2020 World Snooker Championship

zuutroy

I thought his choice of words in a tribute BBC did a couple of years ago was interesting...he said 'Ronnie is the best player I've ever seen' which is a bit non-committal. His language has become increasingly conceding since then but that was the furthest he's gone, particularly on national TV.

If someone told me 2 years ago that Tiger would win another major and Ronnie another World Championship I'd have thought they were a bit cracked.

hetuzozaho

ThewhiteJesus wrote: »

Hendry was the most successful crucible wise, and as good as he was o’sullIvan is better imo

Yeah I feel like this is generally what people say. Obviously o sullivan has been eroding away the successful part of it and records over the years. I wonder will he put it to bed for good before he is 50

walshb

ThewhiteJesus wrote: »

Hendry was the most successful crucible wise, and as good as he was o’sullIvan is better imo

Yes. Ronnie is just more naturally gifted and effortless..

Nobody is as effortless at the game!!!

Pighead

hetuzozaho wrote: »

First Google result for me https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.eurosport.com/snooker/world-championship/2019-2020/snooker-news-who-does-stephen-hendry-rate-as-snooker-s-greatest-player_sto7759432/story-amp.shtml

Feel those instagram interviews he did over lockdown too. But would have to rewatch.

Feel both have always picked each over when asked over the years, maybe I'm remembering it wrong.

Think there's a debate between the fans, but don't remember either really debating it ha

Did you read that article? He clearly says he has omitted himself from the debate for the purpose of that particular debate. He has Judd as number two sure!

hetuzozaho

Pighead wrote: »

Did you read that article? He clearly says he has omitted himself from the debate for the purpose of that particular debate. He has Judd as number two sure!

Well they both always omit themselves when pointing to the best.

AllForIt

AllForIt wrote: »

Not a surprising scoreline for me at the almost end now. Surprised Ronnie was so off color yesterday but he came round today.

For me the final was the Ronnie/Selby semi. Whomever won that was always the
overall winner.

I always said Ronnie could win another WC and even another one, maybe even in 9 months time!

edit: interesting fact I did not know, Ronnie has won more ranking titles than anyone else!

Have to disagree, if Selby had gotten an undeserved victory I reckon it would be a closer one now between him and Wilson.

Then there's the fact that Wilson really wouldn't be playing in not only his first (of very few I'd imagine) Crucible final, but against a living legend to boot; which O'Sullivan can easily be called - no question about it, or no exaggeration needed.

The days of Selby Selbying his way to victory seem gone. Must be hard to keep up that level of play - 40 min frames regularly.

hetuzozaho

What does Hendry have over Ronnie now in the debate, is it just the worlds?

gormdubhgorm

hetuzozaho wrote: »

What does Hendry have over Ronnie now in the debate, is it just the worlds?

Yeah that is all. He has broken all the rest of his records (except youngest ever wc winner)

kingtiger

hetuzozaho wrote: »

What does Hendry have over Ronnie now in the debate, is it just the worlds?

not much, Hendry is still the ultimate match player though, I would put a prime Hendry ahead of prime Ronnie in a Crucible final anytime

hetuzozaho

hetuzozaho wrote: »

What does Hendry have over Ronnie now in the debate, is it just the worlds?

Don't really follow the stats, or the like, but 7 worlds in 9 years, I think, will always be enough for some to claim he's the 'greatest' (and tbf it would be hard to disagree with that).

gormdubhgorm

walshb wrote: »

Yes. Ronnie is just more naturally gifted and effortless..

Nobody is as effortless at the game!!!

Jimmy White at his peak was very similar to O'Sullivan.

hetuzozaho

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Don't really follow the stats, or the like, but 7 worlds in 9 years, I think, will always be enough for some to claim he's the 'greatest' (and tbf it would be hard to disagree with that).

Defo. And if someone thinks hendry is best that's fine by me. An absolute goat like Ronnie haha.

Did you watch the interview with Ronnie and Davis. And Davis was saying he couldn't compete with hendry as the sport gets better as the years go by. Interesting Ronnie is still at the top against the new generation. I'd say hendry and other pros appreciate the longevity. I think the longevity comes from the ridiculous natural talent he has which for me puts him streets ahead. Will be interesting to see how long he keeps knocking them in.

unkel

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Jimmy White at his peak was very similar to O'Sullivan.

Most of the talent and natural ability of O'Sullivan, but not a killer / winner - he couldn't finish people off.

hetuzozaho

unkel wrote: »

Most of the talent and natural ability of O'Sullivan, but not a killer / winner - he couldn't finish people off.

Four of Hendry's worlds against him

How does someone watch 'podcasts'? Are they live on YouTube, or are they on some other platform?

ArnoldJRimmer

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't really follow the stats, or the like, but 7 worlds in 9 years, I think, will always be enough for some to claim he's the 'greatest' (and tbf it would be hard to disagree with that).

Who people think is the greatest is always going to be objective, but you could make the argument that because Ronnie won titles across multiple generations of players, rather than all in one go, then he could be considered the best

Not making an argument either way as I think these arguments can be pretty silly, and both are absolute legends of the game in their own right

hetuzozaho

[Deleted User] wrote: »

How does someone watch 'podcasts'? Are they live on YouTube, or are they on some other platform?

Is it a particular one you are looking for?

You can listen to them via Spotify or podcast apps. Some are videod and on YouTube.

Throw up the one you want and someone will link it for you no doubt.

ziggyman17

unkel wrote: »

Most of the talent and natural ability of O'Sullivan, but not a killer / winner - he couldn't finish people off.

I loved Jimmy, it was a hard watch seeing him lose those 6 world finals, as much as hero he is to me, I could never put him anywhere near Ronnie, Jimmy lacked backbone and crumbled under the slightest of pressure, to this day as much as I love Ronnie, I will always love Jimmy more, but for all his natural talent he was way too fragile when the going got tough, that final against Henry when he was 14-8 up still hurts me as well as the others, I believe if he had of one that first World final he was in then he could have won another 4, that first defeat killed him........

Rothko

Deleted User wrote: »

Have to disagree, if Selby had gotten an undeserved victory I reckon it would be a closer one now between him and Wilson.

Then there's the fact that Wilson really wouldn't be playing in not only his first (of very few I'd imagine) Crucible final, but against a living legend to boot; which O'Sullivan can easily be called - no question about it, or no exaggeration needed.

The days of Selby Selbying his way to victory seem gone. Must be hard to keep up that level of play - 40 min frames regularly.

He did beat Ronnie a few months ago. Although that was in a best of 11. This is obviously completely different.

Sultan of Bling

ziggyman17 wrote:

I loved Jimmy, it was a hard watch seeing him lose those 6 world finals, as much as hero he is to me, I could never put him anywhere near Ronnie, Jimmy lacked backbone and crumbled under the slightest of pressure, to this day as much as I love Ronnie, I will always love Jimmy more, but for all his natural talent he was way too fragile when the going got tough, that final against Henry when he was 14-8 up still hurts me as well as the others, I believe if he had of one that first World final he was in then he could have won another 4, that first defeat killed him........

The one he was 14-8 up was his fourth final.

His first was in 84 v davis which he lost 18-16.

Dont agree that defeat led to his others imo.

Rothko

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

The one he was 14-8 up was his fourth final.

His first was in 84 v davis which he lost 18-16.

Dont agree that defeat led to his others imo.

If he had beaten Alex Higgins in that semi final in 1982, I think he'd definitely would have won the final against Ray Reardon.

hetuzozaho

hetuzozaho wrote: »

Is it a particular one you are looking for?

You can listen to them via Spotify or podcast apps. Some are videod and on YouTube.

Throw up the one you want and someone will link it for you no doubt.

Thanks, I thought they might be on the likes of 'Spotify' (name wouldn't come to me when I asked the question). Try to refrain from using 'apps' - the paper metal type hat in/not on my head .

I suppose I could googlee some of them, if they're repeated on YouTube. If ya could throw up the names of the shows/presenters that'd be great

Inquitus

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

The one he was 14-8 up was his fourth final.

His first was in 84 v davis which he lost 18-16.

Dont agree that defeat led to his others imo.

The most crushing blow was missing the black in final frame of the 1994 final, that was brutal!

zuutroy

Are you looking for snooker podcasts in general? If so Snooker Scene by Dave Hendon is by far the best one but for some reason he insists on recording it with a potato which is quite annoying. WST occasionally have their own one, and Eurosport are running one for the WC called The Break, but I guess that ship has sailed now.

hetuzozaho

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Thanks, I thought they might be on the likes of 'Spotify' (name wouldn't come to me when I asked the question). Try to refrain from using 'apps' - the paper metal type hat in/not on my head .

I suppose I could googlee some of them, if they're repeated on YouTube. If ya could throw up the names of the shows/presenters that'd be great

The break one from eurosport should work for you via browser here https://shows.acast.com/the-break-the-eurosport-snooker-podcast/

zuutroy

Inquitus wrote: »

The most crushing blow was missing the black in final frame of the 1994 final, that was brutal!

Thinking of that shot reminded me...I made a little montage video on the day it was meant to start in April because I was sad that it wasn't on. Oh the lockdown boredom!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4Pzq4P7NhY

gormdubhgorm

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

The one he was 14-8 up was his fourth final.

His first was in 84 v davis which he lost 18-16.

Dont agree that defeat led to his others imo.

Yeah he lost one to Parrott who he should have beaten on paper. Jimmy claims he would have won 10 titles if he had stayed clear of the devils dandruff.
His own fault I think only copping on now pushing 60! (no partying)

Even Ronnie found Running and sought Reardon/Griffiths help. Got that Steve Peters fella. Snooker is off table as well as on. Fellas who didn't mind themselves and say coulda, woulda, shoulda annoy me - at any level.

walshb

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Jimmy White at his peak was very similar to O'Sullivan.

Yes. But Ronnie had that little extra fluidity for me. Plus, was two handed, and bit more steely under pressure..

Match play over 35 frames all at peak:

Higgins.
Ronnie.
Williams
Hendry

In that order..

zuutroy

zuutroy wrote: »

Are you looking for snooker podcasts in general? If so Snooker Scene by Dave Hendon is by far the best one but for some reason he insists on recording it with a potato which is quite annoying. WST occasionally have their own one, and Eurosport are running one for the WC called The Break, but I guess that ship has sailed now.

Thanks, yeah, in general.... Like interviews with players/2 guys discussing tactics and the like...

Will check out some of Dave Hendon's Z, cheers.

Wouldn't mind looking at Rachel Casey , I saw her mentioned earlier on the thread, a Eurosport one I think. Is hers on Eurosport a different podcast to Dave Hendon's?

zuutroy

Dave has been on some Eurosport ones but he runs the Snooker Scene one. Rachel has been doing Eurosport's The Break but it's not a regular season long thing.

gormdubhgorm

walshb wrote: »

Yes. But Ronnie had that little extra fluidity for me. Plus, was two handed, and bit more steely under pressure..

Match play over 35 frames all at peak:

Higgins.
Ronnie.
Williams
Hendry

In that order..

Yeah would agree on fluidity that's the word. Thought you meant Alex for minute and said what?! Then realised it was John?
Where would you rank Davis in matchplay? Used to give new generation players trouble even past his peak.

Mervyn Skidmore

Has it ever happened where the cloth has become severely damaged or torn during a match? What happens? Table fitters fit a new one? How long does that take?

zuutroy

Mervyn Skidmore wrote: »

Has it ever happened where the cloth has become severely damaged or torn during a match? What happens? Table fitters fit a new one? How long does that take?

Ebdon did it one year and they had to end the session early.

walshb

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Yeah would agree on fluidity that's the word. Thought you meant Alex for minute and said what?! Then realised it was John?
Where would you rank Davis in matchplay? Used to give new generation players trouble even past his peak.

Davis is a monster, but I think the game just got that bit better in the early 90s, and then really took off late 90s...

Davis was great, but any mistakes he makes v the likes Higgins and Ronnie would be punished badly. I don’t think his opposition were remotely close to what Ronnie and Higgins and Williams and Hendry could do to him..

Very difficult to say who was best, as so much to consider, including luck..

I just think from all my time watching, Higgins game was just ridiculously brilliant everywhere...He had 0 weaknesses.

StevenToast

I would rather watch a graeme dott v peter ebdon match than top gear....

Please get this over with

This is it

"sit down and get comfortable for the snooker world championship..."

All of 20 minutes at most I'd say

Brian?

walshb wrote: »

Davis is a monster, but I think the game just got that bit better in the early 90s, and then really took off late 90s...

Davis was great, but any mistakes he makes v the likes Higgins and Ronnie would be punished badly. I don’t think his opposition were remotely close to what Ronnie and Higgins and Williams and Hendry could do to him..

Very difficult to say who was best, as so much to consider, including luck..

I just think from all my time watching, Higgins game was just ridiculously brilliant everywhere...He had 0 weaknesses.

Higgins does/did have a weakness, his concentration lapses.

I love watching him play, but the reason he hasn't won as much as Ronnie or Hendry is that he wasn't as good all round. I don't understand the "greatest all round player" tag.

sligeach

Everyone involved in snooker should be embarrassed by this inevitable hollow title for O'Sullivan.

The White Feather

The White Feather wrote: »

I told you all! This is why he is winning. Kyren needs to shave off the goatee in the break to have a chance!!

Awww! It would have been great if he did this :pac:

Brian?

sligeach wrote: »

Everyone involved in snooker should be embarrassed by this inevitable hollow title for O'Sullivan.

Embarrassed? That's a ridiculous thing say.

AllForIt

Deleted User wrote: »

Have to disagree, if Selby had gotten an undeserved victory I reckon it would be a closer one now between him and Wilson.

Then there's the fact that Wilson really wouldn't be playing in not only his first (of very few I'd imagine) Crucible final, but against a living legend to boot; which O'Sullivan can easily be called - no question about it, or no exaggeration needed.

The days of Selby Selbying his way to victory seem gone. Must be hard to keep up that level of play - 40 min frames regularly.

Fair enough, but I still think Selby would have been the hot fav even if it was close. I don't think Wilson is World Champ material yet. He has to improve his game overall, not just have a good few days in the office.

Anyway, I agree with your latter point on Selby. For Ronnie to beat him was I think a turning point in that rivalry.

Happy4all

I think Anthony McGill would have made it tougher if he made it through that final frame. Was getting stronger each round and starting to build on break building.

Will probably be over before the football starts.

Mervyn Skidmore

Strange to have 2 Irish pundits on the beeb for the last session.

This is it

Poor safety and that could be it already

sligeach

O'Sullivan was a good player, but there's a reason he hasn't won for 7 years. His long potting has been awful, took multiple efforts to win frames and blasting the cueball as hard as he could when he was in snookers. Worthy champion my @R$€;!

This is it

This is it wrote: »

Poor safety and that could be it already

Or not poor black from Ronnie

gormdubhgorm

I don't get this 'Ronnie was awesome' stuff. Given chance after chance by Kyren. O'Sullivan not even third gear.

tanko

sligeach wrote: »

Everyone involved in snooker should be embarrassed by this inevitable hollow title for O'Sullivan.

Such rubbish.

Happy4all

if this ends early I hope the supporters don't have to endure 2 hours of Dennis Taylor jokes as compensation. I'd be running for the exit.

The only thing "Hollow" for me about Ronnie's inevitable demolition job is me not 'lumping on' at the evens/close to evens minus 4 1/2 frames handicap

Still, chasing one's losses is a bad job.

Go on RONNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYY

7th next year beckons