Covid 19 Part XXI-27,908 in ROI (1,777 deaths) 6,647 in NI (559 deaths)(22/08)Read OP

is_that_so

stargazer 68 wrote: »

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53826957

According to the BBC we are at 'tipping point' !!

Didn't Martin use the phrase in his speech?

is_that_so

average_runner wrote: »

How many cases is that?

Not sure, I've seen the odd story about it and there was that party in a Cork club I think.

stargazer 68

is_that_so wrote: »

Didn't Martin use the phrase in his speech?

Could have done - didn't watch it!

Drumpot

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058105839

Just putting this link here for anybody who may have some ideas or suggestions for some local lads I’m trying to help. They are personal trainers who do group classes , mostly indoors.

They can only have 5 people which would be unsustainable and outdoors classes are a probelm with the weather. Any ideas or things you have heard would be appreciated as I’d love for them to be able to keep on working. Especially coming into the winter months where things could get hairy.

average_runner

MD1990 wrote: »

How can they. Children don't develop symptoms in most cases & probably wont socially distance either. Not enough testing
They cant control the environment. Indoors will cause spread.

Sports events are important for many people's mental health are outdoors 19 times safer & not caused an outbreak unlike the meat plants which are indoors.

We will be in total lockdown now in October thanks to the insistence for schools to go back while they can do their classes online.

I think schools should be online but have extra PE classes outdoors & have schools sports teams go ahead so they have some social interaction.

You cant do online school for primary school kids. They don't have the attention span and not all homes will have the equipment.

Also how do you handle dyslexia in online schooling?

If both parents work from home it's not possible also

landofthetree

MD1990 wrote: »

How can they. Children don't develop symptoms in most cases & probably wont socially distance either. Not enough testing
They cant control the environment. Indoors will cause spread.

Sports events are important for many people's mental health are outdoors 19 times safer & not caused an outbreak unlike the meat plants which are indoors.

We will be in total lockdown now in October thanks to the insistence for schools to go back while they can do their classes online.

I think schools should be online but have extra PE classes outdoors & have schools sports teams go ahead so they have some social interaction.

Cant do schools online as not everyone has high speed broadband?

average_runner

is_that_so wrote: »

Not sure, I've seen the odd story about it and there was that party in a Cork club I think.

So for a hand full of cases we shut sports down, maybe instead fine the people at the party?

We never get anywhere

average_runner

landofthetree wrote: »

Cant do schools online as not everyone has high speed broadband?

Also broadband is struggling with the work from home zoom calls.

Virgjn in uk keeps crashing

is_that_so

MD1990 wrote: »

How can they. Children don't develop symptoms in most cases & probably wont socially distance either. Not enough testing
They cant control the environment. Indoors will cause spread.

Sports events are important for many people's mental health are outdoors 19 times safer & not caused an outbreak unlike the meat plants which are indoors.

We will be in total lockdown now in October thanks to the insistence for schools to go back while they can do their classes online.

I think schools should be online but have extra PE classes outdoors & have schools sports teams go ahead so they have some social interaction.

The control is in terms of how many catch it, in other words making the groupings as small as possible. There will be cases but we can't just shut down the education system every time one appears. Online classes have merits but they are an unnatural setup, especially for the very young. I'm not disagreeing on outdoor sports events but if people push that to maintain the social aspects
risk can increase.

KrustyUCC

is_that_so wrote: »

Not sure, I've seen the odd story about it and there was that party in a Cork club I think.

None of the clubs had a case after that party in Cork

It does seem that some cases of GAA members in Limerick and Clare are linked to parties

completedit

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

This needs to stop. Latvia is in the EU, they are free to leave any time they want.

I worked with some Latvians in the IT sector, well paid, but sent the vast majority of this money back home (registered as a contractor there and paid no tax here) with the idea to retire in a few years. He now has a few properties there and has no need to work.

Now meat packing isnt IT, but the minimum wage in Ireland is a decent salary for Latvia (where they are sending their money), they also likely arent paying any tax in Ireland (if the IT sector is to go on) - they would be in as independent contractors - which is why there are no sick days etc.

Forcing companies to employ workers directly would likely end up costing them money as opposed to the current arrangement.

Its not a slave operation, its people that are free to go at any point making a choice.

Well said.

Honestly it's so demeaning to relegate people to underprivileged abused migrants. These lads and girls are the equivalent of the Irish who go and work in New York in pubs and restaurants. Hours are ****e and conditions not great but they make good money and have a life experience. It's so arrogant for a country like Ireland to treat these people from a fellow EU country as if they're de facto surpressed second class citizens. Its a short hop on a flight to Latvia. They come here to make some dosh, it's not depressing. It's amazing for them, ****e work but they can then afford to pay for studies or buy a house or drive around Riga in a brand new whip. I get that often it comes from a good place but it unsettles me that there seems to be a view that these peopl exist purely as "migrant workers" and have no other option. Migration across EU in a world of low cost travel has changed. These people are here on their own terms and more power to them. If I was them I'd want to enjoy the time a bit more but we have Irish who do similar, who go away and work like crazy for a few years and come back with a heap of cash.

Wolf359f

tigger123 wrote: »

It's not about money, its about staffing. While you have health care staff sitting around doing nothing waiting for an emergency to break out, other health services and patients are being neglected.

Did they not train the army to take on some contact tracing? I know the meat plants clusters they have specialised teams, HCW's who are skilled in that etc..m but with the community cases and all those home clusters, they don't need the specialists, the trained army could do it. Seems they dropped the ball big time. Or perhaps asleep at the wheel.

is_that_so

average_runner wrote: »

So for a hand full of cases we shut sports down, maybe instead fine the people at the party?

We never get anywhere

Well, that's just one example. I see where they are coming from and logically it makes sense to restrict numbers of people together in one place. That doesn't mean that I agree with it or like it personally.

caveat emptor

is_that_so wrote: »

He has also said that community spread is a low proportion of cases and not the current driver of cases.

That's reassuring thanks. Let's hope it stays that way.

is_that_so

caveat emptor wrote: »

That's reassuring thanks. Let's hope it stays that way.

Indeed, that's what this latest set of measures is about.

smelly sock

is_that_so wrote: »

Well, that's just one example. I see where they are coming from and logically it makes sense to restrict numbers of people together in one place. That doesn't mean that I agree with it or like it personally.

But they havent done that though. Churches are indoors as are most wedding receptions. Bars and restaurants in Kildare allowed to serve outdoors and possibly allowed to reopen fully come next Monday. Yet and outdoor event such as an u14 football game or junior soccer match has been targeted.

I fully understand the need to mitigate people exposure to this virus but the govts logic is like something from a Mickey Mouse cartoon. It's crazy what they have done.

billybonkers

polesheep wrote: »

Many people die from illness every day. Once the hospitals are not overwhelmed and people die for want of treatment then that is all that matters.

I think we want to avoid as many hospitalisations as possible.

plodder

Wolf359f wrote: »

Did they not train the army to take on some contact tracing? I know the meat plants clusters they have specialised teams, HCW's who are skilled in that etc..m but with the community cases and all those home clusters, they don't need the specialists, the trained army could do it. Seems they dropped the ball big time. Or perhaps asleep at the wheel.

If not the army then temporary (paid) work for people who want to help out. Or even contract out to call-centre companies. A lack of people to do it, should not be the limiting factor.

smelly sock

KrustyUCC wrote: »

None of the clubs had a case after that party in Cork

It does seem that some cases of GAA members in Limerick and Clare are linked to parties

Members working in meat plans from what I hear.

KrustyUCC

smelly sock wrote: »

Members working in meat plans from what I hear.

Hmmm that's interesting

I Haven't heard of meat plant cases in Limerick or Clare

caveat emptor

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

This needs to stop. Latvia is in the EU, they are free to leave any time they want.

I worked with some Latvians in the IT sector, well paid, but sent the vast majority of this money back home (registered as a contractor there and paid no tax here) with the idea to retire in a few years. He now has a few properties there and has no need to work.

Now meat packing isnt IT, but the minimum wage in Ireland is a decent salary for Latvia (where they are sending their money), they also likely arent paying any tax in Ireland (if the IT sector is to go on) - they would be in as independent contractors - which is why there are no sick days etc.

Forcing companies to employ workers directly would likely end up costing them money as opposed to the current arrangement.

Its not a slave operation, its people that are free to go at any point making a choice.

So could we all set up as Latvian contractors. That would be great. Then we wouldn't have to pay tax here. I wonder what would happen to the schools and hospitals.

It's a loop hole around minimum wage and taxes. The fact is that the tax should be payed where the money is earned. In a few years time we'll have 72 kids to a class and one ventilator if we all adopt that model.

Same goes for the multinationals who don't pay any tax.

wadacrack

The decision on sports will be reversed in a week or so I think. Its unclear anyway at the minute. Or more clarity will be given . The government making illogical decisions last night has not went down well at all and all public trust is gone.

wellwhynot

Faith Fancy Lava wrote: »

Have a weekend away booked with friends next weekend (rescheduled from April no less). Obviously with new restrictions this isn't allowed as we'll have more than 3 people from 3 different households. Should I wait for the company who own the holiday home to cancel on me?

Why would the holiday home cancel?

average_runner

wadacrack wrote: »

The decision on sports will be reversed in a week or so I think. Its unclear anyway at the minute. Or more clarity will be given . The government making illogical decisions last night has not went down well at all and all public trust is gone.

Typical ff. Heard leo walked out

gifted

wadacrack wrote: »

The decision on sports will be reversed in a week or so I think. Its unclear anyway at the minute. Or more clarity will be given . The government making illogical decisions last night has not went down well at all and all public trust is gone.

I'm expecting the same.....first time that there has been such a back lash against new recommendations and it will be noticed by ministers

giveitholly

They expect the total cases from the mushroom factory in Golden to be between 40/50

https://www.tipperarylive.ie/news/home/567248/breaking-total-number-of-covid-cases-at-golden-mushroom-plant-may-be-between-forty-and-fifty.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

plodder

caveat emptor wrote: »

So could we all set up as Latvian contractors. That would be great. Then we wouldn't have to pay tax here. I wonder what would happen to the schools and hospitals.

It's a loop hole around minimum wage and taxes. The fact is that the tax should be payed where the money is earned. In a few years time we'll have 72 kids to a class and one ventilator if we all adopt that model.

Same goes for the multinationals who don't pay any tax.

They certainly should be paying tax here, and there wasn't any evidence produced to show they don't, but I think the main point was that this is not modern day slave labour. Like the Keelings controversy a few months ago, these people come here voluntarily. I did the same when I was a student in fruit factories on the continent.

giveitholly

Outbreak in UHL,one patient and staff member after testing positive on a ward

https://www.tipperarylive.ie/news/home/567220/latest-outbreak-of-covid-19-confirmed-at-university-hospital-limerick.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Gael23

The government are in real danger now if losing the people

iguana

is_that_so wrote: »

The control is in terms of how many catch it, in other words making the groupings as small as possible.

But they aren't doing that. If they were it would be possible that schools would work but as it stands there will be classes of 30+ kids together in a room with one teacher and in some cases an SNA who may be moving between classrooms. It's pretty much the exact same scenario as in Israel which led to 47% of all infections at the start of their second wave. It is almost certain that the way our schools are reopening will lead to multiple clusters. That was pretty much a certainty as it was a few weeks ago when our cases were low. But now that our 7 day average is moving towards triple figures, there is absolutely no way at all to claim that what we are supposed to be doing is remotely safe and feasible.

And lets not pretend for one second that this is in our children's best interests. The vast, vast majority of children can continue to learn just fine at home. We have literally evolved to learn at a rapid rate in childhood. You'd actually have to work very hard to prevent your average child from learning in any environment. For the children with learning difficulties and at risk home lives, systems should be being put in place to help them. The main benefit to children from school is socialisation. But this stupid, stupid plan to send them to school without any real safety measures means that they are more likely to lose all of the social outlets they currently have. They have already lost a lot last night. We should be doing what we can to ensure they can keep what they do have for as long as possible. Not rushing to put them all back into the same building and risking us all being confined to our homes for months at a time through winter.

They only reason schools are going back is for childcare. If this was 35 years ago and most children had a parent at home, it wouldn't even be a consideration. We'd have school on the tv and radio and that would be the end of the discussion. It would have been so much better to have just admitted that and have worked out a childcare pod system. It would have been harder but it won't be fuçking harder than dealing with clusters in school. It won't be harder than dealing with the absolute clusterfuçk that will happen when someone catches the virus at school and gives it to granny and she's on a ventilator and the parent is crying on the phone to Joe Duffy.

Akabusi

Yesterday was embarrassing, I don't care if Leo is playing political games, he is correct. I'll follow the guidelines that make sense to the letter, not some of the crap from yesterday.
We have seen how poor governance in other countries has led to thousands of deaths, with the exception of the nursing homes being forgotten about from the last Government our time for poor governance is now starting.

road_high

average_runner wrote: »

Typical ff. Heard leo walked out

Where you hear that?! Sweet Jesus, I’d love to know all the juicy details

MOR316

Just on a lighter note, to get away from the heavy stuff for a moment...

What's with the D4s and their pronunciation of the virus' name? "Cow-vid 19"

giveitholly

Gael23 wrote: »

The government are in real danger now if losing the people

They have lost a lot of the people already I reckon,we laughed at Boris Johnson a couple of months ago our leadership are giving him a run for their money

spookwoman

Gael23 wrote: »

The government are in real danger now if losing the people

Did they ever have them.

gifted

Jesus, I just heard eamonn ryan on radio 1 there...it was awful.....asked about school buses and sounded lost with his answer

Necro

plodder wrote:

If not the army then temporary (paid) work for people who want to help out. Or even contract out to call-centre companies. A lack of people to do it, should not be the limiting factor.

There's a rake of people claiming the Pandemic Unemployment Payment at the moment, put them to work on a temp basis till their own jobs can reopen

Doctors room ghost

Gael23 wrote: »

The government are in real danger now if losing the people

What time are rambo and the lads taking over the streets?

khalessi

gifted wrote: »

Jesus, I just heard eamonn ryan on radio 1 there...it was awful.....asked about school buses and sounded lost with his answer

She cornered him on sd on buses for students and that an answer will be given within week. Basically it was discussed at yesterday's cabinet meeting briefly after 5 months to get this sorted. Must have been a surprise the schools go back in August.

seamus

smelly sock wrote: »

But they havent done that though. Churches are indoors as are most wedding receptions. Bars and restaurants in Kildare allowed to serve outdoors and possibly allowed to reopen fully come next Monday. Yet and outdoor event such as an u14 football game or junior soccer match has been targeted.

I fully understand the need to mitigate people exposure to this virus but the govts logic is like something from a Mickey Mouse cartoon. It's crazy what they have done.

I'm not defending their poor messaging, but I can see the logic in what they're trying to do.

I called it out last week; the big issue here is a small number of people with a huge number of close contacts. Some people have 20+ close contacts when they test positive.

That may not sound like a lot over two weeks, until you consider that a close contact is defined as someone that you have spent more than 15 minutes with, without social distancing. I don't know about you, but outside of my own home, there are only 2 or 3 people who fall into that category.

So the main thrust of these measures is to reduce this number. To limit the number of unnecessary close contacts that we all have.

- Avoid public transport if possible
- Avoid having lots of people at your home (inside or outside)
- Avoid having large uncontrolled gatherings where social distancing will not be observed.
- Work from home if at all possible

This is why a "controlled" gathering (where hygiene practices are in place) like Mass is OK, but party in your back garden is not. Likewise sporting events might have a lot of space, but congregation takes place before and after. And to a certain extent people congregate on the sidelines.

Schools are OK, because kids will be isolated to a core group and won't mix outside that.

Restaurants are OK because they have protocols and distancing practices.

And so on.

Why are schools OK, but work is not? I know that question has been asked a lot, but it's not an either/or. If working from home is at all possible, then it's low-effort intervention. Schooling from home is not possible.

Eod100

gifted wrote: »

Jesus, I just heard eamonn ryan on radio 1 there...it was awful.....asked about school buses and sounded lost with his answer

No sign of Varadkar or anyone from FG yet as far as I can see. FF and Greens out alright. Must not be any wifi or phone reception in Mayo for Varadkar's staycation..!

Doctors room ghost

road_high wrote: »

Where you hear that?! Sweet Jesus, I’d love to know all the juicy details

He wanted to throw in a lord of the rings quote and some lyrics from a kylie minogue song but the rest said no, we have the waffle section covered Leo.

yourdeadwright

Politics is a funny game,
Leo an absolute c*nt but because he speaks well he makes the masses feel at ease ,
Himself and Martin could stand up there and tell us the same bad news but because he is better at communicating people would feel more at ease,

Also it wouldn't surprise me if Leo saw the outrage on twitter after last nights press conference and started the rumour he walked out , he plays the game very well,

The current government are like a car sales man on his first day with all the "eh eh "
Leo is the seasoned pro who can sell a tennis mam a 3 liter Range Rover as a run around and she thinks she got a great deal ,

polesheep

billybonkers wrote: »

I think we want to avoid as many hospitalisations as possible.

And I think we just need to make sure that the hospitals can cope.

MOR316

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Politics is a funny game,
Leo an absolute c*nt but because he speaks well he makes the masses feel at ease ,
Himself and Martin could stand up there and tell us the same bad news but because he is better at communicating people would feel more at ease,

Also it wouldn't surprise me if Leo saw the outrage on twitter after last nights press conference and started the rumour he walked out , he plays the game very well,

The current government are like a car sales man on his first day with all the "eh eh "
Leo is the seasoned pro who can sell a tennis mam a 3 liter Range Rover as a run around and she thinks she got a great deal ,

Nail. Head!

If you have a cough and a fever now it really couldn't be anything other than covid? Would that be right as we haven't hit flu season yet.

wadacrack

Deleted User wrote: »

If you have a cough and a fever now it really couldn't be anything other than covid? Would that be right as we haven't hit flu season yet.

No, hayfever is pretty common. High pollen count in the last few weeks also

lee_baby_simms

Deleted User wrote: »

If you have a cough and a fever now it really couldn't be anything other than covid? Would that be right as we haven't hit flu season yet.

No, something as common as tonsillitis would cause fever and sore throat and could easily be misread as covid initially.

Necro

Deleted User wrote:

If you have a cough and a fever now it really couldn't be anything other than covid? Would that be right as we haven't hit flu season yet.

Hayfever as the poster above says. I've been crippled with it twice this summer.

yourdeadwright

Deleted User wrote: »

If you have a cough and a fever now it really couldn't be anything other than covid? Would that be right as we haven't hit flu season yet.

Not correct one of my kids had both last week doctor sent her to be tested for Covid on Saturday and on Monday got the results as negative,

So all your normal things are stil around,