2020 the battle of the septuagenarians - Trump vs Biden, Part 2

namloc1980

Biker79 wrote: »

' Wont someone PLEASE think of the children '

Yeah....sounds like one of the more plausible articles from the NY Times.

What are you talking about? Trump's kids had to pay settlements to 8 charities because they funneled charity money for their own personal use. They've also been barred from serving on any charities in the state of New York for their grifting activities. Are you suggesting this is not true and the courts and legal system made it up?

Irishman80

Leroy42 wrote: »

Absolutley, he doesn't have to be to be re-elected.

However, for the US to start to make things better, to start making the changes necessary to stop the slide then they need a unifyer to bring people together.

And that is why this election is important. Regardless on where one stands on individual issues, every American should be aware that things have got noticeable worse in the last four years.

Of course they can pretend that race relations, rich poor gap, employment rights, healthcare etc don't count and that all that matters is the economy, but that is the path they have followed for 40+ years and sees them where they are today.

You're optimistic, Leroy.

My view is that there is no politician in the US that can unify the country at this time. Lots of dividers, no unifiers.

Irishman80

Irishman80 wrote: »

Yes I did. I basically agreed with you that Trump is not a unifier. And I disagreed with you on my opinions which you seemed to suggest were radical.

What opinion have I stated in the thread that you seem to think is radical?

Do you think protests won't continue to occur while no efforts are made to reform? Trump has further inflamed the situation, no? So what benefits does his presidency offer in this respect? Also iirc, polling indicates the majority support BLM.

Gerry Hatrick

Cody montana wrote: »

Is this not happening under trumps watch?

Trump is offering to send the national guard into sort the mess out and the democratic governors are refusing. Most of the trouble we are seeing is in democrat run cities.

I'm not advocating Trump as a good president (he obviously isn't) but people care about their families security and well being and he's running on the platform which will win him votes.

America is still predominantly white middle class based who won't look favorably upon the Democrats for what's happening come election day.

duploelabs

Gerry Hatrick wrote: »

Trump is offering to send the national guard into sort the mess out and the democratic governors are refusing. Most of the trouble we are seeing is in democrat run cities.

I'm not advocating Trump as a good president (he obviously isn't) but people care about their families security and well being and he's running on the platform which will win him votes.

America is still predominantly white middle class based who won't look favorably upon the Democrats for what's happening come election day.

The national guard was sent in to portland and the rioting increased

Gerry Hatrick

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you think protests won't continue to occur while no efforts are made to reform? Trump has further inflamed the situation, no? So what benefits does his presidency offer in this respect? Also iirc, polling indicates the majority support BLM.

There is a big difference between supporting BLM and supporting the violence.

BLM needed to stick to peaceful widespread mass protest but they haven't and it's done great damage to their movement.

Leroy42

Irishman80 wrote: »

You're optimistic, Leroy.

My view is that there is no politician in the US that can unify the country at this time. Lots of dividers, no unifiers.

True, but Trump is definitely not the person.

Can Biden do it, probably not? Although he does have a history of bi-partisan work to at least signal that it may start a rewind in the current trajectory.

But US needs to start somewhere. Whilst 4 years of Biden not make any positive difference, 4 more years of Trump will undoubtedly lead to significantly more negative difference.

It is a nettle US voters will have to grasp at some point. They will need to put aside their own narrow concerns for the greater ideal of the US. I believe that a significant amount of US are thinking that way, but there remains a significant amount that continue to only care about themselves.

That is most evident in the GoP and particularly Trump voters, which have shown a clear disregard for the US itself in pursuit of their own narrow agenda. The fact that they are wiling to paint Biden as some commie, US hating socialist intent on taking away freedoms and destroying god tells you where their heads are at.

Gerry Hatrick

Gerry Hatrick wrote: »

There is a big difference between supporting BLM and supporting the violence.

BLM needed to stick to peaceful widespread mass protest but they haven't and it's done great damage to their movement.

The thing is violence has largely been a minor aspect that has been over egged. The biggest outbreaks was when Trump sent in the troops and actively inflamed the situation. Support for them has surged.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/support-for-black-lives-matter-surged-during-protests-but-is-waning-among-white-americans/

Irishman80

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Do you think protests won't continue to occur while no efforts are made to reform? Trump has further inflamed the situation, no? So what benefits does his presidency offer in this respect? Also iirc, polling indicates the majority support BLM.

I'm not arguing about protests. The issue is rioting and looting.

Trump is inflaming the issue. He is leaning into the Culture War which is a good position to take politically.

Polling also indicates majority support for sending in the National Guard and even the army to quash the riots. 49% of Democrats said they'd support the army been deployed to US cities.

namloc1980

Gerry Hatrick wrote: »

Trump is offering to send the national guard into sort the mess out and the democratic governors are refusing. Most of the trouble we are seeing is in democrat run cities.

I'm not advocating Trump as a good president (he obviously isn't) but people care about their families security and well being and he's running on the platform which will win him votes.

America is still predominantly white middle class based who won't look favorably upon the Democrats for what's happening come election day.

Trump sent in federal goons to Portland which inflamed things and made them worse. For the party which champions States rights and limited government the republicans and Trump sure love sending the feds in.

Irishman80

Irishman80 wrote: »

I'm not arguing about protests. The issue is rioting and looting.

Trump is inflaming the issue. He is leaning into the Culture War which is a good position to take politically.

Polling also indicates majority support for sending in the National Guard and even the army to quash the riots. 49% of Democrats said they'd support the army been deployed to US cities.

While I'm finding a slightly higher level of support for sending in troops. Trump's handling of it tends to be viewed negatively. Also overall support of BLM has increased.

Irishman80

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The thing is violence has largely been a minor aspect that has been over egged. The biggest outbreaks was when Trump sent in the troops and actively inflamed the situation. Support for them has surged.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/support-for-black-lives-matter-surged-during-protests-but-is-waning-among-white-americans/

This link actually backs up my viewpoint. After an initial surge, support is falling back to previous levels with White Americans.

I expect that to continue if BLM protests become increasingly linked to riots and looting.

dwayneshintzy

Irishman80 wrote: »

I'm not arguing about protests. The issue is rioting and looting.

Trump is inflaming the issue. He is leaning into the Culture War which is a good position to take politically.

Polling also indicates majority support for sending in the National Guard and even the army to quash the riots. 49% of Democrats said they'd support the army been deployed to US cities.

Have you a link for this please?

Irishman80

[Deleted User] wrote: »

While I'm finding a slightly higher level of support for sending in troops. Trump's handling of it tends to be viewed negatively. Also overall support of BLM has increased.

Sending in the army would be the worst thing Trump could do. All the death would be on his hands.

Someone is giving him decent advice in the background.

Carfacemandog

jamule wrote: »

are you afraid to tell us? do they not list them in the manual?

I would also be interested to know, and hope Biker79can do so without plagiarising.

Irishman80

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

Have you a link for this please?

https://theweek.com/speedreads/917760/plurality-democrats-support-calling-military-aid-police-during-protests-poll-shows

It was 48%.

Penn

Irishman80 wrote: »

Sending in the army would be the worst thing Trump could do.

He sent in unidentified federal agents. That's not much better.

namloc1980

Irishman80 wrote: »

Sending in the army would be the worst thing Trump could do. All the death would be on his hands.

Someone is giving him decent advice in the background.

He sent in unidentified federal goons who snatched people off the streets and bundled them into unmarked vehicles, which inflamed things.

Irishman80

Penn wrote: »

He sent in unidentified federal agents. That's not much better.

It was a definitely a mistake. Why take responsibility for Democrat Mayors refusing to quell the riots in their own cities?

He made the correct call pulling them back out.

Irishman80

namloc1980 wrote: »

He sent in unidentified federal goons who snatched people off the streets and bundled them into unmarked vehicles, which inflamed things.

Portland was a mess before he sent them in. And it's even worse since he pulled them back out.

The correct political play was to sit back and leave the Democrat Mayors deal with it. If they ask for Fed assistance, give it to them. If the Democrat Mayors don't ask for assistance but fail to quell riots, they own the riots.

It's a pretty simple strategy but a winning one.

timsey tiger

Irishman80 wrote: »

It was a definitely a mistake. Why take responsibility for Democrat Mayors refusing to quell the riots in their own cities?

He made the correct call pulling them back out.

Because, he is the president of all the people, including those in cities with Democrat Mayors.

Chris_Heilong

Penn wrote: »

He sent in unidentified federal agents. That's not much better.

More left wing conspiracy theories again, there is so much of it on this thread but an army of posters that are so ready to believe them, the agents had identification on their clothing that identified them as Law Enforcement. This went to court in the US and was thrown out as the judge said it was clearly visible. Bad Picture but even at that you can see the word POLICE in big yellow text.


The riots were completely out of control in Portland and the Antifa loving Mayor was not doing anything to stop them, basically lying to the public saying they were peaceful protests, there is literally a montage of left wing news reporters saying peaceful protests while buildings are on fire behind them, Trump only sent in the Feds when federal buildings where being attacked. I would say the businesses that where smashed and burned by the "peaceful protests" will never support a side which so blatantly lie, deceive and want everyone to be racial identiterians, I can see why Neo Nazi leader Richard Spenser is supporting Biden, the Democrats want many of the same things as him.

Podge_irl

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

More left wing conspiracy theories again, there is so much of it on this thread but an army of posters that are so ready to believe them, the agents had identification on their clothing that identified them as Law Enforcement. This went to court in the US and was thrown out as the judge said it was clearly visible. Bad Picture but even at that you can see the word POLICE in big yellow text.

Having a patch saying "Police" does not make you identifiable.

There is a reason police badges have names on them.

Overheal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

So a strong independent woman comes out in favor of Trump (and we certainly need more strong women) yet straight away the slut shaming and commenting on her appearance starts, shameful.

Well you invoked her as a classy act. You don’t get to pretend like all the remarks you quoted were unsolicited.

OMM 0000

Has Biden criticised the violent BLM rioters yet?

I don't understand why the Democrats refuse to admit there are tons of violent rioters in the US right now.

Overheal

Biker79 wrote: »

The fact that you ask speaks for itself.

*dodge*

mcmoustache

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

More left wing conspiracy theories again, there is so much of it on this thread but an army of posters that are so ready to believe them, the agents had identification on their clothing that identified them as Law Enforcement. This went to court in the US and was thrown out as the judge said it was clearly visible. Bad Picture but even at that you can see the word POLICE in big yellow text.


The riots were completely out of control in Portland and the Antifa loving Mayor was not doing anything to stop them, basically lying to the public saying they were peaceful protests, there is literally a montage of left wing news reporters saying peaceful protests while buildings are on fire behind them, Trump only sent in the Feds when federal buildings where being attacked. I would say the businesses that where smashed and burned by the "peaceful protests" will never support a side which so blatantly lie, deceive and want everyone to be racial identiterians, I can see why Neo Nazi leader Richard Spenser is supporting Biden, the Democrats want many of the same things as him.

You'd have a point if that was the only incident and only type of garb used.

Biker79

Overheal wrote: »

*dodge*

* beneath my dignity *

mcmoustache

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Has Biden criticised the violent BLM rioters yet?

I don't understand why the Democrats refuse to admit there are tons of violent rioters in the US right now.

From last night or 13 hours ago.

salmocab

mcmoustache wrote: »

From last night or 13 hours ago.

Nobody cares about your facts