Relaxation of Restrictions, Part V - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

bush

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

How can they justify extending it? Cases went up since 10th of August.... from 5 - 15 a day, to 300 - 450 a day.

You ll see all the happy seals posting now "yeah but if masks werent introduced cases would be over 1000 a day now" :rolleyes:

You still see people posting "wear a mask ffs" on covid case articles as if the vast majority dont.

hynesie08

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

I’m not attention seeking or a “comedy” poster I’m giving my real opinions the same ones I give in real life, in WhatsApp group arguments etc.

It’s exceptionally annoying to have you opinions dismissed as trolling etc even more so when the opinions are actually the mainstream, majority opinion and that of the experts. Like it’s you and a few others in here that are in the minority and bar one or two posters who are definitely trolling I don’t believe most are even if I do disagree with them.

The vast majority do not want the gardai to be given power to enter private residences without a warrant

The vast majority do not want the army on the streets with water cannons

The vast majority don't want mandatory vaccines with jail for refusing.

The vast majority do not want another lockdown

The vast majority aren't salivating at the thought of 18 year olds being kicked out of college for no good reason (any expulsions yet)

That's not including your ridiculous views on drink driving, women's rights, freeloading off your parents, hygiene, your terrible parenting ideas and a thousand other ridiculous things you've said on here......

The day you speak for the vast majority is the day I welcome North Korea turning Ireland into a nuclear playground

_Kaiser_

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

I’m not attention seeking or a “comedy” poster I’m giving my real opinions the same ones I give in real life, in WhatsApp group arguments etc.

It’s exceptionally annoying to have you opinions dismissed as trolling etc even more so when the opinions are actually the mainstream, majority opinion and that of the experts. Like it’s you and a few others in here that are in the minority and bar one or two posters who are definitely trolling I don’t believe most are even if I do disagree with them.

At the very least you're misguided and overly influenced by the same social media you say you want to splash those you disagree with over.

As I and many others have said, the actual facts of the numbers are that this is a very mild disease for the vast majority of the population. That is not to say that some aren't at real risk, or that they shouldn't take steps to protect themselves and limit that risk, but this is not the "deadly virus" it's been positioned as in the media or Government/NPHET, or at least no more deadly than other seasonal viruses that impact - coincidentally enough - the same demographic.

Of course there will be some outliers and the media are doing a great job of finding these to maintain the fear, outrage and paranoia that you and others are expressing - but your anger is misdirected.. it should be to those same media outlets and "experts" that are blowing this out of all proportion vs the actual outcome of infections

And that is the fundamental issue. What was a drastic but entirely appropriate response in March when information was scarce and preparedness was lacking, has now become a complete overreaction since early summer, but now that we're entering colder months again and more are mixing again with the return to school and workplaces, the entirely predictable rise in cases (but still minimal deaths!) is being used to justify that overreaction. It could also be of course that many of the senior decision-makers are in that more vulnerable age category themselves so personal fear and bias is playing a part.

But they've gotten it wrong. That's clear from the numbers and the increasing disconnect of the message to what the general population are seeing for themselves every day, and it's why more are switching off and living their lives again. You can only cry wolf so often before people stop listening.

As a result, we are all are paying for the inability of those in charge to take a step back, calm themselves and re-evaluate the situation.

FintanMcluskey

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

At the very least you're misguided and overly influenced by the same social media you say you want to splash those you disagree with over.

As I and many others have said, the actual facts of the numbers are that this is a very mild disease for the vast majority of the population. That is not to say that some aren't at real risk, or that they shouldn't take steps to protect themselves and limit that risk, but this is not the "deadly virus" it's been positioned as in the media or Government/NPHET, or at least no more deadly than other seasonal viruses that impact - coincidentally enough - the same demographic.

Of course there will be some outliers and the media are doing a great job of finding these to maintain the fear, outrage and paranoia that you and others are expressing - but your anger is misdirected.. it should be to those same media outlets and "experts" that are blowing this out of all proportion vs the actual outcome of infections

And that is the fundamental issue. What was a drastic but entirely appropriate response in March when information was scarce and preparedness was lacking, has now become a complete overreaction since early summer, but now that we're entering colder months again and more are mixing again with the return to school and workplaces, the entirely predictable rise in cases (but still minimal deaths!) is being used to justify that overreaction. It could also be of course that many of the senior decision-makers are in that more vulnerable age category themselves so personal fear and bias is playing a part.

But they've gotten it wrong. That's clear from the numbers and the increasing disconnect of the message to what the general population are seeing for themselves every day, and it's why more are switching off and living their lives again. You can only cry wolf so often before people stop listening.

As a result, we are all are paying for the inability of those in charge to take a step back, calm themselves and re-evaluate the situation.

This is incredibly accurate.

The response in March was appropriate due to the lack of data.

Dr Feeley admitted he predicted Ireland would only have 15% of the required critical care beds, using the initial data in his calculations.

He now said he was wrong and its nowhere near as deadly as 1st thought.

Had to resign for sharing that opinion however

Yet most or Europe and the world is dealing the with virus in a similar way.

Madrid gone into hard lockdown as of yesterday, UK have curfews and local lockdowns, major outbreak in wales in a hospital judged to be serious enough to declare the hospital a covid zone and am emergency hospital is having to be setup nearby for non-covid patients. That’s just a few tiny examples.

We need to stop the virus, we need to severely limit social interactions to do this. Many people are too stupid or selfish to do this themselves so just be forced by restrictions, the current restrictions are looking like they aren’t going far enough so we need to get stricter.

The longer we wait the worse it gets, lockdown hard very hard fast and it won’t take that long to get case numbers down very low and then stay locked down a little longer to get to zero.

Then when there is very very little virus around we can start to slowly step back through restrictions.

drunkmonkey

Is that you Sam?

hynesie08

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Yet most or Europe and the world is dealing the with virus in a similar way.

Madrid gone into hard lockdown as of yesterday, UK have curfews and local lockdowns, major outbreak in wales in a hospital judged to be serious enough to declare the hospital a covid zone and am emergency hospital is having to be setup nearby for non-covid patients. That’s just a few tiny examples.

We need to stop the virus, we need to severely limit social interactions to do this. Many people are too stupid or selfish to do this themselves so just be forced by restrictions, the current restrictions are looking like they aren’t going far enough so we need to get stricter.

The longer we wait the worse it gets, lockdown hard very hard fast and it won’t take that long to get case numbers down very low and then stay locked down a little longer to get to zero.

Then when there is very very little virus around we can start to slowly step back through restrictions.

What a fantastic idea that *checks notes* wouldn't impact you at all.

**** the people who would suffer the most from that though, who needs to be able to pay rent.

_Kaiser_

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Yet most or Europe and the world is dealing the with virus in a similar way.

Madrid gone into hard lockdown as of yesterday, UK have curfews and local lockdowns, major outbreak in wales in a hospital judged to be serious enough to declare the hospital a covid zone and am emergency hospital is having to be setup nearby for non-covid patients. That’s just a few tiny examples.

We need to stop the virus, we need to severely limit social interactions to do this. Many people are too stupid or selfish to do this themselves so just be forced by restrictions, the current restrictions are looking like they aren’t going far enough so we need to get stricter.

The longer we wait the worse it gets, lockdown hard very hard fast and it won’t take that long to get case numbers down very low and then stay locked down a little longer to get to zero.

Then when there is very very little virus around we can start to slowly step back through restrictions.

And then the virus will start rising again.. what then? More lockdown? (because it's worked so well previously!) :rolleyes: Lest you forget we've already tried this approach.

“The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

There's also the "small" matters of the NI border, logistics and supply-chain, international law and treaty governing movement, and the "minor" issue that we do a LOT of business, trade, and travel with lots of different countries - are you planning to lock down until they get to Covid Zero too?

As I said, completely misguided.

stephenjmcd

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Yet most or Europe and the world is dealing the with virus in a similar way.

Madrid gone into hard lockdown as of yesterday, UK have curfews and local lockdowns, major outbreak in wales in a hospital judged to be serious enough to declare the hospital a covid zone and am emergency hospital is having to be setup nearby for non-covid patients. That’s just a few tiny examples.

We need to stop the virus, we need to severely limit social interactions to do this. Many people are too stupid or selfish to do this themselves so just be forced by restrictions, the current restrictions are looking like they aren’t going far enough so we need to get stricter.

The longer we wait the worse it gets, lockdown hard very hard fast and it won’t take that long to get case numbers down very low and then stay locked down a little longer to get to zero.

Then when there is very very little virus around we can start to slowly step back through restrictions.

Madrid doesn't have a hard lockdown, they've essentially the same restrictions as the UK, stay in your area and bars close and 10pm, then the same mixing in houses rule as us.

I fail to see how that is as you describe it a hard lockdown.

What you've described is essentially zero covid and that's just not going to happen no matter how much you want it to.

hynesie08

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Madrid doesn't have a hard lockdown, they've essentially the same restrictions as the UK, stay in your area and bars close and 10pm, then the same mixing in houses rule as us.

I fail to see how that is as you describe it a hard lockdown.

What you've described is essentially zero covid and that's just not going to happen no matter how much you want it to.

If I've learned anything this last week, it's that nox doesn't read the news, only the headlines.

Penfailed

manniot2 wrote: »

Give the lockdown merchants what they want- level 5 for 9 months. **** it, no point arguing at this stage just accept it.

Give the open everything merchants what they want - no restrictions from now on. **** it, no point arguing at this stage just accept it.

hynesie08

hynesie08 wrote: »

What a fantastic idea that *checks notes* wouldn't impact you at all.

**** the people who would suffer the most from that though, who needs to be able to pay rent.

Would you ever just give up with this constant “oh it doesn’t impact you” stuff. You are basically denying a large proportion of the population to have an opinion on this which is total nonsense.

hynesie08

manniot2 wrote: »

Give the lockdown merchants what they want- level 5 for 9 months. **** it, no point arguing at this stage just accept it.

Penfailed wrote: »

Give the open everything merchants what they want - no restrictions from now on. **** it, no point arguing at this stage just accept it.

Middle ground, the government rents centre parcs for 9 months, anyone who wants to can live there in a covid free bubble manned by the army and their water cannons..... The rest of us can live free, infecting and counter infecting until we're either immune or dead......

Penfailed

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

The year was 2024, daily corona virus cases just reached all time low of 2 a day in Ireland, Penfailed was still posting on boards "we are in a middle of a pandemic" :rolleyes:

daft

It's daft that you are trying to take the piss out of me rather than address the point of my post.

hynesie08

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Would you ever just give up with this constant “oh it doesn’t impact you” stuff. You are basically denying a large proportion of the population to have an opinion on this which is total nonsense.

So who's going to pay for your hard lockdown?

There are 300,000 people out of work as it stands, how does your plan get them back to work in the next 18 months?

Your me me me attitude is frankly disgusting.

facehugger99

JRant wrote: »

People need to realise that the numbers don't matter for any of this. Hospitalization, ICU, cases, positive rate of infection, how many magpies land in the CMO's garden, are all equal valid reasons for NPHET to advise for more severe restrictions as they see fit.

NPHET have a very narrow brief - to stop the spread of covid. They do not have to give any consideration to the economic effects of their advise, nor are the qualified to make such considerations.

What has been truly shameful, have been the actions/inactions of the Government in rubber stamping their 'recommendations'.

It has been the most cowardly and nauseating response from the people we pay a kings ransom to best represent our interests.

Zebra3

facehugger99 wrote: »

NPHET have a very narrow brief - to stop the spread of covid. They do not have to give any consideration to the economic effects of their advise, nor are the qualified to make such considerations.

What has been truly shameful, have been the actions/inactions of the Government in rubber stamping their 'recommendations'.

It has been the most cowardly and nauseating response from the people we pay a kings ransom to best represent our interests.

Yep, absolute pure and utter political cowardice.

All it takes is MM flanked by his ministers to call a press conference and say that time has moved on, we are more knowledgeable than in March, but we must look to the future and start to rebuild our economy, the number of people dying is unfortunate but low, and our lives must go on with the vulnerable taking responsibility and people in general taking responsibility.

They can do their usual tricks and leak this to the media so nobody is taken by surprise, but the status quo cannot continue. In March there was a hope that this would all disappear, that there would be a vaccine. This pie in the sky thinking has to change.

How much longer is each poster prepared to go on existing like this?

Another six months?

Until 2022?

2023?

PTH2009

Zebra3 wrote: »

Yep, absolute pure and utter political cowardice.

All it takes is MM flanked by his ministers to call a press conference and say that time has moved on, we are more knowledgeable than in March, but we must look to the future and start to rebuild our economy, the number of people dying is unfortunate but low, and our lives must go on with the vulnerable taking responsibility and people in general taking responsibility.

They can do their usual tricks and leak this to the media so nobody is taken by surprise, but the status quo cannot continue. In March there was a hope that this would all disappear, that there would be a vaccine. This pie in the sky thinking has to change.

How much longer is each poster prepared to go on existing like this?

Another six months?

Until 2022?

2023?

True and mental health is going to be a massive massive issue for some people

Were working towards a plan which is not getting us back to normal

manniot2

Zebra3 wrote: »

Yep, absolute pure and utter political cowardice.

All it takes is MM flanked by his ministers to call a press conference and say that time has moved on, we are more knowledgeable than in March, but we must look to the future and start to rebuild our economy, the number of people dying is unfortunate but low, and our lives must go on with the vulnerable taking responsibility and people in general taking responsibility.

They can do their usual tricks and leak this to the media so nobody is taken by surprise, but the status quo cannot continue. In March there was a hope that this would all disappear, that there would be a vaccine. This pie in the sky thinking has to change.

How much longer is each poster prepared to go on existing like this?

Another six months?

Until 2022?

2023?

nothing is going to change lads. torturing yourselves by thinking they might.

3xh

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

It’s exceptionally annoying to have you opinions dismissed as trolling etc even more so when the opinions are actually the mainstream, majority opinion and that of the experts.

When I joined up here in early August, nox, after finally having enough of the right-on, NPHET-supporting group think, the first response to my first post was a reference to my zero post count!

I also see Dr. Feeley as an expert. You don’t? Majority v minority is subjective as we’ll never hear from the cowed medical staff who’ve been told not to go public with their comments.

weldoninhio

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

No the message isnt out there.

People are convinced mask wearing and hand washing will save them.

The elephant in the room is still obesity

Surely the elephant in the room is people with obesity

3xh

I see what you did there!

Ginger n Lemon

Penfailed wrote: »

Give the open everything merchants what they want - no restrictions from now on. **** it, no point arguing at this stage just accept it.

Pen, people take.

LIVE: Grafton Street blocked as up to 1,000 protesters stage sit-in on main shopping thoroughfare

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/live-grafton-street-blocked-up-19044772

Its getting crazier out there by the week. You watch now Dublin to go to Level 2 next Friday. And it has nothing to do with "cases"

Harry Palmr

Level 2 you mean level 4

Ginger n Lemon

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Level 2 you mean level 4

No, I mean level 2.

There are no mortgage breaks.
PUP is smaller/much smaller for some.
1 in 6 unemployed.
Even a restaurant chain is ready to sue the govt for the groundless restrictions.
We know who is vulnerable to covid. we also have PPE.
Paschal has already confirmed double digit unemployment to January 2022.

Was any of above the case in March?

People are desperate now. Country is not made up of just office keyboard warriors WFH and eating dominos. And it is becoming more and more evident.

froog

edit: wrong thread

Over 600 cases, things are snowballing we are going to be absolutely f*cked unless serious action is taken fast. Level 4 won’t cut it anymore we need a country wide level 5 asap.

FintanMcluskey

froog wrote: »

edit: wrong thread

I thought so.

No worries, stay safe out there

LessOutragePlz

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Over 600 cases, things are snowballing we are going to be absolutely f*cked unless serious action is taken fast. Level 4 won’t cut it anymore we need a county wide level 5 asap.

You're like a parrot repeating the same thing over and over again.

Very shortsighted in your thinking too, as numerous posters have pointed out to you many times:
How are we going to be able to fund another lockdown when there's already 300k unemployed?

Sure we can borrow at cheap interest rates but we'll still have to pay back whatever we borrow.

We need to plough on as we are with no further restrictions we have to prioritize the economy and the future for the younger generation because they are the ones that are ultimately going to be shafted with higher taxes for many many years to repay the debt that we'd need to take on to fund further full lockdowns.

hmmm

Grant Billions Bifocals wrote: »

Over 600 cases, things are snowballing we are going to be absolutely f*cked unless serious action is taken fast. Level 4 won’t cut it anymore we need a county wide level 5 asap.

It's heading towards a 5 unless we get a grip on this.

We should be seeing now whether Dublin begins to level off. That will show us whether level 3 is sufficient to get control over this. It looks like much of the rest of the country will follow.