so I had to take their word when they pointed to burrows they said they had moved rabbits into.

I blame buzzards and pine martens for the drop here in recent years, but I was gladdened to see a re-appearance of numbers this year.

One thing that's changed is that the rabbits don't go more than about 2 metres from the burrow now, as far as I can see.

Thats encouraging to hear. Yeah i rarely ever see a rabbit in the field far from the burrow now

cookimonster

laoismanj wrote: »

.... Yeah i rarely ever see a rabbit in the field far from the burrow now

To be honest and I have been rifle shooting rabbits since the late 1970's, I've never really noticed rabbits out further than a few metres or so from warrens, ditch lines or edges of fields. I've shot them in Cork, Mayo, Waterford, Wexford, Dublin, Meath and Cavan and never noticed a difference in habits. I remember as a young teen seeing my first Buzzard in Meath and nowadays if I don't see one when out it would an exception.
But it's not predator or poaching (unless numbers are already low in the area) that's having a major effect on numbers. The big one is disease with Rhd the main culprit in its ability to efficiently kill so quick.
Another problem is the changing landscape, let's not blame the farmers here, the various departments change their minds quicker than their underwater as how they, the farmers, should hold the land. This year its ditches and drainage or head lands and natural areas the next its single wire fencing and no incentive for natural areas or penalties for not farming the land. Large scale forreststation has also made land useless for the rabbit population.
Rabbits are not the rampant hords that people make out, they need a very specific set of circumstances to thrive on specific lands. I remember shooting large areas of connected land and bypassing individual plots or fields as experience dictated that no rabbits would be present. If the conditions are right the rabbit will thrive and a handful of hunters and predators would do little but put a dent in the numbers. Old ways of systematically hunting warrens would keep numbers in check while still ensuring a future for the rabbit population.
But today, whether it be farmers or golfers, the use of infectious diseases to control rabbits is a very devastating and indiscriminate measure.

Grizzly 45

Haven't seen a rabbit warren in decades around here. But there were until about 10 years ago, still some "Bush rabbits" about. Rabbits who would live in any cover that a field might have to offer.ie bits of old corrugate, non-use drain pipe, under abandoned farm machinery etc. Seems they were the survivors of the rabbit apocalypse of Mixamatosis.Which survived in the warrens in either flea eggs or the soil itself.But even those has disapperd .

Kramer

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

.....still some "Bush rabbits" about. Rabbits who would live in any cover that a field might have to offer.ie bits of old corrugate, non-use drain pipe, under abandoned farm machinery etc.

I call them hares .

Grizzly 45

I think at this stage Kramer, I know the difference between Lepus Hibernia or Lepus Europeaus and Oryctolagus cuniculus Hibernia.:D:D:D

yubabill

dodderangler wrote: »

Buzzards and pine martens but ignore the feral cats, poachers and mixxy??
Buzzards will take young or sick rabbits. They are not capable of taking on the larger ones mate. Have you seen a buzzards feet? They're extremely small.

I'm going to sound like a smartass, no matter how I say it, but what you're saying is 100% correct, however we have always had cats, poachers and myxi and I have seen rabbit populations deal with them.

Like everyone else, I've seen numbers decline noticeably in the last few years while the buzzards and martens have increased massively in numbers (and I haven't seen a woodcock here in the same time - used to always be a few up the back forestry).

WRt RHD, I can't say if we have it locally, as I have seriously laid off the bunnies when the numbers started to fall, only taking magpies and the odd fox in recent years.

And yes, I know buzzards can't handle full-grown rabbits. Taking the young is enough to impact numbers, but combine that with martens mooching around and the effect could be significant. And I have seen martens chasing rabbits, they're very clever.

Birdnuts

yubabill wrote: »

I'm going to sound like a smartass, no matter how I say it, but what you're saying is 100% correct, however we have always had cats, poachers and myxi and I have seen rabbit populations deal with them.

Like everyone else, I've seen numbers decline noticeably in the last few years while the buzzards and martens have increased massively in numbers (and I haven't seen a woodcock here in the same time - used to always be a few up the back forestry).

WRt RHD, I can't say if we have it locally, as I have seriously laid off the bunnies when the numbers started to fall, only taking magpies and the odd fox in recent years.

And yes, I know buzzards can't handle full-grown rabbits. Taking the young is enough to impact numbers, but combine that with martens mooching around and the effect could be significant. And I have seen martens chasing rabbits, they're very clever.

A healthy rabbit population and its breeding potential is well able to withstand the few rabbits the averge buzzard needs to get through a week(and thats assuming its feeding on nothing else, which being a scavanger is unlikely to be the case as they will allways take an easier option as opposed to having to hunt eg. roadkill etc.) - obviously a Pine Marten or fox will take alot more but a persistant low rabbit population is nearly certainly down to disease. Also in the case of RHD the bunnies will be dieing in the burrows so you often won't even notice sick ones out and about

yubabill

Birdnuts wrote: »

A healthy rabbit population and its breeding potential is well able to withstand the few rabbits the averge buzzard needs to get through a week(and thats assuming its feeding on nothing else, which being a scavanger is unlikely to be the case as they will allways take an easier option as opposed to having to hunt eg. roadkill etc.) - obviously a Pine Marten or fox will take alot more but a persistant low rabbit population is nearly certainly down to disease. Also in the case of RHD the bunnies will be dieing in the burrows so you often won't even notice sick ones out and about

Not dismissing the possibility of disease, but never noticed anything unusual with the ones we shot.

We have a lot of buzzards here and a lot of martens. One day last summer I counted six buzzards in the air at once while standing in the garden.

Don't know their range, so cannot say whether there is another population two miles up the road where the rabbits were, but I saw two buzzards up there at once literally waiting in the trees over the burrows.

And the martens wiped out the grey squirrels which were in good numbers for decades in the forestry adjoining the fields where the rabbits were.

Birdnuts

yubabill wrote: »

Not dismissing the possibility of disease, but never noticed anything unusual with the ones we shot.

We have a lot of buzzards here and a lot of martens. One day last summer I counted six buzzards in the air at once while standing in the garden.

Don't know their range, so cannot say whether there is another population two miles up the road where the rabbits were, but I saw two buzzards up there at once literally waiting in the trees over the burrows.

And the martens wiped out the grey squirrels which were in good numbers for decades in the forestry adjoining the fields where the rabbits were.

You may not come across sick ones in the case of RHD as they tend to not leave the burrow.

Buzzards are highly territorial most of the year - groups like that are typically displaying parties ie. courtship rituals, or parents with fledged young. Hunting grounds on the other hand are heavily guarded from outsiders by the resident pair and even that years fledlings won't be tolerated within a month or 2 of leaving the nest.

I understand not everyone is a fan of Pine Martens(obviously can do alot of damage in a chicken run et.c) but the fact that they've got rid of your local Grey Squirrels can only be viewed as a good thing - hopefully it opens up the possibility of re-colinisation by our native Reds as what has happend elsewhere.

Asus1

Ive only shot 1 rabbit in the last probably year and a half and that was a mixi one sitting the far side of a stream.Ive seen a few young knocking around but not enough to take a few.I also have buzzards,fox's and first time i seen a pine Martin around well I know of at least 2.The local birdwatchers have eyes on the 2 buzzard nests for a good few years and talking to them they reckon 80% of the buzzards food is vermin and frogs with the remainder being roadkill.
Id imagine that with so few rabbits around the fox and pine martin are the same except for ground birds nests.I think most problems with rabbits missing are probably change in farmland and these horrible manmade diseases.

Eddie B

There's not a predatory species on this Island that could diminish rabbit populations like we have seen here, over the last decade or more. It's human nature to put the blame on something that can be visibly seen, rather than an invisible killer, that leaves no trace behind.

Yes buzzards are well capable of taking rabbits, but as already said, even if they ate nothing else, they wouldn't even put a hole in a healthy population.

Pine Marten too, will take rabbits, but there are much easier meals for them to prey on. Mink will prey on rabbits, but I've never heard of mink decimating rabbit populations, even back when no one was trapping them. I mean, fox's prey on rabbits constantly, and rabbit numbers have always been healthy.

RHD is very real, and has been here for many years. A lot of hunting folk didn't even know about the virus till it appeared in the papers. Up to then, no one outside of the hunting community seemed to give a dalm about it, till a few hares got infected.

Birdnuts

Sadly both diseases have also recently devastated rabbit populations in their original homelands of Iberia and Southern France:(

laoismanj

Eddie B wrote: »

There's not a predatory species on this Island that could diminish rabbit populations like we have seen here, over the last decade or more. It's human nature to put the blame on something that can be visibly seen, rather than an invisible killer, that leaves no trace behind.

Yes buzzards are well capable of taking rabbits, but as already said, even if they ate nothing else, they wouldn't even put a hole in a healthy population.

Pine Marten too, will take rabbits, but there are much easier meals for them to prey on. Mink will prey on rabbits, but I've never heard of mink decimating rabbit populations, even back when no one was trapping them. I mean, fox's prey on rabbits constantly, and rabbit numbers have always been healthy.

RHD is very real, and has been here for many years. A lot of hunting folk didn't even know about the virus till it appeared in the papers. Up to then, no one outside of the hunting community seemed to give a dalm about it, till a few hares got infected.

Agree 100% there used to be ypung lads lamping with dogs, did it meself when inwas a young lad, ferreting etc anf the rabbits were still tgere and plentyful despite prrdators, one field that had fences like fort knox beside the main road couldnt be hunted in any shape or form we used to always look in at night and wow it looked like the ground was moving but that is just a memory now, they are all gone. I worry for the rabbit population, im thinking of getting them and letting them into old burrows and even vaccenating them against rhd to give them a fighting chance. It will cost money sure but id rather have one up on the bastards that killed our sport than watch them go extinct

Bushwack

Disease and farming practices in my opinion have a lot to answer for in the decimation of any species and the rabbit is no different. Years ago when money was scarce their were big rabbit Warren's in the middle of fields that fed the surrounding areas and when the 360 moved in that was the beginning of the end. If you notice well around me any how the big wide high dry banked ditch is no more and the big clumps of bramble are gone also and the only hedge that's left now has a water course on one side which is not great for burrowing rabbits..Shur most hedge rows now look as if their upside down with all the cover at the top and nothing only tree trunks at the bottom skinned to the bark. How could any animal get shelter. I think the prediction of rabbits is a good thing killing the weak and diseased animals before it spreads. The rabbit is now almost on the same list as all the other wildlife that's gone missing in our countryside along with my ferrets that are not worth keeping any more.

laoismanj

Bushwack wrote: »

Disease and farming practices in my opinion have a lot to answer for in the decimation of any species and the rabbit is no different. Years ago when money was scarce their were big rabbit Warren's in the middle of fields that fed the surrounding areas and when the 360 moved in that was the beginning of the end. If you notice well around me any how the big wide high dry banked ditch is no more and the big clumps of bramble are gone also and the only hedge that's left now has a water course on one side which is not great for burrowing rabbits..Shur most hedge rows now look as if their upside down with all the cover at the top and nothing only tree trunks at the bottom skinned to the bark. How could any animal get shelter. I think the prediction of rabbits is a good thing killing the weak and diseased animals before it spreads. The rabbit is now almost on the same list as all the other wildlife that's gone missing in our countryside along with my ferrets that are not worth keeping any more.

Regards to your ferrets, catch the rabbita and let them go in old warrens thats my plan come the winter when the dreaded annoying cattle arent there to ruin your day