2020 the battle of the septuagenarians - Trump vs Biden, Part 2

MadYaker

The debates should be interesting anyway I could nearly hear the collective sigh of relief from across the pond when Biden made it through the speech without a gaffe or a stammer. Any slip would have been jumped on and twisted out of all proportion but he gave them nothing. Trump's Arizona speech was as usual incoherent and filled with inaccuracies and exaggeration. Will his speech for the RNC be any better? Probably not. Melania is giving a speech which might be interesting.

Kidchameleon

Leroy42 wrote: »

So we have moved back to the 'both bad as each other' defence?


Kid, you cannot possibly expect anyone to take you seriously when you kept banging the drum about Biden possibly suffering from dementia on the basis of how he speaks, and then have literally nothing to say when Trump, yet again, rambles about talking absolute nonsense and clearly forgetting what he was supposed to be doing.

At least have some consistency and standards.

If you believe that Biden is not mentally fit to be POTUS, then surely you feel the same, and much more, about Trump.

And since we know all about Trump, as opposed to a theory about Biden, then the only rational decision is to go with Biden.

I have never questioned Bidens mental capacity. Please stop saying I did. Again, you are lumping all Trump supporters together.

Kidchameleon

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

Apart from the fact that he went golfing on the day his brother died.....have you any evidence for his mysterious trip to the hospital last year being because he was visiting his brother? Was his brother in Walter Reed in November, 2019?

Its a private family matter so I do not have direct evidence. I can only assume based on the tragedy that transpired that the president was visiting his brother.

SlowMotion321

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I have never questioned Bidens mental capacity. Please stop saying I did. Again, you are lumping all Trump supporters together.

Eh, that's because you are all Trump supporters!

Kidchameleon

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Its a private family matter so I do not have direct evidence. I can only assume based on the tragedy that transpired that the president was visiting his brother.

You've invented a conclusion.

Kidchameleon

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

And have you watched Biden's speech yet? What did you think?

*Disclaimer* This post may be offensive to people with speech impediments. I have put one paragraph in spoiler tags as a result. I am not intending to offend anyone here. MODS, delete that paragraph if needs be.

Yes indeed, I have watched the speech. Firstly I will say that I strongly suspect that it was pre recorded. I haven't seen him talk so coherently in a long time. I believe there must have been some trickery involved to get him through the 25 minutes.

He was using the usual public speaking gestures - looking directly at the camera, pointing his index finger when making a point etc. These things are fine when done correctly but you could see he was thinking all the time about it (either that or there was a helper off camera giving him direction). There was just something not normal about his body language, it was awkward and unnatural.

He tried to smear president Trump by using lightness and darkness metaphors but I think this backfired on him. At one point he referred to himself as the "light". Did he expose some heavy narcissism there? Just a thought.

He did not come off as "presidential" IMHO for a couple of reasons. He never referred to POTUS by name. Why is that? We all know that Donald Trump is the president. He should show respect for the office. A potential president should at the very least, have respect for the office of president. He also suckled up to Obama, ranting on about how great he is. He gave off an air of inferiority to Obama. I think this was a mistake on his part, that will not resonate with voters. A president should see himself as the leader of the people, not as second best to someone else.

The speech was littered with flare ups of his speech impediment. Now, this is not an attack on people with speech impediments (I have family members with them) but the average American will see it as a sign of weakness. Imagine Biden was to be a "war" president. Americans will not want someone representing them at a time like that whilst stuttering to their enemies. Again, another aspect of this candidate that will not resonate with voters. Americans want someone seen as strong. Say all you want about Trump but one cannot deny that he is strong. Am I saying that people who stutter are not strong? No, of course not. But I am saying that the average American may view it that way at the very least subconsciously.

I completely disagreed with his Covid remarks. Completely and utterly. He engaged in blatant scare mongering and misrepresentation of the facts (and we see these same misrepresentations here on this thread). He said the US was "By far the worst performance of any nation on earth" relating to Covid. This is just not true. The deaths per million is not near the worst in the world, not near it. Biden is lying and the fact that most people do not know anyone who has died from Covid means the average American will not believe what he is saying. The average American (like the rest of us) has simply been inconvenienced by the virus. When it all blows over, they will thank President Trump for his tactics. They will have jobs to go back to.

Biden speaks about what he would have done to tackle Covid. Now, that is all well and good from his vantage point. But the president must factor in much more than preventing the spread of the disease. Not least, he must think about the economy. Decisions need to be made to protect people's jobs and livelihoods. These decisions will cause preventable deaths. But a true leader will make these decisions, not run away from them. I feel that Biden detailing his rose tinted response to Covid was a bit of an own goal, it highlights the reality of how good Trump is doing. Biden wanted to shut down the country from the start? Bloody hell, can you imagine what would have happened? The US would be much worse off economically and in turn, the world.

His speech is littered with supposed messages of hope yet when it comes to Covid, he engaged in blatant scare mongering. Mandatory nationwide wearing of masks? That is not an America I want to go to! The science is clear on mask wearing, there is no need for such strict measures. The disease is not so bad that the country needs to be shut down. Look at Sweden, they are doing fine. I think president Trump has found the perfect balance for protecting lives as well as the economy. I've said it before and I'll say it again, leadership is not so black and white. We all have our theories about how Covid should have been tackled but none of us are in the position President Trump is in (not even Biden). The president must make tough decisions that will lead to heartache for some but be for the greater good.

He spoke about the "current occupant" of the Whitehouse "fanning the flames of division" but goes on to use words like the "murder" when speaking about George Floyd. Terribly hypocritical especially when you consider the new video footage of Floyds death. It proves beyond any doubt that his death had nothing to do with race. We all know that Floyd was not killed because he was black. He died because he was a drug addict and a criminal. It was accidental. It is Biden and the left who are "fanning the flames of division".

He engaged in the usual boring identity politics - equal pay for women, fairness and privilege, help the middle class & not the rich etc etc. This kind of crap needs to die if you're going to get the average American onboard. Everyone knows that women and men have the same opportunities and that any pay disparity there might be has nothing to do with sexism. Everyone knows that blacks and other minorities' high crime statistics have nothing to do with racism. We all know these things on a rational and instinctive level. He needs to speak about the real issues, not this SJW level crap.

Why did he bring up the "very fine people" incident again? I can't understand this, we all know what Trump meant and we can all verify that independently. Biden comes off as very dishonest when he demonstrably takes the president's words out of context. Attack Trump on his policies and actions, not on things he didn't say. School yard level tactics there from Biden and insulting to the intelligence of Americans. Does he think they are all stupid or something?

I still maintain that Biden will not be running. I know, he has accepted the nomination, it is all official now but I can still see a change down the road, possibly before the debates. He is just too bad a candidate, he comes off as too old, he would not be doing a second term, he lies demonstrably, he seems to care more about optics than reality, the sound of his voice is off putting to me (and I'd imagine to the average voter). He is just a terrible candidate, highly unlikable and his VP pick is hated even by a great many of his supporters. There is absolutely no way Biden will win (regardless of what the polls say). He has no chance.

Billy Mays

Why would Donnie's brother have been in a military hospital in Washington DC when he lives over 300 miles away in New York?

The energy is getting lower by the day

Timberrrrrrrr

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Its a private family matter so I do not have direct evidence. I can only assume based on the tragedy that transpired that the president was visiting his brother.

Walter Reed hospital is in Washington.

Robert Trump died in hospital in New York.

Trump was taken to Walter Reed secretly and unexpectedly, twice!

Chameleon, do you think the middle class will appreciate being put ahead of the rich? I would suspect it would resonate with voters. You'd be praising Trump if he was calling to bring back morning but acknowledging the huge wealth gap is identity politics crap....

In terms of a minor stutter, it doesn't seem to be affecting his polling. Trump seeing a mosquito resulted in weird rants about sharks... That's not exactly a sign of a strong leader... Biden's speeches simply come across as far more presidential than Trump has ever done. Can you point me to one point during covid where Trump has shown a decent level of leadership in a speech?

SlowMotion321

Biden - Addresses the issues

Trump - Apportions blame

Timberrrrrrrr

Kidchameleon wrote: »

*Disclaimer* This post may be offensive to people with speech impediments. I have put one paragraph in spoiler tags as a result. I am not intending to offend anyone here. MODS, delete that paragraph if needs be.

Yes indeed, I have watched the speech. Firstly I will say that I strongly suspect that it was pre recorded. I haven't seen him talk so coherently in a long time. I believe there must have been some trickery involved to get him through the 25 minutes.

You're still going with the "it was pre-recorded" nonsense when it's obviously not!

He was using the usual public speaking gestures - looking directly at the camera, pointing his index finger when making a point etc. These things are fine when done correctly but you could see he was thinking all the time about it (either that or there was a helper off camera giving him direction). There was just something not normal about his body language, it was awkward and unnatural.

Have you ever watched a Trump speech?

He tried to smear president Trump by using lightness and darkness metaphors but I think this backfired on him. At one point he referred to himself as the "light". Did he expose some heavy narcissism there? Just a thought.

He did not come off as "presidential" IMHO for a couple of reasons. He never referred to POTUS by name. Why is that? We all know that Donald Trump is the president. He should show respect for the office. A potential president should at the very least, have respect for the office of president. He also suckled up to Obama, ranting on about how great he is. He gave off an air of inferiority to Obama. I think this was a mistake on his part, that will not resonate with voters. A president should see himself as the leader of the people, not as second best to someone else.

He knew that would pass Trump off, Trimp hates being ignored, Biden is starting to beat Trump at his own game. Trump wants to talk shìt about Biden then he should expect the same back at him.

The speech was littered with flare ups of his speech impediment. Now, this is not an attack on people with speech impediments (I have family members with them) but the average American will see it as a sign of weakness. Imagine Biden was to be a "war" president. Americans will not want someone representing them at a time like that whilst stuttering to their enemies. Again, another aspect of this candidate that will not resonate with voters. Americans want someone seen as strong. Say all you want about Trump but one cannot deny that he is strong. [/quoteb]Am I saying that people who stutter are not strong? No, of course not. But I am saying that the average American may view it that way at the very least subconsciously.

It didn't bother the American public when he was VP.

As for Trump being "strong"? He is a weak little bully who cries out loud when people are "nasty" to him.

I completely disagreed with his Covid remarks. Completely and utterly. He engaged in blatant scare mongering and misrepresentation of the facts (and we see these same misrepresentations here on this thread). He said the US was "By far the worst performance of any nation on earth" relating to Covid. This is just not true. The deaths per million is not near the worst in the world, not near it. Biden is lying and the fact that most people do not know anyone who has died from Covid means the average American will not believe what he is saying. The average American (like the rest of us) has simply been inconvenienced by the virus. When it all blows over, they will thank President Trump for his tactics. They will have jobs to go back to.

Wether you like it or not America has been the country most affected by Covid and its all down to Trumps diabolical response to it.

Biden speaks about what he would have done to tackle Covid. Now, that is all well and good from his vantage point. But the president must factor in much more than preventing the spread of the disease. Not least, he must think about the economy. Decisions need to be made to protect people's jobs and livelihoods. These decisions will cause preventable deaths. But a true leader will make these decisions, not run away from them. I feel that Biden detailing his rose tinted response to Covid was a bit of an own goal, it highlights the reality of how good Trump is doing. Biden wanted to shut down the country from the start? Bloody hell, can you imagine what would have happened? The US would be much worse off economically and in turn, the world.

Just waffle there

His speech is littered with supposed messages of hope yet when it comes to Covid, he engaged in blatant scare mongering. Mandatory nationwide wearing of masks? That is not an America I want to go to! The science is clear on mask wearing, there is no need for such strict measures. The disease is not so bad that the country needs to be shut down. Look at Sweden, they are doing fine. I think president Trump has found the perfect balance for protecting lives as well as the economy. I've said it before and I'll say it again, leadership is not so black and white. We all have our theories about how Covid should have been tackled but none of us are in the position President Trump is in (not even Biden). The president must make tough decisions that will lead to heartache for some but be for the greater good.

You sound like Trump there.... yes people will die "it is what it is"

He spoke about the "current occupant" of the Whitehouse "fanning the flames of division" but goes on to use words like the "murder" when speaking about George Floyd. Terribly hypocritical especially when you consider the new video footage of Floyds death. It proves beyond any doubt that his death had nothing to do with race. We all know that Floyd was not killed because he was black. He died because he was a drug addict and a criminal. It was accidental. It is Biden and the left who are "fanning the flames of division".

He died because a police officer knelt on his neck.

He engaged in the usual boring identity politics - equal pay for women, fairness and privilege, help the middle class & not the rich etc etc. This kind of crap needs to die if you're going to get the average American onboard. Everyone knows that women and men have the same opportunities and that any pay disparity there might be has nothing to do with sexism. Everyone knows that blacks and other minorities' high crime statistics have nothing to do with racism. We all know these things on a rational and instinctive level. He needs to speak about the real issues, not this SJW level crap.

Straight outta the WELOVEDONALD handbook :rolleyes:

Why did he bring up the "very fine people" incident again? I can't understand this, we all know what Trump meant and we can all verify that independently. Biden comes off as very dishonest when he demonstrably takes the president's words out of context. Attack Trump on his policies and actions, not on things he didn't say. School yard level tactics there from Biden and insulting to the intelligence of Americans. Does he think they are all stupid or something?

Isn't this what Trump and his zealots have been doing all year to Biden?

I still maintain that Biden will not be running. I know, he has accepted the nomination, it is all official now but I can still see a change down the road, possibly before the debates. He is just too bad a candidate, he comes off as too old, he would not be doing a second term, he lies demonstrably, he seems to care more about optics than reality, the sound of his voice is off putting to me (and I'd imagine to the average voter). He is just a terrible candidate, highly unlikable and his VP pick is hated even by a great many of his supporters. There is absolutely no way Biden will win (regardless of what the polls say). He has no chance.

He is four years older than the tan in a can that occupies the WH at the moment, you know the guy im talking about right? Has to use two hands to drink a glass of water, shuffles down a ramp like a geriatric, eats mcdonalds everyday, os obese, made two unexpected visits to Walter Reed hospital, hid in a bunker because there were protests outside...i could go on but I'm sure you get my drift.

Igotadose

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Its a private family matter so I do not have direct evidence. I can only assume based on the tragedy that transpired that the president was visiting his brother.

Nahh, the #IMPOTUS was golfing the day his brother died, and as was quoted here made his death all about how his brother praised him. A truly sick puppy. Not as sick as those supporting him still, though.

briany

SlowMotion321 wrote: »

Biden - Addresses the issues

Trump - Apportions blame

True. Trump's reaction to the Coronavirus has been "It won't be a problem"> "It'll go away really soon."> "It's a Democrat hoax."> "The governors aren't doing their jobs."> "China sent it."

At no point in his handling of the crisis has he really made an appeal to have real bi-partisan talks on how to handle the situation. He hasn't even made some flowery speeches about doing that. Any other president would at least try to look like they care about the greater good, even if they really felt different.

Trump never accepts any blame for anything bad. Like, literally. He will, however, try to claim 100 percent of the credit on good things he had little or nothing to do with. That's got to be in Chapter 1 of "How to be a narcissist".

MadYaker

If still haven't heard Trump say what he actually has planned for a second term. This campaign isn't half as slick as his 2016 one, there doesn't seem to be a coherent message. Brain drain due to good people not wanting to be associated? Most of the stuff I read from him or his campaign is attacks on others. What happened to the health bill he said he going to sign signing in 2 weeks about 6 weeks ago?

Overheal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

As we recently found out, he was visiting his terminally ill brother. Have some respect please, its not the kind of thing you should use to score political points.

His brother wasn’t at Walter Reed.

Kidchameleon

Overheal wrote: »

His brother wasn’t at Walter Reed.

Maybe he was. How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Trumps medical records?

Maybe Trump was at Reed to visit veterans? Maybe he felt ill? Who cares, he's in great health.

pjohnson

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Maybe he was. How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Trumps medical records?

Maybe Trump was at Reed to visit veterans? Maybe he felt ill? Who cares, he's in great health.

How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Donald Trumps medical records?

Kidchameleon

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Maybe he was. How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Trumps medical records?

Maybe Trump was at Reed to visit veterans? Maybe he felt ill? Who cares, he's in great health.

Robert Trump wouldn't be eligible to be a patient. It's also pretty unlikely he was visiting veterans. Also he's far from great health...

Timberrrrrrrr

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Maybe he was. How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Trumps medical records?

Maybe Trump was at Reed to visit veterans? Maybe he felt ill? Who cares, he's in great health.

He was terminally ill, he died in hospital in New York yet you're still trying to claim Trump went to Walter Reed to visit his brother?

Great health lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tszIXno2Q8

He is obese and unfit, he claims to be the fittest president of all time when reality tells us he is just the fattest president of all time.

Overheal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Maybe he was. How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Trumps medical records?

Maybe Trump was at Reed to visit veterans? Maybe he felt ill? Who cares, he's in great health.

Maybe you should research what Walter Reed National Military Medical Center is and then get back to me.

His brother was hospitalized in New York.

Again you prove you’re just a dishonest Trump supporter.

extra gravy

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Maybe he was. How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Trumps medical records?

Maybe Trump was at Reed to visit veterans? Maybe he felt ill? Who cares, he's in great health.

Great health...that's why he needs a golf cart to drag his fat ass around. At least Biden can ride a bike, Donnie would probably pass out if he tried.

Overheal

Trump is in fact obese as his own disclosed records have shown.

Overheal

Newly leaked audio, after 2016 election Trump boasts about how great it was that black turnout was low

https://www.mediaite.com/election-2016/trump-privately-boasted-of-low-african-american-voter-turnout-after-2016-election-in-newly-leaked-audio-it-was-great/

dwayneshintzy

In 2004, how many prominent Republicans came out against GWB?

In 2012, how many prominent Democrats came out against Obama?

There's seemingly quite a few prominent Republicans this year against Trump; Mitt Romney, John Kasich, Colin Powell, Phil Scott (Vermont governor), William McRaven, Francis Rooney....

Timberrrrrrrr

Lincoln project new ad really shows Fox up lol

https://twitter.com/ProjectLincoln/status/1296968605205065728?s=19

jamule

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Maybe he was. How can you be sure? Do you have access to Robert Trumps medical records?

Maybe Trump was at Reed to visit veterans? Maybe he felt ill? Who cares, he's in great health.

why does Trump keep hiring criminals?

MadYaker

The Steve Banon build the wall sh!ts show is absolutely hilarious. Trump new all about it as well, I’d say they had a good laugh over it at the time. Steve isn’t laughing anymore.

Timberrrrrrrr

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Lincoln project new ad really shows Fox up lol

https://twitter.com/ProjectLincoln/status/1296968605205065728?s=19

I usually try to avoid listening to him speak as he annoys the crap out of me, but that was hilarious.

Kidchameleon

MadYaker wrote: »

The Steve Banon build the wall sh!ts show is absolutely hilarious. Trump new all about it as well, I’d say they had a good laugh over it at the time. Steve isn’t laughing anymore.

Any proof of this claim?

dwayneshintzy

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Any proof of this claim?

Maybe it's just his opinion, or a feeling that he has? That's good enough, right?