Schools and Concerns

Neyite

RocketRaccoon wrote: »

This is when the teachers will have to step in and refuse to allow sick children into the class. Hopefully someone standing at the classroom entrance with a temperature monitor. If your kid is sick then off home they go.

Unfortunately Teachers /Staff aren't medical experts, and like another poster says, a dose of calpol at 8.55 sorts them out for a few hours, plus children are more likely to be asymptomatic, and are typically vectors, not victims of viruses.

Essentially unless a household is responsible enough to notify the school if they've been in close contact with someone who's potentially got it, there's a good chance that a child who's got covid will mix fully with his /her class for days or weeks before it comes to light. Then you'll have the parent pretend that they had NO IDEA that Auntie Sarah who's coughed and spluttered her way through the family party two weeks ago had covid, because those tests give false positives, don't they? And anyway, Sarah's friends' cousin is a homeopath and gave her stuff to ward off the virus...

wirelessdude01

Neyite wrote: »

Unfortunately Teachers /Staff aren't medical experts, and like another poster says, a dose of calpol at 8.55 sorts them out for a few hours, plus children are more likely to be asymptomatic, and are typically vectors, not victims of viruses.

Essentially unless a household is responsible enough to notify the school if they've been in close contact with someone who's potentially got it, there's a good chance that a child who's got covid will mix fully with his /her class for days or weeks before it comes to light. Then you'll have the parent pretend that they had NO IDEA that Auntie Sarah who's coughed and spluttered her way through the family party two weeks ago had covid, because those tests give false positives, don't they? And anyway, Sarah's friends' cousin is a homeopath and gave her stuff to ward off the virus...

Or they belong to the 'it's just the flu bro' brigade.

fits

Digs wrote: »

It is going to be a loooooooong Winter.

This

shesty

Digs wrote: »

This is what I’m wondering about. We have had notification from both school and Naíonra regarding their dates to return and that’s as much as I’ve heard. We’ve been told school is working on the return plan and will update shortly. I would assume they will give instructions on when to stay at home if sick etc As I said I’ll do as I’m told and do our bit but am fully expecting back and forth and stops and starts. It is going to be a loooooooong Winter.

Well the only thing the school notification says is to stay home if "showing symptoms of Covid".Given that most bugs small children have fall into the "symptoms of Covid" definition, I am at a loss.
Her throat was fine after some Calpol and a night's sleep, I haven't heard a mention of it.She is a bit snotty and has sneezed a few times but that is it. But as someone said, should I have rung the GP yesterday at the mention of a sore throat?How can I do that everytime they have any sniffle, I will have myself and the GP driven mad.

byhookorbycrook

Teachers cannot be responsible for taking temperatures, part of the so-called DES “ plan” says parents must make the call as to whether their child is ill or not .
If a child complains of a sore throat etc. expect a phone call to come and take your child home ASAP . That’s unfortunately the way it has to be .

shesty

Yes, if she was at school I would have kept her home.
But are we supposed to go ringing for tests every time they have a sniffle??Do we all isolate for a fortnight when something like this happens?That is what is causing me the wonder.

fits

shesty wrote: »

Yes, if she was at school I would have kept her home.
But are we supposed to go ringing for tests every time they have a sniffle??Do we all isolate for a fortnight when something like this happens?That is what is causing me the wonder.

It’s going to be an interesting school year. I guess all we can do is keep them home if they have symptoms and phone gp if symptoms match Covid-19. I wouldn’t be blanket keeping them home for two weeks after every sniffle. You just couldn’t.

Neyite

fits wrote: »

It’s going to be an interesting school year. I guess all we can do is keep them home if they have symptoms and phone gp if symptoms match Covid-19. I wouldn’t be blanket keeping them home for two weeks after every sniffle. You just couldn’t.

It's not even just keeping them off school, it's the rest of the family too. Mum's workplace, Dad's workplace and the various schools the siblings of snotface attends. Arrange for someone else to pick up Grandad's precription and bring Granny to her outpatient appointment. If any of the older siblings have a boyfriend or girlfriend, does their family need to take precautions as well...
I suppose we will find out as we go along.

Digs

shesty wrote: »

Yes, if she was at school I would have kept her home.
But are we supposed to go ringing for tests every time they have a sniffle??Do we all isolate for a fortnight when something like this happens?That is what is causing me the wonder.

Ugh the stress. Totally on the same page as you.
I was listening to RTE radio 1 on Wednesday and they were interviewing a director from The WHO (who’s name annoyingly escapes me!!). He was excellent though, very level headed and reassuring but he basically said without a doubt this term is going to be bumpy as we figure it all out, we’ll get it right, get it wrong but we’ll get it in the end, we have to because education (And our youth!) cannot continue to suffer as it has.

shesty

I absolutely agree with that.It is just going to be a very long winter!

Uncle Pierre

Uncle Pierre wrote: »

If I may......I think in fairness that they really are the options. For anybody in that situation, you either have to:

- send the kids to school, and accept the risk
- move to live somewhere else
- somehow home school the kids instead of sending them to school, or
- not educate them at all.

I honestly can't think of any other alternative.

There is a very clear and easily implemented alternative. Launch a zoom meeting at the start of every class so any student who can’t attend school can attend via video.

I personally don’t think the schools should even be considering opening, it’s going to be hundreds and hundreds of “meat factories” with clusters galore. The target should be delivering classes via zoom until a vaccine is widespread.

shesty

The problem is that might work for older kids but it is no good for younger ones.
Also teachers have kids that need minding too so delivering a day of classes via Zoom is next to impossible with kids of their own.

lazygal

Lamar Short Sidearm wrote: »

There is a very clear and easily implemented alternative. Launch a zoom meeting at the start of every class so any student who can’t attend school can attend via video.

I personally don’t think the schools should even be considering opening, it’s going to be hundreds and hundreds of “meat factories” with clusters galore. The target should be delivering classes via zoom until a vaccine is widespread.

Ridiculous suggestion. How do our two children do zoom when we're using the two laptops in the house to work? How do we supervise them for full school days in front of a screen when we're working?

jlm29

Lamar Short Sidearm wrote: »

There is a very clear and easily implemented alternative. Launch a zoom meeting at the start of every class so any student who can’t attend school can attend via video.

I personally don’t think the schools should even be considering opening, it’s going to be hundreds and hundreds of “meat factories” with clusters galore. The target should be delivering classes via zoom until a vaccine is widespread.

I’m guessing you don’t have children? If I stayed here long enough I could write a list of at least 50 reasons why this wouldn’t work and isn’t an option long term.

RocketRaccoon

A local school here has sent out a message saying that there will be no homework this year, no schoolbags to be used, all books etc to be left in the class all the time. The only thing kids will need to bring with them each day is their lunch bag.

jlm29

RocketRaccoon wrote: »

A local school here has sent out a message saying that there will be no homework this year, no schoolbags to be used, all books etc to be left in the class all the time. The only thing kids will need to bring with them each day is their lunch bag.

Some schools have said no lunch boxes, lunch has to be bagged so the bag can be thrown out. There’s been no word from our school about any of it yet
I know it’s necessary, but I can’t help but think of all the waste plastic etc

shesty

I think a lot of the preschools have said that - thankfully ours have said yes to lunch boxes, but no to schoolbags. Nothing about that stuff from the primary school though, they don't seem to think it's necessary (I'd be sceptical myself about it too).

Dravokivich

Lamar Short Sidearm wrote: »

There is a very clear and easily implemented alternative. Launch a zoom meeting at the start of every class so any student who can’t attend school can attend via video.

I personally don’t think the schools should even be considering opening, it’s going to be hundreds and hundreds of “meat factories” with clusters galore. The target should be delivering classes via zoom until a vaccine is widespread.

I wouldn't be keen on using Zoom. With a Microsoft account, I can control who is able to contact my son within their services.

jlm29 wrote: »

Some schools have said no lunch boxes, lunch has to be bagged so the bag can be thrown out. There’s been no word from our school about any of it yet
I know it’s necessary, but I can’t help but think of all the waste plastic etc

Paper bags, not an option? Just had a quick look and it seems Supervalu do them, might be worth checking out:

https://shop.supervalu.ie/shopping/household-cleaning-food-sandwich-bags-paper-lunch-1-piece-/p-1094950000

shesty wrote: »

I think a lot of the preschools have said that - thankfully ours have said yes to lunch boxes, but no to schoolbags. Nothing about that stuff from the primary school though, they don't seem to think it's necessary (I'd be sceptical myself about it too).

My son's school are insisting on stationary being washed everyday. If needed, I don't get why they wouldn't just ask to have a set at home, so they can reduce the amount of stuff going in and out.

Neyite

Lamar Short Sidearm wrote: »

There is a very clear and easily implemented alternative. Launch a zoom meeting at the start of every class so any student who can’t attend school can attend via video.

I personally don’t think the schools should even be considering opening, it’s going to be hundreds and hundreds of “meat factories” with clusters galore. The target should be delivering classes via zoom until a vaccine is widespread.

You are comparing primary school to the likes of an adult training courses. It's like comparing apples and tomatoes.

My next door neighbour has four kids ranging from Junior infants to fourth class. The only pc they have in the home is being used for the mother's work.

With us, we've only one child, but even so, the only device available to him is his tablet which has a screen of about 8". His dad has a work laptop and I've my work pc. Neither of which is available during school hours for our son's use. The three months of homeschool, using screens for exercises was a disaster - he just couldn't work on his tablet that way.

Then you've got to consider space. How does my neighbour (who's office is an annex to the garage) supervise 4x Zoom classes plus do her own work? How do the children concentrate with their siblings beside them also talking? You'll need 4 sets of headphones at least. More because sods law will be that at 9.28 at least one headset will be on the missing /broken list. They'll need to be in separate rooms to concentrate and interact with their class. Not everyone has the space in their home to give each child a quiet space to follow the lesson. Younger children will almost certainly need direct supervision and assistance, which is hard to do if you yourself are on a zoom call in another room. Older ones will find ways to not bother. Or kids will spend the time pinching their siblings to disrupt their attention.

Then there's the school itself. They don't have the cash to buy each teacher a PC/Laptop and if you think the DoE would fund that, you'd be sorely mistaken. And if you think that parents could fork out for devices when they've already bought uniforms/bags /books and paid the contribution to the school, then you'd also be very much mistaken.

From a teachers point of view - I'm limited here as I've no experience other than as a parent, but I can imagine that in a real life classroom a teacher can see who's not understanding, who isn't paying attention, and encourage the shyer ones to take part. The entire lesson plan for each subject for the year is based on a classroom delivery /hard copy format based on a syllabus that is based on physical books not a virtual environment so overhauls would need to happen there. There's some kids who literally do need the classroom environment and real life interaction to learn properly. Throw into that a few teachers who have little or no computer knowledge. They'll need training (who's going to pay?) days off for training (who's going to cover their class)

I've just covered the neuro-typical children there. There are several in our small school that needs SNA support on a one-to-one basis during lessons. How can that work from home? There's a little lad who's hearing impaired, who sits up beside the teacher. If he has to learn at home, how? Speech to Text software is amazing, but not so good for a wee lad just learning how to read. The kid with dyslexia, how does the teacher view in real time what they are putting on their workbooks?

Tech is very useful and I'd love to see it in schools more - and it's obviously going to be more useful with post-primary students, but rushing it in as an emergency measure in a pandemic and parking a small kid in a room with a tablet and zero preparation isn't the answer for either the teacher or the student.


I think most parents can accept that the new term is going to be trial and error. And that disruption to school work, employment and family life will certainly happen. We just don't know to what extent and there's no easy Plan B that suits all kids/families/teachers.

jlm29

Dravokivich wrote: »

Paper bags, not an option? Just had a quick look and it seems Supervalu do them, might be worth checking out:

https://shop.supervalu.ie/shopping/household-cleaning-food-sandwich-bags-paper-lunch-1-piece-/p-1094950000

I’ll make the effort and use paper bags if I’m told we can’t have lunch boxes, but there’s thousands who won’t because they don’t care enough. Even if it’s paper rather than plastic though, it’s still an awful awful lot of waste.

shesty

Just on those particular paper bags, they are very small - they are only meant for holding a sandwich (I use them). It is hard to find a paper alternative big enough to hold a lunch, because I looked a few weeks ago! I suppose a reusable Ziploc bag would be the next best thing.

fits

The wrapping that bread comes in can be used as well. We were told no lunch boxes by one of the preschools. The small aldi paper bags will cover the snack fine as they are only in there for 3 hours.

Really concerned about the other preschool for special needs children though. Some of them are so vulnerable. My son is also in a high risk group but is in good health generally. He had been getting transport but that brings the close contacts way up. Not sure how it will go.

The uncertainty of next few weeks on top of my usual end of summer blues... Not in good form with all this.
My special needs boy starting in mainstream preschool would be enough as it is. (he's doing 50:50)

Digs

Totally with how you’re feeling Fits. It’s so tough since Friday. We have had zero communication from both school and Naíonra. I would just love some direction about what’s to come, what to expect so I can prep the kids, everthing is bought and paid for.

I know I shouldn’t have been so naive but considering schools are closed since March I can’t believe we’re here right now. Leadership was good for a while.

bee06

My little boy had his settling in hour at preschool this morning. They are fine with lunchboxes etc and school bags. Realistically it’s the child that’s most likely to spread COVID anyway not lunch box.

kippy

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

you may have to consider moving away from parents, as situation doesn't sound sustainable for next 12 months unless your parents accept the risk.

schools will never be "safe" in that situation, will always be some risk.

The big issue is parents and grandparents help out an awful lot with kids. I don't know where you'd find the additional help were you to take them out of the equation.

Neyite

shesty wrote: »

Just on those particular paper bags, they are very small - they are only meant for holding a sandwich (I use them). It is hard to find a paper alternative big enough to hold a lunch, because I looked a few weeks ago! I suppose a reusable Ziploc bag would be the next best thing.

That would suit us given that any fruit we pack has merely a day trip away from the fruit bowl, returning with only a few bruises.The Stunt Banana. I could replace it for the entire year with a fake one and nobody including my kid, would cop.

kippy wrote: »

The big issue is parents and grandparents help out an awful lot with kids. I don't know where you'd find the additional help were you to take them out of the equation.

Carpooling (very popular at our school) is another area that it could affect.

Digs

I received email from school for my eldest who’s going into Rang.1 - very comprehensive and I can only imagine the planning that has gone into it. Main takeaways are no homework for this term at least. Staggered drop of times and pick ups and we drop off/pick up from the gates whereas usually we go into the yard. Nothing about lunches and the only note on uniforms was asking us to make sure the child changes as soon as they go home.

The school is just prefabs, building had been due to begin for their (long awaited!!) new building last March but obviously that didn’t happen. I don’t envy their task figuring it all out but feel so much better knowing the plan!

Dravokivich

staggering times isn't a plan. My sons school is planning on doing that, but no survey was done to see how practical it'll be to implement it. My son goes to creche that does drop offs and pick ups, but it'll be for other kids in other classes in that school too. That can't just wait at the side of the road.

I need to send them a copy of a GP letter so will be querying that as well.

Cakerbaker

Dravokivich wrote: »

staggering times isn't a plan. My sons school is planning on doing that, but no survey was done to see how practical it'll be to implement it. My son goes to creche that does drop offs and pick ups, but it'll be for other kids in other classes in that school too. That can't just wait at the side of the road.

I need to send them a copy of a GP letter so will be querying that as well.

Our crèche has said they can’t offer their drop off / pick up service this year because of the staggered times in one of the local primary’s. Thankfully my kids aren’t starting yet but the parents of the kids moving on are now in a panic trying to figure out how to get their kids to school in the morning and how to get them from school to crèche after school finishes.

Digs

Yeah we’re fortunate that we can figure it out. Middle girl is in the Naíonra next door and now starts a half hour before her older sister starts school which isn’t ideal but we’ll all wait in the car I suppose.

They’ve done it alphabetically in ours so at least siblings go in at the same time. I had heard of one school who is grouping the start times by class so some parents of multiple kids were having multiple drop offs. Nightmare.