Cannabis Legalisation Ireland

kjl

Ok, let me start by saying I know this has been posted a million times but I haven't seen it in a while.

Why is cannabis still illegal in Ireland? Seriously it's 2020. I'm 40 years old, do I not have a ****ing right to do whatever I want with my own body?

Meanwhile it's perfectly legal do drink a bottle of whiskey and kill myself with alcohol poisoning or smoke cigarettes and give myself lung cancer.

We are now getting to a point where it's getting rediculous, Leo said it would be the next big question so why hasn't it been asked?

Why do I have to resort to going to some drug dealer to get my fix? Why is this completely untaxed product not taxed and made complete safe?

Like I am so sick of reefer madness, the US is starting to give in and legalising it and they are the ones who started this whole idiotic war on a plant.

I can't see any reasonable argument as to why is should remain illegal. The whole gateway argument is moot, and the few who suffer from paranoid schizophrenia from smoking it still have access to it without proper information.

Not to mention that now with the rise of cannabis vapes people are dying from black market vapes which cut the oil with vitamin e, pesticides and cyanide. This is literally killing people because it's not regulated.

It's 2020, what the **** is taking so ****ing long to sort this out. Surely all the biddies from 30 years ago have died off. Not one person on this forum doesn't know at least one cannabis user? Why do those idiots in government start the conversation already?

Seriously, I'm so sick of this backward law. Now is the time to change it, we are all bored out of our tits at home with this Corona virus, wouldn't it be nice to have a joint to forget about it?

cj maxx

I'm with you. It helps my physical problems and appetite.

bassy

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kjl

bassy wrote: »

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Maybe it time you woke up, you're not helping the cause

s1ippy

kjl wrote: »

Why is cannabis still illegal in Ireland? Seriously it's 2020. I'm 40 years old, do I not have a ****ing right to do whatever I want with my own body?

Maybe now that the Greens are in, there will be sweeping changes.

I think it should remain illegal. It’s a scourge.

Hannibal36

The health service in Ireland has been doing some very strange things over the last couple years to try and force a link between psychosis and weed, now I am not saying there isn't a link at all, I am just saying a lot of it is contrived by a medical industry trying to stop the legalisation of weed from the top down.Why is anybodies guess, maybe its obvious,but don't expect any movement on it in Ireland soon.

s1ippy

https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/hywoie/could_someone_explain_why_64_year_old_tony_keoghs/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

Meanwhile Tony Keogh has been in jail for weeks because they said his crop had a "street value" of €14k or some shit. I saw those plants and it was closer to about 3k worth, when grown, if he was going to sell it (which it doesn't sound like he was). That fallacy landing this frail, elderly man with a criminal charge is absolutely scandalous.

I've been buying Keoghs and writing to my TDs but sometimes I just think what the hell is the point in anything anymore when this can happen for no fucking good reason .

s1ippy

s1ippy wrote: »

https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/hywoie/could_someone_explain_why_64_year_old_tony_keoghs/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

Meanwhile Tony Keogh has been in jail for weeks. I saw those plants and it was closer to about 3k worth, when grown, if he was going to sell it (which it doesn't sound like he was). This frail, elderly man with a criminal charge is absolutely scandalous.

I've been buying Keoghs and writing to my TDs but sometimes I just think what the hell is the point in anything anymore when this can happen for no fucking good reason .

No good reason? Have a word with yourself, he was growing drugs. What age is the cutoff you get a free pass to do what you like then?

Frail . You sound like a red top rag.

s1ippy

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

No good reason? Have a word with yourself, he was growing drugs. What age is the cutoff you get a free pass to do what you like then?

Frail . You sound like a red top rag.

The age where he's deaf, arthritic and can't walk without support. Jailing somebody for trying to grow something that's illegal but will give them pain relief just strikes me as completely wrong and I'm not even a smoker.

s1ippy

s1ippy wrote: »

The age where he's deaf, arthritic and can't walk without support. Jailing somebody for trying to grow something that's illegal but will give them pain relief just strikes me as completely wrong and I'm not even a smoker.

Well enough to be growing the **** though. Bottom line: it’s illegal.

Hannibal36

s1ippy wrote: »

https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/hywoie/could_someone_explain_why_64_year_old_tony_keoghs/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

Meanwhile Tony Keogh has been in jail for weeks because they said his crop had a "street value" of €14k or some shit. I saw those plants and it was closer to about 3k worth, when grown, if he was going to sell it (which it doesn't sound like he was). That fallacy landing this frail, elderly man with a criminal charge is absolutely scandalous.

I've been buying Keoghs and writing to my TDs but sometimes I just think what the hell is the point in anything anymore when this can happen for no fucking good reason .

Theres a big agenda against any White Irish in the courts these days that is part of it, but this is also to set down an example to stop anyone trying to grow their own supply either. They want to force everything illegal, create as much crime as possible, also weed is a soft drug that doesn't do much harm. They need alcohol, cocaine etc to keep society in as big a mess as possible, easier to Control.

Gruffalux

kjl wrote: »

Ok, let me start by saying I know this has been posted a million times but I haven't seen it in a while.

Why is cannabis still illegal in Ireland? Seriously it's 2020. I'm 40 years old, do I not have a ****ing right to do whatever I want with my own body?

Meanwhile it's perfectly legal do drink a bottle of whiskey and kill myself with alcohol poisoning or smoke cigarettes and give myself lung cancer.

We are now getting to a point where it's getting rediculous, Leo said it would be the next big question so why hasn't it been asked?

Why do I have to resort to going to some drug dealer to get my fix? Why is this completely untaxed product not taxed and made complete safe?

Like I am so sick of reefer madness, the US is starting to give in and legalising it and they are the ones who started this whole idiotic war on a plant.

I can't see any reasonable argument as to why is should remain illegal. The whole gateway argument is moot, and the few who suffer from paranoid schizophrenia from smoking it still have access to it without proper information.

Not to mention that now with the rise of cannabis vapes people are dying from black market vapes which cut the oil with vitamin e, pesticides and cyanide. This is literally killing people because it's not regulated.

It's 2020, what the **** is taking so ****ing long to sort this out. Surely all the biddies from 30 years ago have died off. Not one person on this forum doesn't know at least one cannabis user? Why do those idiots in government start the conversation already?

Seriously, I'm so sick of this backward law. Now is the time to change it, we are all bored out of our tits at home with this Corona virus, wouldn't it be nice to have a joint to forget about it?

Totally agree with you. I have not smoked ganja in 20 years, but it is a backward law that causes unnecessary suffering and needs changing. Legalise personal use and growing. Regulate drug driving ie zero limit like alcohol. Alcohol is a hugely intoxicating substance that causes tremendous damage to quite a number of people and yet after 10am it can be bought in any supermarket. We are buying Keoghs crisps only to support yer man!

Tony EH

kjl wrote: »

Maybe it time you woke up, you're not helping the cause

Maybe the "cause" isn't worth helping.

s1ippy

If you asked me in my late teens if I thought the weed or eating too many crisps was going to send me to an early grave first, I'd have laughed at you. I would definitely demand some context for that situation.

Yet here we are, in 2020.

Ultrflat

I'm all for legalization, I think it should be a socially acceptable as having a pint.

How ever these smoke ups, where 100's of people walk around smoking joints in the city center is ridiculous, it can't be taken seriously. Doesn't do anything for the current opinion that weed should indeed be legal. I think it does the complete opposite. lf people really had any common sense they'd start an actual campaign.

Where education was at the for front, they may be taken more serious. Who the hell takes some one seriously who's drunk?

ReginaldSmythV

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

I think it should remain illegal. It’s a scourge.

Making/keeping something illegal does not prevent it.

Wanderer78

Ireland still has strong conservatism leanings in some aspects, but I think legalisation will eventually occur

Kylta

Hannibal36 wrote: »

The health service in Ireland has been doing some very strange things over the last couple years to try and force a link between psychosis and weed, now I am not saying there isn't a link at all, I am just saying a lot of it is contrived by a medical industry trying to stop the legalisation of weed from the top down.Why is anybodies guess, maybe its obvious,but don't expect any movement on it in Ireland soon.

It effects people differently, some people should actually never smoke it, say in the way some people should never drink. I've seen people get paranoid and ive seen some people with major personality changes. Saying that its must be over twenty years since I smoke sh!t, and the smell of the stuff that their smoking now. My opinion is it should've been decriminalised a long time ago. But again it don't suit everbody

Dublinandy3

I personally think we should go down the Portuguese route when it comes to all drugs and treatment/punishment rather than the american/canadian/dutch.

A previous poster pointed out we're in 2020 now and yet the debate goes on, yes we are in 2020 so I don't think people can fly the flag anymore than cannabis is harmless and that's why it should get decriminilized or made legal. However both alcohol and tobacco are far more dangerous so in theory they should just be made illegal too, I wouldn't have an issue with that, however it won't ever happen.

Changes need to happen to the way the Irish, and most societies address all drugs these days but the problem is it is unlikely because being tough on crime, including drug users and/or abusers is always a vote winner with a chunk of the electorate, regardless of the country.

But just to reiterate, like the poster earlier who provided anecdotal evidence about it providing no harm to him or the peole he knows after many years of use I could provide the opposite, so could lots of actual scientific evidence but neither of those arguements should be used as a final yes or no. The whole issue of how society as a whole addresses drugs as a whole, inclduing tobacco and alcohol as they're drugs too, needs to be looked at, but probably won't.

kjl

Kylta wrote: »

It effects people differently, some people should actually never smoke it, say in the way some people should never drink. I've seen people get paranoid and ive seen some people with major personality changes. Saying that its must be over twenty years since I smoke sh!t, and the smell of the stuff that their smoking now. My opinion is it should've been decriminalised a long time ago. But again it don't suit everbody

My point in my original post was that people can still get weed regardless, at least if it was legal it could be regulated and proper information could be provided. Also the stigma would not be there. Imagine if you did suffer from psychosis, do you not think that paranoia of the fact that it is illegal and you've had to deal with criminals to procure the drug could have a huge impact on reporting that you were suffering symptoms?

Kylta

kjl wrote: »

My point in my original post was that people can still get weed regardless, at least if it was legal it could be regulated and proper information could be provided. Also the stigma would not be there. Imagine if you did suffer from psychosis, do you not think that paranoia of the fact that it is illegal and you've had to deal with criminals to procure the drug could have a huge impact on reporting that you were suffering symptoms?

Its funny because the use of the word paranoia only came into my vocabulary when I started getting high many many years ago, but in my day it was criminalised to extend that it wasn't sold as openly has it is now, when you rolled a joint in my time it was in secret, people roll joints openly now and its all but excepted now. In regard to the psychosis, some peoples make up or personality is not acceptable to whatever ingredients might by in the weed. I would say in my day the majority of the people I hung around with smoked hash. Some if I'm honest have ended fu¢ked up, whether it was caused by smoking hash or some other personality defect I don't know. Thinking back the criminality part was if caught with enough for a few joints the cops would take it of you. But scoring for us was like goingto the off license execpt you were never asked your age. In regards to revenue, the government would make a fortune on a weed tax. I wonder would many people some weed then. I mean smoking weed was away of maybe saying to goverment you can't control me like a passive rebellion. Sh!t
I smoked it to get high.
Happy days my past gone by.
How many people reading this post will say his stoned after posting this rambling post

Ash.J.Williams

if you're sick to the point of hearing voices and need serious medication to stay on the level, then weed can kill you. (or let you kill yourself)

In my middle age I've had to quit twice for workplace testing and each time it's harder to go back . I'm probably done now at this stage.

No regrets but i could have done better without

biko

My response in last month's thread

biko wrote: »

It should be legal for anyone over 65 for recreational use.

Wanderer78

biko wrote: »

My response in last month's thread

ah legalize it for all adults

kjl

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

if you're sick to the point of hearing voices and need serious medication to stay on the level, then weed can kill you. (or let you kill yourself)

In my middle age I've had to quit twice for workplace testing and each time it's harder to go back . I'm probably done now at this stage.

No regrets but i could have done better without

I have already addressed this, it is maybe 1 in 20,000 people who suffer from weed psychosis, how many people in this country are full blown alcoholics. How many people have died from both alcohol poisoning and from the unhealthy lifestyle caused by alcoholism?

People can still get their hands on weed. Anyone can go out today and buy it relatively easy. Having it be illegal does not change if people have issues with it. I don't think this small minority should dictate the rules for everyone else. Not only are we missing tax revenue, but we are also propping up drug gangs with an easy source of income. Drug gangs by the way who won't care if the person they are selling it to is displaying psychotic behaviour. Drug gangs who don't care if people get sick from altered cannabis, remember a few years ago people were spraying cannabis plants with some crystal ****. That wouldn't happen under a regulated market.

kjl

Wanderer78 wrote: »

ah legalize it for all adults

Exactly, all adults. Drug gangs don't care who they sell to and that included underage users. I reckon a 10 year old could buy weed if they wanted to.

Legalisation and regulation would stop underage sales as well.

Wanderer78

kjl wrote: »

Exactly, all adults. Drug gangs don't care who they sell to and that included underage users. I reckon a 10 year old could buy weed if they wanted to.

Legalisation and regulation would stop underage sales as well.

id imagine kids are buying it alright, and selling it unfortunately

might not unfortunately

AudreyHepburn

Medicinal cannabis should absolutely be legal - this shouldn’t even be up for debate.

Legalising it for recreational use though.... drugs are not for me and I make no apologies for that but if it can be done using the Dutch model then I wouldn’t have a problem with it.

It would need to be properly regulated.

biko

biko wrote: »

It should be legal for anyone over 65 for recreational use.

Wanderer78 wrote: »

ah legalize it for all adults

kjl wrote: »

Exactly, all adults.

It isn't as fun asking for something to be legal for someone else, but not you, is it.

Wanderer78

biko wrote:

It isn't as fun asking for something to be legal for someone else, but not you, is it.

I've never used illegal drugs, thank God, I'd probably be a basket case if I did

randd1

Stick on a poll there OP and see how we go on this issue.

Strumms

I can see the value of it, if it’s medicinal, and doctors can prescribe it and you can buy it from a pharmacy.


For simply for recreation, no. We have enough trouble in the country with a legal recreational drug (alcohol), without adding cannabis into the mix. The fallout from doing that would simply cost the state too much revenue.

Tony EH

kjl wrote: »

Exactly, all adults. Drug gangs don't care who they sell to and that included underage users. I reckon a 10 year old could buy weed if they wanted to.

Legalisation and regulation would stop underage sales as well.

This is pure fantasy.

The legalisation crowd always try and pass this off as a given. But legalising this won't get rid of criminal sales. The criminals will just undercut the regulated price and you can guarantee that that regulated price will keep going up and up with every budget passed, just like tobacco.

The criminals aren't just going to go away, if dope is legalised.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Tony EH wrote: »

This is pure fantasy.

The legalisation crowd always try and pass this off as a given. But legalising this won't get rid of criminal sales. The criminals will just undercut the regulated price and you can guarantee that that regulated price will keep going up and up with every budget passed, just like tobacco.

The criminals aren't just going to go away, if dope is legalised.

This would depend on how it's taxed.

Gruffalux

Strumms wrote: »

I can see the value of it, if it’s medicinal, and doctors can prescribe it and you can buy it from a pharmacy.


For simply for recreation, no. We have enough trouble in the country with a legal recreational drug (alcohol), without adding cannabis into the mix. The fallout from doing that would simply cost the state too much revenue.

Do you think that by legalising it way more people who do not smoke now are going to start hopping off it? Well, maybe my ancient mother might - she has a hankering for it. I could give her some but I would be worried for her, maybe she would find it too strong, which is probably silly of me. She might love it. I used to love it a very long time ago, never got alcohol, horrible drug. Weed is much more mellow - or used to be!
But anyways most people who want to smoke it, smoke it already. The few that want a joint now and then would have easier access after legalisation, and nobody would be made feel like a filthy reprobate for favoring one drug over another. Personally I think the weed arguments are quite silly, especially given how very many otherwise middle of the road people seem to absolutely love cocaine in the country. That blows my mind because cocaine - now there is one hell of a drug. :eek:

JohnnyFlash

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Medicinal cannabis should absolutely be legal - this shouldn’t even be up for debate.

Legalising it for recreational use though.... drugs are not for me and I make no apologies for that but if it can be done using the Dutch model then I wouldn’t have a problem with it.

It would need to be properly regulated.

There’s very little quality research to show medicinal cannabis is an effective drug for the huge range of disorders and conditions it’s being touted as a miracle for. Even then it would come in tablet/shot form, and not a big bag of Lucifer’s Lettuce.

Carfacemandog

They legalized it in Canada a few years ago and the country hasn't caved in on itself, and the differences in income in US states with and without it legalized is pretty incredible in some cases.

I have been to a free legal place in Canada, and it's quite different to in the Netherlands where quite frequently it's some ropey looking fella behind a bar in an uninviting environment - it was more like going into an electronics shop if anything. The inside is completely blocked from street view, you have to show age ID to get in, and they have a wall with different strains, strengths, etc. Staff are walking around with tablets, either to take your order or to go through differences in whichever ones you are looking it. You can buy a very mild sativa (the type that makes you giggly and active) or strong indica (the type that makes you sedate and sleepy), or anything in between, with a lot of the stuff having very little and oftentimes no THC but CBD instead (which relaxes you but doesn't get you 'stoned'). That seems a far better situation we have in Ireland, where people don't know what they're getting most of the time and a lot of the public - even smokers - have a serious lack of understanding of the differences between strains, and are buying it illegally to fund the black market.

Takes money off the black market, creates direct and indirect employment, depending on how its implemented can generate quite a bit of money for the state, and stops wasting the time of the gardai, freeing them up to deal with actual crime.

Found a picture of the place.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

There’s very little quality research to show medicinal cannabis is an effective drug for the huge range of disorders and conditions it’s being touted as a miracle for. Even then it would come in tablet/shot form, and not a big bag of Lucifer’s Lettuce.

Depends on what you mean by "effective drug." It's not (to the best of my knowledge) cure anything but it has been known to alleviate pain. And at that point, it depends on the person in pain and their personal experience.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Depends on what you mean by "effective drug." It's not (to the best of my knowledge) cure anything but it has been known to alleviate pain. And at that point, it depends on the person in pain and their personal experience.

It works to alleviate shaking issues for people with Parkinson's, or other conditions that cause tremors. It's not simply about pain relief, and provides a certain quality of life for many situations. And, yes, in any situation, it depends on the person, the dosage, and quality. Just as it does with just about any western medicine.

Cannabis can help considerably with my shaking disorder. It doesn't cure it. Doesn't remove it entirely, but it 'can' reduce my muscle spasms and general tremors to the point where it's barely noticeable by other people. It might not seem like much to someone who doesn't shake, but it's massive for those who do.

I've used a wide variety of medicines assigned by Doctors (over 30 years), none of which worked, and all had various side-effects both physical and psychological... Moderate cannabis usage is far better overall when it's of good quality...

But when it comes to medicine or drug usage, it's always going to depend on the individual. People like to suggest that Cannabis is different to mainstream prescription drugs but it's not. I went through a period of 6 months with one doctor who insisted on a barrage of drug cocktails, which gave me side effects ranging from internal bleeding, kidney failure, to blindness in one eye. Because in most cases, doctors need to experiment with each person to find what might work. In my experiences of my shaking disorder being treated by western doctors, it didn't work. Which is why they're now pushing for experimental surgery.

Yup, dicking around with my brain is far better than giving us access to cannabis, even though doctors have unofficially recommended that I search for it. (just as they also unofficially recommended alternative medicines that mainstream medicine dismisses)

Ash.J.Williams

kjl wrote: »

I have already addressed this, it is maybe 1 in 20,000 people who suffer from weed psychosis, how many people in this country are full blown alcoholics. How many people have died from both alcohol poisoning and from the unhealthy lifestyle caused by alcoholism?

People can still get their hands on weed. Anyone can go out today and buy it relatively easy. Having it be illegal does not change if people have issues with it. I don't think this small minority should dictate the rules for everyone else. Not only are we missing tax revenue, but we are also propping up drug gangs with an easy source of income. Drug gangs by the way who won't care if the person they are selling it to is displaying psychotic behaviour. Drug gangs who don't care if people get sick from altered cannabis, remember a few years ago people were spraying cannabis plants with some crystal ****. That wouldn't happen under a regulated market.

I never mentioned weed psychosis so you addressed nothing relevant

snotboogie

Tony EH wrote: »

This is pure fantasy.

The legalisation crowd always try and pass this off as a given. But legalising this won't get rid of criminal sales. The criminals will just undercut the regulated price and you can guarantee that that regulated price will keep going up and up with every budget passed, just like tobacco.

The criminals aren't just going to go away, if dope is legalised.

Not sure on that. In Canada, where the black market persisted after legalization, the black market prices are about a quarter of what they are here. Im sure that is aided by the climate there which makes growing in bulk outdoors extremely cheap and easy.

c.p.w.g.w

I have a buddy, who doesn't consume alcohol because his a horrible drunk...

Friday evening after work, he gets high on whatever drug takes his mood, and he gets grief from family and some friends...lots of rubbish about it ruining his life etc etc...

He earns €80k ish a year and now owns his house outright...yeah his life is ruining ruined by taking magic mushrooms and cannabis 1 or 2's a week...but a bottle of wine a night is perfectly normal, sure the french and Italians do that :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Wanderer78

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

I have a buddy, who doesn't consume alcohol because his a horrible drunk...

Friday evening after work, he gets high on whatever drug takes his mood, and he gets grief from family and some friends...lots of rubbish about it ruining his life etc etc...

He earns €80k ish a year and now owns his house outright...yeah his life is ruining ruined by taking magic mushrooms and cannabis 1 or 2's a week...but a bottle of wine a night is perfectly normal, sure the french and Italians do that :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

illegal drugs are obviously not harm free, you d never know with them

c.p.w.g.w

Wanderer78 wrote: »

illegal drugs are obviously not harm free, you d never know with them

Nor are legal drugs...Alcohol is more damaging...Just look at A&E's(Pre-Covid) on a friday & saturday...and it student towns/cities Tuesdays & Wednesdays

the purple tin

It is a political hot potato. I don't think any of the main parties would want to put it forward and risk losing votes.

c.p.w.g.w

How much do the AGS spend a year on Drug related crime? If that money could be spent on social issues and mental health services we would be much better of place as a whole...oh and add in the tax from cannabis sales too

i_surge

As a country we have already decided that her body her choice is the correct principle....time to apply it universally.

Black market substances are a public health issue. We have a generation who grew up smoking filthy soapbar and mixing that with tobacco gaining an addiction to nicotine. Victims of prohibition. Now it is unflushed fertilizer filled mouldy uncured herbal material, equally dangerous to health. Compare and contrast with the healthy vaping and edibles culture in the USA and no tobacco mixing.

It is a no brainer on economic, health, crime and moral grounds.

Wanderer78

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

How much do the AGS spend a year on Drug related crime? If that money could be spent on social issues and mental health services we would be much better of place as a whole...oh and add in the tax from cannabis sales too

the legalise campaign does need to realise though, legislation wont solve all drug related issues, and in fact would introduce some of its own

i_surge

Strumms wrote: »

I can see the value of it, if it’s medicinal, and doctors can prescribe it and you can buy it from a pharmacy.


For simply for recreation, no. We have enough trouble in the country with a legal recreational drug (alcohol), without adding cannabis into the mix. The fallout from doing that would simply cost the state too much revenue.

Ask any cop and they will agree that cannabis use will temper the terrible culture we have around alcohol. Less violence for sure.

Tony EH

snotboogie wrote: »

Not sure on that. In Canada, where the black market persisted after legalization, the black market prices are about a quarter of what they are here. Im sure that is aided by the climate there which makes growing in bulk outdoors extremely cheap and easy.

Canada is an outlier in many areas and no country can be really used as a universal benchmark at the end of the day.

But, consider this. Criminals make millions selling illegal cigarettes on the streets of Ireland, even though they're available in every newsagents on every street corner and they're "taxed" and "regulated". I see no reason why they wouldn't continue their illegal selling for dope either.

Plus, in Amsterdam, the criminal element never disappeared and there's a thriving black market for drugs there.

I just don't buy this idea that criminal gangs will just give up and disappear, if dope became legal. It isn't going happen. But it always seems to get touted as a given by the pro legalisation crowd.

My needle isn't buried on this either way, but the pungent smell of what's around today suggests a far different thing than when I used to puff away when I was younger. making me somewhat reluctant to come down on the legalise it side of things.

But I think in any conversation to do with this, it's better to talk straight, than to indulge in fantasy scenarios about how "wonderful" everything would be.