Covid 19 Part XXI-27,908 in ROI (1,777 deaths) 6,647 in NI (559 deaths)(22/08)Read OP

AlmightyCushion

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Well seeing as there was 136 outstanding up to yesterday from Sunday & Monday there already was a fair few to be added in yesterday

They wouldn't have known that on Saturday.

Eod100

seanb85 wrote: »

Reality is, nearly six months in, the testing capacity isn't good enough. And the tracing is under pressure when we're averaging only 80 cases a day. And our isolation facilities aren't sufficient. And the school plan is worthless.

The things you need to have in place to "live with the virus" aren't there.

It was a huge effort from the public that got cases down to single figures but this was done via a very crude and simple measure, lockdown. This should have given us time to get things ready but the people in charge have failed at this in nearly every area.

Heard Prof Paddy Mallon on RTE earlier. Think he said here turnaround time seems to be from swabbing to test result as opposed to request for test which would be more accurate. Didn't there had been huge delays in getting a test til now but guess even if was a day say it does add 5o average turnaround time

Eod100

Strumms wrote: »

The virus doesn’t prioritize or discriminate...

The virus doesn’t say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, we will leave them alone “

The virus doesn’t say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, but Mammy has asthma “

The virus DOES say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, with living cells to infect, to multiply to make certain ill or worse.

With the behaviors of kids it’s going to spread like wildfire..

It's also daft to think schools could close after a few weeks kids sent home for few weeks only to risk inevitably spreading it to parents and family either way. It's a once in a lifetime global pandemic (hopefully at least), think we need to be flexible about when and if schools go back tbh. Could at least wait until January say.

AlmightyCushion

spookwoman wrote: »

Hold your horses was putting the numbers all together

This just proves the conspiracy wrong. Friday the 07/08 they announced the lockdown in Kildare, Laois and Offaly and on that day cases roughly equaled swabs. Yet the following day they announced 174 cases with only 128 swabs. So they had another 50ish cases they could have added into Friday's numbers for the big announcement but they didn't.

Friday 14/08 there was 67 cases and 138 swabs. Then on Saturday there was 200 cases with 122 swabs. Yet there was no big announcement on Saturday.

LuasSimon

completedit wrote: »

Well said.

Honestly it's so demeaning to relegate people to underprivileged abused migrants. These lads and girls are the equivalent of the Irish who go and work in New York in pubs and restaurants. Hours are ****e and conditions not great but they make good money and have a life experience. It's so arrogant for a country like Ireland to treat these people from a fellow EU country as if they're de facto surpressed second class citizens. Its a short hop on a flight to Latvia. They come here to make some dosh, it's not depressing. It's amazing for them, ****e work but they can then afford to pay for studies or buy a house or drive around Riga in a brand new whip. I get that often it comes from a good place but it unsettles me that there seems to be a view that these peopl exist purely as "migrant workers" and have no other option. Migration across EU in a world of low cost travel has changed. These people are here on their own terms and more power to them. If I was them I'd want to enjoy the time a bit more but we have Irish who do similar, who go away and work like crazy for a few years and come back with a heap of cash.

These people are employed because most can’t speak English , are unsure ( not told ) of any entitlements , don’t get their proper breaks etc etc . These jobs were far better paid jobs twenty years ago but Larry Goodman and his equals are paying ****t money for tough jobs to make more and more money to route through his Luxembourg tax exile status . Larry won’t pay the farmers , the workers or tax in this country but he’s worth close on 3 billion .
He could pay his staff a living wage and still make loads but he’s so greedy he’d prefer to fly in the poorest people in Europe and pay them the lowest he can with no sick pay and spread covid in the process so he can get to 3 billion wealth . He will be flying people in from Ethiopia and routing their pay through Syria next .

seanb85

Eod100 wrote: »

Heard Prof Paddy Mallon on RTE earlier. Think he said here turnaround time seems to be from stabbing to test result as opposed to request for test which would be more accurate. Didn't there had been huge delays in getting a test til now but guess even if was a day say it does add 5o average turnaround time

Even access to tests is shambolic, mad locations that you need a car to get to. I know the ambulance service are helping, but that too is limited. Semi permanent test locations should be everywhere, hundreds of them, I don't care if they only do 10 tests a day in a location, you need them there for when you need to do 100. In 12 months time getting a Covid test will still be a thing, but seemingly we decided huge amounts of stuff based on this lasting 3-6 months.

stephenjmcd

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

They wouldn't have known that on Saturday.

And ? For Saturday there was 71 outstanding from Friday with 122 postive swabs on Sat.

Another clear discrepancy. They've out by a small amount many times but not to the level of the last few days.

I'm not claiming conspiracy I'm saying there's a fundamental issue in reporting at the moment when the number issued as "Newly confirmed cases" is not the number of new cases found in the last 24hrs.

Let's see if it's back on track today

What Username Guidelines

caveat emptor wrote: »

Nice comparison with the worst hit country in Europe. It's a combination of different behaviours. The extend of the spread. Differences in demographics.

Better comparison would be with Denmark. The difference is the area under the curve. That's a huge amount of people who are dying every day that are not dying in a country beside with similar culture. i.e unnecessary deaths.

I'm growing tired of false equivalencies.

Nice comparison with one of the least hit countries in Europe. But I'm not talking numbers, I'm looking at the progress of the epidemic and how it's similar in shape in different latitudes, no matter what action is taken.

So why is Sweden coming down at all? Why do most European countries peak in ~April and follow a trend down, Denmark included? Peru locked down at a similar time and didn't see the same shaped curve, they see the same as Brazil.

ACitizenErased

17 in hospital as of 8am, reduction of 3 on last night. Majority of discharges occur on Wednesdays.

seamus

I wonder are the discrepancies / time delays between swabs and cases something to do with notifying the individuals?

That is, a positive swab might be reported in near real time back to the HSPC. But by the time that report filters back to the hospital, to the GPs, then to the HSE to notify them of a new case, there's a 24-48 hour delay? It might also be possible that the HSE cannot be notified of a new case until the individual themselves has been notified?

Hurrache

Strumms wrote: »

The virus doesn’t prioritize or discriminate...

The virus doesn’t say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, we will leave them alone “

The virus doesn’t say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, but Mammy has asthma “

The virus DOES say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, with living cells to infect, to multiply to make certain ill or worse.

With the behaviors of kids it’s going to spread like wildfire..

The virus also says look at all these people mingling, there's our way in. Its spread can be minimised.

ACitizenErased

seamus wrote: »

I wonder are the discrepancies / time delays between swabs and cases something to do with notifying the individuals?

That is, a positive swab might be reported in near real time back to the HSPC. But by the time that report filters back to the hospital, to the GPs, then to the HSE to notify them of a new case, there's a 24-48 hour delay? It might also be possible that the HSE cannot be notified of a new case until the individual themselves has been notified?

The story about the Tipp factory receiving positive results came out Saturday as far as I know. Released on Tuesday.

What Username Guidelines

seamus wrote: »

I wonder are the discrepancies between swabs and cases something to do with notifying the individuals?

That is, a positive swab might be reported in near real time back to the HSPC. But by the time that report filters back to the hospital, to the GPs, then to the HSE to notify them of a new case, there's a 24-48 hour delay? It might also be possible that the HSE cannot be notified of a new case until the individual themselves has been notified?

I'm thinking similar - they also need to verify which are new cases vs old cases and gather req'd info. They obviously work off different timelines (midnight - midnight, 3pm - 3pm, or similar), and there is an into-gathering exercise which appears to slow at weekends, but there is no discernible pattern which is odd.

MOR316

Hurrache wrote: »

The virus also says look at all these people mingling, there's our way in. Its spread can be minimised.

You people are idiots!

The virus cannot talk

seamus

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

I'm thinking similar - they also need to verify which are new cases vs old cases and gather req'd info. They obviously work off different timelines (midnight - midnight, 3pm - 3pm, or similar), and there is an into-gathering exercise which appears to slow at weekends, but there is no discernible pattern which is odd.

If you think about it, the lab obviously has no idea the nature of the swab. They have a relatively anonymous ID, they do the test, get the result. Result gets pushed back up through the chain.

I get a text on my phone, but that system has no idea if this is a new test; I could have been tested yesterday, or last week or last month.

The only person who can confirm "this is a new case of Covid" is the person's doctor - their GP or their hospital consultant. So it's only at the point that they receive the test result and act on it, that a notification to the HSE can take place.

So it's easy to see how you could have 260 positive swabs that don't get translated into "new cases" for a day or two. This would also mean that we could expect today's figures to be relatively low, though we don't know yet how many swabs were taken yesterday.

s1ippy

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

Nice comparison with one of the least hit countries in Europe. But I'm not talking numbers, I'm looking at the progress of the epidemic and how it's similar in shape in different latitudes, no matter what action is taken.

So why is Sweden coming down at all? Why do most European countries peak in ~April and follow a trend down, Denmark included? Peru locked down at a similar time and didn't see the same shaped curve, they see the same as Brazil.

Their society is organised completely differently to ours. Remember how it went in Italy because of large family gatherings? Imagine that, except you also have a huge variety of standards of education to contend with and families can be 30 people living under the one roof. If there's a roof.

The poorest in Peru and throughout the world are always the hardest hit. Behaviour and keeping informed is what wins out against this. Which is why I sometimes can't help but laugh at some of the people on this thread thinking they're "raging against the machine" and being so smart by fighting the messenger instead of the virus.

To those people, I say: there will come a moment of clarity when you realise that you're not getting one over on anyone except yourself, your friends and family.

What Username Guidelines

ACitizenErased wrote: »

17 in hospital as of 8am, reduction of 3 on last night. Majority of discharges occur on Wednesdays.

Also in last nights report, Mater had 2 in ICU at 6.30pm, but 1 patient total at 8pm. ICU has also dropped from 7 to 6 on dashboard this morning. Hopefully a discharge will be reflected in tonight's figures, and not a death.

Hurrache

MOR316 wrote: »

You people are idiots!

The virus cannot talk

Not that we know of yet, there's still a lot of unknown unknowns.

What Username Guidelines

seamus wrote: »

If you think about it, the lab obviously has no idea the nature of the swab. They have a relatively anonymous ID, they do the test, get the result. Result gets pushed back up through the chain.

I get a text on my phone, but that system has no idea if this is a new test; I could have been tested yesterday, or last week or last month.

The only person who can confirm "this is a new case of Covid" is the person's doctor - their GP or their hospital consultant. So it's only at the point that they receive the test result and act on it, that a notification to the HSE can take place.

So it's easy to see how you could have 260 positive swabs that don't get translated into "new cases" for a day or two. This would also mean that we could expect today's figures to be relatively low, though we don't know yet how many swabs were taken yesterday.

Exactly, I assume HSPC have plenty of due diligence to do beyond the positive swab result, which if they didn't do, would result in many many more denotifications later.

s1ippy wrote: »

Which is why I sometimes can't help but laugh at some of the people on this thread thinking they're "raging against the machine" and being so smart by fighting the messenger instead of the virus.

To those people, I say: there will come a moment of clarity when you realise that you're not getting one over on anyone except yourself, your friends and family.

Maybe I haven't had that moment of clarity yet, because I don't really get what you're saying here?

AlmightyCushion

stephenjmcd wrote: »

And ? For Saturday there was 71 outstanding from Friday with 122 postive swabs on Sat.

Another clear discrepancy. They've out by a small amount many times but not to the level of the last few days.

I'm not claiming conspiracy I'm saying there's a fundamental issue in reporting at the moment when the number issued as "Newly confirmed cases" is not the number of new cases found in the last 24hrs.

Let's see if it's back on track today

I agree that the numbers don't match but my issue is with people thinking they are holding them back for the big announcements. They wouldn't have needed to do that for yesterday's announcement. They could have just pointed at the large number of cases over the previous few days.

seamus wrote: »

I wonder are the discrepancies / time delays between swabs and cases something to do with notifying the individuals?

That is, a positive swab might be reported in near real time back to the HSPC. But by the time that report filters back to the hospital, to the GPs, then to the HSE to notify them of a new case, there's a 24-48 hour delay? It might also be possible that the HSE cannot be notified of a new case until the individual themselves has been notified?

I believe Ronan Glynn said before something about holding off reporting of numbers in clusters until the whole cluster has been tested or contact traced. I can't remember the exact details but it was something like that.

spookwoman

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

Also in last nights report, Mater had 2 in ICU at 6.30pm, but 1 patient total at 8pm. ICU has also dropped from 7 to 6 on dashboard this morning. Hopefully a discharge will be reflected in tonight's figures, and not a death.

Hub data
6 in ICU 1 Discharged and 1 admitted
17 in hospital, 2 admitted and 3 discharged

Strumms

Eod100 wrote: »

It's also daft to think schools could close after a few weeks kids sent home for few weeks only to risk inevitably spreading it to parents and family either way. It's a once in a lifetime global pandemic (hopefully at least), think we need to be flexible about when and if schools go back tbh. Could at least wait until January say.

Could wait till January and see how the state of play is then.


A good idea come January would be a reduced curriculum. With covid PE isn’t going to be possible you’d think.. if schools just ninjad religion, PE and maybe whatever else that isn’t viewed as absolutely necessary subject, maybe music, Art, home Economics... and just focus on Maths, English, History, Geography, Languages, Science... it’s less time on school property for teachers and students ... have them doing 10.00-3.30 say every day including a food break...

Continuous assessment forms their leaving cert grades. No pressure on the state and students to be up and running with a sat leaving cert. a leaving is no way fûcking practical with things as they are, continuous assessment over ‘calculated grades’.

lee_baby_simms

Strumms wrote: »

The virus doesn’t prioritize or discriminate...

The virus doesn’t say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, we will leave them alone “

The virus doesn’t say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, but Mammy has asthma “

The virus DOES say.. “ ahhh look, little kids, with living cells to infect, to multiply to make certain ill or worse.

With the behaviors of kids it’s going to spread like wildfire..

Then the virus says "****, none of these kids have ACE-2 receptors so we have no way into their cells to infect them."

Then the virus says "Lets find one of those old age homes that these idiots didn't protect back in March and April."

s1ippy

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

Exactly, I assume HSPC have plenty of due diligence to do beyond the positive swab result, which if they didn't do, would result in many many more denotifications later.



Maybe I haven't had that moment of clarity yet, because I don't really get what you're saying here?

Sorry, not a personal jibe at you...

I meant like when people are getting annoyed about the restrictions or the high numbers and they do that by fighting the people who are imparting the information.

What Username Guidelines

s1ippy wrote: »

Sorry, not a personal jibe at you...

I meant like when people are getting annoyed about the restrictions or the high numbers and they do that by fighting the people who are imparting the information.

Ah, gotcha. Tough to have lively debate in here without a label of doom-monger/sugar-coater/head-in-sand being applied to you depending on the info posted

bodhrandude

It doesn't make any sense at all what's the point of giving Gardai power that they can't use, the latest restrictions are in place till September 13th but Gardai can't get that power till September 15th, that's totally dumbass.

Strumms

lee_baby_simms wrote: »

Then the virus says "****, none of these kids have ACE-2 receptors so we have no way into their cells to infect them."

Then the virus says "Lets find one of those old age homes that these idiots didn't protect back in March and April."

Covid is less prevalent in kids, also they don’t seem to manifest very serious symptoms but kids still get covid and can infect others.

Hurrache

Ryanair are still being pricks about it. I guess they must have refunded all their customers in order to try take the moral highground.

https://twitter.com/RobOHanrahan/status/1296046952518492160

s1ippy

Hurrache wrote: »

Ryanair are still being pricks about it. I guess they must have refunded all their customers in order to try take the moral highground.

https://twitter.com/RobOHanrahan/status/1296046952518492160

Will any company even come close to looking as bad as they have this year.

amandstu

tigger123 wrote: »

People are being advised against public transport as it is a number of people from different households in the same confined space.

Has public transport been identified as a significant transport of the disease recently or earlier on?

Are masks being worn by everyone on board?

Plumbthedepths

s1ippy wrote: »

Will any company even come close to looking as bad as they have this year.

I think Larry Goodman owns a company or two and we can trace outbreaks back to his premises, not sure the same applies to RA.

dundalkfc10

Hurrache wrote: »

Ryanair are still being pricks about it. I guess they must have refunded all their customers in order to try take the moral highground.

https://twitter.com/RobOHanrahan/status/1296046952518492160

Why would Ryanair refund people for flights that are still going. The Govt needed to ban people from going, not advise against it but no course no they didn't have the balls.

tom1ie

What do the new restrictions mean for gyms?
Or is there any effect on them as they are business?

Hurrache

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Why would Ryanair refund people for flights that are still going.

Sigh.

https://twitter.com/search?q=%23ryanairrefunds&src=typeahead_click

seamus

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I think Larry Goodman owns a company or two and we can trace outbreaks back to his premises, not sure the same applies to RA.

I don't think Larry's businesses have released multiple statements basically saying, "To hell with this pandemic, let us get on with business, there's money to be made!"

yourdeadwright

tom1ie wrote: »

What do the new restrictions mean for gyms?
Or is there any effect on them as they are business?

Was in one this morning ,Just no more than 6 people I think at anyone time ,

Paddygreen

Had a word with an old couple just now in Spar. Politely told them to go home as they were not shopping at their designated time as per the new rules laid out by our experts. It was very satisfying watching them put down their basket and walk away after my chat with them. We are all in it together guys and the rules are the rules so it’s our duty as good citizens to set each other on the right path.

Paddygreen

We need more regulations. The nice West African security guard at Spar isn’t so nice to me anymore as I have personally tried to motivate him to tighten the ship.

Plumbthedepths

seamus wrote: »

I don't think Larry's businesses have released multiple statements basically saying, "To hell with this pandemic, let us get on with business, there's money to be made!"

It's not a statement that has caused outbreaks in certain factories, or have I missed something?
Btw Larry hasn't said it but it's obvious him and others have behaved in exactly the same manner you castigate RA for.

dundalkfc10

seamus wrote: »

I don't think Larry's businesses have released multiple statements basically saying, "To hell with this pandemic, let us get on with business, there's money to be made!"

No he has just went ahead and let his meat factory's operate the way they do, not saying anything

Drumpot

tom1ie wrote: »

What do the new restrictions mean for gyms?
Or is there any effect on them as they are business?

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Was in one this morning ,Just no more than 6 people I think at anyone time ,

https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/77b6d-statement-on-the-introduction-of-new-measures-to-limit-the-spread-of-covid-19/

According to above

- gyms/leisure centres/swimming pools/exercise and dance studios will remain open with strict distancing and other appropriate protective measures in place

-limits of 6 apply to exercise and dance classes with appropriate physical distancing

- limits of 15 apply to groups outside including training sessions (with exception of elite/professional sports and horseracing). There should be no mixing between groups

Not exactly clear if it’s 6 in a gym at a time.. So if I’m working out in a gym that’s not that spaced out or large, what’s the difference if it’s a class or not ? I presume the 6 limit is for classes or gym.

AdamD

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

They aren't holding back numbers for the announcements, it makes no sense. The difference yesterday between positive swabs and new case is about 150. If they had been added evenly between Sunday and Monday then we would have 150 cases Sunday and 140 Monday.

If any one asked at a press conference yesterday 'Why the new restrictions sure there are only 31 new cases today?' They could easily just point out we had nearly 200 on Saturday and nearly 150 on both Sunday and Monday for a total of 500 cases in the previous 3 days.

This suggestion they are holding back numbers to have a big number for when announcing restrictions is rubbish.

They could have, but I gurantee you the big announcement of new measures was never going to be on a day when they announce 40 new cases.

You can look at it a number of ways, but in my opinion the government are absolutely using the numbers to fit their announcements. You can say they aren't manipulating them, but it certainly looks like they're planning press conferences and announcements around times when they know a backlog will be cleared.

Its not even remotely outrageous enough to be thrown in as a conspiracy theory

Paddygreen

Drumpot wrote: »

https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/77b6d-statement-on-the-introduction-of-new-measures-to-limit-the-spread-of-covid-19/

According to above

- gyms/leisure centres/swimming pools/exercise and dance studios will remain open with strict distancing and other appropriate protective measures in place

-limits of 6 apply to exercise and dance classes with appropriate physical distancing

- limits of 15 apply to groups outside including training sessions (with exception of elite/professional sports and horseracing). There should be no mixing between groups

Not exactly clear if it’s 6 in a gym at a time.. So if I’m working out in a gym that’s not that spaced out or large, what’s the difference if it’s a class or not ? I presume the 6 limit is for classes or gym.

Are you working out with a mask on? I take a bottle of cillit bang to the park every morning to disinfect the yellow ski simulator . I keep my mask on when I’m working out. working on tightening my butt atm

Tandey

Paddygreen wrote: »

We need more regulations. The nice West African security guard at Spar isn’t so nice to me anymore as I have personally tried to motivate him to tighten the ship.

Not surprised really. Nobody likes a busybody.

Red warning - to the weather forum

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058105531&page=20

Arghus

CalamariFritti wrote: »

I disagree with you.

Of course some people have 'flaunted' some of the advice at times. But I cant see that being a big factor. In any case you need to let people have some social outlet.

If someone told me you could either go along with not going out or anywhere not meeting people concerts and all the rest of it for another couple of years or else you get the virus tomorrow I'd say I might take my chances with the virus.

I don't know how you can disagree with me to be honest.

People have picked up the virus through negligence, flaunting restrictions or simply just not giving a shyte. This is a fact. You state this yourself. It's irrelevant if it's a small amount of people or a large amount of people, the fact is it has happened, is happening and will continue to happen. Whether you like it or not that often comes down to personal choice, responsibility and behaviour.

You can't blame the authorities if you've been told not to do something for clear reasons countless times and then go ahead and do it and it results in the outcome that you were warned about. There's lot of regular ordinary social things that I don't do anymore. I don't know, maybe I'm a Saint, but it is possible to make sacrifices and behave with a certain degree of responsibility. According to a proportion of people that seems to be absolutely impossible.

And why the exaggeration when attempting to refute what I'm saying? You can go out, you can meet people, it hasn't been going on for years. These are all emotive, but inaccurate statements, which seem to give a sort of justification for certain behaviours, but, at the end of the day, aren't true.

Queried

Drumpot wrote: »

https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/77b6d-statement-on-the-introduction-of-new-measures-to-limit-the-spread-of-covid-19/

According to above

- gyms/leisure centres/swimming pools/exercise and dance studios will remain open with strict distancing and other appropriate protective measures in place

-limits of 6 apply to exercise and dance classes with appropriate physical distancing

- limits of 15 apply to groups outside including training sessions (with exception of elite/professional sports and horseracing). There should be no mixing between groups

Not exactly clear if it’s 6 in a gym at a time.. So if I’m working out in a gym that’s not that spaced out or large, what’s the difference if it’s a class or not ? I presume the 6 limit is for classes or gym.

Hi,

The gym I'm a member of sent an email this morning saying that from now on classes will be limited to 5 participants and the instructor to adhere to the 6 person limit. However they also said that the rest of the gym will remain as it was (i.e. 50 people max in the building at one time).

Renjit

Drumpot wrote: »

https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/77b6d-statement-on-the-introduction-of-new-measures-to-limit-the-spread-of-covid-19/

Thanks, laddie.

hotmail.com

Is Eamon Ryan still in the government?

Renjit

CalamariFritti wrote: »

I disagree with you.

Of course some people have 'flaunted' some of the advice at times. But I cant see that being a big factor. In any case you need to let people have some social outlet.

If someone told me you could either go along with not going out or anywhere not meeting people concerts and all the rest of it for another couple of years or else you get the virus tomorrow I'd say I might take my chances with the virus.

Arghus wrote: »

I don't know how you can disagree with me to be honest.

People have picked up the virus through negligence, flaunting restrictions or simply just not giving a shyte. This is a fact. You state this yourself. It's irrelevant if it's a small amount of people or a large amount of people, the fact is it has happened, is happening and will continue to happen. Whether you like it or not that often comes down to personal choice, responsibility and behaviour.

You can't blame the authorities if you've been told not to do something for clear reasons countless times and then go ahead and do it and it results in the outcome that you were warned about. There's lot of regular ordinary social things that I don't do anymore. I don't know, maybe I'm a Saint, but it is possible to make sacrifices and behave with a certain degree of responsibility. According to a proportion of people that seems to be absolutely impossible.

And why the exaggeration when attempting to refute what I'm saying? You can go out, you can meet people, it hasn't been going on for years. These are all emotive, but inaccurate statements, which seem to give a sort of justification for certain behaviours, but, at the end of the day, aren't true.

Both of you should include flout instead of flaunt. Unless, I am **** at word meanings